Arena won't be implemented with data supporting

[Elaithe]

The glory days of Arena was back in BC when Blizzard actively cared about them, after WOTLK hit and it became melee cleaves left and right 2 shotting everyone it was not fun at all. I'm glad Bioware will never implement Arena, was a failed experiment (if a fun one while it lasted)

[Scoobings]

Go to S. Korea and say that about E-Sports. Did you know they built entire stadiums down there for Starcraft?

 

There is a market for E-sports, just not an American one. Don't know about those Euros tho.

 

E-sports are pretty big in Europe and just generally pretty huge all over Asia. It'll catch on here, but slower because there was more of a mainstream "video games aren't cool" sentiment over here. It's working it's way up, video games are cool now. It's only a matter of time until people start wising up and seeing the cash cow that is e-sports that has been completely untapped.

 

WoW didn't work as an E-sport because of a few reasons, but the MAIN one (I think) is how truly spectator unfriendly it was. No free cameras, or overhead views, lackluster, and downright confusing UI. The game was not designed to be watched, which is the most important thing in having an e-sport. It has to be a spectacle, and fun to watch.

 

I think that's why this game actually has potential in this. It's got a completely new kind of pvp which has a really simple, trackable objective.

[klathnagma]

Whats wrong with arenas to the game? If you dont like it ,dont play it. Easy. But the hardcore pvpler need that aspct of the game since we want an option to compare with good players and get better.

What's wrong with Arenas is that in the end, if you make Arenas you have to balance PvP around them.

 

In wow there are over powered arena classes that are a real pain to play in any other kind of PvP in the game like the warlock class. The warlock is a damage over time class that in 3v3 spread the damage quite well making a lot of pressure for the opponent team. They are the class most played in top end 3v3 arena.

 

But that pressure come at the cost of almost no burst so most of the warlock population in wow are a free kill in world PvP, random battlegrounds or rated battlegrounds.

 

There exist the opposite as well. The frost mage class is a glass cannon with lots of CC and snares, but as those are dispelable, in Arenas they are usually trained and not the best Arena class around.

 

But in world PvP and random/rated battlegrounds, where you don't have a pocket healer at to dispel their cc, they completely over powered and can kill any class with ease. Most melee classes just sit in roots and cc the whole fight with a frost mage, being completely unable to play their characters. This of course is completely frustrating for any melee class.

 

And there is even a third and most hilarious case. The hunter class. They don't do very well in Arena as melee cleaves use to destroy them in few seconds - they have minimum range so if you stay on top of them they can do almost nothing. They are also quite hard to play in any kind of PvP so most of them neither do it quite well in battlegrounds.

 

But they are quite good at one thing, killing cloth players if you let them free cast - say mages and warlocks.

 

So in tournaments, where they don't have to climb ladders and face melee cleaves - that are utterly destroyed at high ratings by frost mages and warlocks - they do quite well.

 

So no balance for them at all as if a class is able to be in a tournament wining team, it is because it is fine.

 

For this the majority of the hunter players suffer badly.

 

So once you put arenas in game and start to balance them, you are making a nice and very fun game for the 2% of the game population and utterly destroying the fun of the 98% of the players.

 

I do really prefer if they balance the game around what the 98% of the population plays.

[BetweenMatt]

lololol everyone here saying that arenas are bad and ruin pvp etc etc etc......

 

 

were the dk's that didnt get glad s5.

 

that is all.

 

 

 

 

 

my real contribution to the thread.... e-sport is the way to go. i know i, as well as all the real pvpers that came to this game will eventually leave if arenas are never to come.

Edited December 29, 2011 by BetweenMatt

[Deferionus]

What's wrong with Arenas is that in the end, if you make Arenas you have to balance PvP around them.

 

In wow there are over powered arena classes that are a real pain to play in any other kind of PvP in the game like the warlock class. The warlock is a damage over time class that in 3v3 spread the damage quite well making a lot of pressure for the opponent team. They are the class most played in top end 3v3 arena.

 

But that pressure come at the cost of almost no burst so most of the warlock population in wow are a free kill in world PvP, random battlegrounds or rated battlegrounds.

 

 

On my warlock I dominate in both world pvp and BGs - both rated and regular. You are simply speaking for yourself.

 

Dot, Fear, Fear, Port, Snare, Run, Death Coil, Fear off drs, fear, fear, port. You rotate these abilities and you will out live the person for world pvp.

 

In RBGS warlocks are there for control. It's not unusual for me to go into the middle and put curse of exhuastion on everyone or just following a healer or two and fear spam them so they don't catch their tank, thus making the tank only have one healer, or none. In season 9 my team (Clearly Outplayed- US Sargeras) was 3100 team MMR and was number 1 north america with me doing this until everyone got emo and quit, transfered, or whatever. You have to know the right time to do this to keep healers away and when you need to just go and help DPS though.

[klathnagma]

WoW didn't work as an E-sport because of a few reasons, but the MAIN one (I think) is how truly spectator unfriendly it was.

WoW did not worked as an e-sport as it got kicked from tournaments because their flagrant unbalance in PvP.

 

In wow gear > skill, and team composition > gear. There is no PvP balance at all.

 

Flavour of The Month classes steam roll any other class from patch to patch.

 

Over powered team compositions arise and completely destroy whatever skilled PvPers you put in front of them.

 

You can make an e-sport based on what is the OP class and comp today.

[klathnagma]

On my warlock I dominate in both world pvp and BGs - both rated and regular. You are simply speaking for yourself.

It is what the warlock community have been saying on wow forums the whole expansion.

 

Just go there and watch for yourself.

[mastersloup]

There are many, many games where you can play against other players to your heart's content.

 

Why people think MMOs should, could, or are great for PvP competition is beyond me.

 

You can't have competition without danger and with gear (and levels) playing a huge part of MMO's pvp that danger is not present in a vast amount of PvP encounters (in the majority of modern MMOs).

 

In EvE: A kestrel isn't going to kill a Titan even if the Titan's pilot is on vacation for the next week.

 

In WoW: A fresh max level player wouldn't kill a quadraplegic player with the best gear.

 

In StarCraft: A brand new player could, concievably, beat a Top 10 player if he cheesed hard enough.

 

Street Fighter: I could get lucky and button mash my way to victory against a great player.

 

Any FPS: A 4 year old could snipe the best player in the world.

 

 

 

Moral of the story is: If you want good PvP, you're playing the wrong genre of games.

 

It's basically like coming here and complaning the platforming sections aren't as good as Mario Bros. No ****.

 

I may talk a lot about guild wars 2 on this forum but look at what arenanet have done. Guild wars 2 is already great enough to be An E-sport. They have done everything to make both PvE and PvP balanced and fun. PvP in a mmo can be balanced. Most devs just need to get over themself and allow ability to act differently on a player and a monster like some skills in Gw1 and Gw2.

 

You can't balance a game if you balance only around PvE and then blindy introduce PvP and call it a day. This is exactly what Bioware and blizzard did.

[Zerbak]

I find it funny that the bulk of the people responding as what is wrong with Arena are using well thought-out responses, breaking paragraphs up well, and overall showing maturity through their post.

 

Those for Arena, overall are responding with "lol Arena is cool, ur all noobz."

 

Perhaps a defined maturity difference (regardless of the user's actual age) between the opposing sides? This is definitely a blanket statement, but it seems like the "hardcore" players are the ones that have the "me me me" mantra and responses of a bratty child. Sadly that's rampant across many of the PvP servers and PvP players, one of the reasons why I many times opt for PvE servers. It's not the lack of challenge or "fear" of being ganked, but rather, the amout of immaturity displayed by the average user and need to prove oneself, or be the baddest bro in the game.

 

BioWare has designed this game with a particular intent. No amount of crying on my or your part is going to affect their decision. They have stated already that they will not succumb to the woes spouted on the forums, but adapt based on the data they collect. I can only assume that the apparent drop in Arena numbers, the admitted imbalances by Blizzard developers, and the over-arching opinion of the bulk of BioWare's target audience towards Arena, will cause it to not be a part of this game.

 

Competitive gaming will be offered to the hardcore PvP'ers, Mr. Reid stated that in this last interview. You will get your venue, or "e-sport." If you don't like it, there are other games available for you.

[DurdensWrath]

Yes do, I promise you wont have to participate in it if you dont want to.

 

You couldn't be more wrong. A lot of PvE nerfs came from Arena. Don't pretend it didn't.

[Dcayd]

I find it funny that the bulk of the people responding as what is wrong with Arena are using well thought-out responses, breaking paragraphs up well, and overall showing maturity through their post.

 

Those for Arena, overall are responding with "lol Arena is cool, ur all noobz."

 

Perhaps a defined maturity difference (regardless of the user's actual age) between the opposing sides? This is definitely a blanket statement, but it seems like the "hardcore" players are the ones that have the "me me me" mantra and responses of a bratty child. Sadly that's rampant across many of the PvP servers and PvP players, one of the reasons why I many times opt for PvE servers. It's not the lack of challenge or "fear" of being ganked, but rather, the amout of immaturity displayed by the average user and need to prove oneself, or be the baddest bro in the game.

 

BioWare has designed this game with a particular intent. No amount of crying on my or your part is going to affect their decision. They have stated already that they will not succumb to the woes spouted on the forums, but adapt based on the data they collect. I can only assume that the apparent drop in Arena numbers, the admitted imbalances by Blizzard developers, and the over-arching opinion of the bulk of BioWare's target audience towards Arena, will cause it to not be a part of this game.

 

Competitive gaming will be offered to the hardcore PvP'ers, Mr. Reid stated that in this last interview. You will get your venue, or "e-sport." If you don't like it, there are other games available for you.

 

That's funny, to me most of the anti-arena posters are just saying "it was bad in WOW and unbalances pve and best gear yadda yadda" when plenty of the pro-arena posters have stated why it was bad for WOW, how the gear should be the same and not better, and how Bioware had already shown they are willing to separate pve and pvp for sake of balance in both (30% healing debuff in warzones). It's funny how many times someone says gear shouldn't be better or that arena balancing should be limited to arenas only to have the next poster complain that it's not fair to add arenas and make people do them for gear.

 

The big disconnect between pve and pvp players is not maturity as you like to stereotype, but that it seems most hardcore pve players can't comprehend the idea that for some people the carrot on the stick is not gear, but actual gameplay. I'd pvp naked as long as I'm still competitive.

 

And how is pvp epeen stroking but raiding not? What's the point of all that fancy raid gear if not to show off? To kill more bosses? For what? More gear. No matter what aspect of an mmo you enjoy, make no mistake: if you are doing it with others you are doing it for your e-peen.

 

If you don't like arenas then more power to you. We aren't asking for arenas to be the be-all end-all of pvp, we just want the option of doing it.

 

Edit: I could care less about "e sports", I just like the option to play smaller scale skirmishes without objectives and constant aoe spam. I do want arenas, but right now I want more wz and dual specs more.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Dcayd