What stats distribution give you the possibilty to hit 6k+ DPS in Ops ?

[Suplax]

Sup guys , I've been trying to adjust here and there and I simply can't make it to 6k+ DPS in ops.

 

I would like to know if anyone know a stats distribution that give a Sin Deception the possibility to get to 6k+.

I'm even having trouble hitting 5.5k >_<.

 

I mean How much do you need in each stats to get that.

I'm only hitting 5.5k in luck because i'm having to sacrifice a little accuracy in order to do it, but I can't imagine anything i could change that will make me go 6k+.

 

Btw full augmented 220 and some 224 gear.

Thanks in advance to anyone who can help

 

EDIT - After all the info i gathered the only thing i was doing wrong was using blackout at wrong times.

I can't think of anything else i'm doing it wrong.

Here is the link of my latest combat log in the dummy , the numbers stay almost the same in all of then , around 5.5k. I've done all HM ops , I have no problem with then , but with this numbers I won't be able to go NiM with my sin.

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/178990

 

EDIT 2 - HAD uploaded the wrong one where i use lacerate mostly , hours practicing at the dummy ><" sorry

This is my normal rotation.

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179035

Edited June 2, 2016 by Suplax
spelling error

[lord-angelus]

first of all how much are you parsing on dummy ? secondly i think you should use 110+ accuracy always, so you dont miss.

[LudhaninRolgge]

Lambastate + a **** ton of adds

[FlavivsAetivs]

Deception/Infiltration is very difficult to do well on in actual ops. I typically hit anywhere from 4.5 to 5.5K, and I parse over 6K. I can hit almost 6K on the stupidly easy bosses, like Karagga.

 

There are also some bosses that Infil shadow can't do. NiM Brontes you can't bring an infil shadow, I don't know if you can bring one on HM even.

 

Serenity also struggles, although not as badly as infiltration.

 

~ Eudoxia

Edited June 1, 2016 by FlavivsAetivs

[sumquy]

it's not about the gear. of all the things you can do to improve dps, increased gearing is one of the least effective. it has to be done, or the leet raiders will make fun of you, but it is not going to increase your dps by any impressive amount. going from 220 to 224 is not going to give you 500 more dps no matter what stats are on it. at a certain point in the game you just have to get gud...or not. start by looking at the parsley operations leaderboards for boss fights so that you can compare your actions per minute to theirs. look at the percentage of damage from each ability and compare it to yours. when in the fight, you have to have very good raid awareness and experience to know when adds are going to pop and/or a move is required. the difference between anticipating the add spawn, with aoe ready, vs. hitting them 2 seconds later after your teammates have half killed them already is huge. you need to find all of the little fraction of a second pauses in the fight and eliminate them. go over your parse damage line by line and look at all the places where your next ability is firing off 1.6 seconds after your previous instead of 1.501 and click faster. stop clicking and hotkey everything.

 

good luck!

 

postscript after rereading what i wrote: it is important to understand that it is impossible to do all of those things every pull. the parses that we put up on the leaderboards are 1 in 100, where everything went right, AND we got lucky. that is not an exaggeration either. i doubt there are any operations bosses in this game that i haven't pulled at least 100 times. some of those were the best on the boards and so i posted them, but i don't expect to hit that number every time, just within a few percentage points of it.

Edited June 1, 2016 by sumquy

[Suplax]

first of all how much are you parsing on dummy ? secondly i think you should use 110+ accuracy always, so you dont miss.

 

At the dummy i'm doing 5.5k - 5.7k.

In ops is really random.

Sometimes i do 5.5k sometimes 4.3k...

 

Anyone who can put 6k + as Sin Deception can give your stats ?

Like how much you have at your stats.

Edited June 1, 2016 by Suplax

[lord-angelus]

Well given that the difference beetween 220-224 gear difference is only about 1.5% - %3 percent , your stats wont help you that much but let me give you a couple ideas for better dps output. As a sin you dont have any luxary to make mistakes. First of all you should always start with your opener (talking about pre-cast crushing darkness opener). So your tanks should do proper countdown before the fight.

 

You have know and think about every mechanic of the fight and how to improve your dps as well. Placing phasewalks correctly as a gap closers can help you big time on staying on the boses since we dont have viable gap closer ability.For example on dp Nim second boss, or tfb first boss, comes to my mind atm.And i suggest you to bind your force speed somewhere easy (im using a razer anansi keyboard so i press it with my left thumb). Remember key is the staying on the boss. And for that part lasty i can suggest using the force shroud correctly as well. For example on tfb nim dread guards when the lighting phase begins i use the force cloak to activate the first shroud (delaying the force cloak on the opener) and use shroud again when the second lighting hits. So instead of moving to the corners i can stay on the boss and dps.

 

Using blackout- force cloak properly is very important for not getting force menagement issues as well. Force cloak also ends the cd on blackout as well as the recklesness.

 

For the thinking of the mechanic of the fight is really important. For example in deletion phase in operator 9, you can see the remaning shield time on the boss's target bar. Instead of just waiting you can properly land the crushing darkness to extra dps. Its not much but still , landing crashing mind x4-5 times properly its better than doing nothing on that boss (assuming al the adds are dead)

 

If you serious about raiding I would strongly suggest that you should learn the hatred as well. On a fights like Titan6 on SnV or DP first boss , spreading the dots and aoe ing does wonders on numbers.

 

Lets come to the stats tough since that was your question. I didnt theory craft on 4.0 so Im using the Bants stats as well. But Im leaning to the critical more than alacrity. (On the mobile so not %100 sure but 13~~ crit, 89~ alacrity, 701 acc). Perhaps Aelanis or solona can post their stat which will be more helpfull to you.

 

But in the end deception pve is a joke and not viable for the lastest bosses of NiM content. Hell , İ wouldnt take any sin to my raid group and my main and favorite class is a sin.

 

4.3 dps for operations tough, thats totally on you. On dummies practice until you see of avarage 6.2 -6.3 ( İ know, hate the dummies as well). Practice until rotation is your second nature, and feels natural. Then keep the pointers i gave you abone and add more to them, Maybe Aelanis is also in the nice mode and can give further tips on operation bosses as well. But i think your main problem atm is rotation and operation knowledge.

 

 

I understand putting the effort and not seeing the numbers is really frasturating, I've been there. ıf you were playing a merc you would have pulled more numbers for the same kinda knowledge level. Unless they seperate pve and pvp damage we are not gonna see Real class balance. Begining on 4.0 I was happy that we were finally a place we deserve but 3 patches later, booom, worst place ever, again. I've never been a fotm player but playing more pt these days cause bored af, and lost all of the hope towards bioware.

Edited June 2, 2016 by lord-angelus
Edit : typos

[LudhaninRolgge]

There are also some bosses that Infil shadow can't do. NiM Brontes you can't bring an infil shadow, I don't know if you can bring one on HM even.

 

It's not a problem in HM, just an annoyance. I have yet to try it in NiM though

 

At the dummy i'm doing 5.5k - 5.7k.

In ops is really random.

Sometimes i do 5.5k sometimes 4.3k...

 

Anyone who can put 6k + as Sin Deception can give your stats ?

Like how much you have at your stats.

 

Have you even read the post just above yours ? Gear won't magically make you do 1000 more DPS. The difference between 220 and 224 is (theoretically) 3.8%, that's 244 DPS. Proper optimization is even less of a DPS gain, something around 1%.

What is gonna make you gain DPS in ops is actual practice. The more you know a boss, the more you can anticipate and the less DPS you'll lose.

 

Doing 6k+ in a boss fight is not impossible though, but you have to meet several conditions. The boss either need to not move, making it a dummy (Nefra or Grob'thok for example), have a lot of adds (Corruptor Zero or The Eyeless) or have some sort of damage increase (Malaphar or Kephess The Undying). For the rest, it most likely is the way how stealthing out is handled that's skewing the parse (you can notice 2' parse on Styrak for example)

[FlavivsAetivs]

Granted though, having the right stats can help a lot. I have my accuracy at 700 (cause that's what you want in full 224), then I max out my crit (I don't remember what it is, but 1540 is the cap), and then I use about 930ish alacrity. I don't remember if I had anything left to dump into power or not.

 

If you've got no alacrity and everything dumped into accuracy or stuff like that, that can actually have a serious impact.

 

The trick with Infiltration is knowing the stuff most people don't pick up on right away. It's pretty easy cause all the procs glow, but you gotta do them in the right order. Clairvoyant Strike keeps up your 2 stacks of... something I can't remember, that you want 100% uptime one. The priority is Force breach > Psychokinetic blast > Shadow Strike/Whirling Blow > Clairvoyant Strike. Blackout restores force energy faster, force potency Procs Force Breach, and cloak knocks a minute off the cooldown on force potency and gives the force energy regeneration. Battle readiness gives you a brief damage boost and you want to coordinate its cooldown with your adrenal (I use crit adrenal... dunno if crit or power is better.)

 

~ Eudoxia

Edited June 2, 2016 by FlavivsAetivs

[Suplax]

Thx for the help guys , back to the training dummy it is

 

I'll make good use of all these information.

[Suplax]

Updated.

[Greezt]

Without looking at your rotation, if you increase your APM to 49.4 (Bant's recommended APM for 220 gear) you should get to ~5850 dps with your current gear.

 

You seem to be using recklessness a bit late in your opener. You want to use it off the bat, unless you're opening with crushing darkness (you're not).

 

Why are you using lacerate on a dummy? It's AoE...

 

Also, seems to me like you're using maul a bit too much.

 

That's all I could glean from an admittedly short look at your parse. I'd say - work on your opener and on APM. If you have your priorities right, that should give you a nice dps boost.

[Suplax]

Without looking at your rotation, if you increase your APM to 49.4 (Bant's recommended APM for 220 gear) you should get to ~5850 dps with your current gear.

 

You seem to be using recklessness a bit late in your opener. You want to use it off the bat, unless you're opening with crushing darkness (you're not).

 

Why are you using lacerate on a dummy? It's AoE...

 

Also, seems to me like you're using maul a bit too much.

 

That's all I could glean from an admittedly short look at your parse. I'd say - work on your opener and on APM. If you have your priorities right, that should give you a nice dps boost.

 

Yeah I've uploaded the wrong parse , I usually use Voltaic Slash instead of lacerate , it's just that I kept trying different things in the dummy for like 3-4 hours , trying different combos.

But the damage output is almost the same , I always stay around 5.5k - 5.6k if i'm lucky.

[Suplax]

Right parse file , sorry was late and i was tired of training at the dummy.

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179035

[lord-angelus]

Right parse file , sorry was late and i was tired of training at the dummy.

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179035

 

This is so wrong in so many levels.

Lacarate twice before the fight. - stealth -

Precast mind crash- recklesness +attack adrenal - discharge - Phantom stride - discharge - ball lighting - maul - volcanic slash x 2. - blackout - ball lighting - discharge....... Should be your opener then comes the force cloak so on and so on..

[lord-angelus]

And who are you using lacarate on a single target? Why are you using recklesness after ball lighting. You just wasted a stack there... I think you should go back the dummy and learn the rotation., do your opener correclty and with little luck you should start from 9.8 -11k dps ..

[LudhaninRolgge]

You're wasting too many stacks of Surging Charge. You should use Discharge the next GCD it has proc'd. Also, your Phantom Stride and Recklessness usage is wrong. You should always use Recklessness after a "natural" Discharge as for Phantom Stride so you don't waste stacks. And if you're in the case where Recklessness has less than 30" remaining to its CD, delay your PS that way you can do 3 Discharges back to back to back. It goes like this : "natural" Discharge > Recklessness + Discharge > PS + Discharge. That way, you ensure you have 2 crit Discharges.

Your Force Cloak usage is also wrong and you seem to delay your Blackout. Don't. It's a loss in force regen and thus a DPS loss. You want to use BO on CD. You'll use it 3 times then only after the 3rd time use your FC. You'll delay FC a bit by doing that, but that's not a problem since it makes it possible to squeeze another BO before stealthing out and makes you able to do BO > FC > BO in a row.

Angelus gave you the standard parsing opener, I'll add something to add. In order to maximize your force regen, you should always wait till the DE you get from coming out of stealth falls off then use BO to have a new DE. When it falls off, stealth out to have a new DE again and finally when this one falls off, use your BO to get a last one. This sets up you BO/FC usage for the rest of the fight.

[Suplax]

And who are you using lacarate on a single target? Why are you using recklesness after ball lighting. You just wasted a stack there... I think you should go back the dummy and learn the rotation., do your opener correclty and with little luck you should start from 9.8 -11k dps ..

 

You're wasting too many stacks of Surging Charge. You should use Discharge the next GCD it has proc'd. Also, your Phantom Stride and Recklessness usage is wrong. You should always use Recklessness after a "natural" Discharge as for Phantom Stride so you don't waste stacks. And if you're in the case where Recklessness has less than 30" remaining to its CD, delay your PS that way you can do 3 Discharges back to back to back. It goes like this : "natural" Discharge > Recklessness + Discharge > PS + Discharge. That way, you ensure you have 2 crit Discharges.

Your Force Cloak usage is also wrong and you seem to delay your Blackout. Don't. It's a loss in force regen and thus a DPS loss. You want to use BO on CD. You'll use it 3 times then only after the 3rd time use your FC. You'll delay FC a bit by doing that, but that's not a problem since it makes it possible to squeeze another BO before stealthing out and makes you able to do BO > FC > BO in a row.

Angelus gave you the standard parsing opener, I'll add something to add. In order to maximize your force regen, you should always wait till the DE you get from coming out of stealth falls off then use BO to have a new DE. When it falls off, stealth out to have a new DE again and finally when this one falls off, use your BO to get a last one. This sets up you BO/FC usage for the rest of the fight.

 

I really Don't know what i'm doing wrong , I just started with Crushing Darkness and did better at dischargers.

Now I got to 5.7k + dps.

It will be impossible to make to NiM with sin. One slightly mistake and your dps go down ><"

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179400

[LudhaninRolgge]

I really Don't know what i'm doing wrong , I just started with Crushing Darkness and did better at dischargers.

Now I got to 5.7k + dps.

It will be impossible to make to NiM with sin. One slightly mistake and your dps go down ><"

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179400

 

You stealth out too early. By doing that, you're missing out 1 BO. When your FC comes off CD don't use it right away, instead delay it until BO comes off CD.

 

You also seems to delay all your BO, I don't know why. By doing so, you delay your FC which delay your nex BO and your Recklessness.

[Suplax]

You stealth out too early. By doing that, you're missing out 1 BO. When your FC comes off CD don't use it right away, instead delay it until BO comes off CD.

 

You also seems to delay all your BO, I don't know why. By doing so, you delay your FC which delay your nex BO and your Recklessness.

 

I think I'm getting it better , but i really dont know how can I improve more .

Now i'm getting 5.9k + thx to you guys

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179400

[LudhaninRolgge]

I think I'm getting it better , but i really dont know how can I improve more .

Now i'm getting 5.9k + thx to you guys

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179400

 

You posted the same parse. But I'm happy that helped you. Deception is not a hard spec to play, but there are some tips and tricks to master before being above average and it takes time ^^

[Suplax]

You posted the same parse. But I'm happy that helped you. Deception is not a hard spec to play, but there are some tips and tricks to master before being above average and it takes time ^^

 

Sorry here it is

 

http://parsely.io/parser/view/179497

 

I know right ?

So unfair that mara or merc can get good numbers without suffering so much

Bioware need to give some love to sin.

[Zamilork]

This is so wrong in so many levels.

Lacarate twice before the fight. - stealth -

Precast mind crash- recklesness +attack adrenal - discharge - Phantom stride - discharge - ball lighting - maul - volcanic slash x 2. - blackout - ball lighting - discharge....... Should be your opener then comes the force cloak so on and so on..

 

* Pre cast lac x2 stealth, CrD->Rek+DC->PS-> DC->BL-VS->M

Forgot the autocrit

[danhatto]

maybe learn hatred as well? its actually really fun, and a better preforming spec. im not saying you cant play deception, im saying maybe you should play both

[Kinman]

Hey there!

 

I don't know my stats by hard but can provide them in a few hours when I'm at home. I play a shadow in Serenity and Infiltration and getting 6k+ DPS on a boss is a way harder than getting it on the dummy. By looking at your parse, I see that your APM is not as high as it should be. Maybe you have less Alacrity in your build.

 

I never open with Mind Crush/Crushing Darkness, because I don't like to precast and I like to have a longer increased force regeneration time.

 

Here's a parse: http://parsely.io/parser/view/157571/0

 

On bosses:

• You have to know the boss mechanics really, really good.
  
• If you have some time in the fight, were you aren't at the boss, use it as force regeneration. That means, that you exploit your force beforehand, you time your Blackout/Force Cloak according.
  
• You have to use your 10m range of Psychokinetic Blast (Ball Lightning?).
  
• Use your AoE to build stacks if you're not at the boss.
  
• Use Phase Walk and Force Speed as gap closer instead of Shadow/Phantom Stride, if possible.
  
• Time your bursts with burn phases (f.e. Kephess).
  
• At the end of the fight you should have all your force exploited. Remaining force means, that you haven't maxed out your attacks. You have to get a feeling, when you start this "exhaust" phase.
  
• Only do "real" DPS. DPS on adds which don't need DPS and are only for the parse are complete useless. Don't boost your DPS with such crap.
  
• Learn the rotation over and over until you can do it blindfold.
  
• Learn to recover from mistakes (force exhausted).
  
• Learn using Resilience (Shroud) to stay longer on the boss.

 

Best regards

Kinman