Well, played the heck out of Path of Exile, the game I currently focus on, and it works out that just as I am getting burnt out on that game which I played the past 2 years while away, SWTOR is changing things up in a way that interests me again, so I am coming back here to the place where I spent 8 years (since Beta 2).

Oh no! You feel INSULTED. Look at Ole Buzzard. Him and I have both have been on these forums for quite a long time and often have different and disagreeing opinions. Does HE feel insulted? No. He argues his points just as passionately as I argue mine, but because we will handle it with a degree of maturity we have a respect for one another despite coming from things at different angles and having different viewpoints. This is what it means to approach the conversation in a mature manner. To actually be INSULTED by someone else's OPINION demonstrates to me a lack of maturity to tolerate any opinions other than one's own, which means a real conversation can't be had in the first place as a practical matter, because it is pure narcissism for one to believe their opinions are always right, but also foolishness to conflate narcissism with passion, for the sake of trying to win an internet argument because you cannot tolerate disagreement. Buzzard has been able to change my mind and opinions on things before because he approaches it from a place of respect. And he gives respect for as much as he demands it. For those who only demand respect but not give it, from me they will never have it.

So, having gotten a feel for what combat styles will look like, I plan on rolling some new characters when LotS comes out. Combinations I am looking forward to: Bounty Hunter - Gunslinger | Commando (bringing the firepower) Sith Warrior - Lightning | Juggernaut (Trolling Baras is the best Sith Story line) Trooper - Operative | Sniper (Spec force trooper, here I come!) Bounty Hunter (love this story) - Mercenary | Powertech (True BH) Anyone got some combos they are looking forward to and why?

This is something I never understood. People ready to rage-quit over something that hasn't been put in yet. And it wouldn't be the first time in this game's history this has been done either - I remember the huge kerfuffle over level-sync and all these threats, and when people actually got to playing it, they realized it wasn't that bad (other than for the people who wanted to god-mode flashpoints). I get having concerns over upcoming content. While I disagree with their opinions, I get the reason why some of the forum people here who want the game to stay the same for solo play and are upset its changing. But the people who get nasty and personal over it are what I will never understand. It may have come off poorly, but that was all my original post meant when I said to someone "your opinion doesn't matter" - I wasn't meaning didn't matter to the developers; I was meaning that the opinion will never matter to me, when presented in such a manner. I guess I just don't understand this need to fight with people and force everyone to have to agree - its a losing battle. My opinion is mine. I respect that it isn't other people's. They have their opinions and are entitled to them. But this name calling over having a different opinion or getting all mad and insinuating people are liars and some such - its just so emotionally stunted, generally speaking (not referring to any one person in particular here, but my overall time on the forums in my 10 years here). I'd rather all the flouncing stop, and people just express their differences and opinions with their emotions more in check instead of always dialing it up to 11...

I agree with this. I also think there is an impatience Factor as well. Anyone with a brain and a bit of foresight can see combat styles was done as a way to fulfill player requests for new classes, and I wouldn't be surprised to see the first of these arrive within the next year.

If it were possible to like posts, I would like this one.

Hey man. Just because you want to disregard the past two years of hiring notices for SWTOR doesn't mean they didn't exist or didn't happen...

Here's the missing thing though. The players who voiced their concern are all the solo players who were left after all the group players abandoned ship. So obviously the forums here are going to be slanted towards solo play. That's who's left. From my eyes, it looks like BioWare is looking to bring back all the different fans of the different types of group content. So that's an entirely different group than the one here on the forums.

Hey there! There's an old familiar face I haven't seen in awhile! How goes the war? I get what you're going for with the other stuff but I just have one question: if you were the developer of a game and needed to add more group content and incentivize more group content, but had through the course of 10 years made all the original group content that was supposed to be group content able to be soloed to appease a shrinking player base, and then suddenly had life breathed into your game by way of finances and hirings at the 10-year Mark with a renewed focus on player retention and rebuilding the game on the fly to support models that will keep people there longer, would you take your efforts and develop a brand new group content for the incoming people, even though that would pull resources away from all the other things the game needs to freshen it up for a new modern audience, or would you take the group content that is already in the game and just roll back and rebalance it to be group content once again, which was what its original intent was, just saving you time, money, and resources that can be spent on other areas of the game to get it ready for a new influx of people - which would you choose? I'm not saying I don't get the disappointment of the solo players, but they have been playing group content solo for a long time now because BioWare enabled this to deal with a shrinking player base. Now over the past year they have built up something which looks to be focused towards almost a relaunch of the game, and if I were developer I would want to maximize every cent and every developer hour I could. So I absolutely would rather repurpose content for its original intended use rather than leaving all of it solo and making brand new stuff - because all that brand new stuff seems to take a long time. The developers made the smart move and the right move in my opinion. They are making the game more accessible and more group-friendly. This is an MMO; if you aren't gearing it towards groups than what the hell are you doing? We both admit groups needed help. I just think they did the right thing by returning group contents to group play while still leaving a path open for solo players 2 gear with conquest

So, 2 things. I get why you feel solo play is being punished. With 6.0, the developers practically converted all the game systems to solo play. At least a significant portion of them. It was needed at the time to keep the game going, as EA wasn't investing heavily into SWTOR at that time. But EA losing the exclusivity on the SW license combined with their failure to do anything with said license changed things, and based on hiring practices over the past 24 months, they reinvested in their one real money-making SW property. It also matters that Anthem fell hard. Basically it left EA and BioWare with nowhere to turn but to reinvest in SWTOR. So 7.0 is the culmination of that reinvestment. The move away from solo play stings for you, and I get that, but they are putting the game back to how it was originally meant to be, but this time with a renewed focus on player retention, which is brand new to BioWare's core game philosophy (before, James Ohlen stated it was preferred that players unsub and go away until there was new content, which seemed like business suicide to me). I was here before 6.0, so the grouping stuff doesn't bother me as much as it would for the people who were used to the solo play of 6.0. But I will give a piece of advice - you will always find that toxic element in ANY MMO when it comes to pick up groups. Its not just a SWTOR thing. And the best way to counter that is to find a Guild. Not all Guilds are good, and I have seen some toxic ones in my day (one of the worst was named after a bed and bath furnishing store), but if you just keep at it, you will find there are some really good guilds out there that are new player and/or solo player - friendly. A guild might be counter-intuitive to a solo player, but trust me, finding a good guild can make all the difference in terms of positive group play.

You're probably wasting your breath. I'm an old vet of the forums here, and I know outraged people want to stay outraged, even if the things they are outraged about are just phantoms and they are jousting at windmills. It won't really settle down until the expansion launches and people actually get to play the changes and realize its not so bad, or may even be fun. Its just how the forums here work. I think I can count on one hand the number of times people had a valid reason to be outraged and it wasn't made better when the changes went live. Not to say they loved what happened, but they usually would settle down because it wasn't the doomsday scenario they were predicting. Also, I'm coming back to the game a bit early, at least for subbing, so the forum will definitely slant towards a heavy solo-play bias, because group people like me likely are waiting until after launch to come back. I subbed early to check the changes on PTS here and there. That's why I am not going to engage with the people getting mad and questioning what I am saying - they have their opinions, I have mine, and even if I showed them proof, like Bioware increasing hiring for SWTOR over the past 24 months as proof EA is re-investing in the game, I know they won't believe it, and I am not into wasting my time. They have their opinions and are entitled to them. I have mine, and am also likewise entitled to them.

I think the concept of it is harder than the actual play will be. I saw a video of Swtorista who tested these on PTS, and she was able to fill the new conquest solo requirements pretty quickly still.

I suppose that's fair - how about this: What's bringing me back is the re-incentivization of group play. Clearer?

Hey man! Yeah, so I just got burnt out on SWTOR. Ops runs were dead, everything was geared towards anti-social solo play, and honestly, there were a lot of positive changes in 6.0 that I really liked - its just that there wasn't enough to keep me invested. Ended up playing a pretty bad arse Diablo clone called Path of Exile that held my interest for over a year, but then the devs decided to muck with it a little, and while they are righting the ship again, its getting to be borring, and it just aligns perfectly that I am excited for a lot of the 7.0 changes that will bring me back. And crazy that they are starting to focus on player retention! That's been a major gripe against bioware since launch - and its exciting that they are finally changing their business model. The other thing I am hoping for, is that they do a graphics refresh. I know that they can't replace the engine, but if you look at Elder Scrolls online, that is also hero engine and the game looks better there, so they can probably do more with lighting, shaders and higher rez textures in this game as well to make it feel fresher. Don't know if they will do that. The UIs on PTS looking slick though and coming together! So yeah, happy to be back. I'll likely be light on contributing until 7.0 launches. Once its up, I'll get back into the swing of things. Already planning on rolling a new toon for 7.0 - Bounty Hunter with Commando/Operative Combat Styles....

Play something different. For me, I have been away for almost 2 years playing Path of Exile. 7.0 is bringing me back. So I resubbed in anticipation for its December release...

Solo players have conquest. So there IS a solo path where they can gear up and are at no one's mercy. They just don't get EVERYTHING any more - the group content is being returned to the group players.

To clarify my retention comments - I get the solo players who are mad will argue with me on this. I get it. I was in your shoes when 6.0 launched. But the systems they are tweaking are all things to try to give people something to do and incentive to stay logged in, which is a massive departure from how they used to do business. And while I get you're mad - you still will have solo tracks to gear up. But now those of us who LIKE to group will finally have content too. So try not to be too grouchy and anti-social, and make some room for us coming back.

I get what they're going for. In order to keep the game alive through the 6.00 era, the developers really did have to adopt a solo play model because most of the players they had left were solo players. They had run off a lot of the PVP and operations groups. So you had conquest which was geared towards a bunch of solo players contributing towards a larger goal, and gearing redone for solo players. What's obvious with 7.0 is that EA has renewed their commitment to SWTOR, and given them more of a budget. It also looks like based on the changes, for the very first time SWTOR is going to focus on player retention - that is Major because it has been a core Business philosophy up until this point that BioWare doesn't care if people sub or not. I'm not even kidding. There's a James Ohlen interview where he explicitly states that from about a year after the game was launched. Also, based on the information we are getting oh, it looks like they are trying to make it more of an MMO again and it looks like they are gearing up to reach out to that type of audience. It's also why they are trying to make as much as they can be beginner-friendly and also combat inflation, so that new people aren't hit with sticker shock. That being said, I think people are overreacting here because solo play isn't going away, and there is a gear path for solo players via personal conquest, which rewards players from playing whatever content they want. It's just that they are allowing group Play to gear faster, to incentivize grouping in order to do so. And while solo players may complain about it, we are playing an m m o... The point of that category is to group! So what BioWare is trying to do is bring back the people who are in favor of group content as well as add more people to enjoy group content. That the forums are so negative is more indicative of just the fact that they've catered to solo players for a while and that's who all is really left on the forums. If they are successful in bringing in more people, the tenor of the forms will shift along with those groups returning. As for me, I was one of the group content people they ran off. Combat styles was interesting, but incentivizing grouping is what is bringing me back. That, and the game finally getting some needed TLC...

Going to leave this here even though its not what was asked: The opening BH cutscene needs to be cleaned up when picking a combat style not originally from BH. It looks weird as hell for my BH with a commando combat style carrying his heavy cannon and then looking like he shot electricity from his hand to knock out the runaway guy - maybe have an alternative where the character pulls a gun out and stuns him? Otherwise, its weird and jarring, especially if I were a new player, it would be a poor first impression.

They tried that for the side quests in KotFE and KotET. It was hated and universally panned....

Switching up combat styles will be interesting for the game moving forward, however I'm sure after a little while the novelty of playing is a smuggler with an assault Cannon and the like will wear off. What makes the idea of combat styles intriguing, is potential crossover. Give us a bank of three abilities, one designated as major and two designated as minor however you choose to classify them. Then designate every ability in the game is either a major or minor ability. When we choose a second class, let us unlock this ability bar and allow us to choose three key abilities from the other combat class we chose and bring those over. You can also make some abilities exempt. For instance I'm sure everyone would try to pick stealth as a major ability but it can be exempt from the pool to force players to pick more diverse things and to specifically have to flip to that combat style to use stealth. But for instance, what if I have myself a commando who has a second class of mercenary? It would be nice that while I am using the commando, I had access to certain abilities from mercenary. Perhaps a major ability would be like death from above, and minor abilities would be things like electrodart or priming shot. There can also be prerequisites, such as you need to have the weapons already in your loadout in order to be able to access those abilities - like for instance you can't have an assault Canon and then run death from above shooting from the cannon because you don't have animations for it. So in order to be able to use that ability even as a commando, you have to have those pistols in your loadout for when you switch to mercenary, otherwise you cannot use the ability. Then at least the game will know to pull those pistols out and use that animation. With the inability to flip between styles in combat, some limited ability for crossover would really add spice and make people really think about what they choose for that second combat class

By changing classes to origin stories, and moving combat away from that integration, this does open the door again for more origin stories. One of the biggest reasons why swtor lost so many players early on was their decision to kill class stories. When that became official, there was a major hemorrhage of players. Introducing more origin stories would be an amazing addition.

I remember that as well. VERY clearly stated. Then again, the person you are quoting seems to play fast and loose with the "truth" anyway...

I wanted to address this separately. It really didn't "fail here too". There was a completely different set of reasons why SWTOR didn't have the success it could have, and it actually starts with BioWare having a hissy fit that they wanted to make a Single player successor to KOTOR, and EA wanted an MMO. That sounds like EA's fault at first, but at launch, SWTOR blew EVERYONE away. It wasn't WoW, but it had a damn good launch. Except problem - BioWare Had no experience making MMOs and therefore thought the players would get content done in years what actually took them months to complete, leading to a more than a year long drag on new content. BioWare from the very beginning had (and continues to have) a flawed business model in sustaining an MMO (because their heart isn't in it) - rather than focus on content to improve retention, they are perfectly ok with players leaving to go play something else for a while, and then come back for a month when there is new content. Yes, I know this sounds crazy, but James Ohlen openly ADMITTED this. If you want to read more about what really happened, read this thread, from contracted tester Nyman: https://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=968223 In it, BioWare attempts to try to deflect by saying Nyman was never a BioWare employee, but technically, paid testers that are contracted out are employees for their contract company, even as they test for say another video game company - it was a cheap try to deflect the negative optics of the time. Give it a read - it really is fascinating and helps make a lot of sense with what the hell happened to SWTOR. Having said that, I really do believe Keith Kannig DOES care about SWTOR. They still haven't changed their business model yet, but I can see they are trying to turn the titanic around. Not every choice is going to be popular, but it seems like now that EA has lost the exclusive license, they are investing in SWTOR again, likely to stave off Disney thinking about potential competition in the market. After all, while SWG did indeed die, the reason it did was because Lucasfilm/arts group opted NOT to renew the licensing that allowed Sony to use Star Wars, because they had a replacement waiting in the wings in SWTOR...

In truth, SWG's player base hit its high early, and then started a very slow bleed of players as the ongoing nerf wars were happening. Because it plateaued so early, and was only losing players, that is the business reasons for facilitating the CU and then the NGE. The other part of the reasoning for the NGE, was that when questioned why players were jumping ship from SWG prior to the NGE, the two reasons that kept coming up was that the game didn't have a good Star Wars story that players could immediately immerse themselves in (not everyone wants to just make their own stories - in fact most people don't), and that the game was just too complicated and too hard to really get started in. The NGE was an attempt to rectify those - albeit an extremely poor one. The thing is, SWG wasn't really marketed very well and even the developers didn't really know what it was, other than trying to make it Ultima Online with a Star Wars skin. The creator was the same, but Raph didn't really know what to do with a property like Star Wars. Ultimately, he just recreated his game with Star Wars trappings and expected it to go off without a hitch, all while not keeping up with an evolving player base. His missteps weaponized and toxified the entire player community. The decision not to balance PvP and PvE separately from the beginning is what opened the door for the nerf wars. I give a lot of grief to the SWG players, because their entitled behavior and their wretched demeanor in a lot of cases went beyond the pale and would not be tolerated in the current environment with a lot more awareness and sensitivity to threats, trolling, and other behavior that would drive players away. But ultimate blame does indeed fall to Raph Koster. Doesn't mean Julio Torres or John Smedley get a pass by any means, because they just made things worse and worse, but ultimately, the failure of basically everything in SWG falls on Raph's shoulders. Which is why I will never lionize him. And keep in mind that as a beta member, Raph spent a TON of time in the forums getting ideas and feedback from us. And all of us beta players were shocked, because the Raph we thought we knew during Beta did a complete about face and went off the rails as soon as the game went live, and none of us ever expected that same guy to go off the deep end like that. And even to this day, Raph blames everyone but himself for the failure of the game, other than to say "sure, I was in charge, so ultimately blame lies with me, but let me tell you who REALLY was at fault... (proceeds to point a billion fingers and zero thumbs)"....