Where most jedi during the end of the old Jedi order weak?

[raandomname]

20 something jedi Grevious killed the only other non force user who killed more was the BH and even that was hard to believe. The point still stands they did not used the force to kill him. They could have done that as its very efficient look at how Tano managed if she used the force. Look how Windu managed as he really damaged his internal organs with it.

Why don't they use the force well because they can't they have not been trained to do that. Unless you are Anakin you will will not become stronger then the Jedi of old.

First of all Grievous killed over 100 Jedi.

 

There are several reasons as to why telekinetic attacks dont work on Grievous. First is his speed. Grievous was shown to dodge telekinetic blasts from high level Jedi in OCW, an average knight would have had no chance of hitting him. He can anchor himself into the ground using the magnetic claws on his feet to resist force pushes. He is also very durable making it almost impossible for an average knight to damage him by simply smashing him into a wall. The reason Mace could cripple him was his immense strength in the force and that his shatterpoint likely revealed the weaknesses of Grievous' body.

[adormitul]

Wow he really killed over 100 jedi?

The best I could find was 20 something where can I get better information about the number of jedi he killed?

When he was hit by force push in the scenes I saw he was quite stunned for a while.

[raandomname]

Wow he really killed over 100 jedi?

The best I could find was 20 something where can I get better information about the number of jedi he killed?

When he was hit by force push in the scenes I saw he was quite stunned for a while.

Check out his respect thread.

 

I guess the scenes were from TWC which isnt the real Grievous.

[adormitul]

Check out his respect thread.

 

I guess the scenes were from TWC which isnt the real Grievous.

 

There where from the Star Wars:The Clone Wars both the 2003 cartoons and the 2008 animation something. Both shown Grevious quite affected by a force push.

Also does it mean that most of his kills where not shown either in a comic, a book, a movie or in animated format?

Does TWC means the 2008 clone wars series? Why are they not showing the real Grievous?

Edited December 5, 2015 by adormitul

[ConVallian]

Something else that people tend to overlook is that Yoda was training these generations specifically for when the Sith resurfaced, with the Jedi trials including having to keep up sparring with a Battlemaster, or even the Grand Master, for hours.

 

I hadn't thought of that, but truthfully hours spent in the class room can't prepare you like a true life experience can. Especially like a conflict as huge as the Clone Wars .I believe the PT order had more "skilled" duelists than the OR. But i use music as an example, you have this kid who had been taught and trained for years to read write and play his piano, when he gets old he has all this knowledge of his instrument and note music, he is a great musician, but then you get the kid who grew teaching himself playing by ear, he cant read notes but he can play the devil out of his instrument. He gets old while the one has more "knowledge" and been trained to have more "skill" if you will,but the kid who taught himself is just as good as the other in terms of actually playing music.

 

but i think the OR had more conviction than the PT common jedi, they were not afraid to kill notice if it was for the greater good. they were always on guard.Sometimes actually allowed marriage although it was advised against and frowned upon it still happened. As for the PT masters being overwhelmed in numbers..i'll give them that. In terms of stability and numbers i'd say the PT were a stronger Order, but the OR order had more powerful jedi in their ranks. The Jedi of the PT era were peacekeepers not soldiers as the man himself said, but they were beginning to become warriors. The OR order jedi were already warriors.

 

Was the Jedi Order in the PT weaker than OR? No, it was probably stronger which would make what Sidious said a few times true that the Order had become blinded by arrogance, they were narrow-minded which is probably how he was able to trap them without them knowing it. The OR jedi, not all but alot fought with conviction, and weren't as narrow minded or arrogant in their Seat of Power in the republic. I just believe the OR had more powerful Jedi in their ranks at a time than the Pt era did. But both had their champions and and both had their average joes

[PadsterPwns]

I hadn't thought of that, but truthfully hours spent in the class room can't prepare you like a true life experience can. Especially like a conflict as huge as the Clone Wars .I believe the PT order had more "skilled" duelists than the OR. But i use music as an example, you have this kid who had been taught and trained for years to read write and play his piano, when he gets old he has all this knowledge of his instrument and note music, he is a great musician, but then you get the kid who grew teaching himself playing by ear, he cant read notes but he can play the devil out of his instrument. He gets old while the one has more "knowledge" and been trained to have more "skill" if you will,but the kid who taught himself is just as good as the other in terms of actually playing music.

 

but i think the OR had more conviction than the PT common jedi, they were not afraid to kill notice if it was for the greater good. they were always on guard.Sometimes actually allowed marriage although it was advised against and frowned upon it still happened. As for the PT masters being overwhelmed in numbers..i'll give them that. In terms of stability and numbers i'd say the PT were a stronger Order, but the OR order had more powerful jedi in their ranks. The Jedi of the PT era were peacekeepers not soldiers as the man himself said, but they were beginning to become warriors. The OR order jedi were already warriors.

 

Was the Jedi Order in the PT weaker than OR? No, it was probably stronger which would make what Sidious said a few times true that the Order had become blinded by arrogance, they were narrow-minded which is probably how he was able to trap them without them knowing it. The OR jedi, not all but alot fought with conviction, and weren't as narrow minded or arrogant in their Seat of Power in the republic. I just believe the OR had more powerful Jedi in their ranks at a time than the Pt era did. But both had their champions and and both had their average joes

 

This I can roughly agree with but the PT Champions are mostly better than their OR counterparts, especially when it comes to Yoda vs Shan. As far as saying that the OR Jedi had more conviction, I think that's debatable as the PT Jedi had the conviction to stay by their morals in their darkest time whereas the OR Jedi were more pragmatic but still had the conviction to stay true to what they believed.

 

The only part I don't agree with is the first part as the PT Jedi have had generations to improve their technique and make/discover new ones.

[PadsterPwns]

First of all Grievous killed over 100 Jedi.

 

There are several reasons as to why telekinetic attacks dont work on Grievous. First is his speed. Grievous was shown to dodge telekinetic blasts from high level Jedi in OCW, an average knight would have had no chance of hitting him. He can anchor himself into the ground using the magnetic claws on his feet to resist force pushes. He is also very durable making it almost impossible for an average knight to damage him by simply smashing him into a wall. The reason Mace could cripple him was his immense strength in the force and that his shatterpoint likely revealed the weaknesses of Grievous' body.

 

Random can I use this anytime a certain someone tries to mock me about Grievous dodging telekinetic attacks? I'll pay if necessary.

[ConVallian]

This I can roughly agree with but the PT Champions are mostly better than their OR counterparts, especially when it comes to Yoda vs Shan. As far as saying that the OR Jedi had more conviction, I think that's debatable as the PT Jedi had the conviction to stay by their morals in their darkest time whereas the OR Jedi were more pragmatic but still had the conviction to stay true to what they believed.

 

The only part I don't agree with is the first part as the PT Jedi have had generations to improve their technique and make/discover new ones.

 

I don't know man, i don't think Shan and Yoda are that far apart from each other. Correct me if im wrong but it i think it was said the Revan/Shan family line's strength in the force was second only to the Skywalker line. I used to think Satele probably would've sensed palpatine's plot before it would be to late had she been alive in that era, but i doubt that now seeing as how Revan was able to build an army of traitors under her nose. If you want my personal opinion, bottom line i think once you reach a certain level of power/skill in the force i dont think there is a definite "stronger". The fights will just play out, just like you can't say since a Kung Fu master defeated a muay thai boxer that Kung Fu is a better art. It also doesnt mean he would win a second time or against another Muat thai boxer of equal skill and experience.

 

So in short my true opinion would be most of the order's strongest masters were on par with each other no matter the era, But you still have people like Revan who was the greatest Warrior if his era as stated many times, then you get Dooku who was the greatest duelists of his era. Also being stronger doesnt guarantee victory, PT is great example i mean you have Kenobi who couldn't beat Dooku who lost to anakin and in turn anakin lost to kenobi. Can we say kenobi is stronger than anakin because anakin defeated someone he lost to? No we all know without a doubt Anakin was far more powerful but when they fought looked who walked away and look who had to live the rest of his live in life-support suit. But if we used that logic we could say anakin is a good as yoda and yoda was said to be one of the only duelists to rival Dooku, and sidious fought on par with yoda as dooku did, and anakin killed dooku, and Kenobi defeated anakin, but kenobi wasn't strong enough to face the emperor according to yoda but could beat Vader who beat a guy whos skills with a lightsaber rivaled yoda's. That's how I look at it the OR didn't have stronger jedi than PT neither did the PT have stronger jedi than the OR, just the select few remarkable individuals who reshaped the galaxy.

Edited December 5, 2015 by ConVallian

[adormitul]

Bultar Swan, K'Kruhk, Quinlan Vos, A'Sharad Hett, Fay, Nahdar Vebb, Krell, Ima-Gun Di, Aayla Secura and Rahm Kota. These are the ones I would put first, though there are likely quite a few others that are better than these.

 

Okay took me some time to read about all but K'Kruhk no he was not impressive at all he lost against Grevious and Ventress and the only good thing about him is that he survived a long time but he was non the less not impressive he survived because he hide a lot.

Fay well sorry to say so but no she was not impressive especially because of how she died did she not learned force sense? She did had a interesting ability but in the end she was just a average jedi why well you have to beat Ventress at least to not be one.

Nahdar Vebb this hell no this guy was the definition of average really use the force you idiot when you fight Grevious push then push more and then more and he had so many opportunities when Grevious was distracted but no he went lightsaber duel way. Do not let him get close and have the advantage.

Pong Krell yeah do I really have to say why this guy? He got shoot in the back after he got captured while he knew he was gonna be attacked by the clones unlike during order 66 this time he knew and still lost. By the way he was captured first really captured not killed do I have to tell you how weak that is?

Ima-Gun Di no nothing impressive about him just a good person and a great man but not a great jedi sorry but that is the truth what he did even a normal non force user could have done.

Rahm Kota this guy was weak a rackdoll jedi master he only got owned everytime I saw him fight.

Edited December 5, 2015 by adormitul

[raandomname]

There where from the Star Wars:The Clone Wars both the 2003 cartoons and the 2008 animation something. Both shown Grevious quite affected by a force push.

Also does it mean that most of his kills where not shown either in a comic, a book, a movie or in animated format?

Does TWC means the 2008 clone wars series? Why are they not showing the real Grievous?

OCW stands for old clone wars, the 2003 cartoon, TCW stands for the clone wars, the new cartoon.

 

In OCW and most/all other sources of that time period Grievous kicks @, while in TWC he is a real looser which is why I describe TWC Grievous as not the real Grievous.

 

Unlike as in TWC, in OCW Grievous is not strongly effected by telekinetic attacks. Iirc he is not damaged by tk on Hypori and on Coruscant he dodges 2 tk attacks, appears undamaged by a third one that hits him and is only force crushed by Mace due to reasons already explained multiple times such as shatterpoint, Mace's strength in the force, the fact that Grievous was trying to flee not fight, Grievous most likely expecting Mace to attack with the lightsaber etc.

[adormitul]

He is weaker in the new animated series but its canon and yep that is him. Well this like superman with kryptonite in some issues he could resists tones of it and in some he could not resist a pebble and that was after we saw him resist the tons of kryptonite.

[raandomname]

Okay took me some time to read about all but K'Kruhk no he was not impressive at all he lost against Grevious and Ventress and the only good thing about him is that he survived a long time but he was non the less not impressive he survived because he hide a lot.

Fay well sorry to say so but no she was not impressive especially because of how she died did she not learned force sense? She did had a interesting ability but in the end she was just a average jedi why well you have to beat Ventress at least to not be one.

Nahdar Vebb this hell no this guy was the definition of average really use the force you idiot when you fight Grevious push then push more and then more and he had so many opportunities when Grevious was distracted but no he went lightsaber duel way. Do not let him get close and have the advantage.

Pong Krell yeah do I really have to say why this guy? He got shoot in the back after he got captured while he knew he was gonna be attacked by the clones unlike during order 66 this time he knew and still lost. By the way he was captured first really captured not killed do I have to tell you how weak that is?

Ima-Gun Di no nothing impressive about him just a good person and a great man but not a great jedi sorry but that is the truth what he did even a normal non force user could have done.

Rahm Kota this guy was weak a rackdoll jedi master he only got owned everytime I saw him fight.

How is it a poor feat to loose to Starkiller? Everyone in the OR Jedi order would have lost to Starkiller. The fact that Kota was even able to have a fight and wasnt crushed instantly, the fact that he wasnt even really trying to win and the fact that he survived already put him head and shoulders above most of the OR order.

Its also not a sign of weakness to loose to Ventress and especially Grievous as basically everyone in the OR order would have lost to them.

[raandomname]

He is weaker in the new animated series but its canon and yep that is him. Well this like superman with kryptonite in some issues he could resists tones of it and in some he could not resist a pebble and that was after we saw him resist the tons of kryptonite.

The difference is that TWC is a single source that portrays Grievous as terrible while there are around a dozen sources that portray him as awesome thus TWC's portrayal is not representative.

[Kaedusz]

The difference is that TWC is a single source that portrays Grievous as terrible while there are around a dozen sources that portray him as awesome thus TWC's portrayal is not representative.

 

1. There isn't much difference. Grievous is roughly the same in both

2. If Grievous isn't representative then nothing from these series is. It's a logical dead end.

Edited December 6, 2015 by Kaedusz

[PadsterPwns]

Okay took me some time to read about all but K'Kruhk no he was not impressive at all he lost against Grevious and Ventress and the only good thing about him is that he survived a long time but he was non the less not impressive he survived because he hide a lot.

Fay well sorry to say so but no she was not impressive especially because of how she died did she not learned force sense? She did had a interesting ability but in the end she was just a average jedi why well you have to beat Ventress at least to not be one.

Nahdar Vebb this hell no this guy was the definition of average really use the force you idiot when you fight Grevious push then push more and then more and he had so many opportunities when Grevious was distracted but no he went lightsaber duel way. Do not let him get close and have the advantage.

Pong Krell yeah do I really have to say why this guy? He got shoot in the back after he got captured while he knew he was gonna be attacked by the clones unlike during order 66 this time he knew and still lost. By the way he was captured first really captured not killed do I have to tell you how weak that is?

Ima-Gun Di no nothing impressive about him just a good person and a great man but not a great jedi sorry but that is the truth what he did even a normal non force user could have done.

Rahm Kota this guy was weak a rackdoll jedi master he only got owned everytime I saw him fight.

Like Random said losing to Ventress or Grievous isn't a mark against them as most OR Jedi would have lost to them too. The same goes about Kota vs Starkiller, in fact Starkiller would probably beat any OR Jedi bar Revan, and even then Revan wouldn't win easily.

 

As for Nahdar Vebb, how can you not call him powerful? Considering he only became a Jedi Knight part way through the Clone Wars his feats of casually scrapping magnaguards, surviving Gor and dueling Grievous are feats that some Jedi Masters wouldn't be able to replicate. Also while Vebb could have Force pushed him, this is a prime example of how Yoda was right in saying some Jedi were becoming too arrogant.

 

When you were talking about Krell being captured by clones you seem to have forgotten that he slaughtered a mini-army of clones first and that he was only captured because he got caught by a creature that almost killed an ARC trooper and couldn't move meaning they had a chance to stun him.

 

Ima-Gun Di actually did something that would be practically impossible for a non-Force sensitive, he managed to hold of a massive army of droids in one area whilst everyone around him was being slaughtered and he was only killed when they completely surrounded him. So saying that a non-Force sensitive could do that isn't very convincing, especially since every non-Force sensitive around him was killed first.

 

[PadsterPwns]

1. There isn't much difference. Grievous is roughly the same in both

2. If Grievous isn't representative then nothing from these series is. It's a logical dead end.

 

1. Not really, in ROTS we see him almost break Kenobi's defense whereas in TCW they mostly stalemate.

2. Not too sure what you're trying to say, I'm really tired atm so sorry if it's something simple.

[Kaedusz]

1. Not really, in ROTS we see him almost break Kenobi's defense whereas in TCW they mostly stalemate.

2. Not too sure what you're trying to say, I'm really tired atm so sorry if it's something simple.

 

1. This doesn't mean anything. Try to view the characters as real people, not as a card in a card game with a list of abilities and feats written on it. For example, you don't see an athlete performing the same in every competition, despite that he is the same guy in all of them. It doesn't work like that.

 

2. You can't nitpick characters from TCW series and decide they are fake. Either the whole series are valid or the whole series aren't.

Edited December 6, 2015 by Kaedusz

[adormitul]

Like Random said losing to Ventress or Grievous isn't a mark against them as most OR Jedi would have lost to them too. The same goes about Kota vs Starkiller, in fact Starkiller would probably beat any OR Jedi bar Revan, and even then Revan wouldn't win easily.

 

As for Nahdar Vebb, how can you not call him powerful? Considering he only became a Jedi Knight part way through the Clone Wars his feats of casually scrapping magnaguards, surviving Gor and dueling Grievous are feats that some Jedi Masters wouldn't be able to replicate. Also while Vebb could have Force pushed him, this is a prime example of how Yoda was right in saying some Jedi were becoming too arrogant.

 

When you were talking about Krell being captured by clones you seem to have forgotten that he slaughtered a mini-army of clones first and that he was only captured because he got caught by a creature that almost killed an ARC trooper and couldn't move meaning they had a chance to stun him.

 

Ima-Gun Di actually did something that would be practically impossible for a non-Force sensitive, he managed to hold of a massive army of droids in one area whilst everyone around him was being slaughtered and he was only killed when they completely surrounded him. So saying that a non-Force sensitive could do that isn't very convincing, especially since every non-Force sensitive around him was killed first.

 

 

Yeah I doubt Garek would have defeated the Jedi Exile without doing it covertly. Also the same with the Consular that guy is a beast. But that is not the issue here Kota fought Garek with the help of army and still lost. He was in not any advantage against him and was a very unfair fight for him and still won.Do you get why I think Kota was not impressive

 

Now do you know how Ventress got so strong? She was not trained in anything special she developed force choke and the use of the force so well mostly by herself. I mean really she was a self trained dark adept besides of course the training she got from her jedi master mattered but she was so strong that she could defeat jedi masters in her own right. Can anyone explain why a self trained force adept was so strong?

Because I can most jedi had poor training even her master died because of that poor training while she lived and eliminated all opposition on the planet. That is why I say that all who can't defeat Ventress are not impressive she is a self trained dark acolyte for gods sake be stronger then her to actually be a impressive jedi prove that you rose above that terrible training of yours.

 

Nahdar Vebb is not impressive that he became a jedi knight half way the clone wars because that was stupid Tano had better feats then him and she was only a padawan and she did manged to keep up with Grevious because she used the freaking force. She even cut his hands their first meeting. Also arrogance is not a excuse for the ****** way he fought Dooku. Magna Guards are droids pretty sure they fight according to a program and can not improvise you can so do it. That arrogance and poor display he had against Grevious was why I think he was not impressive.

 

Ima-Gun Di well I have a simple argument why he was not impressive. http://www.cracked.com/article_19306_the-6-most-epic-one-man-armies-in-history-war.html enjoy. Also that article is also my reason why four arms was not a impressive jedi because normal humans killed scores of other humans who where soldiers in the battlefield and they did not had the force.

Edited December 6, 2015 by adormitul

[PadsterPwns]

Yeah I doubt Garek would have defeated the Jedi Exile without doing it covertly. Also the same with the Consular that guy is a beast. But that is not the issue here Kota fought Garek with the help of army and still lost. He was in not any advantage against him and was a very unfair fight for him and still won.Do you get why I think Kota was not impressive

 

Keep in mind that Kota had been noted as a threat to the Empire and he and his militia had been raiding their ships for ages as the Empire couldn't catch them. That alone is a great feat but also consider that he and his men had captured the ship that Starkiller fought through, so neither of them would have been at full strength. On top of that Kota managed to tutaminis Starkillers lightning whilst laughing and was a Juyo specialist, pretty much confirming he had mastered a few lightsaber forms.

 

Now do you know how Ventress got so strong? She was not trained in anything special she developed force choke and the use of the force so well mostly by herself. I mean really she was a self trained dark adept besides of course the training she got from her jedi master mattered but she was so strong that she could defeat jedi masters in her own right. Can anyone explain why a self trained force adept was so strong?

Because I can most jedi had poor training even her master died because of that poor training while she lived and eliminated all opposition on the planet. That is why I say that all who can't defeat Ventress are not impressive she is a self trained dark acolyte for gods sake be stronger then her to actually be a impressive jedi prove that you rose above that terrible training of yours.

 

IIRC Dooku trained Ventress, so that's why she was so powerful, Sidious actually ordered Dooku to kill her because he felt she was growing too powerful. That alone is impressive. Also keep in mind that she has fought on par with Anakin and Kenobi before, beat Kit Fisto in a duel and has been shown to be able to strike down massive groups of droids with ease. Her feats pretty much show how dangerous she is, so it's no wonder why she killed so many Jedi.

 

Nahdar Vebb is not impressive that he became a jedi knight half way the clone wars because that was stupid Tano had better feats then him and she was only a padawan and she did manged to keep up with Grevious because she used the freaking force. She even cut his hands their first meeting. Also arrogance is not a excuse for the ****** way he fought Dooku. Magna Guards are droids pretty sure they fight according to a program and can not improvise you can so do it. That arrogance and poor display he had against Grevious was why I think he was not impressive.

 

Becoming a Jedi Knight isn't all about combat and as another poster in the thread said Ahsoka isn't exactly your typical padawan. As for saying scrapping magnaguards isn't impressive, it is. Magnaguards have been shown to trouble Kenobi before and have flat out killed Jedi Masters before they could react. On top of this they were often trained by Grievous and knew the seven classical lightsaber forms to the point where they could accurately predict what Jedi were going to do, Anakin (a prodigy with droids) thought they were worse than Droidekas. Take all of this into account and casually taking out magnaguards is actually a very good feat.

 

Ima-Gun Di well I have a simple argument why he was not impressive. http://www.cracked.com/article_19306_the-6-most-epic-one-man-armies-in-history-war.html enjoy. Also that article is also my reason why four arms was not a impressive jedi because normal humans killed scores of other humans who where soldiers in the battlefield and they did not had the force.

 

The problem with that is that is that we have in-universe examples of Clone troopers making last stands that usually only last a couple of seconds when they're the last ones, in comparison Ima-Gun Di lasted quite a long time on his own. Also while the article was cool it doesn't really serve as the best comparison as those soldiers, while very brave, weren't facing advanced droids programmed to kill them and they weren't going up against Jedi.

[adormitul]

Keep in mind that Kota had been noted as a threat to the Empire and he and his militia had been raiding their ships for ages as the Empire couldn't catch them. That alone is a great feat but also consider that he and his men had captured the ship that Starkiller fought through, so neither of them would have been at full strength. On top of that Kota managed to tutaminis Starkillers lightning whilst laughing and was a Juyo specialist, pretty much confirming he had mastered a few lightsaber forms.

You do not get it it does not mean he was a master of anything he probably knew then at a certain degree but I doubt he was a master and Garek had to fight a army to get to him a freaking army to get to him and then beat the hell out of him with little to no injuries. Yeah that is why he was not impressive. And his raiding was done with a small army by his side and unfortunately this kind of hit and run attacks are very efficient even in the real world. Lets not say its impressive its the only thing he can do if he wants to annoy the empire.

IIRC Dooku trained Ventress, so that's why she was so powerful, Sidious actually ordered Dooku to kill her because he felt she was growing too powerful. That alone is impressive. Also keep in mind that she has fought on par with Anakin and Kenobi before, beat Kit Fisto in a duel and has been shown to be able to strike down massive groups of droids with ease. Her feats pretty much show how dangerous she is, so it's no wonder why she killed so many Jedi.

Not really Dooku sent her against Anakin quite fast after he discovered her after she pretty much slaughtered half a dozen powerful bounty hunters by herself and before that she killed all the warlords on the planet all of them. This is impressive and she was not nearly as trained as the jedi she killed. Again the jedi had poor training very poor training. And you know what is strange compared to Yoda she is nothing I mean he did not even took her seriously he took her lightsabers examined them and gave them back to her clearly not worth his time. You see the difference between the best the best of the order and the average Joe jedi even her who was very powerful was nothing against the elite. That is what I mean at least be equal to her to be impressive or equal Grevious any one of the 2.

 

Becoming a Jedi Knight isn't all about combat and as another poster in the thread said Ahsoka isn't exactly your typical padawan. As for saying scrapping magnaguards isn't impressive, it is. Magnaguards have been shown to trouble Kenobi before and have flat out killed Jedi Masters before they could react. On top of this they were often trained by Grievous and knew the seven classical lightsaber forms to the point where they could accurately predict what Jedi were going to do, Anakin (a prodigy with droids) thought they were worse than Droidekas. Take all of this into account and casually taking out magnaguards is actually a very good feat.

No its not I can't take that as a impressive jedi because he killed droids you can freaking force crush them or trow a ton of things on them do you know how Kenobi killed magna guards? He let made a tank fall on them. How drunk was the council when they the made this guy a knight and let Tano be a padawan she basically passed all trial in the clone wars. This dude should not have gone further then the trial of skill and I can not believe he passed the trial of spirit with that arrogance. Tano outclassed this dude in every way and she was a padawan which proves that the council has no idea what its doing promoting such people to the rank of knight. Most jedi do not use lightsaber forms by the book and improvise and adapt and change forms when needed be magna guards have everything by the book they can be taken by surprise when the form has difference from what they know.

 

The problem with that is that is that we have in-universe examples of Clone troopers making last stands that usually only last a couple of seconds when they're the last ones, in comparison Ima-Gun Di lasted quite a long time on his own. Also while the article was cool it doesn't really serve as the best comparison as those soldiers, while very brave, weren't facing advanced droids programmed to kill them and they weren't going up against Jedi.

You know that star wars has its own examples of non force users that made it even better 6 non cyborg ones actually, guess who they are?

And also the jedi you mentioned did not fought against other jedi but against droids and troopers and lost. One of them was a alien with 4 forms and strong as tank besides being a jedi and still lost. The trooper was not a alien with 4 arms and strong as a tank and he killed thousands upon thousands taking bases that had hundreds if not thousands of enemy soldiers. Bobba Fett did the same and in real life there where humans that did even better then those 2 jedi http://www.cracked.com/article_17019_5-real-life-soldiers-who-make-rambo-look-like-*****.html.

So when you have the force you better not freaking lose battles that non force users can win. Impressive would have been if they had won like the ones in the new article I linked. Last stands are great and all but even better is when you win.

 

People like the new knight makes me thing that most of the jedi order is weak.

Edited December 6, 2015 by adormitul

[Jarons]

Yeah I doubt Garek would have defeated the Jedi Exile without doing it covertly. Also the same with the Consular that guy is a beast. But that is not the issue here Kota fought Garek with the help of army and still lost. He was in not any advantage against him and was a very unfair fight for him and still won.Do you get why I think Kota was not impressive

 

Now do you know how Ventress got so strong? She was not trained in anything special she developed force choke and the use of the force so well mostly by herself. I mean really she was a self trained dark adept besides of course the training she got from her jedi master mattered but she was so strong that she could defeat jedi masters in her own right. Can anyone explain why a self trained force adept was so strong?

Because I can most jedi had poor training even her master died because of that poor training while she lived and eliminated all opposition on the planet. That is why I say that all who can't defeat Ventress are not impressive she is a self trained dark acolyte for gods sake be stronger then her to actually be a impressive jedi prove that you rose above that terrible training of yours.

 

Nahdar Vebb is not impressive that he became a jedi knight half way the clone wars because that was stupid Tano had better feats then him and she was only a padawan and she did manged to keep up with Grevious because she used the freaking force. She even cut his hands their first meeting. Also arrogance is not a excuse for the ****** way he fought Dooku. Magna Guards are droids pretty sure they fight according to a program and can not improvise you can so do it. That arrogance and poor display he had against Grevious was why I think he was not impressive.

 

Ima-Gun Di well I have a simple argument why he was not impressive. http://www.cracked.com/article_19306_the-6-most-epic-one-man-armies-in-history-war.html enjoy. Also that article is also my reason why four arms was not a impressive jedi because normal humans killed scores of other humans who where soldiers in the battlefield and they did not had the force.

When you said Garek couldn't beat the Jedi Exiled I stopped reading because you truthfully no less than crap.Dude He beat Darth Vader he would Destroy the Whole Jedi and Dark Council of the OR era without Breaking a Sweat.Garek took down some of the best of the best of the PT era and that's not even his strongest incarnation.Starkiller could destroy anyone in the OR era Darth Vader and Starkiller Pound for pound could 1vX any members of either order during the OR period.So just give it up.

 

Also the Give me one Or Jedi that you think is impressive that's wasn't a Jedi master and I will give you a PT counter parts that's more impressive.

[Rhyltran]

When you said Garek couldn't beat the Jedi Exiled I stopped reading because you truthfully no less than crap.Dude He beat Darth Vader he would Destroy the Whole Jedi and Dark Council of the OR era without Breaking a Sweat.Garek took down some of the best of the best of the PT era and that's not even his strongest incarnation.Starkiller could destroy anyone in the OR era Darth Vader and Starkiller Pound for pound could 1vX any members of either order during the OR period.So just give it up.

 

Also the Give me one Or Jedi that you think is impressive that's wasn't a Jedi master and I will give you a PT counter parts that's more impressive.

 

Starkiller would not be able to beat Valkorion or Revan but yes there's not much else who could take him on.

[Jarons]

Starkiller would not be able to beat Valkorion or Revan but yes there's not much else who could take him on.

You know I didn't mean Valk Rhyltran please he the Emperor not a member of the Dark council. I have to disagree with you on the Revan thing.I believe off of a Dark side Nexus Revan wouldn't preform the Same and Starkiller could win.It could truthfully go either way.

[cs_zoltan]

This thread gave me cancer.

[Jarons]

This thread gave me cancer.

Zoltan it gives us all Cancer I can't believe Random and Pad even tried with these people.