Kit Fisto vs Darth Nox

[PurpleDelirium]

A more even fight than my Nox vs Windu thread, I think.

 

Kit Fisto is he were when confronting Darth Sidious in Episode III.

He is equipped with his single lightsaber.

 

Darth Nox appears as his Dark side incantation, just after the end of his vanilla storyline.

He is equipped with a single lightsaber of common design, powered with a red synthetic crystal.

 

Fight occurs on a neutral force neutral planet. They meet in a room similar in design to the Dark Council chambers.

 

If you don't have anything to say that actually contributes to the discussion, please refrain from commenting.

Edited October 12, 2015 by PurpleDelirium

[Balthrax]

This fight really boils down to whether or not Kit can get in close enough to attack. Nox's main bonus, assuming he's a Sorcerer(given single, common-design lightsaber stipulation), is that he'd be at his best, about... thirty yards away. If Kit can't close the gap, he's seafood. I'd assume that the inverse, would also be true. If Kit can close the gap, he'd be the clear victor.

 

I'd, personally, say it's a coin-flip.

[Rhyltran]

A more even fight than my Nox vs Windu thread, I think.

 

Kit Fisto is he were when confronting Darth Sidious in Episode III.

He is equipped with his single lightsaber.

 

Darth Nox appears as his Dark side incantation, just after the end of his vanilla storyline.

He is equipped with a single lightsaber of common design, powered with a red synthetic crystal.

 

Fight occurs on a neutral force neutral planet. They meet in a room similar in design to the Dark Council chambers.

 

If you don't have anything to say that actually contributes to the discussion, please refrain from commenting.

 

Let's start with Nox.. Nox is a skilled Niman practitioner and while his style isn't stated we can easily surmise that it's exactly what he uses. Niman is a style that is based on the principle for using the saber to fend off attacks while allowing one to use the force as their offensive weapon of choice. We know that he must have some saber skill otherwise if his lightning is blocked he'd be cut down by a skilled warrior. He's taken down both other sorcerers, assassins, and even warriors.

 

Nox has the power of 4-5 ghosts and has had his body enhanced by the mother machine giving him a body that can withstand the power of the ghosts. Not only that but through Voss rituals his mind is also enhanced meaning any kind of mental attacks are simply not going to work. The most prominent powers at his disposal are force drain, death field, force storm, and powerful lightning assaults. He can also tire and break down the force defenses of some of the most powerful force users in his era like a child picking apart a toy but Nox real strength isn't his force strength.

 

Nox has a tendence to pick fights with people much stronger than himself while also finding a way to come out on top. He's unlikely to give in to arrogance or pide because he's always been the underdog. He's used to being the weak man at the bottom but has a tendency to rise up. Many force users who were originally more powerful and skilled than Nox looked down on him with disdain but their underestimation has lead to their downfall. He's also solved problems without sheer power such as when he conned Paladius cult into following him (by creating a fake tremor.)

 

Now let's look at Fist. Fisto is one of the most talented swordsman the Jedi order has ever had in their entire history. Every Jedi (even most Sith) learn the Shi-Cho style as a first form. It's simple and basic but very few focus entirely on it and it's principles. Kit studied it in such a degree that he was able to give in toit fully. Entering a state that was unpredictable and often described as savage. This surprised people who were very familiar to fighting most Jedi and even very unorthodox fighters had trouble dealing with him because his methods weren't common place among other Jedi.

 

Kit Fisto has engaged opponents who were less than human and less than normal. One of his most notable fights involved General Grievous. Grievous was capable of using four arms and wielding four lightsabers. Even his feet were lethal weapons if he was hard pressed. Grievous had slew and defeated even members of the Jedi council. Fisto not only defeated Grievous but did it with extreme ease. Mocking him the whole way and toying with him throughout the fight. This leads me to believe Fisto could easily defeat most of the members of the Jedi Council in his era.

 

Fisto employed force techniques in tangem with his fighting style but used them in most unexpected ways (as is his style) such as using the force to pull Grievous feet right out from under him. He was also one of the quickest members of the Jedi council. Even though Shi-Cho only teaches the most basic forms of attack and defense Grievous couldn't touch him. When Grievous support came to aid him Fisto had no trouble escaping. Proving him to be very clever and resourceful.

 

So a fight between the two would probably be a cat and mouse style game. Fisto would probably use his taunts trying to draw Nox into giving something away or making a mistake. He would try to use his force techniques in order to trip up Nox to allow himself to get in close. Nox would have to contest with Fisto's speed, strength, ferocity, and unpredictability. Fisto would find that getting Nox to slip up is no easy feat. He has a mind of steel and his force defenses are considerable. Also not having the pride that most of his sith brethren suffers he would do his best to play keep away with Fisto realizing relatively quickly that he's the superior duelist.

 

In the end we have two talented fighters who are both known for their unorthodox methods of fighting. Both tend to be resourceful. The two of them tend to be underestimated as well but Nox has a major advantage over Kit. Kit is arrogant to a fault. He likes to play with his opponent, provoke them, and even monologue. Not only that but Fisto is very used to destroying those who underestimate him and very rarely ever meets anyone who can give him pause for a considerable time.

 

On the other hand Nox doesn't have that arrogance as mentioned above and he's used to facing people stronger, faster, and even superior to himself. There's no reason to believe Fisto matches Nox in power and even if he has the superior skills I don't think it's enough to finish Nox off. I foresee Nox leading Fisto into a false sense of security and when Fisto goes to take the bait Nox uses the full power of the dark side and the spirits he has at disposal.

 

I give this fight to Nox but not easily.

[S_W_LeGenD]

A more even fight than my Nox vs Windu thread, I think.

 

Kit Fisto is he were when confronting Darth Sidious in Episode III.

He is equipped with his single lightsaber.

 

Darth Nox appears as his Dark side incantation, just after the end of his vanilla storyline.

He is equipped with a single lightsaber of common design, powered with a red synthetic crystal.

 

Fight occurs on a neutral force neutral planet. They meet in a room similar in design to the Dark Council chambers.

 

If you don't have anything to say that actually contributes to the discussion, please refrain from commenting.

In the other thread, I have offered a reasonable explanation of how Darth Nox can/would defeat Mace Windu.

 

This contest is an absolute mismatch in the favor of the Dark Lord.

[PadsterPwns]

For me this is a who slips up first scenario. Kit has the edge in dueling and likely in general physical augmentation (e.g speed, strength) but Nox has the edge in force techniques and raw force power. As far as mindset goes Kit can be cocky at times, as noted by Rhyltran, which is something Nox could take advantage of, however it could also work for Fisto if it unnerves Nox, although I think that is unlikely.

 

While both have edges I think this fight first of all depends on starting distance because if Nox can keep his/her distance Fisto won't have anything sufficient to counter with. However, since this takes place in a chamber and due to Fisto's speed I don't think range will be an issue, though I don't know the precise size of the chamber meaning this could be me misjudging. If (and in my opinion when) Fisto gets in range I think it becomes an easier fight for Fisto as he enjoys a skill edge, along with a speed edge. Put these edges together with Fisto's mastery of Shii-cho and it means that Nox could, and would in my opinion, have a difficult time dealing with Kit's offensive frenzy. Here is where I think the match will be decided, either Nox can't keep up and Fisto gets a strike in ending the match or Nox catches Fisto off guard and launches a vicious force assault ending the match. Between the two I feel the first one is slightly more likely to happen, however because I think that slightly increased chance is negligible I'm calling this a 50/50 fight.

[PadsterPwns]

In the other thread, I have offered a reasonable explanation of how Darth Nox can/would defeat Mace Windu.

 

This contest is an absolute mismatch in the favor of the Dark Lord.

 

Uh, Nox may win (though even that is debatable) but saying this is a mismatch is ridiculous, what evidence do you have that even hints at this being a mismatch?

[cs_zoltan]

Uh, Nox may win (though even that is debatable) but saying this is a mismatch is ridiculous, what evidence do you have that even hints at this being a mismatch?

 

Don't mind him.

[S_W_LeGenD]

Uh, Nox may win (though even that is debatable) but saying this is a mismatch is ridiculous, what evidence do you have that even hints at this being a mismatch?

My friend, as good as Kit Fisto is in lightsaber combat, this skill is virtually useless in this confrontation since Darth Nox is not a straightforward lightsaber combatant. Moreover, Kit Fisto is not a powerhouse or promoted as such. He is renowned for his skills in lightsaber combat but is average in raw power and command of the Force aspects.

 

Darth Nox, on the other hand, is super-strong and have excellent command of the Dark Side. He also have defeated foes much stronger and dangerous then Kit Fisto. Therefore, my assessment is logical.

Edited October 14, 2015 by S_W_LeGenD

[PadsterPwns]

My friend, as good as Kit Fisto is in lightsaber combat, this skill is virtually useless in this confrontation since Darth Nox is not a straightforward lightsaber combatant. Moreover, Kit Fisto is not a powerhouse or promoted as such. He is renowned for his skills in lightsaber combat but is average in raw power and command of the Force aspects.

 

Darth Nox, on the other hand, is super-strong and have excellent command of the Dark Side. He also have defeated foes much stronger and dangerous then Kit Fisto. Therefore, my assessment is logical.

 

I'm not saying Fisto wins outright, I'm a massive Fisto fan but I know what his limits are and this fight is a tough fight for both Fisto and Nox. Nox obviously has the edge in raw force power and applying force techniques in combat but Nox will have a tough time doing this if Fisto is within melee range due to Fisto's unpredictable, randomized and swift assaults.

 

Also how will Nox keep Fisto out of melee range? Fisto holds the edge in physical augmentation meaning he will be faster and stronger than Nox and we should not forget how Fisto has out dueled Grievous, has moved at speeds that baffled TCW Kenobi and has stomped 2 magnaguards in a trilogy where 3 of them were overwhelming Obi-Wan. In addition Fisto has accolades that put him as among the best bladesmasters in the PT Order, which had combatants such as Obi-Wan, Shaak Ti and Mace Windu, though I'm not suggesting he is on par with them but simply not that far away from them either. While Nox does have the edge in force power and applying force powers, this doesn't mean Fisto is a slouch in using the force either, he has demonstrated the ability to chain force pushes into his lightsaber sequences in his duel against Grievous, he has used telekinesis to perform a saber throw, he has used TK to lift and roll a large agrocite canister and he was able to sense when Obi-Wan was almost killed which he stopped by cutting through a support so that Ventress and Kenobi's fight ended.

 

Could you give me something to prove Nox is "super-strong" and give examples of foes Nox has faced that are more dangerous than foes Fisto has faced? I'm fairly familiar with Nox as a character (playing through my second SI now actually ) but apart from Thanaton none of Nox's foes seem to come close to Grievous or Ventress.

 

Again, I just want to state that while I think Fisto has a slight chance of gaining a win, I feel that it is too slight of a chance to matter, so in my opinion this is a 50/50.

 

Edit: Ignore the magnaguard comparison with Obi-Wan, although I'll still say how quickly he killed the magnaguards is still a good feat.

Edited October 14, 2015 by PadsterPwns

[cs_zoltan]

has stomped 2 magnaguards in a trilogy where 3 of them were overwhelming Obi-Wan.

 

I've seen this referenced a lot. That's just wrong:

 

Three MagnaGuards, each with a double-ended weapon that generated an energy field impervious to lightsabers, each with reflexes that operated near lightspeed, each with hypersophisticated heuristic combat algorithms that enabled it to learn from experience and adapt its tactics instantly to any situation, were certainly beyond Obi-Wan's ability to defeat, but it was not Obi-Wan who would defeat them; Obi-Wan wasn't even fighting. He was only a vessel, emptied of self. The Force, shaped by his skill and guided by his clarity of mind, fought through him.

—Revenge of the Sith

 

It was only the author's idiotic way of saying that Kenobi had the Force.

[PadsterPwns]

I've seen this referenced a lot. That's just wrong:

 

Three MagnaGuards, each with a double-ended weapon that generated an energy field impervious to lightsabers, each with reflexes that operated near lightspeed, each with hypersophisticated heuristic combat algorithms that enabled it to learn from experience and adapt its tactics instantly to any situation, were certainly beyond Obi-Wan's ability to defeat, but it was not Obi-Wan who would defeat them; Obi-Wan wasn't even fighting. He was only a vessel, emptied of self. The Force, shaped by his skill and guided by his clarity of mind, fought through him.

—Revenge of the Sith

 

It was only the author's idiotic way of saying that Kenobi had the Force.

 

By had the force do you mean the author was literally saying he was force sensitive? If so that is awfully worded.

[cs_zoltan]

By had the force do you mean the author was literally saying he was force sensitive? If so that is awfully worded.

 

Indeed, he even said that Obi-Wan is not even fighting...

 

There were several instances of this, like his fight with Grievous, or the flying part at the very beginning.

Edited October 14, 2015 by cs_zoltan

[PadsterPwns]

Indeed, he even said that Obi-Wan is not even fighting...

 

Wow that ties with Revan's oneness in how badly that's worded. Right, I've edited that bit of my argument. Thanks for pointing that out.

Edited October 14, 2015 by PadsterPwns

[cs_zoltan]

Edit: Ignore the magnaguard comparison with Obi-Wan, although I'll still say how quickly he killed the magnaguards is still a good feat.

 

It is, Magnaguards are still no joke.

[S_W_LeGenD]

I'm not saying Fisto wins outright, I'm a massive Fisto fan but I know what his limits are and this fight is a tough fight for both Fisto and Nox. Nox obviously has the edge in raw force power and applying force techniques in combat but Nox will have a tough time doing this if Fisto is within melee range due to Fisto's unpredictable, randomized and swift assaults.

More like significant edge in both raw power and command of the Force aspects, and advantage in these two aspects is always a game-changer. This holds true even in the case of a strictly Lightsaber duel.

+

command of the Force sharpens the senses and improves precognition abilities while raw power grants the strength to conduct an attack forcefully and parry any blow. If a Force-user is 'a master of the Force' and well-trained in Lightsaber combat, this Force-user will be logically a potent duelist and will outduel a more capable duelist by virtue of his superiority in the ways of the Force. These are the basics of Star Wars that everybody should understand.

 

For example, Darth Thanaton dispatched Lord Skar to assassinate Darth Nox but guess what happened? Darth Nox slaughtered Lord Skar instead. Now who is Lord Skar? He honed his talents in the Jedi dueling arts to such a degree that he (officially) became unparalleled in Lightsaber combat in his era. Yes, I am not joking. On top of this, Lord Skar was a Sith Inquisitor (so he wasn't lacking in command of the Force and raw power aspects either).

 

Here is proof:

 

 

Taken from Star Wars: The Old Republic: Persons of Note (Lord Skar)

 

Since rising up from the Korriban Academy, Lord Skar has been Darth Thanaton’s apprentice. A valiant general and unparalleled lightsaber duelist, many have marveled that Skar has never moved against his master. In truth, Skar finds the life of a scheming Sith Lord distasteful, and prefers the more visceral thrill of battle to the political machinations of a Darth. But that is not to say that Skar lacks ambition, and he has been responsible for his fair number of betrayals and dead rivals over the years.

 

 

Now, you will be scratching your head and asking that how-come a Sith Inquisitor become a fantastic duelist? Because a Sith Inquisitor does not neglects training in the Jedi dueling arts:

 

 

Taken from Star Wars: The Old Republic: Sith Inquisitor (holonet)

 

An Inquisitor’s skills with a Lightsaber are equally impressive. Often wielding a double-bladed Lightsaber, Inquisitors use quick, guileful, and lethal maneuvers to strike their enemies down with astonishing speed.

 

 

A Sith Inquisitor also tends to wear an attire that does not compromises his agility:

 

 

Taken from Star Wars: The Old Republic: Sith Inquisitor (holonet)

 

Asserting power and authority is one of the highest priorities for the Sith Inquisitors. Their choice of attire reflects this strategy, as they often prefer dark, high-contrast robes to express their sophisticated tastes and ambitions for political control. Nonetheless, despite regal appearances, great attention is given to ensure all their attire allows the flexibility for stunning acrobatics in Lightsaber combat.

 

 

Therefore, it is possible that Darth Nox is an excellent duelist himself. In-fact, the official SWTOR holonet profiles reflect on the capabilities of the protagonists.

 

Kit Fisto can hope to close the gap if he is somehow tanking Darth Nox's force powers, which is absolutely unlikely. Now, you may assume a scenario that both stand 2 feet apart from each other before the duel begins but then what is stopping Darth Nox from unleashing a blast of power with a thought? Keep in mind that command of the Force is Darth Nox's specialty. Moreover, Darth Nox is not implied to be lacking even in Jedi dueling arts in any source.

 

So as apparent from the example of fate of Lord Skar, Kit Fisto is absolutely outgunned in this contest.

 

Also how will Nox keep Fisto out of melee range?

Covered above, my friend.

 

Fisto holds the edge in physical augmentation meaning he will be faster and stronger than Nox

We have no idea about Darth Nox's physical attributes and capabilities so this argument is moot. At maximum, based on the information in the holonet, it can be inferred that Darth Nox is extremely agile and capable of stunning acrobatic maneuvers. Proficiency in these matters might have proven to be useful against Lords Skar and Paladius.

 

and we should not forget how Fisto has out dueled Grievous, has moved at speeds that baffled TCW Kenobi and has stomped 2 magnaguards in a trilogy where 3 of them were overwhelming Obi-Wan. In addition Fisto has accolades that put him as among the best bladesmasters in the PT Order, which had combatants such as Obi-Wan, Shaak Ti and Mace Windu, though I'm not suggesting he is on par with them but simply not that far away from them either.

All of these developments imply that Fisto is a good duelist but I never disputed this point. My point is that Fisto is outgunned in raw power and command of the Force aspects in this contest and these shortcomings will prove to be his undoing. Fate of Lord Skar should also tell you something.

 

While Nox does have the edge in force power and applying force powers, this doesn't mean Fisto is a slouch in using the force either, he has demonstrated the ability to chain force pushes into his lightsaber sequences in his duel against Grievous, he has used telekinesis to perform a saber throw, he has used TK to lift and roll a large agrocite canister and he was able to sense when Obi-Wan was almost killed which he stopped by cutting through a support so that Ventress and Kenobi's fight ended.

These are basic Force abilities. Darth Thanaton (40 years before his prime) was capable of telekinetically disintegrating droids from point-blank distance(s) and telekinetically disarming opponents without even drawing his Lightsaber in a fight. Now imagine how much capable Darth Thanaton would have been in his prime days.

 

Could you give me something to prove Nox is "super-strong" and give examples of foes Nox has faced that are more dangerous than foes Fisto has faced? I'm fairly familiar with Nox as a character (playing through my second SI now actually ) but apart from Thanaton none of Nox's foes seem to come close to Grievous or Ventress.

Sure.

 

Darth Nox defeated following notable opponents:

 

1. Khem Val

 

A (Force-resistant) being who is naturally gifted in the use of Force Drain or similar powers; he have history of consuming lot of Force-users, even many (powerful) Force-users [officially]. Before Darth Nox, only Tulak Hord managed to defeat Khem Val in single combat. I hope that you have some knowledge of Tulak Hord; he is officially counted among the greatest and most powerful Sith in galactic history.

 

2. Darth Skotia

 

Now this is a Darth level opponent. Enhanced by cybernetics, Darth Skotia was a force to be reckoned with.

 

3. Lord Paladius

 

Lord Paladius possessed the rare talent to suppress Force-sensitivity of another Force-user with sheer force of will. He sapped Darth Nox's powers in a confrontation and it really amazes me how Darth Nox managed to defeat him. Outcome of this battle says a lot about Darth Nox's talents aside from being a master of the Dark Side.

 

4. Jedi Strike Team

 

Yes, Darth Nox singlehandedly destroyed a Jedi Strike Team (assembled to attack House Thul) with his powers.

 

5. Nomar Organa

 

By all accounts, a powerful Jedi Master; only Darth Nox stood a chance at defeating him in single combat [on Aldeeran] and he did.

 

6. Jedi Masters Ocera and Ryen

 

Darth Nox literally stomped two Jedi (Masters) in a confrontation.

 

7. Lord Skar

 

The unparalleled duelist of his era and a Sith Inquisitor. Yet his powers and skills with a lightsaber were not enough to overcome Darth Nox.

 

8. DP-6 Guard Droid

 

A massive droid with considerable firepower. Darth Nox one-shotted it with a powerful blast of Force Lightning.

 

9. Darth Kallous

 

Another Darth level opponent. Not much is known about him but only a powerful Sith could hope to become a Darth in the Empire.

 

10. Sith Strike Team

 

This Strike Team comprised of a Darth level opponent and two Sith Warriors. Yet, Darth Nox eliminated it.

 

11. Darth Thanaton

 

By all accounts, one of the most powerful Sith of the Empire (and possibly galactic history). Most Sith stood no chance against him in a confrontation and Darth Marr assumed that he wouldn't live long enough to witness his downfall. Darth Nox was forced to harness the raw power of several Sith ghosts via Sith Sorcery to defeat Darth Thanaton. To give you an idea, some Sith ghosts mortally wounded Darth Sidious on Korriban in an encounter; Sith ghosts can be extremely dangerous when hostile.

 

Again, I just want to state that while I think Fisto has a slight chance of gaining a win, I feel that it is too slight of a chance to matter, so in my opinion this is a 50/50.

No, my friend.

Edited October 14, 2015 by S_W_LeGenD

[cs_zoltan]

The funny thing is the only one Nox actually defeated alone is Khem Val, for everyone else she had backup.

[S_W_LeGenD]

The funny thing is the only one Nox actually defeated alone is Khem Val, for everyone else she had backup.

By this logic, Revan had backup in each confrontation during the events of KoTOR game. Funny thing is that your assertion can be refuted by revelations in published literature.

Edited October 14, 2015 by S_W_LeGenD

[cs_zoltan]

By this logic, Revan had backup in each confrontation during the events of KoTOR game. Funny thing is that your assertion can be refuted by revelations in published literature.

 

Such as?

[PadsterPwns]

More like significant edge in both raw power and command of the Force aspects, and advantage in these two aspects is always a game-changer. This holds true even in the case of a strictly Lightsaber duel.

+

command of the Force sharpens the senses and improves precognition abilities while raw power grants the strength to conduct an attack forcefully and parry any blow. If a Force-user is 'a master of the Force' and well-trained in Lightsaber combat, this Force-user will be logically a potent duelist and will outduel a more capable duelist by virtue of his superiority in the ways of the Force. These are the basics of Star Wars that everybody should understand.

 

I understand that the aforementioned factors often are the deciding factors in a duel between two combatants, however this is assuming that both are at least remotely near each other as far skill goes and that there isn't a huge disparity of force power. While Nox is obviously a skilled duelist, do you really think that Fisto will be challenged by Nox? Fisto, a Jedi who has accolades that state him as among the best bladesmasters in the PT era, in the entire history of the Jedi order and has feats to back these claims?

 

 

Now, you will be scratching your head and asking that how-come a Sith Inquisitor become a fantastic duelist? Because a Sith Inquisitor does not neglects training in the Jedi dueling arts:

 

In the source that you are citing it states that Inquisitors often use double-bladed lightsabers, if this is the case here and Nox is using a double bladed lightsaber then Nox is going to be hard pressed by Fisto, as his complete mastery of Form 1 will give him an advantage over Nox due to Form 1's effectiveness over multiple opponents, which can manifest as an effectiveness over multiple blades.

 

Kit Fisto can hope to close the gap if he is somehow tanking Darth Nox's force powers, which is absolutely unlikely. Now, you may assume a scenario that both stand 2 feet apart from each other before the duel begins but then what is stopping Darth Nox from unleashing a blast of power with a thought? Keep in mind that command of the Force is Darth Nox's specialty. Moreover, Darth Nox is not implied to be lacking even in Jedi dueling arts in any source.

 

While nothing stops Nox from unleashing a force assault, nothing stops Fisto from dodging it or, if it is lightning, simply using his lightsaber to absorb it. Keep in mind that throughout the game we have seen the PC's dodge lightning assaults, as seen on Coruscant where a pre-act 1 HoT dodges a blast of force lightning. If a pre-act 1 HoT can dodge force lightning, then Fisto, a Jedi known for being fast and agile surely can.

 

We have no idea about Darth Nox's physical attributes and capabilities so this argument is moot. At maximum, based on the information in the holonet, it can be inferred that Darth Nox is extremely agile and capable of stunning acrobatic maneuvers. Proficiency in these matters might have proven to be useful against Lords Skar and Paladius.

 

Well if we use the information we have then the argument is not moot. So we know that Nox is agile and capable of stunning acrobatic maneuvers but will this help against Fisto? As I've mentioned before Fisto is known for being a fast and agile opponent, able to stomp magnaguards through speed, keep up and overwhelm Grievous casually, baffle the eyes of TCW Kenobi and beat a JK droid. This last feat is particularly impressive as it is designed to kill Jedi and has slight precog abilities but Fisto still beat it. So Fisto is superior in augmenting his physical stats as Nox has next to no evidence that proves them even proficient at it.

 

These are basic Force abilities. Darth Thanaton (40 years before his prime) was capable of telekinetically disintegrating droids from point-blank distance(s) and telekinetically disarming opponents without even drawing his Lightsaber in a fight. Now imagine how much capable Darth Thanaton would have been in his prime days.

 

While these are basic force abilities I was simply listing that Fisto is not weak in the force, I was not arguing that he is superior to Nox in command of the force or raw force strength.

 

As for the list of foes you provided (thanks for that btw), as Zoltan said, apart from the battle with Khem, Nox has had some kind of help or assistance against all of them. Besides, the only foe on your list that comes close to Grievous is Thanaton and even then Nox didn't flat out stomp Thanaton, whereas Fisto casually handled Grievous.

Edited October 14, 2015 by PadsterPwns

[PadsterPwns]

Something I would like to say is that while Fisto can be arrogant, as pointed out by Rhyltran, I wouldn't say it would be his undoing as while he can be cocky he also has been shown to carefully gauge his opponent. An example of this being when Mace, Saesee Tiin, Agen Kolar and Fisto are going to arrest Palpatine, before they step into the gunship that takes them to Palpatine's office, Kit Fisto expresses that he would feel more comfortable if Obi-Wan was with them. While yes he is still arrogant, he doesn't exactly underestimate his opponents either which is why I feel this wouldn't be a major factor in this fight.

[Joluka]

I can't believe people are trying to say Fisto is anywhere near as strong as Nox... It's Fisto, guys, not Anakin or Obi-Wan.

[PadsterPwns]

I can't believe people are trying to say Fisto is anywhere near as strong as Nox... It's Fisto, guys, not Anakin or Obi-Wan.

 

Er, Anakin, and likely Kenobi, would take the majority over Nox and Fisto is only a tier under them. This is a fairly balanced match up. Nox may win, Fisto may win but neither is doing this easily or stomping.

[Aurbere]

Darth Nox would win. And, no, it's not really balanced.

 

Kit Fisto is a better duelist, yes, but when his opponent is primarily geared to a Force fight, Fisto's lack of power is going to cost him. He doesn't really have anything on someone who is one of the most powerful beings of their era. He can't bring anything to a Force fight that Nox can't deal with, especially when Nox is shrugging off a storm of lightning with casual ease and then dominated one of the most powerful beings in the galaxy.

 

Nox is one of the most powerful Sith in the galaxy at the time, by virtue of being on the Dark Council. It was believed by Darth Marr that he and Nox were the only ones keeping each other in check in the power struggle of the Dark Council. That certainly implies that Nox was in the #1 or #2 spot of the Sith Empire by the end of Shadow of Revan. Nox is easily Fisto's superior in power by virtue of feats and hype.

 

Kit Fisto's only real option is to get close, but he can't really do that when he can't defend against Nox's Force powers. He can't engage Nox on Nox's playing field, which is the only way for him to get close to engage in lightsaber combat. It's very unlikely that Fisto can overcome Nox's Force powers. Thus, he dies.

[S_W_LeGenD]

Such as?

You may check articles and cut-scenes.

 

If a companion is officially involved in a battle, he is featured in a cut-scene and his role his highlighted in an article. Khem Val is officially involved in the battle against Lord Zash so I did not highlight this particular confrontation in my list.

 

I understand that the aforementioned factors often are the deciding factors in a duel between two combatants, however this is assuming that both are at least remotely near each other as far skill goes and that there isn't a huge disparity of force power. While Nox is obviously a skilled duelist, do you really think that Fisto will be challenged by Nox? Fisto, a Jedi who has accolades that state him as among the best bladesmasters in the PT era, in the entire history of the Jedi order and has feats to back these claims?

Not often, those two factors will [always] make a difference unless some kind of circumstances are involved that put the wielder in trouble.

 

Look at the example of Revan; he does not have much hype in the matter of his skills with a Lightsaber but he will soundly defeat many master swordsmen [1 on 1]. Revan's precognitive abilities and senses are excellent; he is able to predict dueling moves of an opponent with perfect clarity before they materialize and capitalize on the situation.

 

As apparent from the example of fate of Lord Skar, you know that skills with a Lightsaber become irrelevant in a confrontation with Darth Nox.

 

In the source that you are citing it states that Inquisitors often use double-bladed lightsabers, if this is the case here and Nox is using a double bladed lightsaber then Nox is going to be hard pressed by Fisto, as his complete mastery of Form 1 will give him an advantage over Nox due to Form 1's effectiveness over multiple opponents, which can manifest as an effectiveness over multiple blades.

You expect Kit Fisto to outduel [any] wielder of double-bladed Lightsaber? Yes, Fisto specializes in Form I and might pose a threat to Darth Nox in a strict Lightsaber duel but I have provided ample evidence that skills with a Lightsaber become irrelevant in this contest because Darth Nox knows how to nullify such an advantage.

 

While nothing stops Nox from unleashing a force assault, nothing stops Fisto from dodging it or, if it is lightning, simply using his lightsaber to absorb it. Keep in mind that throughout the game we have seen the PC's dodge lightning assaults, as seen on Coruscant where a pre-act 1 HoT dodges a blast of force lightning. If a pre-act 1 HoT can dodge force lightning, then Fisto, a Jedi known for being fast and agile surely can.

Dodging Force powers is not as easy as you are implying it to be. Masters of the Force are able to unleash Force powers with a mere thought. Even the greatest and most agile Jedi are unable to evade Force powers from a master of the Force in a battle. Darth Nox can conjure a maelstrom of Force Lightning so I don't see the possibility of Fisto evading it or even containing it with a Lightsaber.

 

Look at this: http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11122/111222381/4540680-1938220067-u1PFE.gif

 

And this: http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11122/111222381/4540913-2102424676-vrFK7.gif

 

And this: http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11122/111222381/4540909-5309834253-Qp24z.gif

 

Besides, what is stopping Darth Nox from putting Fisto in a choke-hold and then bombard him to death or shatter his bones?

 

Look at this: http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11122/111222381/4540462-1752397739-vOWML.gif

 

Well if we use the information we have then the argument is not moot. So we know that Nox is agile and capable of stunning acrobatic maneuvers but will this help against Fisto? As I've mentioned before Fisto is known for being a fast and agile opponent, able to stomp magnaguards through speed, keep up and overwhelm Grievous casually, baffle the eyes of TCW Kenobi and beat a JK droid. This last feat is particularly impressive as it is designed to kill Jedi and has slight precog abilities but Fisto still beat it. So Fisto is superior in augmenting his physical stats as Nox has next to no evidence that proves them even proficient at it.

Darth Nox defeated the best swordsman of the Empire, my friend.

 

Besides, Darth Nox can use his powers to prevent even a super-strong Force-user to attack him with a Lightsaber: http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11122/111222381/4540461-8515922073-v1V0k.gif

 

While these are basic force abilities I was simply listing that Fisto is not weak in the force, I was not arguing that he is superior to Nox in command of the force or raw force strength.

Of-course, a Jedi Master is not expected to be weak in the Force. A weak Jedi wouldn't become a Master in the first place. But Fisto is a joke in comparison to the likes of Darth Nox in this department.

 

As for the list of foes you provided (thanks for that btw), as Zoltan said, apart from the battle with Khem, Nox has had some kind of help or assistance against all of them. Besides, the only foe on your list that comes close to Grievous is Thanaton and even then Nox didn't flat out stomp Thanaton, whereas Fisto casually handled Grievous.

You're welcome.

 

Such assistance is alleged. I recall Khem Val assisting Darth Nox in a battle against Lord Zash (officially) and I excluded this battle from the list.

 

Darth Thanaton comes close to General Grievous? You've got to be kidding me. Darth Thanaton would reduce the likes of Grievous to spare parts in a matter of seconds. Grievous should not be expected to be a match for a Sith (Lord), let alone the elites among the Lords.

Edited October 15, 2015 by S_W_LeGenD

[Nerithiel]

just a question since u guys make VS threads againist amazing duelists/skilled with the force users from the movies wouldnt be better make the version of Nox who weilds dualsaber he is better duelist and still use impressive force powers for either enchance his attacks or attack straight with em like the 1hand version