Please let me romance Arcann.

[Drisjra]

Drisjra ---> I agree with your arguments.

You said that Arcann still needs: time, patience and redemption... and that is why he is a perfect LI option for a jedi. You can heal him, because you have a full package of this features

 

But I don't agree that people started to see him otherwise only after KotFE. I like him very much in KotET. Does anyone doubt that he will get a chance for a redemption? It was obvious from the begining, even from the frist trailer. Because - somehow - he was also a victim of Emperor actions, just like Vaylin was.

 

When I think of him as a romance option, I imagine rather that he and the Outlander will slowly build the attachment to each other. Despite all the things he did, the Outlander gives him another chance and still belive in him. It's a great beginning to build trust, respect and come to terms with their sad past. Sudden passionate affair would be unnatural... but quiet, peaceful affection?

 

Arcann lost his brother and the joy of life. Outlander lost her / his friends and a big part of life because of the imprisonment. Both were lonely, betrayed, and manipulated.

 

This story has a big potential and is definitely better written than all these previous characters with a few boring dialogues and a great confession of love in final chapter: "let's get married! because why not?!".

 

But we'll see...

First of all, thanks for taking the time to read through all of that.

 

Actually, you would be surprised by how many people had a change of heart regarding Arcann after his transition in KotET. I met quite a few of them. Most of them went from wanting to kill him to wanting to befriend/romance him. And it´s understandable, given that he wasn´t given much development in KotFE.

 

You´re right that the Outlander and Arcann both lost people and things that were dear to them, and are still suffering from the repercussions, which could be the catalyst for them bonding. I can definitely see them becoming close friends eventually. It mainly depends on the Outlander´s personality, but I agree that an LS Jedi is a good fit.

 

It would definitely take a lot of time to build a believable, genuine relationship after everything they went through, probably spanning across multiple expansions. But we know the devs don´t have the time for that, so I expect that if we do get an Arcann romance, it might be good, but it will still likely be rushed.

 

I was personally disappointed that Vaylin wasn´t redeemable, or that Thexan didn´t get to interact with Arcann, even as a ghost, because I feel like Arcann needed to resolve the tense situation in his family first. It´s clear that his family were one of the few things that Arcann actually cared about (except for his father, that is), and while it´s great that he still has Senya, it´s pretty sad that both of his siblings are dead. Vaylin could have been given a redemption story, but I guess the devs either didn´t feel like doing it or thought that doing it twice would be boring.

 

I do agree that it has the potential to be a better written story than most of the companion romances, because the vanilla ones were pretty meh, in my opinion. Not bad, just...not anything deep. It´s not like we should expect more from an MMO, though.

Edited January 11, 2017 by Drisjra

[UnahzaalDovah]

Yay ! I'm not the only one who thought about this !

 

Would love it ! It would be quite dramatic because of his past but beautiful...

 

(I would like to see his mask again in the future or a little angry Arcann at some point though ( I know he just recovered but still... ))

[revkashepard]

I've played enough Bioware games to know there are characters who had done even worse than Emperor Arcann did that was romanceable. Zevran is a licentious rogue and assassin who would try to kill you if you don't gain his favor enough. Anders is a self-radicalized anarchist who publicly destroy an institution just to push an inevitable conflict between the mages and templars. Fenris who like to stab through people's chest with his hand and crush their heart and he'd do the same to his own sister simply because he hated mages. Garrus who became disenchanted from his boring life and turned into a murderous vigilante who traveled to the lawless side of the galaxy just to kill indiscriminately because he thought what he did is right and that everyone he killed is the bad guy including his friend who was tortured by the desperate people that Garrus and his team had terrorized for months and driven by revenge for their murdered relatives and friends. These are romanceable characters who committed genuine atrocities with their own bloodstained hands but it still doesn't stop players from romanticizing their actions and justifying all of them as being "interesting" and "endearing". It was an optional preference after all.

 

KOTFE's Emperor Arcann is ruthless and scary and definitely isn't a good match to pure LS Jedi (also he drove a lightsaber through you at one point).... but Jedi teachings frown at developing attachments and relationship and they encourage celibacy. But after Chapter 12, I don't think that rule should apply anymore but I don't find it necessary to do mental gymnastics to make Arcann romance work for people's sickening good and self-righteous Jedi character. And I really don't wish the writers to accommodate to that. As if it wasn't enough that KOTFE and KOTET are railroaded to favor force sensitive character.

 

But like most people in obvious position of power and branded as tyrant and dictators, they become hated symbols and caricatures of themselves, people are afraid of the idea of them but doesn't really see the person themselves (which aren't even impressive to begin with) and the enablers around them who stayed with the flow regardless (notably Knights of Zakuul and nobles). Everyone's motivation is convoluted but what is clear was that everyone is self-serving. The alliances that you make, the friends and followers, who was disillusioned by all party (the Sith Empire, The Republic, the Jedi Order, the Sith Council, Eternal Throne) and all benefit from your rise of power. You are essentially making your own Revanites and Arcann and Vaylin are made to be your chosen bad guy when it was really you 'The Outlander' who symbolically became the major destabilizing element in the story and everyone is simply bidding their time to take you down (even Uprisings is about this). I could make a real life example but enough politics as it is.

 

And Arcann said it himself, he doesn't want to be redeemed, he acknowledged that he had kept you in prison for five years (in which if he hadn't, Valkorion would have destroyed your mind easily. There's no record of any Vitiate's host surviving the ritual and you are the first Voice of the Emperor who fully resisted him.. even Revan was driven insane and the Emperor simply kept him in mental torture for centuries) and he already swore his eternal loyalty to you as witnessed by the galaxy. He wanted to atone for his mistakes and held himself accountable for his actions (which is easier if you choose to execute him anyway) and he will work hard to earn loyalties through his actions and didn't really expect you to forgive him so easily. And it was a choice to tell Arcann directly that he is stronger and a better man than his father ever was and he certainly does prove himself that. Arcann dealing with his self-doubt and renewed courage to save the Outlander from his father is definitely heroic.... and sickeningly romantic if you choose to see it as a man trying to free the love of his life from his father's nightmare cage.... #relationshipgoals

 

He was willing to give up the throne and believe you earn it regardless of your choices. And he only sit on the throne just to spite Valkorion and as a natural heir, it was his birthright anyway. In the end, it was really Scorpio who took the throne from him and as far as everyone's concerned it was Vaylin who was the mastermind behind everything. The battle on Odessen was a show of Alliance strength and victory against the Eternal Fleet, not really about dethroning Arcann who Scorpio said he readily gave up the throne just for a chance to confront his father.

 

Any story for future expansion is up for speculation but I really doubt Arcann's characterization ended with KOTET simply because of his optional state and the existence of plot-armored characters like Lana and Theron, who still doesn't make their move against the Outlander yet but there were enough foreshadowing in KOTFE and KOTET to support this.

 

Also, I don't mind that KOTET changed a lot of folk's perception for him that the idea of romance possibility finally seem feasible considering I've spend better part of year with people telling me that I'm mentally screwed or sick or wanted to be emotionally abused simply for considering him attractive as a person, let alone to want him to be happy and loved.

 

But I know, the general sentiment was any resources that could be allocated to Arcann romance will take away any hypothetical romance scenes with their own love interests. I sympathize with this especially the whole waiting for years for these characters to come back, but there's so many factors involved; writers, directors, pay, availability, health, family, SAG-AFRRA strike and a lot of these actors haven't been with the game or industry for years and are busy with their own lives to simply flew to California just to record a few hours worth of lines. Threads like this attract these kinds of resentment simply because any interest toward new characters by itself is threatening and its easier to rage about it.

Edited January 12, 2017 by revkashepard

[Nefla]

I will fully admit to not liking Arcann when he was evil but liking him after he turned good. I even felt bad about trying to shoot him down at the end of KotFE. I didn't think he could be redeemed but Voss techniques are weird and amazing and the result was almost like that of an exorcism where an evil force was removed. I understand that this was a quick and dirty way to make Arcann good and that they didn't have enough time to have it be built naturally over the course of the story like they would with a full single player game but it worked for me. Though I'm going to be honest, I will try any romance unless I find the character annoying (Lana, Doc). I like the extra character development and being able to see a different side of that character, plus seeing how they react differently if you are their friend vs their love interest.

[Zehal]

Agreed, Arcann Romance is very interesting and I would welcome it! Also trying to imagine him being romantic, specially with that rough voice is an entertaining thought...LOL. I still think there is more to this story... also I can't help shake the feeling that his brother... is not dead... The Emperor has proven to be very... VERY adept at surviving or creating threats and sealing them away. In any case, I think there be enough story for romance in future...

 

 

PS: I just hope the I don't have to endure the writers writing us down, to be force push left and write like if the Outlander was a inexperience civilian... god does cinematic were such a torture to watch... Sigh* carbonate poison weakening us can only be an excuse for so long, let alone a real reason for a seasoned veteran expert of fighting force users, not being able to land on his feet or counter it. I really expected more, at least some unlock options or better performance, for having a character since the beginning of class story.

 

[Drisjra]

I've played enough Bioware games to know there are characters who had done even worse than Emperor Arcann did that was romanceable. Zevran is a licentious rogue and assassin who would try to kill you if you don't gain his favor enough. Anders is a self-radicalized anarchist who publicly destroy an institution just to push an inevitable conflict between the mages and templars. Fenris who like to stab through people's chest with his hand and crush their heart and he'd do the same to his own sister simply because he hated mages. Garrus who became disenchanted from his boring life and turned into a murderous vigilante who traveled to the lawless side of the galaxy just to kill indiscriminately because he thought what he did is right and that everyone he killed is the bad guy including his friend who was tortured by the desperate people that Garrus and his team had terrorized for months and driven by revenge for their murdered relatives and friends. These are romanceable characters who committed genuine atrocities with their own bloodstained hands but it still doesn't stop players from romanticizing their actions and justifying all of them as being "interesting" and "endearing". It was an optional preference after all.

You´re right, those are basically most Bioware romances in a nutshell. Most of them did something horrible at some point. They are wonderfully complex characters, and that´s why we love them. I wasn´t trying to say that Arcann shouldn´t be romanceable because he did terrible things, but rather pointing to them to showcase that he isn´t a "precious cinnamon roll" and a "sweetheart" like some seem to believe.

 

And he only sit on the throne just to spite Valkorion and as a natural heir, it was his birthright anyway.

Not much of a justification for his actions, to be honest.

 

But I know, the general sentiment was any resources that could be allocated to Arcann romance will take away any hypothetical romance scenes with their own love interests. I sympathize with this especially the whole waiting for years for these characters to come back, but there's so many factors involved; writers, directors, pay, availability, health, family, SAG-AFRRA strike and a lot of these actors haven't been with the game or industry for years and are busy with their own lives to simply flew to California just to record a few hours worth of lines. Threads like this attract these kinds of resentment simply because any interest toward new characters by itself is threatening and its easier to rage about it.

I know that some people are angry about the original companions not returning, and while I´m not one of them, they have every reason to be. They were promised before the beginning of KotFE that they would get them all back, and all they got instead was a summoning console. I can see how that would be incredibly disappointing. I understand that the developers have problems with resources, but in that case, they shouldn´t have promised anything.

 

About people being interested in more content from new characters, that doesn´t phase me in the least. I actually share their sentiments, for the most part. I wasn´t "raging" because I was seeing Arcann as a "threat" to other romances, I was just expressing my feelings on a subject that I think is very complicated.

 

Again, I do find Arcann an interesting and even likeable character. I would like to see him get more development. He does have a lot of potential. Standing up for himself, his mother and the Outlander and facing his father was certainly a courageous, even heroic act. One of his first steps towards atonement. But I still don´t like the way his redemption came about. The "cleansing ritual" on Voss felt like a complete cop-out. A person has to work through feelings, not just "get rid of them". Also, I don´t remember anyone ever mentioning Arcann being "corrupted" by Valkorion. Yes, Valkorion abused him and subtly manipulated him since childhood, poisoning his mind with lies. But he didn´t actually use the Force to corrupt him like he did with Vaylin. I don´t see how a "cleansing ritual" can simply undo years of emotional abuse and manipulation with the wave of a hand. Arcann actually overcoming his hate and anger like a normal person would have taken too much time and writing effort, both of which weren´t really put all that much into KotET.

 

Maybe my expectations for an MMO romance are too high. I really don´t mean to come off as someone who wants to dissuade others from wanting a romance with him. I´m just salty because there was so much potential that was unfulfilled, just like in KotFE.

[Nefla]

I feel like the dark side of the force isn't like normal evil actions or thoughts. It seems to really corrupt people even physically and isn't subtle or like real emotion at all. Someone who falls to the darkside can go from zero to killing temples full of younglings or killing their own master and doing a 180 from righteous and noble padawan to crazed and promiscuous murder-sith in 60 seconds flat. A real person wouldn't act like Anakin or DS Jaessa. A real person if they went from good to evil would take years of cutting corners and compromising their morals before they were completely degraded and even still they might retain a conscience deep down. It seems almost more along the lines of demon posession (though not literally) from Dragon Age than it does anything believable so I don't see much of a problem with it being removed as easily aside from it just not being a very interesting way to do things.

[Drisjra]

I feel like the dark side of the force isn't like normal evil actions or thoughts. It seems to really corrupt people even physically and isn't subtle or like real emotion at all. Someone who falls to the darkside can go from zero to killing temples full of younglings or killing their own master and doing a 180 from righteous and noble padawan to crazed and promiscuous murder-sith in 60 seconds flat. A real person wouldn't act like Anakin or DS Jaessa. A real person if they went from good to evil would take years of cutting corners and compromising their morals before they were completely degraded and even still they might retain a conscience deep down. It seems almost more along the lines of demon posession (though not literally) from Dragon Age than it does anything believable so I don't see much of a problem with it being removed as easily aside from it just not being a very interesting way to do things.

Dark side users are conscious of their actions and thoughts, though, unlike people possessed by demons in DA. They draw upon their negative emotions, using them as a source of their power, which can certainly cloud their judgement, but it's not like the dark side is controlling their actions. You're right that it would take more than a few days for a real person to turn to the dark side. I don't think Anakin is a very good example, though, since his fall to the dark side WAS gradual, as shown throughout the prequels.

I do see where you're coming from, though. It was a quick and easy way to bring about Arcann's redemption, and since he is

a killable character,

it would seem pointless to spend that many resources on it. I'm still disappointed with the writing, though.

[Nefla]

Dark side users are conscious of their actions and thoughts, though, unlike people possessed by demons in DA. They draw upon their negative emotions, using them as a source of their power, which can certainly cloud their judgement, but it's not like the dark side is controlling their actions. You're right that it would take more than a few days for a real person to turn to the dark side. I don't think Anakin is a very good example, though, since his fall to the dark side WAS gradual, as shown throughout the prequels.

I do see where you're coming from, though. It was a quick and easy way to bring about Arcann's redemption, and since he is

a killable character,

it would seem pointless to spend that many resources on it. I'm still disappointed with the writing, though.

 

Of course, and I do agree with you that it was disappointing writing it almost feels like they didn't plan ahead to make him turn to the light. In the beginning of KotFE Arcann was more of a sympathetic character. He killed his brother in a split second of rage and I'm not sure that even in that second he meant to do it and then he was clearly devastated and regretful right after. He conquered the empire and republic but then pretty much left them to their own devices, he could have killed the main character but instead froze them in carbonite. At this early stage in the story Vaylin was clearly the much more evil and irredeemable one and I thought that she'd take over and maybe Arcann would either die at her hand or join our side. Then later on the cheese pretty much slid off the cracker with Arcann (and there wasn't even a catalyst for it) and he decided to randomly have his own knights kill each other, bomb 5 worlds to dust, etc...he went from believably dark and someone who could go either way with the right push to mustache twirling villain. If they had planned ahead they could have kept Arcann on that line, made Vaylin the darker one maybe going rogue, disobeying orders, doing whatever she wants, causing mayhem and murder (in the later part of KotFE they seemed to switch and make her the more reasonable one all of a sudden which was weird do me).

 

They could have had Arcann and the main character fight, Vaylin comes in and betrays him, trying to kill them both, and Senya rescues them (by sealing off a passage with debris or something) but Vaylin kills her and steals the throne, branding Arcann as a traitor (and giving him a taste of his own medicine). In this scenario he would have not bombed 5 worlds or killed half his knights. He could join the alliance out of necessity and to avenge his mother and start off hostile/reluctant/untrusting/whatever but over the course of the next expansion see the error of his ways. You could even have moments along the way where they meet Zakuul citizens that have been affected for the worst by his rule and find out what his people actually think of him.

Edited January 13, 2017 by Nefla

[LamiaKan]

Of course, and I do agree with you that it was disappointing writing it almost feels like they didn't plan ahead to make him turn to the light. In the beginning of KotFE Arcann was more of a sympathetic character. He killed his brother in a split second of rage and I'm not sure that even in that second he meant to do it and then he was clearly devastated and regretful right after. He conquered the empire and republic but then pretty much left them to their own devices, he could have killed the main character but instead froze them in carbonite. At this early stage in the story Vaylin was clearly the much more evil and irredeemable one and I thought that she'd take over and maybe Arcann would either die at her hand or join our side. Then later on the cheese pretty much slid off the cracker with Arcann (and there wasn't even a catalyst for it) and he decided to randomly have his own knights kill each other, bomb 5 worlds to dust, etc...he went from believably dark and someone who could go either way with the right push to mustache twirling villain. If they had planned ahead they could have kept Arcann on that line, made Vaylin the darker one maybe going rogue, disobeying orders, doing whatever she wants, causing mayhem and murder (in the later part of KotFE they seemed to switch and make her the more reasonable one all of a sudden which was weird do me).

 

They could have had Arcann and the main character fight, Vaylin comes in and betrays him, trying to kill them both, and Senya rescues them (by sealing off a passage with debris or something) but Vaylin kills her and steals the throne, branding Arcann as a traitor (and giving him a taste of his own medicine). In this scenario he would have not bombed 5 worlds or killed half his knights. He could join the alliance out of necessity and to avenge his mother and start off hostile/reluctant/untrusting/whatever but over the course of the next expansion see the error of his ways. You could even have moments along the way where they meet Zakuul citizens that have been affected for the worst by his rule and find out what his people actually think of him.

 

I like your version of the story better! I would definitely like him more in KOTFE if that's the case. I didn't hate him then just thought he was flat. Replaying KOTFE I found that there's some interesting bits,one being you surrendered to him in chapter 8, but they are few and far between. And the filler chapters didn't help me connecting to his character either. What I'm saying is that I'm also one of the people who like him way better in KOTET, partly due to the writing is tighter (while not perfect).

[Austranaar]

I'm with you!

 

Guys I`ve returned to game since 2013 just to check how i'ts going, walk through Revan, KotFE and KotET stories in about a week and totally fell in love.

 

I nderstand English only about 70-80% without dictionary, but read all 36 pages of this thread and think you need my vote for Arcann`s romance.

[Venn_Dras]

This would be an interesting development if the writers did decide to introduce an option to romance Arcann. I haven't played through KOTET yet, but from the forums I can gather that Arcann has the potential to become one of the better companions in the game. Story wise, his is the most well written starting from KOTFE. There were moments during the cut scenes that I went back and re watched just to laugh at his reactions to the Outlander's moves.

 

If it did become an option, my Knight would be the guinea pig.

 

After all, is it really believable that Doc would have stayed faithful without his ball and chain to keep him in line? Sorry, he's too much of a gigolo for that. Probably hit on the next patient he slapped a kolto pack on.......

[Eialune]

Personally I think it would be cool to have male love interests of type 1,2, and 3. The problem with type 1 body though is the romance animations in comparison with the female body types. The animations are meant to be man=tall, woman=short. I made a body type 1 male smuggler to romance Akaavi because I thought skinny little twerp with large amazon woman would be fun but BioWare clearly didn't anticipate that combination and the animations are hilarious! http://i.imgur.com/mKzKFb0.png I totally would have romanced Talos though T_T Theron with my body type 1 male trooper look normal so I don't know if it's just the camera not showing the weird positioning or if it's my trooper taking the female animation.

 

I just romanced Theron with my type 1 SW, and I was suddenly as tall/taller than him, like in your screenshot. First time was on Rishi, and the angle was close so I couldn't see whether it was awkward positioning or the game just saying, "fine you're up here now." Then with the Yavin 4 kiss, the camera draws back, and I swear to the Force it looks like I'm standing on a ROCK. Like Robert Downey Jr. in the MCU.

 

You can make a few type 1 males that don't look ridiculous, but mostly only if you go for a scrawny teenager vibe.

 

(Also, yesplz Arcann romance option.)

[gaelicvixen]

My Sin is still sitting in her DK penthouse with Darth Marr because I'm only giving him up for an Arcann romance <_<;

[Nnyv]

I have a bit of a hero(ine) complex, so I've been wanting to redeem/save Arcann ever since I saw the trailer and how Valkorion treats him (and Thexan). I'm sad that Thexan had to die, but I love the depth it adds to the story. Ever since it was hinted at that Arcann could be redeemed, I knew that was the path I'd take, and that I wanted to be able to romance him afterward. I'm not entirely happy with the way the redemption went, though. I get the healing, but I think the redemption needed a little more story-time, with the Outlander assisting/guiding him. Anyway, count me as another member of the romance Arcann team. Also, that voice. *swoon*

[Jesira]

Let me romance Arcann!!!!!!

[Karenpeterson]

Well...

think of the happy threesome!

 

I would love it if we could have a romance with Arcann

[RevansSoul]

I'll romance him. I like his voice. I like his larger than type 2 build. I also don't find the relationship between Arcann and the Outlander to be abusive. They are two powerful warriors duking it out. Arcann holds no power over the Outlander and exerts no control. By the end of KotET it is the Outlander with all the power and control. Besides, marrying your rival for alliance building is a time honored tradition. 😉

 

But for all players then, like Theron and Lana.

[Damask_Rose]

But for all players then, like Theron and Lana.

 

Absolutely for all players!

[BlueShiftRecall]

I would still like this to happen.

[Cawyden]

I support this

[vennenox]

Please make this happen! I'm trying to keep my character single for this exact reason!

[PiJeee]

I'd like that too, it would be cool to date Arcann for my optinion, also he deserves a little love no ?

[ekurian]

im already shipping my knight with him rn tBH. and you can give him courting gifts so... make it so, please!

[Capella]

I'm still hoping this will be an option going forward.