Jeff Hickman has promised we will NOT be getting any new MMO content this year.

[GalacticStarfigh]

OP... this has been discussed, and the Poly article has been reviewed and re-reviewed. Was this news to you? They are not forgetting about MMO content. In fact, Eric and team will be putting up a blog that will detail the plans.

 

Let a little search through the forums guide you.

 

Now back to your regularly schedule programming. Let's talk slot machines! That horse "aint" dead yet.

 

Yes, it was news to me. Article is from last week. I don't think it quite qualifies as beating a dead horse just yet. Not even in internet time.

[FerkWork]

They really need to make blatant clickbaiting and sensationalism a ToS violation worthy of moderation.

 

Seconded

[Hebruixe]

Sweet!

[GalacticStarfigh]

Seconded

 

 

They really need to offer this Annual Thread Title Critics Convention some private space elsewhere, so they'd stop littering my thread.

 

You know what is great about touch sensationalist thread title topics? it is valuable reminder on how you never should settle digesting heart of the matter from topic alone. it usually can't be poured in 7 words anyway. Topics are allowed certain measure of artistic freedom I think. Actual text in OP itself starts with direct, 100% accurate quotes, cited sources, links to full context, etc. What else do you need?? Find better ways to have a problem with what I say, please.

 

I wonder what sort of a person it takes to actively hope there'd be more TOS violations to report.

Edited June 23, 2015 by GalacticStarfigh

[swils]

I'm quite happy they are focusing on story. PvP...Raids...you can find tons of those things in a dozen other MMOs.

 

A good story based system that can be pretty much all soloed...not so much.

 

 

"ehrmegerd Y U solo in MMO??!!" will be ignored

 

Ignoring the OP for a minute... this right here might just be the most asinine thing I've read recently. Especially the last line. "Here's my really stupid opinion, now I'm going to ignore the most obvious and applicable response to it! *smileyface*" It's an MMO. The focus *should* be on things like PvP and raids. I'm not saying that there's no room for story (there is plenty of room, and given that this is Bioware, I expect a high level of it), but to think that SWTOR is a good MMO because it is essentially offering the content of an offline RPG? Get real.

[HazardousMatt]

OKsowaitaminutehere.

Am I to understand that there are now people that consider *only* endgame content to be actual MMO content? Oh that's just too much. I mean, really. I've played an MMO that didn't even have an endgame at all (CoH, before they added raiding only 2 years before shutdown). And yet, somehow, that was magically considered an MMO.

 

This attitude of "the game doesn't start until the cap" really needs to go. It's ruining the genre.

[swils]

OKsowaitaminutehere.

Am I to understand that there are now people that consider *only* endgame content to be actual MMO content? Oh that's just too much. I mean, really. I've played an MMO that didn't even have an endgame at all (CoH, before they added raiding only 2 years before shutdown). And yet, somehow, that was magically considered an MMO.

 

This attitude of "the game doesn't start until the cap" really needs to go. It's ruining the genre.

 

No argument. (Group) flashpoints and the planet heroic quests (or in general, instances/quests across any MMO that require a group to do at-level) are a core part of the MMO experience. If you can just solo your way through it, you might as well be playing an offline RPG. Don't get me wrong, I've loved the 12x exp for grinding out 60's, but having that be only class quests, when I can't even have someone do that quest alongside me (of the same class, or, I would have to cut efficiency by doing both of our different class stories), man, that makes for a boring grind. Significantly shorter, but boring. I do enjoy the group aspect of leveling.

 

I think that the "game doesn't start until the cap" is wrong. If that were the case, there shouldn't even be leveling. But there definitely does need to be enough content at the cap to keep people engaged. Eventually you run out of fresh content, either by leveling enough alts and seeing everything, or by burning out on end game.

[TravelersWay]

OKsowaitaminutehere.

Am I to understand that there are now people that consider *only* endgame content to be actual MMO content? Oh that's just too much. I mean, really. I've played an MMO that didn't even have an endgame at all (CoH, before they added raiding only 2 years before shutdown). And yet, somehow, that was magically considered an MMO.

 

This attitude of "the game doesn't start until the cap" really needs to go. It's ruining the genre.

 

Indeed. Again we see the narrow-mindedness of the gaming community - much like when the discussion of what Pay to Win means comes up. There is more to an MMO than just PvP and Raids. Point of fact, for nearly every MMO I have every seen, when devs give stats out about what their playerbase is doing, only a small percentage of that playerbase actually engages in the "MMO elements" of the game. I have seen reports of anywhere from 1% to 10% of the playerbase that PvPs and/or Raids. Therefore, I would venture to say that PvPing and Raiding are in fact very minor parts in the overall MMO of a game.

[GalacticStarfigh]

OKsowaitaminutehere.

Am I to understand that there are now people that consider *only* endgame content to be actual MMO content? Oh that's just too much. I mean, really. I've played an MMO that didn't even have an endgame at all (CoH, before they added raiding only 2 years before shutdown). And yet, somehow, that was magically considered an MMO.

 

This attitude of "the game doesn't start until the cap" really needs to go. It's ruining the genre.

 

Not at all. At least I've not had exclusively end-game in mind. In this context,( = My problem with BW's philosophy in how to keep people paying. how to keep people playing& how to keep people playing and paying happy) I'd personally count everything that adds actual longevity as " core MMO conent" . Basically, stuff that doesn't lose much of it's appeal once you spend 10 hours to play through it once.

Edited June 23, 2015 by GalacticStarfigh

[swils]

Point of fact, for nearly every MMO I have every seen, when devs give stats out about what their playerbase is doing, only a small percentage of that playerbase actually engages in the "MMO elements" of the game. I have seen reports of anywhere from 1% to 10% of the playerbase that PvPs and/or Raids.

 

Statistics without sources are anecdotal at best.

[GalacticStarfigh]

 

only a small percentage of that playerbase actually engages in the "MMO elements" of the game. I have seen reports of anywhere from 1% to 10% of the playerbase that PvPs and/or Raids. Therefore, I would venture to say that PvPing and Raiding are in fact very minor parts in the overall MMO of a game.

 

When World of Warcraft was living it's absolute glory days around 2010, I recall Blizzard talking about how 70% of people playing WoW will never reach level 10. Imagine how huge this is. 70 percent. No doubt the number is even larger among TOR players, since game is F2P and all. [some tiny number here omg!] percentage of people raiding isn't about " people not caring about raiding or pvp" or " people not caring about MMO!" it is just about people being people: it is free to try the game. Significant, huge majority gives it a brief spin and then drops it anywhere between lvl 1 and lvl 30 etc. 0% of these people will have done a single Operation ever. On the other hand, 100% of these people have done some amount of story. I'm sure you realize it resuilts in a situation where you can easily provide numbers every bit as flattering of story as you can possibly imagine. Story starts getting crammed down your throat from the 1st second in. Literally every single character is " deeply involved with the stroy" Yet, it doesn't tell much about how many people enjoy it or how many people consider it vital. In all likelyhood, for huge majority of people quitting, story related content is all they've ever done.

 

 

 

When providing stats like these, specially for an F2P game, You'd have to put people in different pools: Players who have an active sub running. Those who've reached, say, lvl 50. Those who play more than 3 hrs/week. People who throw money at EA via CM. People who write forum posts, class guides and actually play the game. How important is raiding,FPs, pvp, GSF, etc is to these people? This is the group that counts. These are the people who have weight. The majority who pick the game up, " remain deeply involved with story!!" for like 10 hours and then forget about the game for rest of eternity have much less weight. Perhaps they have less weight IRL as well, since they don't sit on their arse playing an mmo. ;p

 

 

 

 

Actually found the article:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/blizzard-70-percent-of-new-wow-players-dont-get-past-level-10_1

Edited June 23, 2015 by GalacticStarfigh

[Sangetorix]

Um, this is to the OP:

 

I think this has been a simple misunderstanding. When the dev said that, "...it's all about story this year," I don't believe he meant that no MMO content would be introduced. I think he simply meant that the focus of this expansion was the story driven content. For example, with the other expansions new planets were introduced but a lot of these were not integral nor mandatory to the story. Like Oricon and Czerka...these places can be skipped entirely.

 

I mean look at what he says in the previous sentence about how there will still be raids and pvp and all that stuff. And the story driven stuff on rishi and yav weren't the good, Bioware-esque things a lot of people wanted. Not to mention new companions? Companions are part of the story. All the MMO stuff will come with the expansion as well, but the focus, ie, the primary purpose of this expansion is the story. That does not exclude new MMO content.

 

A lot of other people on here have said how the article has been thoroughly discussed and reviewed. Do you see what I'm saying here? I had the same apprehensions at first but then I then I thought about it that way.

[TravelersWay]

Statistics without sources are anecdotal at best.

 

The sources are available on that magical thing called the interswebz or something like that.

 

When providing stats like these, specially for an F2P game, You'd have to put people in different pools: Players who have an active sub running. Those who've reached, say, lvl 50. Those who play more than 3 hrs/week. People who throw money at EA via CM. People who write forum posts, class guides and actually play the game. How important is raiding,FPs, pvp, GSF, etc is to these people? This is the group that counts. These are the people who have weight. The majority who pick the game up, " remain deeply involved with story!!" for like 10 hours and then forget about the game for rest of eternity have much less weight. Perhaps they have less weight IRL as well, since they don't sit on their arse playing an mmo. ;p

 

From what I recall (it's been a while since I was looking at that stuff), the gist of the percentages were from active players and not those who stopped playing the game, which, as you said, would not make for accurate or useful information.

Edited June 23, 2015 by TravelersWay

[swils]

The sources are available on that magical thing called the interswebz or something like that.

 

If you wish to present them as evidence in support of your stance, the onus is on you to provide the sources. Otherwise you're just another guy on the internet citing some random numbers that seem to prove your point.

[GalacticStarfigh]

Um, this is to the OP:

 

I think this has been a simple misunderstanding. When the dev said that, "...it's all about story this year," I don't believe he meant that no MMO content would be introduced. I think he simply meant that the focus of this expansion was the story driven content. For example, with the other expansions new planets were introduced but a lot of these were not integral nor mandatory to the story. Like Oricon and Czerka...these places can be skipped entirely.

 

I mean look at what he says in the previous sentence about how there will still be raids and pvp and all that stuff. And the story driven stuff on rishi and yav weren't the good, Bioware-esque things a lot of people wanted. Not to mention new companions? Companions are part of the story. All the MMO stuff will come with the expansion as well, but the focus, ie, the primary purpose of this expansion is the story. That does not exclude new MMO content.

 

A lot of other people on here have said how the article has been thoroughly discussed and reviewed. Do you see what I'm saying here? I had the same apprehensions at first but then I then I thought about it that way.

 

I guess we'll see about that. I think so far we have one scale piled up with lead dev proudly declaring " this year will be all about story" and lots of pre-release hype, multi million dollar cinematics included, kinda underlining this statement. Meanwhile, other scale comes up with some vague promise about the " the other stuff" that will get looked into "later" or whatever.

 

Imagine Christoph Waltz from Inglorious basters sitting behind his office table. Holding the collective weight of 8 mil daddy issue cgi and " all about story" statements in one of his palms..and " uhh blog post about other STUFF " in another palm. Measuring their weights up.

 

...It makes a pretty tipped scale

[Rafaman]

Yes, it was news to me. Article is from last week. I don't think it quite qualifies as beating a dead horse just yet. Not even in internet time.

 

Last week is a long time on the internet. Articles have a shelf life of maybe a day or two before it is old news.

 

But that's cool. It was news to you.

 

Bottom line, you are reading way too much into this. This will still be an MMO. "MMO content" will be coming. They are focusing on story which well they should. Story was and has been this MMO's niche for 3 1/2 years.

 

You should also remember that MMOs are a building process and not a finished product. New systems, content and improvements are introduced all the time. This is no different.

 

You may not like what it is being built up now, but it will be a huge boost to the game. What comes after will only benefit from this.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Rafaman

[GalacticStarfigh]

The sources are available on that magical thing called the interswebz or something like that.

 

 

 

From what I recall (it's been a while since I was looking at that stuff), the gist of the percentages were from active players and not those who stopped playing the game, which, as you said, would not make for accurate or useful information.

 

If I was busy making a huge point about some stats that I can't quite seem to recall, I'd go and double check them and provide a link while at it I bet!

[Sangetorix]

...It makes a pretty tipped scale

 

Maybe....but what you're saying is that there is no scale at all, but rather nothing but story. I don't think that's correct.

[branmakmuffin]

TOR is an MMO. Any content added to it is by definition "MMO content."

[Rafaman]

^^ This. 100% this.

 

I'm happy about the new stuff coming too. I'm excited. The stories are why I play this. I don't raid, pvp, or do flashpoints I can't solo. I basically play Malibu Darth Barbie and live the adventure. So, I'm happy.

 

Hello Luna! Somehow I knew you would be jumping in here.

 

I'm excited about the stories and going back to BW's strong suit. And... I raid, pvp, and do all the rest of it too.

 

It's all good here, except for that Theran situation. lol

Edited June 24, 2015 by Rafaman

[TheSeventhJedi]

"We [are] doing lots of stuff around flashpoints and operations and raid bosses and PVP"

How does that translate to no new MMO content?

 

I think it's way too soon to claim the MMO sky is falling. Let's see what the 2nd half of 2015 brings first.

 

Even if it did mean there was no new MMO content, if there truly was enough story content to warrant a complete departure for a few months to a year, well yeah, I'd be fine with that. I've definitely done the same ops over and over again - why not focus my repetition on what BioWare does best?

[Anaesha]

Hello Luna! Somehow I knew you would be jumping in here.

 

I'm excited about the stories and going back to BW's strong suit. And... I raid, pvp, and do all the rest of it too.

 

It's all good here, except for that Theran situation. lol

 

I don't raid all that much and only recently started PVPing but story is the main thing that BW excels at in their games be it a SP RPG or MMO.

[GalacticStarfigh]

Even if it did mean there was no new MMO content, if there truly was enough story content to warrant a complete departure for a few months to a year, well yeah, I'd be fine with that.

 

 

If I believed there was even a slightest of a change for anything of this scale, I wouldn't even bother making my complaints about this. 10 hours, 1 or 2 new zones of daily quests, experience that is just like playng through Rishi all over again. That is my guess of what waits underneath the cool multi million cgi and other hype. Just an educated guess and a bet though. But I don't think many feel like taking that bet. p

Edited June 24, 2015 by GalacticStarfigh

[annabethchase]

I guess we'll see about that. I think so far we have one scale piled up with lead dev proudly declaring " this year will be all about story" and lots of pre-release hype, multi million dollar cinematics included, kinda underlining this statement. Meanwhile, other scale comes up with some vague promise about the " the other stuff" that will get looked into "later" or whatever.

 

Imagine Christoph Waltz from Inglorious basters sitting behind his office table. Holding the collective weight of 8 mil daddy issue cgi and " all about story" statements in one of his palms..and " uhh blog post about other STUFF " in another palm. Measuring their weights up.

 

...It makes a pretty tipped scale

 

Only a sith deals in absolutes. We'll have some "mmo content".

[annabethchase]

If I believed there was even a slightest of a change for anything of this scale, I wouldn't even bother making my complaints about this. 10 hours, 1 or 2 new zones of daily quests, experience that is just like playng through Rishi all over again. That is my guess of what waits underneath the cool multi million cgi and other hype. Just an educated guess and a bet though. But I don't think many feel like taking that bet. p

 

Bioware is taking that bet. They literally are betting that the content they are producing is exactly what the majority of customers want.