Thank you BW

[JediMasterAlex]

i dont believe anyone suggested they are balanced, only that being what they are people still play them wrong.

 

The point is though, merc dcds are still too strong, even if you play against them correctly. No other class has as much anti-focus, which allows mercs an ability to facetank and freecast that no other class has, except fury maras to a somewhat lesser degree.

[foxmob]

Having 20+ seconds of "lol don't touch me while I shoot you in the face for free"

 

please explain this to me.

 

here are my thoughts: reflect is 6s. are you really not going to dps into 12s of energy shield for fear of the heal after it drops? that almost never happens. if there's a cc or another target to hit, yeah. but iunno. heal shield does not deter ppl from attacking outside of 1v1 saps in my experience. at max it heals 40% hp, and that's only after the shield drops. it's a great dcd, but I don't see it as a deterrent to focus like reflect or an actual escape (stealth/PW). I understand that combined with the other 2 dcds it's overmuch, but...literally no one has been deterred from attacking me in yolo cuz of energy shield heal.

 

but perhaps you're thinking along other lines?

[Dyne-]

please explain this to me.

 

here are my thoughts: reflect is 6s. are you really not going to dps into 12s of energy shield for fear of the heal after it drops? that almost never happens. if there's a cc or another target to hit, yeah. but iunno. heal shield does not deter ppl from attacking outside of 1v1 saps in my experience. at max it heals 40% hp, and that's only after the shield drops. it's a great dcd, but I don't see it as a deterrent to focus like reflect or an actual escape (stealth/PW). I understand that combined with the other 2 dcds it's overmuch, but...literally no one has been deterred from attacking me in yolo cuz of energy shield heal.

 

but perhaps you're thinking along other lines?

 

The answer to your first question is it depends on the situation. Ex: Is it a 1v1, 2v1, 3v1, 8v8? Can I LOS the merc at this moment? Can I kill the merc through the DR and before the heal?

 

Yes Fox, i'm thinking along other lines and i'm a little too drunk tonight to type a "how to" guide to mercenary. To properly answer your question i'd have to not only discuss energy shield and responsive safeguards, but electro net, power surge, jet boost, hydraulic overrides, rocket out, and additional utilities. Then i'd have to go over how and when to use them to maximize your immunity time. I'm less than interested in that at the moment. Not to mention the majority of these discussions that i've read on the forums don't come from a place of honesty. Players are too quick to omit information if it suits their argument and i've no interest in sifting through paragraphs of BS to prove a point.

 

I'm not saying you are guilty of this ( from what i've seen you aren't ), just that i'm trying to spare myself the headache.

 

I will say this. Most 1v1s with decent mercs will never go down in a situation where they open with reflect then roll into energy shield like you described in your example ( especially if they want to take advantage of the 25% DR from energy shield or energy shield timer resets ). Mercs have a surprising amount of immunity / control from the aforementioned abilities that come into play prior to dcds being popped that are used as a counter to enemy gap closers; in addition to a hilarious amount of soft cc.

 

Due to this it's actually pretty difficult to "just mezz" a merc simply because they popped a dcd. Typically they pop a dcd during some sort of immunity phase, and they'll cc break something like intimidating roar and let their other cc immunity take care of the rest. This is the elephant in the room that merc players rarely ever mention when discussing whether or not their class is overtuned.

 

Anyway this is way more than I wanted to say on this subject already. Realistically 20+ seconds of "can't touch this" was actually an understatement on my part if a merc knows what they're doing.

[Floplag]

The point is though, merc dcds are still too strong, even if you play against them correctly. No other class has as much anti-focus, which allows mercs an ability to facetank and freecast that no other class has, except fury maras to a somewhat lesser degree.

 

I dont agree with that, but the point is most are NOT playing it correctly, so the point is moot and there is no discussion to be had.

[JediMasterAlex]

I dont agree with that, but the point is most are NOT playing it correctly, so the point is moot and there is no discussion to be had.

 

What?

 

Even if we assume that the merc and opponent(s) are both playing correctly, mercs' dcds are still way better than any other dps in the game. That is a fact regardless of how poorly some people play against mercs.

[foxmob]

The answer to your first question is it depends on the situation. Ex: Is it a 1v1, 2v1, 3v1, 8v8? Can I LOS the merc at this moment? Can I kill the merc through the DR and before the heal?

 

Yes Fox, i'm thinking along other lines and i'm a little too drunk tonight to type a "how to" guide to mercenary. To properly answer your question i'd have to not only discuss energy shield and responsive safeguards, but electro net, power surge, jet boost, hydraulic overrides, rocket out, and additional utilities. Then i'd have to go over how and when to use them to maximize your immunity time. I'm less than interested in that at the moment. Not to mention the majority of these discussions that i've read on the forums don't come from a place of honesty. Players are too quick to omit information if it suits their argument and i've no interest in sifting through paragraphs of BS to prove a point.

 

I'm not saying you are guilty of this ( from what i've seen you aren't ), just that i'm trying to spare myself the headache.

 

I will say this. Most 1v1s with decent mercs will never go down in a situation where they open with reflect then roll into energy shield like you described in your example ( especially if they want to take advantage of the 25% DR from energy shield or energy shield timer resets ). Mercs have a surprising amount of immunity / control from the aforementioned abilities that come into play prior to dcds being popped that are used as a counter to enemy gap closers; in addition to a hilarious amount of soft cc.

 

Due to this it's actually pretty difficult to "just mezz" a merc simply because they popped a dcd. Typically they pop a dcd during some sort of immunity phase, and they'll cc break something like intimidating roar and let their other cc immunity take care of the rest. This is the elephant in the room that merc players rarely ever mention when discussing whether or not their class is overtuned.

 

Anyway this is way more than I wanted to say on this subject already. Realistically 20+ seconds of "can't touch this" was actually an understatement on my part if a merc knows what they're doing.

 

Yeah. I never said roll reflect into energy shield. It's just that the abils combined = about 20 secs, and that seemed the most obvious way you got to that number.

 

As a merc, I rarely mezz around reflect. Just death from above plus frag Grenade. By that time I can go back into normal rotational abils without giving him a single heal and continuing to pressure him.

 

But I guess that's beside the point. My real reason for raising my eyebrows at your 20 seconds comment is that the only abil a merc has that can realistically force a focus swap is the 6s reflect. Where are those other 14 seconds coming from that you have to just frown while the merc runs through his rotation with impunity?

Edited August 9, 2019 by foxmob

[Floplag]

Yeah. I never said roll reflect into energy shield. It's just that the abils combined = about 20 secs, and that seemed the most obvious way you got to that number.

 

As a merc, I rarely mezz around reflect. Just death from above plus frag Grenade. By that time I can go back into normal rotational abils without giving him a single heal and continuing to pressure him.

 

But I guess that's beside the point. My real reason for raising my eyebrows at your 20 seconds comment is that the only abil a merc has that can realistically force a focus swap is the 6s reflect. Where are those other 14 seconds coming from that you have to just frown while the merc runs through his rotation with impunity?

 

Well said Fox, and dead on.

Thats exactly the issue in my view in that people dont react properly to the use of the skills. As you say someone pops reflect you change up the rotation and skills usage... you dont have to stand there with your dork in hand, just do something different.

Very few do this so it makes the whole argument somewhat hard to swallow effectively.