Lethality has better DPS while MM has better burst. In PvP the burst is more important than DPS over a long period. You want your team to focus 1 player and take it down as fast as possible and then move to the next person. DoT's are very very bad at this kind of gameplay especially when you need to place 2 DoT's before you can cull and weak blast. With that said, then i have also experienced that when my team do assisting, i wont even get a my ambush off because the enemy is gone before i can place cover and do my ambush, also known as 3,5 seconds. In these cases ambush or takedown are most useful. If you run around with lots of scrub then yes, you will have extra time due to lack of focus and then it "might" be better to DoT them up. There is always some magical amount of seconds where the better DPS catches up to the better burst, i just havent calculated that for this game

What i meant was that the sorc has a pool of 500 (100 for us) energy and they regenerate 8 points (5 max 2 lowest for us) and they dont regenerate slower at lower energy. These are comparisons without spending talents to improve the systems.

Here are some of the reasons why snipers are not as effective as they could be. Projectile travel time: This is simply a 0,5 seconds delay from shot goes off until the shot hits the target. When we start shooting at 35m range, you wont get hit by the CC until youre within 30m range, so our extra range is fancy but not viable in reality. Legshot: It is unbreakable root for 2 seconds, but we have to remember that to get 1 good shot off we need at least 1,5 second cast time. In other words, our CC will be broken after the first attack. Cover system: Its very buggy and it doesnt allow us to use cover near edges for full range and LoS advantage which other ranged classes get. We get "Unknown effect" error report and cover is cancelled. Energy system: For those who doesnt know it, the lower we are on energy the slower it will regenerate. So if the sniper does a full burst, he will need to rest somewhere or wait 30 seconds to have a full bar again. This is also why alacrity is one of the worst stats possible for us, we simply dont have the energy for the faster shooting. Please give us the sorc energy system which is superior in every way possible. LoS: This is only an issue because we have long casting times combined with 100% immobility. The LoS is also very sensitive, were talking about 0,1 broken LoS and the ability is cancelled. Many other MMOs are more forgiving like 2 checks, one when you start the attack and one at the end. This would make a difference in huttball where each fire pit has 4 poles to break LoS. Defenses: There is nothing worse than waiting 2,5 seconds for the attack to be dodged/parried, these kind of defenses should be for instant/auto attacks. You have to consider, with our energy system not allowing us much space, then every attack counts especially those with high cost and long cast times. The class is not useless but right now it relies on too many factors to be in place before its effective.

Leth vs MM all comes down to the environment, if the Leth sniper has the ability to LoS the MM Sniper, he will win, if its in the open without breaking LoS, the Leth will lose. MM is overall the most effective spec for PvP, but it is way too easy to counter making it situational. For those who worship lethality, PvP is about group achievement and as in most games you must kill squishies first and fast. MM is better for this, once the enemy squishies are down you should outnumber the enemies and from there it will be an easy fight.

Get to 50 and start dueling good people. You will find out how easy our class is to break line of sight and how easily our damage is negated with armor, deflect, dodge and so on. Once you have enough experience, please come back and give us your opinion.

There are other classes which outshine everything, people are currently rolling the flavor of the month. Snipers are not useless but were not good either.

Dont listen to the ******* who think this class is fine. There was a thread on the PvP forums about who people feared. Sniper was always the least feared or 2nd least feared beaten by marauders. Alot of stuff need sto be adjusted before the sniper is viable. PvP is about 2 importanth things, mobility and burst damage. Our class cannot have both at the same time, if you go lethality your burst damage is gone, if you go marksman your mobility is gone. Since we are a pure DPS class no matter which tree, we shouldnt be compromising these 2 things. Im not talking about cover here even tho that is also just another hindrance, but the MM spec relies too much on attacks that require you to be stationary. (Ambush, Sniper and Series of shots) As other posts also have mentioned then being ranged with energy weapons is prone to migitation and deflection and so on. The class needs to be toned up or other classes needs to be toned down. Everyone who doesnt see this are delirious about the current state of snipers.

Now guys, don't be jelly! Eisenhart Legions of Lettow

Its all quite simple, the problem is not with the sniper itself, the problem is when you compare it to other classes, so either you bring the sniper on up par with them or you bring them down on par with the sniper. Sniper is weak compared to other DPS classes, but the class is still useful despite being weaker. On top of being weaker then this class does require you to think ahead while other classes doesnt require this while still being better. These are the issues that needs to be fixed.

Mate you lost all credability when you call flashbang a stun and say legshop is 5 second root. The reality is that legshot is a 2 sec root while flashbang is next to useless unless youre in a 1 on 1 situation where others wont break it, making the AoE part pointless. Youll realise that these are very important details when you go lethality spec.

You have to remember that other snipers/gunslingers also has cover so the advantage evens out. The only classes it gives an advantage over is Mercenary/Commando. So 1 out of 8 classes it actually helps against. This class has so many issues its laughable, i even started a sorc alt just to try it out and guess what, it has 500 energy pool which regenerates 8 a tick without less regeneration the lower the pool gets. How about we got that "mechanic" to our class?

This is true if the expertise is not "compared". By that i mean the most balanced formula should be the one that calculates the Delta value between offender and defender. Example would be 550 exp vs 590 would give 40 exp difference and this is the total bonus you get from, wether its the defender or offender who has the highest expertise. That way you wont get a flawed system like the one you describe. Anyway, i dont know how the formulas are done in the game, but i do wonder how they balance the healing.

How can you write this and not facepalm yourself? Anyway mine says 45% and 9 seconds, and you forgot that it takes people out of cover. Where did this description come from?

Smoke grenade is a debuff not a CC, get your facts straight. Anyway to contribute to this whole thread: If the enemy has skills and abuse the weakness of snipers/gunslingers then yes, our class will be total crap as a marksman sniper. OP has some good ideas, which would help us be in endgame groups. No matter how well you are doing now, then premades are better off with other classes which does the same damage, are more mobile, and where the damage is reliable. Top issues for snipers/gunslingers are: 1. Buggy cover system 2. Hysterical sensitive LoS system, were talking 0,1 second of broken LoS and ability fails 3. Long casting times combined with a really bad CC system. 4. People lagging around doesnt make the LoS better So lets cut to the cake, you will not be top DPS in a good team as a marksman sniper, you will however have some insane burst damage. 1 class shouldn't have the best DPS and the best burst damage in the same spec, lethality is very likely to have better DPS overall but at the cost of burst damage. In conclusion the class is fine despite some issues with the game itself and not really the class. However i am worried how we will fare endgame as it currently is. The marksman tree will for sure not be viable if an arena system should be implemented at some point. Anyone who has been high ranked in WoW knows the importance of mobility which this tree doesnt give.

That could explain a whole lot, thx.