Interested in rotation.

[ViskarNogame]

So for PT Tanking, I've been playing around a bit with it lately (Jug is my main) and I'm wondering about the abilities we use. Trying to plan my spec, but I could put 5 points into Railshot, or I could buff things like Rocket Punch - Is Rail Shot really used at all while we tank? I mean, -I- use it... but I dunno if I should.

[chainsawsamurai]

There aren't any "high threat" abilities in TOR. Everything does threat based off of the damage it causes. So yes, use Rail Shot since it is very nice threat when it is available.

 

OK, I lied, grapple technically is a "high threat" move.

 

Everything else is just a multiplier based off of your damage however.

 

As far as rotation, there really isn't one.

 

Keep your Heat below 40 unless you're getting some burst damage/threat and intend on using Vent Heat.

 

You should use Rocket Punch and Rail Shot as soon as they become available in order to get the cooldown rolling. These are about your highest priorities.

 

Flame Spin is a little inefficient damagewise unless you've got a full 5 targets in the AoE. It's good to use for initial threat to keep things off the healer, I'm just saying not to over do it. Bear in mind Flame Spin only affects 5 targets.

 

Flame Thrower is great AoE damage/threat and should be used everytime it is feasable. Some use it Single Target, this is especially handy low level when you don't have a heck of a lot of other options yet.

 

Explosive dart is good threat and crowdcontrol on weaker mobs. Don't target a Silver with it if there is a normal available. Bear in mind the explosion will only affect 3 targets.

 

Unload has a bad rap for tanks, but it's useful for the Ranged badguys that just wont come over if Grapple is down. An Unload will keep him off the healer until the DPS kill him. With ION Cylinder active you can get some decent threat out of it.

 

I don't have Heat Blast. I don't like it. However some do, espescially for tanking (I don't need it and I think people over emphasis it's importance because it is a 31 point talent and that implies awesomeness or something. If you are going to use it then maximizing its effectiveness can be a bit tricky. Mechanically you want to use it every time it is off cooldown as soon as it is available. This maximizes the heat gain from it -- Heat = Threat -- so that is how it improves your threat output. The trick is you now not only have to worry about staying below 40 Heat, but when Heat Blast is coming off of cooldown you need to ensure you are above 8 heat (preferably 13 to account for the next dissipation tick).

 

Flame Burst is about as low a priority it gets, that's why it is spammable, it sucks. It doesn't suck persay, but don't use it until everything else relevant is on cooldown and you've got threat to burn.

 

Finally Rapid Shots. Use it instead of whatever else you'd use if that ability would take you over 40 heat.

 

 

The difficulty in telling you a rotation stems from the fact that both combat and the heat system are a bit more dynamic than what most are used to from other MMOs. So the rotation isn't solid since it isn't just based on priority, but timing.

 

GLHF

[DarrkLore]

Keep your Heat below 40 unless you're getting some burst damage/threat and intend on using Vent Heat.

 

You should use Rocket Punch and Rail Shot as soon as they become available in order to get the cooldown rolling. These are about your highest priorities.

 

Flame Spin is a little inefficient damagewise unless you've got a full 5 targets in the AoE. It's good to use for initial threat to keep things off the healer, I'm just saying not to over do it. Bear in mind Flame Spin only affects 5 targets.

 

Flame Thrower is great AoE damage/threat and should be used everytime it is feasable. Some use it Single Target, this is especially handy low level when you don't have a heck of a lot of other options yet.

 

Explosive dart is good threat and crowdcontrol on weaker mobs. Don't target a Silver with it if there is a normal available. Bear in mind the explosion will only affect 3 targets.

 

Unload has a bad rap for tanks, but it's useful for the Ranged badguys that just wont come over if Grapple is down. An Unload will keep him off the healer until the DPS kill him. With ION Cylinder active you can get some decent threat out of it.

 

I don't have Heat Blast. I don't like it. However some do, espescially for tanking (I don't need it and I think people over emphasis it's importance because it is a 31 point talent and that implies awesomeness or something. If you are going to use it then maximizing its effectiveness can be a bit tricky. Mechanically you want to use it every time it is off cooldown as soon as it is available. This maximizes the heat gain from it -- Heat = Threat -- so that is how it improves your threat output. The trick is you now not only have to worry about staying below 40 Heat, but when Heat Blast is coming off of cooldown you need to ensure you are above 8 heat (preferably 13 to account for the next dissipation tick).

 

Flame Burst is about as low a priority it gets, that's why it is spammable, it sucks. It doesn't suck persay, but don't use it until everything else relevant is on cooldown and you've got threat to burn.

 

Finally Rapid Shots. Use it instead of whatever else you'd use if that ability would take you over 40 heat.

 

 

The difficulty in telling you a rotation stems from the fact that both combat and the heat system are a bit more dynamic than what most are used to from other MMOs. So the rotation isn't solid since it isn't just based on priority, but timing.

 

GLHF

 

I agree with most of what you said except for a couple of things.

 

Rocket Punch is a definite priority, especially if you put points into the skills associated with it in the skill trees (including the point in Pyrotech).

 

Flamethrower is useful in AoE tanking until you get Flame Sweep, I'll explain shortly.

 

Flameburst is very useful, especially as a tank. To begin with it's got a decent damage to cooldown ratio. On top of that if you put two skill tree points into Combust it also lowers the target's damage by 4% for 15 seconds (as does Flame Sweep). That's very tank friendly!

 

This is also why Flame Sweep is very useful, 4% damage reduction on up to 5 enemies. So at its full potential you get to reduce the damage coming at you from 5 mobs for 15 seconds on top of doing some damage yourself. That's nothing to sneeze at. It's also good for maintaining AoE threat.

 

Unload is very useful for grabbing a stray mob. But it's also useful if you've got high heat and Vent Heat is on CD since your heat dissipates a bit while you're channeling Unload.

 

And where are you getting the idea that heat = threat? I've never seen that stated anywhere.

 

I agree that there is no solid rotation for PT tanking since there are so many variables involved. It's kind of a judgement call class. But there are certain things that take a priority: rocket punch and flame sweep. And you do want to try to keep your heat low, but you definitely shouldn't ever let your heat drop to 0 because that's wasted potential.

Edited December 30, 2011 by DarrkLore

[Kinvalar]

This is also why Flame Sweep is very useful, 4% damage reduction on up to 5 enemies. So at its full potential (4% * 5) you get 20% total damage reduction for 15 seconds on top of doing some damage yourself. That's nothing to sneeze at. It's also good for maintaining AoE threat.

 

4% DR on 5 enemies doesn't mean 20% damage reduction. Simple example to explain:

 

Enemy 1-5 each hit you for 100 damage. 500 damage total. You Flame Sweep before said attacks and instead each hit is for 96 damage. 480 damage total. 480 x 100 / 500 = 96(%). You have still only reduced your incoming damage by 4%.

 

Say you only hit 4 of 5 targets by happenstance? You have reduced it even less. You need to hit every enemy you're fighting at the time to even talk about a static 4% DR. Obviously not an issue on boss fights, but there are numerous ranged mob groups that don't like to be gathered up.

 

Obviously it is still a good idea to keep the debuff on any mob(s), but that only means firing off a Flame Burst/Sweep once every 14 seconds or so (to be sure the debuff doesn't drop).

 

And where are you getting the idea that heat = threat? I've never seen that stated anywhere.

 

I think the point is that the better your heat management the more you can use damaging skills, and with Heat dumps in particular wasted dumps means you've thrown away potential heat for attacks. If you Heat Blast at say, 10 your next tick of regen while your GCD is waiting is going to have part of it wasted. You need to never EVER hit 0 heat mid-battle. If you ever do then you're not doing as much as you could be, and are wasting regen ticks (partially or fully). It is quite possible for an overly enthusiastic Heat dumper to do just that.

 

I know nobody likes WoW comparisons, but an apt one would be Rogue's Energy or Hunter's Focus. Anytime you let them max out means you let some partial/full ticks of regen out into the ether. Same thing here, just backwards.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Kinvalar

[DarrkLore]

4% DR on 5 enemies doesn't mean 20% damage reduction. Simple example to explain:

 

Enemy 1-5 each hit you for 100 damage. 500 damage total. You Flame Sweep before said attacks and instead each hit is for 96 damage. 480 damage total. 480 x 100 / 500 = 96(%). You have still only reduced your incoming damage by 4%.

 

Say you only hit 4 of 5 targets by happenstance? You have reduced it even less. You need to hit every enemy you're fighting at the time to even talk about a static 4% DR. Obviously not an issue on boss fights, but there are numerous ranged mob groups that don't like to be gathered up.

.

 

Haha yeah sorry math isn't my strong suit. I know it won't reduce your total damage by 20% I just meant that if you hit 5 targets with it, it stacks up to a decent amount of mitigation.

[anwg]

Pretty sure you cannot dodge while channeling, so only use flamethrower on trash or the boss isn't actually attacking.