No Longer Worried About Upcoming Story Updates

[IoNonSoEVero]

If I offended anyone I apologise, but I believe I have been clear in my meaning and nowhere has it been my intent to belittle someone. If you choose to take offense to what I say that is your problem, not mine. I am not here to insult people, I tried to bring in a wave of enthusiasm but sadly, as it was from the start, people don't like nice happy things.

 

What's clear to you isn't always clear to others, and it's perhaps a good thing to keep in mind that we don't always come across online as we intend. That's a general statement, and I don't except myself from it.

 

The nice happy thing I liked was KOTFE, and I had to listen to multitudes of people complaining about it. So perhaps the truth is not that people don't like nice happy things, but that all of us have our own perspective on what that is.

Edited October 16, 2018 by IoNonSoEVero

[grania]

 

 

PRlCK.

 

 

 

What is this even, how did you..

[JennyFlynn]

And here I thought Reddit was the bad part of the internet... surprise, surprise, I am able to have reasonable and pleasant discussions about this subject over there with a lot of good reads, but here? It seems the opinions people on SWTOR's Reddit have over the forums here might not be so wrong after all.

You were wrong. While I frequent this place and do find the odd good conversation, out of all media platforms the forum feels by far the worst. Tumblr may have something to say about that, I've heard via via that the Companion vs. Companion crowd there can be extremely bad, but I don't Tumblr.

Edited October 16, 2018 by JennyFlynn

[JennyFlynn]

Do tell! In spoiler tags of course Or PM me with all the juicy spoilery details!

*bows* Security Officer! He never said what sort of drama, just that there will be, logically, some companion reactions depending on whether you choose to sabotage or be loyal. I imagine Aric Jorgan, for instance, might have a huff or two to make if you're a Trooper who's sabotaging the Republic in favor of the Empire. Nothing that'll break up the relationship, Charles did say players won't face a situation where they risk their romance without explicitly choosing to do so.

[JennyFlynn]

What is this even, how did you..

Lower case L.

[Ylliarus]

You were wrong. While I frequent this place and do find the odd good conversation, out of all media platforms the forum feels by far the worst. Tumblr may have something to say about that, I've heard via via that the Companion vs. Companion crowd there can be extremely bad, but I don't Tumblr.

 

Ooh Tumblr is a bad place. I left it eons ago because it was... bad. Just bad.

 

But you're right, the atmosphere over on Reddit or Discord is much more amiable. True you have your odd dustup or troller, but at least it's a place where you can discuss things reasonably. But not here, absolutely not here.

 

I understand now why most of the people I know here on SWTOR keep telling me "dude, stay away from the forums, most people there are bad". Tried and proven!

Edited October 16, 2018 by Ylliarus

[Dracofish]

Likes what I don't like = BioWare apologist. Could it be that you two just don't like the same things? I'm sure I know the answer already.

 

No...a person who talks down and/or belittles someone for expressing concern over the game direction and writing...is a person I describe as a BioWare Apologist. Perhaps it's just a Tumblr term...that is my more common stomping ground. (If you think the forums are volatile, don't go to Tumblr.)(I don't have much choice...it's the best place to network art and writing.)

 

If someone wants to be happy with what we're being given, that's perfectly fine, and nowhere have I stated otherwise. But I do take issue when my own thoughts are taken as somehow "incorrect" because they don't tow the same line. As if I need to be convinced or that I must be an outlier when it's pretty obvious there are more than a few of us who have the same concerns.

 

The fact remains, however, that the game will never be improved upon if we don't share our thoughts and concerns...good, bad, or otherwise.

 

And here I thought Reddit was the bad part of the internet... surprise, surprise, I am able to have reasonable and pleasant discussions about this subject over there with a lot of good reads, but here? It seems the opinions people on SWTOR's Reddit have over the forums here might not be so wrong after all.

 

I get it...you've said you aren't trying to be offensive and belittling...but you're coming off that way...and I'm not the only person who has noticed. (And believe me, it takes a lot to get me going...as I said, I frequent Tumblr and that place is a cesspool.)(Perhaps it's a cultural difference...I'm in the US, so who knows...I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt.)

 

You keep saying that I'm actively choosing to misinterpret you...I'm not choosing to do anything. But perhaps you need to take a better look at how you're wording things? Maybe? Just a thought? If that truly wasn't your intent. As has already been stated, meaning can easily be misconstrued over the interwebz. But...you can't say "I respect your opinion" in one breath, and then in the next utter "but here's why you're wrong". That's not respecting someone's opinion...that's belittling it.

 

But, whatever...I'm done arguing. Have a wonderful evening and I really do hope you enjoy the new content.

Edited October 17, 2018 by Dracofish

[Dracofish]

*bows* Security Officer! He never said what sort of drama, just that there will be, logically, some companion reactions depending on whether you choose to sabotage or be loyal. I imagine Aric Jorgan, for instance, might have a huff or two to make if you're a Trooper who's sabotaging the Republic in favor of the Empire. Nothing that'll break up the relationship, Charles did say players won't face a situation where they risk their romance without explicitly choosing to do so.

 

I wonder what Theron would have to say to an Imperial-aligned SI...she won't be sabotaging the Empire...but she also won't be slaughtering Jedi if she can avoid it.

 

I also wonder if this only applies to new romances (Theron/Lana)? Will our old companions have stuff to say?

Edited October 17, 2018 by Dracofish

[Ylliarus]

I get it...you've said you aren't trying to be offensive and belittling...but you're coming off that way...and I'm not the only person who has noticed. (And believe me, it takes a lot to get me going...as I said, I frequent Tumblr and that place is a cesspool.)(Perhaps it's a cultural difference...I'm in the US, so who knows...I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt.)

 

You keep saying that I'm actively choosing to misinterpret you...I'm not choosing to do anything. But perhaps you need to take a better look at how you're wording things? Maybe? Just a thought? If that truly wasn't your intent. As has already been stated, meaning can easily be misconstrued over the interwebz. But...you can't say "I respect your opinion" in one breath, and then in the next utter "but here's why you're wrong". That's not respecting someone's opinion...that's belittling it.

 

But, whatever...I'm done arguing. Have a wonderful evening and I really do hope you enjoy the new content.

 

But saying "I respect your opinion, but here is mine and why I do not agree with you" is how discussions are made and continued, how debates about a subject come to be.

 

I am done arguing as well because it only leaves me with feelings of frustration while this was supposed to be a happy thread. Luckily I know there are a lot of people out there just as happy as me (looking at the poll on Reddit

) so at least that's some consolation. Edited October 17, 2018 by Ylliarus

[Swingkittie]

Any word on whether existing LIs (already reunited ones) get any new dialogue or is it just some scenes for starting new ones? If you don't know or don't want to say, it's ok. I kind of don't want to be too spoiled this time. Usually I love spoilers.

 

I didn't see that with exception to two companions we talked to a lot in Kotfe/Kotet. But also in fairness when I realized what I was reading and saw certain names pop up, I closed out of the browser. I had actually found it on accident when I was looking up something on Gnost Dural. I didn't read to far into it, just on Imperial side then I stopped.

Edited October 17, 2018 by Swingkittie

[Swingkittie]

Quote: Originally Posted by JennyFlynn View Post

*bows* Security Officer! He never said what sort of drama, just that there will be, logically, some companion reactions depending on whether you choose to sabotage or be loyal. I imagine Aric Jorgan, for instance, might have a huff or two to make if you're a Trooper who's sabotaging the Republic in favor of the Empire. Nothing that'll break up the relationship, Charles did say players won't face a situation where they risk their romance without explicitly choosing to do so.

 

I wonder what Theron would have to say to an Imperial-aligned SI...she won't be sabotaging the Empire...but she also won't be slaughtering Jedi if she can avoid it.

 

I also wonder if this only applies to new romances (Theron/Lana)? Will our old companions have stuff to say?

 

This is precisely what has me concerned and I have mentioned it in other threads. Some of these people are at level 50 influence and romanced. Now Charles seems to be confirming what I feared but it sounds pretty ambiguous, that these romances could be at risk depending on choices. My trooper (married to Aric) betrayed the republic on Iokath. My Sith Inq is in love with Theron and sided with the Empire. My Sith Warrior also romanced Theron but sided with the Republic. I am not worried about my warrior, but the other two I have concerns. Plus all the other companions that came from different factions to join the alliance I could lose. My mains have these people at high level of influence. My SI especially had her main companions most at 50 influence.

[SiegePro]

Well, I hunted down the script and, if accurate, if you’re a former Imp looking to become an ex-Imp you’re going to bitterly disappointed.

 

My worst fears seem to have been justified... your sabotage only changes a clear victory to a pyrrhic one, you have to go along with killing a bunch of people from the faction you ultimately hope to join and because you’re not allowed to actually to sabotage them when it’d really mattered (despite it being an obvious point in any story with a saboteur twist for such a reveal) and so the Imps or Pubs never even realize you’re not actually on the Sith’s side.

 

I’m now largely expecting that 6.0 will NOT give the option of faction switching, but instead because your saboteur actions are not recognized, the faction you hoped to join will NOT let you and you’ll be stuck with the original faction you’ve grown to despise.

 

I probably wouldn’t mind it so much if they hadn’t teased the prospect of a faction switch twice already. But they did.

 

So I’m glad I looked it up... I now know I should consider my Main’s story done after Nathema and focus only on Pubside toons.

[Dracofish]

This is precisely what has me concerned and I have mentioned it in other threads. Some of these people are at level 50 influence and romanced. Now Charles seems to be confirming what I feared but it sounds pretty ambiguous, that these romances could be at risk depending on choices. My trooper (married to Aric) betrayed the republic on Iokath. My Sith Inq is in love with Theron and sided with the Empire. My Sith Warrior also romanced Theron but sided with the Republic. I am not worried about my warrior, but the other two I have concerns. Plus all the other companions that came from different factions to join the alliance I could lose. My mains have these people at high level of influence. My SI especially had her main companions most at 50 influence.

 

I could have sworn I read somewhere that faction choice alone wouldn't lose you a romance. I really hope that's the case because I'm not about to meta-game to keep Theron happy. He married a SI who sided with the Empire on Iokath, and actively fought the Pubs there...so I'm hoping....

 

But that's why I have all sorts of doubts and concerns with this whole thing. I definitely won't be bringing any characters other than testers through for a long time.

[IoNonSoEVero]

This is precisely what has me concerned and I have mentioned it in other threads. Some of these people are at level 50 influence and romanced. Now Charles seems to be confirming what I feared but it sounds pretty ambiguous, that these romances could be at risk depending on choices. My trooper (married to Aric) betrayed the republic on Iokath. My Sith Inq is in love with Theron and sided with the Empire. My Sith Warrior also romanced Theron but sided with the Republic. I am not worried about my warrior, but the other two I have concerns. Plus all the other companions that came from different factions to join the alliance I could lose. My mains have these people at high level of influence. My SI especially had her main companions most at 50 influence.

 

A while back, Charles Boyd said on Twitter that committing war crimes against Imperials could result in Lana leaving you. I would think that the same might be true on the other side with Theron, especially if it means fighting directly against Satele. Now, saying 'war crimes' makes me think it's something huge and unethical that the player will have a chance to refuse, but it looks like there will definitely be things that risk relationships.

 

My characters side Imperial so I don't think they will need to worry about Lana walking out on them, necessarily, but I do have Republic side companions like Aric and Rusk that I'd like to keep, given that a lot of them are at level 50 influence.

 

The reasons never to play this on my mains keep stacking up.

[Dracofish]

A while back, Charles Boyd said on Twitter that committing war crimes against Imperials could result in Lana leaving you. I would think that the same might be true on the other side with Theron, especially if it means fighting directly against Satele. Now, saying 'war crimes' makes me think it's something huge and unethical that the player will have a chance to refuse, but it looks like there will definitely be things that risk relationships.

 

My characters side Imperial so I don't think they will need to worry about Lana walking out on them, necessarily, but I do have Republic side companions like Aric and Rusk that I'd like to keep, given that a lot of them are at level 50 influence.

 

The reasons never to play this on my mains keep stacking up.

 

Yeah, I think I saw the same thing...that there would be some choice made above and beyond just faction choice. I really hope that's the case. I cant imagine they would give us cross-faction romances all the way back to SoR and then take them away by default.

 

My SI has no interest in supporting a corrupt Republic. The Empire is no better but at least they're up front about it...at least in her eyes.

[Ylliarus]

Well, I hunted down the script and, if accurate, if you’re a former Imp looking to become an ex-Imp you’re going to bitterly disappointed.

 

My worst fears seem to have been justified... your sabotage only changes a clear victory to a pyrrhic one, you have to go along with killing a bunch of people from the faction you ultimately hope to join and because you’re not allowed to actually to sabotage them when it’d really mattered (despite it being an obvious point in any story with a saboteur twist for such a reveal) and so the Imps or Pubs never even realize you’re not actually on the Sith’s side.

 

I’m now largely expecting that 6.0 will NOT give the option of faction switching, but instead because your saboteur actions are not recognized, the faction you hoped to join will NOT let you and you’ll be stuck with the original faction you’ve grown to despise.

 

I probably wouldn’t mind it so much if they hadn’t teased the prospect of a faction switch twice already. But they did.

 

So I’m glad I looked it up... I now know I should consider my Main’s story done after Nathema and focus only on Pubside toons.

 

1 little thing and you immediately see everything doom and gloom. We don't know what we'll get in 6.0, we can only speculate. But personally I prefer to look at everything positively. I'd hate to have to see the negative in all things all the time... looking at things from the bright side is so much more enjoyable!

 

No but seriously what did you expect? This is only the start of the story, it's logical we don't get a full faction swap right now. Stuff needs to build up, the story has to develop. Give it a chance to grow instead of shouting doom and gloom before the story is even released.

 

Also, do a spoiler alert next time. I really want to go into the story knowing as little as possible and I am sure there are many who think alike.

Edited October 17, 2018 by Ylliarus

[IoNonSoEVero]

Yeah, I think I saw the same thing...that there would be some choice made above and beyond just faction choice. I really hope that's the case. I cant imagine they would give us cross-faction romances all the way back to SoR and then take them away by default.

 

My SI has no interest in supporting a corrupt Republic. The Empire is no better but at least they're up front about it...at least in her eyes.

 

Yeah, both Theron and Lana have already shown they will work with you to support the other faction on Iokath, even if they disapprove. I don't think faction choice will be enough to influence them. But I do think there will be a limit to how far you can attack their home faction before they say 'no more, I don't want any part in this anymore.'

 

And I can't see some other companions like Quinn, Aric, Raina and Elara going along with an all-out assault on their factions, so I do wonder if the players' actions will potentially affect those romances too.

 

Your SI's opinion is exactly why all of my characters (even the Republic ones) support the Empire. The Empire helped them during the war with Zakuul and at least the subterfuge and corruption are out in the open there.

[Ylliarus]

Yeah, both Theron and Lana have already shown they will work with you to support the other faction on Iokath, even if they disapprove. I don't think faction choice will be enough to influence them. But I do think there will be a limit to how far you can attack their home faction before they say 'no more, I don't want any part in this anymore.'

 

And I can't see some other companions like Quinn, Aric, Raina and Elara going along with an all-out assault on their factions, so I do wonder if the players' actions will potentially affect those romances too.

 

Your SI's opinion is exactly why all of my characters (even the Republic ones) support the Empire. The Empire helped them during the war with Zakuul and at least the subterfuge and corruption are out in the open there.

 

Well, didn't we all want "Choices Matter"? Or at least, people always wanted choices to matter and have consequences. Even if our choices would make our companions turn away from us, we'd be able to get them through the Comp terminal. Sure, they might not appear in our story anymore but actions have consequences, as it should be. If you don't help Senya heal Arcann, she dies. It's a huge pity aye, but if choices are supposed to matter then the consequences make sense.

Edited October 17, 2018 by Ylliarus

[IoNonSoEVero]

Well, didn't we all want "Choices Matter"? Or at least, people always wanted choices to matter and have consequences. Even if our choices would make our companions turn away from us, we'd be able to get them through the Comp terminal. Sure, they might not appear in our story anymore but actions have consequences, as it should be. If you don't help Senya heal Arcann, she dies. It's a huge pity aye, but if choices are supposed to matter then the consequences make sense.

 

MY characters' chose to be a peacekeeper and lead the Alliance. My Republic characters chose to fully align with the Empire on Iokath. Those are the options they took in the story. And that obviously means nothing, since they are being forced back into a faction war against their will and will have their agency to fully choose the faction they want removed.

 

So please don't lecture anyone about how choices matter. Obviously, they don't mean anything when it's convenient for the devs.

[Ylliarus]

MY characters' chose to be a peacekeeper and lead the Alliance. My Republic characters chose to fully align with the Empire on Iokath. Those are the options they took in the story. And that obviously means nothing, since they are being forced back into a faction war against their will and will have their agency to fully choose the faction they want removed.

 

So please don't lecture anyone about how choices matter. Obviously, they don't mean anything when it's convenient for the devs.

 

*sigh* Why do I keep having to do this...

 

I am not lecturing anyone, just asked a genuine question. So if you'd please be able to stop seeing my comments as attacks or hostile that would be great!

 

I get that we all invest a lot in our companions. But if you're originally Republic, romance for example Theron and then align with the Empire you can know that at some point it's going to cause problems and potentially a break up eventually. And personally, I'd cheer for that, because choices should matter and have consequences. At least, if you'd ask me.

[casirabit]

Well, didn't we all want "Choices Matter"? Or at least, people always wanted choices to matter and have consequences. Even if our choices would make our companions turn away from us, we'd be able to get them through the Comp terminal. Sure, they might not appear in our story anymore but actions have consequences, as it should be. If you don't help Senya heal Arcann, she dies. It's a huge pity aye, but if choices are supposed to matter then the consequences make sense.

 

Well on the companions unfortunately if they gave an kill option those of us that didn't take the option the companion doesn't appear in the story already. While I don't mind if I make the choice I do mind when someone choices forces us not to have a companion in our story because of their choices.

[Ylliarus]

Well on the companions unfortunately if they gave an kill option those of us that didn't take the option the companion doesn't appear in the story already. While I don't mind if I make the choice I do mind when someone choices forces us not to have a companion in our story because of their choices.

 

Yeah okay, that's understandable, but it's not a given. True the risk is definitely there (Lord Cytharat being an example), but then again Theron and Arcann prove the opposite. But that is a valid point of concern, aye

Edited October 17, 2018 by Ylliarus

[IoNonSoEVero]

*sigh* Why do I keep having to do this...

 

I am not lecturing anyone, just asked a genuine question. So if you'd please be able to stop seeing my comments as attacks or hostile that would be great!

 

I get that we all invest a lot in our companions. But if you're originally Republic, romance for example Theron and then align with the Empire you can know that at some point it's going to cause problems and potentially a break up eventually. And personally, I'd cheer for that, because choices should matter and have consequences. At least, if you'd ask me.

 

Except that the player is not being given a choice that would make sense based on their story decision to lead an Alliance. They are being forced back into the factions and forced to work with them against their will. My characters never had any intention of returning to their home factions, so that would have been irrelevant to them.

 

The new storyline is forcing players back into a conflict they might have no interest in, and the companions might end up being collateral damage, and that's not fair. They're really not giving people like me who hate this storyline and direction intensely any reason NOT to hate it. They're not giving people who value their companions any reason to want to play through.

[casirabit]

Yeah okay, that's understandable, but it's not a given. True the risk is definitely there (Lord Cytharat being an example), but then again Theron and Arcann prove the opposite. But that is a valid point of concern, aye

 

Koth is another example--One of my smuggler's romanced him but because of the hate because he had an opinion that some didn't like-they allowed him to be killed off and therefore destroying him in my story. You kill him fine but don't take him out of my story-that is not right and that is why I don't always trust BW anymore with regard to the companions.

[Ylliarus]

The new storyline is forcing players back into a conflict they might have no interest in, and the companions might end up being collateral damage, and that's not fair. They're really not giving people like me who hate this storyline and direction intensely any reason NOT to hate it. They're not giving people who value their companions any reason to want to play through.

 

I do feel sorry you feel that way, I truly do. But in the end, Bioware is a company. They do what is most profitable and clearly a majority of players wants a return to this narrative. Is it fair? No, it isn't, but in the end Bioware will seek to please the many instead of the few. Would a compromise have been fair? Absolutely, but Bioware simply doesn't have the resources for that.

 

Koth is another example--One of my smuggler's romanced him but because of the hate because he had an opinion that some didn't like-they allowed him to be killed off and therefore destroying him in my story. You kill him fine but don't take him out of my story-that is not right and that is why I don't always trust BW anymore with regard to the companions.

 

Koth is another valid example aye but if I remember correctly from the streams they did have plans for him for the people who romanced him. Not sure if I recall it correctly though, could be wrong there.