Upcoming KOTFE Bonus Chapter “Shroud of Memory”

[Cayoimeah]

So, I read about this today and that this content will be exclusive. I have a suggestion that might help you not alienate all of your new players who are completely sold on your game as you are planning to.

 

There's a pretty big difference in not allowing a player who has been with the game less than 8 months (which is seriously weird, if you were doing this for people who have been subbed for several years or something I could probably better justify it) to obtain a companion because they weren't subbed Jan-whatever--which is the HK-55 companion you only allowed January subscribers to have.

 

Fair enough. There are plenty of companions and I wasn't too worried about that.

 

Now, you are planning to offer EXCLUSIVE *content* to those who have been subbed since January. I can't imagine who thought that was a good idea because seriously--you are not going to let me play CONTENT because I subbed in FEBRUARY?? Really?

 

Here's the thing--and my suggestion:

 

You can handle this in a way that rewards your subscribers who were here January to August--by giving them the content for free.

 

However, you could make the content accessible to ANYONE who wants it by charging a nominal fee or offering it as a cartel coin purchase. If it would make you feel better then by all means--make it an outrageous price to make the people who are getting it free feel even better about themselves.

 

But DO NOT alienate an entire group of people who LOVE your game AND who have been committed to playing through EVERY SINGLE bit of content by doing what you have planned.

 

PLEASE reconsider.

 

I have spent an extraordinary amount of money on this game since I subbed as I am that kind of player, a girl who doesn't buy purses, or shoes, or clothes and stuff like that all the time, instead I invest my money into things I love--and this game has received A LOT of my money since I subbed in February. As a paying member I take exception to actual content that I will not be able to play since the only criteria is that I didn't know about your game before that date.

[KEVHOUSTTWO]

Terrible idea. To start with, there would be serious legal consequences for doing such a thing. The main problem with this is that the bonus chapter is the sole reason a lot of people (including me) maintained our subs during this content drought. If it had not been exclusive, a lot of people would have simply subscribed for chapter 16 and get them all at once. Making the bonus chapter available to everyone would not only anger their loyal subs, but also destroy any possibility of using such an incentive in the future.

 

If they were to make it available for a price, for it to be fair it must cost at least $120 (as that is the value of an 8 month sub). You are kidding yourself if you think sane people will pay that much for a story mission lasting maybe 45 minutes.

 

I know it sucks to have missed it by one month, but maybe they could do something like reduce the price for each month subbed after January. Still doubtful though, as such a proposition would still have legal ramifications.

[Cayoimeah]

Can you explain the legal ramifications? Because I honestly don't see any difference in this than them putting out any other content they charge money for?

 

There is a promotion they are running right now that appears to randomly give gifts to subbed members--so I don't think one player getting something and another not getting it has any legal issues at all or how could they legally do that?

 

I am not being confrontational--written words are hard to get the tone--I am genuinely curious since I can understand maybe the "loyal" subbed players might get mad (which frankly, I don't understand if *I* had to pay for it and you got it for free why would you even care how my game was played or paid for?)--but them not doing it for legal reasons really doesn't make a bit of sense to me.

 

Can't see any difference in this than a cartel exclusive item that you have to pay real money for...*shrug*

[Cayoimeah]

And also, I will say this--I would pay a great deal of money to play the content---why? Because I am the kind of person who does every quest, explores every single area, experiences every penny of my money's worth and I am positive I am not the ONLY recently subbed person who plays the game that way.

 

Why did I only come to SWTOR in February?

 

Because before that I completed Everquest, LOTRO, and FFXIV (and was waiting for new content) and wanted a new game to explore. I didn't even know this game existed until my son told me about it, so why should I be excluded from content when I have spent a lot more than $120 in cartel coins to furnish my house and buy packs and things--A LOT more than that.

[azudelphi]

The issue is false advertising. That's what makes it legally dangerous for them to even consider this (especially in the short run).

[Cayoimeah]

The thing is, when I signed up to be a subscriber in February their page told me the following:

 

"Get Unlimited Access to All Game Content and Features as a Subscriber!"

 

That doesn't mean armor, weapons, cartel coin bonuses or anything else, but I read that say saying that I will have access to all of the CONTENT in the game, and there are no exceptions listed as far as I can tell. So perhaps, there is a legal issue either way.

[Avashnea]

Can you explain the legal ramifications? Because I honestly don't see any difference in this than them putting out any other content they charge money for?

They can't, because claiming there would be legal consequences is something they just pulled out of their ***. The entire concept of denying content to PAYING customers is totally ridiculous.

[americanaussie]

I know. I'm sad. I didn't have the money back in Jan. I didn't even know about it back then. I'd buy it if I could. I really would.

[RameiArashi]

I wish it wasn't linked to a series of quests I purposely avoided.

[casirabit]

The thing is, when I signed up to be a subscriber in February their page told me the following:

 

"Get Unlimited Access to All Game Content and Features as a Subscriber!"

 

That doesn't mean armor, weapons, cartel coin bonuses or anything else, but I read that say saying that I will have access to all of the CONTENT in the game, and there are no exceptions listed as far as I can tell. So perhaps, there is a legal issue either way.

 

While I have my problems with the game this is not one of then due to the fact they actually stated this on the page for KOTFE.

 

While you were reading that did you not see this as well:

 

 

HK-55 BONUS CHAPTER – PLAY AS HK-55!

BE A SUBSCRIBER FROM: JAN 11 – AUG 1**

RELEASE DATE TO BE ANNOUNCED IN FEBRUARY

Choose to be a continuous Subscriber from January 11 to August 1 and unlock a special bonus chapter where you PLAY AS HK-55, undertaking a special personal mission as the iconic Droid.

 

Don’t miss your chance to unlock this exciting bonus chapter!

 

 

http://www.swtor.com/fallen-empire/rewards

Edited August 15, 2016 by casirabit

[casirabit]

 

PLEASE reconsider.

 

I have spent an extraordinary amount of money on this game since I subbed as I am that kind of player, a girl who doesn't buy purses, or shoes, or clothes and stuff like that all the time, instead I invest my money into things I love--and this game has received A LOT of my money since I subbed in February. As a paying member I take exception to actual content that I will not be able to play since the only criteria is that I didn't know about your game before that date.

 

 

I would also reconsider that statement above. You by yourself said you have only been here since Feb of this year yet you state something like you did above . There have been people that have been here since launch that I know have spent more than you but yet you want to use that statement to gain some kind of leverage?

[Avashnea]

I would also reconsider that statement above. You by yourself said you have only been here since Feb of this year yet you state something like you did above . There have been people that have been here since launch that I know have spent more than you but yet you want to use that statement to gain some kind of leverage?

 

Under NO circumstances should CONTENT be withheld from paying players just because they're new. Items, mounts, pets, yes. NOT CONTENT

[Cayoimeah]

Here's the thing--I didn't think A SINGLE THING about what I posted here being controversial, because why would someone care if I pay to get CONTENT? I posted here because I was told to when I spoke to Customer Service about this.

 

First, when I joined in February, of COURSE I did not go to any page that referenced KOTFE. I was just starting TOR and I did NOT want spoilers. So pointing to a page OTHER than the page on their site that you go to for more information for new subscribers doesn't change anything--so no, I didn't read a page that said the things you posted at all, and it's NOT on the initial subscriber page--so it's irrelevant. The page anyone who wants to subscribe to says that you will have access to ALL CONTENT. Period. It doesn't link to some other place or say *except for this and that. It just says ALL CONTENT so please don't act like I'm a idiot for thinking that it would be "all" content. It's not odd that someone who pays for a game to expect to have all playable content--even if it is an expansion you have to pay separately for.

 

http://www.swtor.com/free

 

They could have handled this by gating content behind a length of time, instead of a series of dates.

Instead of this day to this day--it could be as simple as "be with us for 6 months / 8 months / a year" and you will gain this content. Then the content is attainable by everyone who plays the game if they are loyal subbers.

 

To be honest, I still am boggled as to how if I am willing to PAY for content that YOU CAN HAVE FOR FREE--how could it even effect anyone else's game play at all? I'm also really curious at what kind of players actually WANT content kept away from new players like that?? I mean seriously!? What do you gain by keeping the content away from me? I'm seriously asking...because people took the time to actually say "no, we don't want you to have it"--which is just...hateful?

 

As far as how much I spent on the game since February--you misunderstand what I am trying to say--(written words suck so it's not surprising! ha) I was not saying that as leverage--I was saying it to point to my COMMITMENT to the game, despite being a baby subber. It's not some kind of bully tactic--the point I failed at conveying--it was to say that there are A LOT of people like me--who LIKE to spend money on these games. A lot like me play a game for years and then we're ready to try a different one. *shrug* I know for myself that when I start a new game if I fall in love with it, the first year is going to see me making a huge investment in not just a great deal of money, but time, and effort as well.

 

I'm also trying to say, I am just as valuable to this game since February as anyone else. There is no REASON to pretend that loyalty is bound to how long you have been with a game--if everyone would remain that loyal then the need to entice people to keep their subs would be moot.

 

I am NO LESS a fan of this game JUST because I hadn't known about the game before February--and I'll go toe to toe with that. How much you love a game is dependent on your involvement, what you put into it, and your dedication--not just your "start date". While I applaud those who have been at the game since the beginning--shout out to any other LOTRO founders!--I do NOT understand the idea that you are actually supportive of NEW people who WILL bring new income to the game, will continue to spend money IN the game, being denied CONTENT.

 

The bottom line, and I will stand by it--I was promised the content--if you can show me on the SUBSCRIBER page the info about certain content being locked, then I'll yield and we'll all go on our merry way, but I checked AGAIN and it is not there--and THAT is where people go to join the game!

 

It says in big bold yellow letters:

 

Get Unlimited Access to All Game Content and Features as a Subscriber!

 

So everyone is welcome to be mad that I even made a SUGGESTION in the SUGGESTION forum (not the debate--if such a thing exists here) because I believed what they TOLD me. They never promised that I would get every mount, every piece of armor, all of the housing items, all of the pets, or anything else--but they DID promise me the CONTENT. And that is the only thing I am discussing here.

 

But please, do not insult my intelligence by suggesting that I am wrong to expect this. Likewise, please don't think I am some self-entitled gamer who just wants everything she can't have. It has NOTHING to do with that. There are already TONS of things in game that I would love to have that I never will. Such is the luck of life when you aren't one of the first players in the gate. I just expect CONTENT. Because that *IS* what I pay for.

[Cayoimeah]

Wanted to add that if my words seem angry or confrontational--they aren't. If we were all sitting down at a table with a drink I think we'd all be laughing by now. =o)

[ibndeath]

I am in the same boat. I have my Founder title but i lapsed at one point, came back, etc. I only came back a month ago and I am on the last tier of DvL and I really like where they have taken the game... and I am very disappointed i will not be able to play the bonus chapter. I played KOTOR on release 3 times and my favorite part of the game was HK47 and I rebuilt him in KOTOR 2. I would love to play a bonus chapter for HK55 and i was disappointed in the story he had in the latest xpac (just avoiding spoilers by not speaking plainly).

 

So yeah... I want the bonus chapter. I bought a 6 month sub (not month to month) so i am sticking around for a while (especially considering there is a new xpac coming within that 6 months so i will undoubtedly renew)... I would be more than happy to get it from CM if needed... but I do agree with OP. I subbed for ALL content. I do think the unlocking would be better served with time gating rather than date gating.... this would open it up to any concurrent subscriber going forward. especially with the new player drive that is DvL... give them the reward for continued sub based on time... not date.

 

anyways, OP, I liked your post and your reasoning... we seem very similar... i am a completion addict. I also do not understand the elitst attitude of most young gamers either... i could care less what another player plays or has if it does not impact my ability to play the game. people that want to gate you or deny you are simply folks not worth grouping with or even talking to... I am here to have fun and experience the content in the game and with level sync i can do that now wihtout having to worry about level, gear, etc. If i outlevel something it no longer matters and i can just focus on the story and the folks i am playing with.

 

so please BW give some sort of option/quest/way of getting the chapter that you KNOW all old school KOTOR fans and players want... we want to kill meatbags as and HK unit.

 

keep having fun everyone... its why we play games.

[azudelphi]

For the record, I don't like the idea of a chapter as the reward. In fact have many issues with the structure of the subscriber rewards. But the terms of the program have been stated since before the launch of KotFE. You have my sympathy that you missed out because of timing, but not my support.

 

They can not advertise it as an exclusive reward only to change their mind at the last second. Even if they didn't lose a court case, they would lose a significant chunk of the dwindling subscriber base. Why be a subscriber when all you have to do is subscribe once at the end of a chapter and get the top tier subscriber reward.

 

So no, they shouldn't change their minds this time around. Moving forward, I agree they should reassess such a philosophy towards sub rewards.

Edited August 18, 2016 by azudelphi

[DirdamLaer]

Give us the companion to all loyal subscribtores from the beginning, calculated ligth or dark, and because noses are obliged to do 8 stories, it is not fair not to mention that we have more characters, is that we have to deleted old because they ask us to do 8 new?

besides the latter pack only thing good that had been the story but poorly mounted left you not choose peers nor create stories with them or talk or anything, or go for the planet and do missions, 4 Prieros chapters could combert easily in a single chapter or to create the alliance 1 whole chapter, the second form the alliance, 3 the final attack when troopers are added and step into nar-shaada when the last character joins, there put a story, what of teach Jedai tricks that is longer no "" get a drink "," teaching techniques and how to fight and according to the amount that fence up with the missions seek her these planets stories in the Mandalorian also a mission a chapter 10 minutes Lana for example chapter 3

 

we have many accounts is not fair that only reach the event, and I honestly do not think my character falling ill

 

PD: buy the game in 2011

 

Traductor Spanish:

que nos den el compañero a todos los subscribtores leales desde el principio,calculen ligth o dark, y porque narices estamos obligados a hacer las 8 historias, no es justo por no hablar de que tenemos mas personajes, es que nos toca borrar los antiguos porque nos piden que nos hagamos 8 nuevos?

ademas este ultimo pack lo unico bueno que tuvo fue la historia pero mal montada no te dejaba elegir a los compañeros ni tampoco crear historias con ellos ni hablar, ni nada, ni ir por el planeta y hacer misiones, los 4 prieros capitulos se podrian combertr facilmente en un solo capitulo o hasta crear la alianza 1 capitulo entero, el segundo formar la alianza, 3 el ataque definitivo cuando se agregan los troopers y de paso en nar-shaada cuando el ultimo personaje se une, poner ahi una historia, lo de enseñarle trucos jedai que sea mas largo no ""buscar una bebida"" ,enseñarle tecnicas y modo de combatir y segun la cantidad que vaya subiendo con las misiones buscaren esos planetas historias, en el mandalorian tambien alguna mision un capitulo 10 minutos el de Lana por ejemplo el capitulo 3

 

tenemos muchas cuentas no es justo que solo lleguen a las del evento, y yo la verdad no pienso hacer de personajes que me caen mal

Edited August 18, 2016 by DirdamLaer
faltas

[DirdamLaer]

While I have my problems with the game this is not one of then due to the fact they actually stated this on the page for KOTFE.

 

While you were reading that did you not see this as well:

 

 

HK-55 BONUS CHAPTER – PLAY AS HK-55!

BE A SUBSCRIBER FROM: JAN 11 – AUG 1**

RELEASE DATE TO BE ANNOUNCED IN FEBRUARY

Choose to be a continuous Subscriber from January 11 to August 1 and unlock a special bonus chapter where you PLAY AS HK-55, undertaking a special personal mission as the iconic Droid.

 

Don’t miss your chance to unlock this exciting bonus chapter!

 

 

http://www.swtor.com/fallen-empire/rewards

 

I was registered long before, and do not get me chapter

[Elchax]

In my opinion, this suggestion is relevant.

 

I have read the terms about the bonus chapter reward several times and I did not find any statement supporting the idea, that this would be the only way to achieve the reward. So, they are free to come up with other ways to achieve this reward in the future.

 

What I would perceive as fair - an option to achieve this reward by having a subscription for 7 consecutive months (which is roughly the same amount as from Jan 11th to Aug 1st) - maybe with several months delay after the release of the bonus chapter.

[Master_Neaj]

Just want to know when the release date is, before of after KOTFE???

[azudelphi]

In my opinion, this suggestion is relevant.

 

I have read the terms about the bonus chapter reward several times and I did not find any statement supporting the idea, that this would be the only way to achieve the reward. So, they are free to come up with other ways to achieve this reward in the future.

 

What I would perceive as fair - an option to achieve this reward by having a subscription for 7 consecutive months (which is roughly the same amount as from Jan 11th to Aug 1st) - maybe with several months delay after the release of the bonus chapter.

 

Hmm... I think there may be the pieces of a reasonable compromise here.

[Cayoimeah]

Hmm... I think there may be the pieces of a reasonable compromise here.

 

Yep, I never meant to cause such a stir--this was about reasonable compromise from the very first post I made. I don't understand what is so revolutionary about a company figuring out a way to make ALL of their players happy. As I have said, many times in this thread--I am willing to a) wait as long as necessary apart from *forever*, b) pay a fair amount of money, c) jump through any hurdles necessary and finally d) all of the above if that's going to get me the content.

 

I have had to write my responses multiple times before posting--as my tone is angry and disappointed--but this has shown me a REALLY ugly side of other players I did not know existed and it makes me really sad.

 

I want to give a huge shout-out to those here who wrote with RESPECT even when you disagreed with me. I sincerely appreciated your tone and manners! <3

[Keraejis]

In my opinion, this suggestion is relevant.

 

I have read the terms about the bonus chapter reward several times and I did not find any statement supporting the idea, that this would be the only way to achieve the reward. So, they are free to come up with other ways to achieve this reward in the future.

 

What I would perceive as fair - an option to achieve this reward by having a subscription for 7 consecutive months (which is roughly the same amount as from Jan 11th to Aug 1st) - maybe with several months delay after the release of the bonus chapter.

 

Legally there is nothing that says the bonus chapter is exclusive to those with subscriptions for the stated length of time but it is implied and will alienate a considerable amount of players who participated in this event. It could very well be construed as false advertising since I will be so bold to say that it was meant to be an incentive to keep players subscribed for the dates stated.

 

For BW to go back on this and sneak out through a loophole because the advertisement did not implicitly state exclusivity, would definitely cause many who subscribe to stop subscribing.

 

If they allow access to this content for those who weren't part of the incentive, subbing players will feel like they were thrown out with the trash by BW and BW will never get back their reputation and even future games will suffer.

 

I know I would not have subbed the entire time knowing that I could sub for one month during the last episode and received everything everyone else did who subbed the entire time. It is my belief that many many subs would not have subbed the entire time. I mean, those monthly rewards were not enough for me to sub and I was going to go F2P, but decided to stick around for the bonus content in hopes it would have some worthwhile playtime.

 

As someone has mentioned, I would not mind if the episode was gated behind an insane amount of something, whether it be real money or CC, but unless the episode was super-awesome-sweetness-yumyum, or a complete expansion in and of itself (as in hours and hours of non-repetitious play-through) no one would bother paying that much unless they just had money to throw away. And if that's the case, throw it my way!

[Cayoimeah]

::shrug::

 

I give up.

 

There is always going to be a sharp misunderstanding between those who are completely serious when they say that if BW gave ME this content then THEY would actually quit the game.

 

Cause, where's the outcry about all of the subbers who have just STARTED playing this game since February (NOT RETURNING SUBBERS but completely new ones!) and the threat that WE will walk out?

 

Oh, there isn't any, cause none of us would actually LEAVE the game over something so asinine. Good grief.

 

I'll just say again, it concerns me that apparently the ONLY reason anyone who's been here before February still stays subbed is because of the incentives. That's sad to me, and seems like the first death knoll for the game.

 

As someone has mentioned, I would not mind if the episode was gated behind an insane amount of something, whether it be real money or CC, but unless the episode was super-awesome-sweetness-yumyum, or a complete expansion in and of itself (as in hours and hours of non-repetitious play-through) no one would bother paying that much unless they just had money to throw away. And if that's the case, throw it my way!

 

I mentioned this in the very first post I made, and I still stand by it.

 

The issue with your statement is twofold.

 

First you assume I have "money to throw away"--which is not true.

 

Second, you are negating the content like it's immaterial and has no tangible value to me. It has INFINITE value to me and as such any money I spent on it would not be "thrown away" anymore than my monthly subscription costs are. I buy experiences with that money, and experiences are the REASON we all play these games?

 

The bottom line, subscriber rewards that are manifest as OBJECTS are something that make sense, rewards that are CONTENT are NOT the same. Period.

 

And also, to be clear, I won't be unsubbing because I don't get what I want--didn't come here with some self-entitlement issue, just came cause CS told me to. I love the game, not the rewards, and will continue play it no matter what happens with the HK content--disappointed or not. Makes me wonder who the loyal subber is after all?

Edited August 23, 2016 by Cayoimeah

[JaxstonEagle-Eye]

Don't give up. You can't state your case well enough to please everyone, not in a forum like this. I myself qualify for this "extra content''. I for one would be happy if the content itself was 'exclusive' long enough to satisfy legal and was then released free to all at a later date.