Question: Can Trandoshans become a playable race in the future.

[Darth-Obvious]

being as the dev team is too lazy to make it so the cloak hoods dont cover twilek heads.it just clips... they said they werent gonna add anymore non regular headed speices... which is redarculous , want the targrutas and the shak ti species , , bothans. and ithorians. . trandosians too.... that would rool

 

What are you talking about? It's already been confirmed that Togruta are the next playable race, so you're just flat out lying when you say "hey said they werent gonna add anymore non regular headed speices"

 

As for cutscenes, I'm pretty sure trandos would work given the fact that they are roughly the size of a type 3 male body.

 

yea i they could add wookiees and trandos ... there body styles are basically type 3... and theres even a type 4 trando npc.... butt yea your right:)

 

No, you're both wrong. Trandos and Wookies are both significantly taller than body type 3. There is no way for them to fit in the existing cutscenes without cropping the tops of their heads off.

 

I appreciate the feedback, but the Sage/shadow has a Trandoshan as a companion so the animations are already there

 

No, they're not there. Qyzen, Bowdarr, Broonmark, and Khem all use the same skeleton and animations, however none of them have Sniper, Gunslinger, etc, animations rigged to them.

 

None of those races can fit on a majority of the games speeders either as they were all designed around the 8 existing body types.

 

the Togruta will become a playable race, so can the Trandoshan become a playable race as well.

 

No, they can't. The Togruta work in the confines of every requirement needed to become a playable race. They use the existing body types thus work in all cutscenes, can use all the class animations, and can use all the speeders in the game with no problem.

 

Every single one of you guys are just making stuff up in order to try and validate your opinion. Stating things as if they were fact when they couldn't be further from the truth.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Darth-Obvious

[Bluerodian]

Every single one of you guys are just making stuff up in order to try and validate your opinion. Stating things as if they were fact when they couldn't be further from the truth.

 

How about saying that some people simply don't care about "requirements" and no doubt will continue to push for what they want. Would you prefer that?

 

I know I don't care about the requirements. It really doesn't matter what is said to the contrary.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Bluerodian

[Raphael_diSanto]

No, you're both wrong. Trandos and Wookies are both significantly taller than body type 3. There is no way for them to fit in the existing cutscenes without cropping the tops of their heads off.

 

They're a different shape, too.

[Raphael_diSanto]

How about saying that some people simply don't care about "requirements" and no doubt will continue to push for what they want. Would you prefer that?

 

I know I don't care about the requirements. It really doesn't matter what is said to the contrary.

You may not care about the requirements, but whether you care about them or not, they're what new races have to meet. Have fun tilting at windmills, dude.

 

So it actually doesn't matter whether or not you care about the requirements. The fact is; they exist.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Raphael_diSanto

[Bluerodian]

You may not care about the requirements, but they're what new races have to meet. Have fun tilting at windmills, dude.

 

Isn't just me apparently.

 

I suspect, however, I am the only one that thinks the pixel romance is pointless and silly.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Bluerodian

[Raphael_diSanto]

Isn't just me apparently.

 

Lord no. Requirements or no requirements, it doesn't stop people from wanting. I hope you get it. I just don't think you will.

 

I can't speak for anyone else, but when I post saying "It's very unlikely to happen", that doesn't actually mean I'm against seeing Wookies or Trandos or whatever in the game. I played a Bothan in SWG, and I'm fairly sure I won't ever see her in TOR.

 

So it doesn't mean I don't want you to get it. It means exactly what it says: "It's very unlikely to happen, and this is why: X, Y, Z, etc etc"

 

I suspect, however, I am the only one that thinks the pixel romance is pointless and silly.

Definitely not the only one on this topic, either. However, it -is- one of the USPs for this MMO, so it wouldn't be a surprise if you were in a big minority amongst the playerbase of this particular MMO. Many people came to play TOR not because it was an MMO, but because they're BioWare fans. They're fans of BioWare's particular style of storytelling. They're fans of getting to know their companion characters, of taking them around on fights, of having them interject in conversations. And yes, they're fans of the romances. They wanted that Dragon Age/Mass Effect/KoTOR/Jade Empire experience, in a multiplayer setting.

 

So no, you're not the only one. But in an MMO where that's one of the reasons -why- people play BioWare games, you're definitely in the minority, certainly.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Raphael_diSanto

[OddballEasyEight]

How about saying that some people simply don't care about "requirements" and no doubt will continue to push for what they want. Would you prefer that?

 

I know I don't care about the requirements. It really doesn't matter what is said to the contrary.

 

Not enough players "don't care" about the requirements to make it profitable for BW to make a race that don't fit them.

 

Sure, they could make a wookiee race that doesn't speak basic and can't wear armour.

 

But it wouldn't sell many copies since most people don't want to sit through hundreds of hours of cutscenes of the main character going "wroooaar" at every line, and most people want their romances, and most people want to show off the armour that they spent all that money (in-game or even real) on.

 

Yes, there are players that would buy a race that doesn't fit the requirements, but there certainly aren't enough of them.

[Bluerodian]

Lord no. Requirements or no requirements, it doesn't stop people from wanting. I hope you get it. I just don't think you will.

 

I can't speak for anyone else, but when I post saying "It's very unlikely to happen", that doesn't actually mean I'm against seeing Wookies or Trandos or whatever in the game. I played a Bothan in SWG, and I'm fairly sure I won't ever see her in TOR.

 

So it doesn't mean I don't want you to get it. It means exactly what it says: "It's very unlikely to happen, and this is why: X, Y, Z, etc etc"

 

If people want something bad enough then they need to push for it. These requirements are not set in stone but people act like they are. Like you said you would want to play a Bothan but have effectively surrendered.

 

I say keep on pushing. When bioware or someone else starts quoting requirements tell them to stuff it and\or tell them to change the requirements.

 

Where Bioware is concerned the pressure has to be relentless

[XiamaraSimi]

since most people don't want to sit through hundreds of hours of cutscenes of the main character going "wroooaar" at every line, and most people want their romances, and most people want to show off the armour that they spent all that money (in-game or even real) on.

 

This, this to infinity! I wont even watch things that are in other languages with subtitles, gives me a headache.

Edited May 4, 2015 by XiamaraSimi

[Raphael_diSanto]

If people want something bad enough then they need to push for it. These requirements are not set in stone but people act like they are. Like you said you would want to play a Bothan but have effectively surrendered.

 

I say keep on pushing. When bioware or someone else starts quoting requirements tell them to stuff it and\or tell them to change the requirements.

 

Where Bioware is concerned the pressure has to be relentless

Well, potay-to, potah-to, really. You call it surrender, I call it living by the serenity prayer. You know, the bit that says "serenity to accept the things I cannot change" and "the wisdom to know the difference".

 

Also, you know "don't sweat the petty things". There's way more important things in life than whether or not I get to recreate Freya in SWTOR. I figure life's too short to get torqued out about it, so I roll with what I got, and I have fun with the races that exist. My enjoyment of TOR doesn't hinge on their being bothans, thank god. I'm just not that passionate about it. (Come to think of it, I'm not really that passionate about much of anything in a video game. It's just entertainment, after all)

 

But if you succeed, more power to ya. Maybe I'll roll a rodian. Or a wookie. Or a trando, or any of those other races that people are asking for that I find unlikely to be included. I have at least one of every one so far, including cathar, and I have a togrutan lined up for when that goes live. If they're there, I'll use 'em. If they're not, I won't. And it doesn't much bother me either way.

 

Good luck on your crusade though, dude. I still think yer tilting at windmills, but you're certainly entitled to do so.

[Darth-Obvious]

How about saying that some people simply don't care about "requirements" and no doubt will continue to push for what they want. Would you prefer that?

 

I know I don't care about the requirements. It really doesn't matter what is said to the contrary.

 

The problem is that you or people like you constantly think in terms of the sky is the limit and once someone points out to you the fault in that you either give up on that notion or complain.

 

Very rarely will someone like you ever present ideas about how to work with in the game's limitations because that's actually challenging and you need to know how the game works, but you'll never do that you'll constantly present things that are un obtainable rather than posting things that are actually possible that the devs could do. For instance you're never going to present an idea about how to best recycle art assets. You're always going to ask for something new and different. Perfect example of this is something like Forged Alliances Part 1. It was a clever idea that made the most out of something that was already part of the game (Tython/Korriban) while also adding in new elements (Cutscenes/Story/Theron/Lana)

 

If people want something bad enough then they need to push for it. These requirements are not set in stone but people act like they are. Like you said you would want to play a Bothan but have effectively surrendered.

 

I say keep on pushing. When bioware or someone else starts quoting requirements tell them to stuff it and\or tell them to change the requirements.

 

Where Bioware is concerned the pressure has to be relentless

 

That is insanity.

 

It's not that Wookies are completely impossible to get working in the game it's that they're not cost effective. The amount of time money, man hours, resources, etc, it would take to make them playable would never ever be able to turn a profit with the way the game currently is.

 

What you and so many people constantly fail to realize is that this game was not the WoW like success they thought it was going to be. They made/designed the game in such a way that they believed that was going to be the case but when that didn't happen it made everything way, way worse because then they stuck with a game that didn't have the numbers they needed but was still difficult, time consuming, and expensive to develop for.

 

Had this game been the WoW like success they thought you would've totally seen things like full on boxed retail expansions, more class quests, new classes, races like Wookies, etc, etc, but the game never became that kind of success and as such had to become drastically scaled back to the point where those type of things are never going to happen.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Darth-Obvious

[Bluerodian]

The problem is that you or people like you constantly think in terms of the sky is the limit and once someone points out to you the fault in that you either give up on that notion or complain.

 

Very rarely will someone like you ever present ideas about how to work with in the game's limitations because that's actually challenging and you need to know how the game works, but you'll never do that you'll constantly present things that are un obtainable rather than posting things that are actually possible that the devs could do. For instance you're never going to present an idea about how to best recycle art assets. You're always going to ask for something new and different. Perfect example of this is something like Forged Alliances Part 1. It was a clever idea that made the most out of something that was already part of the game (Tython/Korriban) while also adding in new elements (Cutscenes/Story/Theron/Lana)

 

 

 

That is insanity.

 

It's not that Wookies are completely impossible to get working in the game it's that they're not cost effective. The amount of time money, man hours, resources, etc, it would take to make them playable would never ever be able to turn a profit with the way the game currently is.

 

What you and so many people constantly fail to realize is that this game was not the WoW like success they thought it was going to be. They made/designed the game in such a way that they believed that was going to be the case but when that didn't happen it made everything way, way worse because then they stuck with a game that didn't have the numbers they needed but was still difficult, time consuming, and expensive to develop for.

 

Had this game been the WoW like success they thought you would've totally seen things like full on boxed retail expansions, more class quests, new classes, races like Wookies, etc, etc, but the game never became that kind of success and as such had to become drastically scaled back to the point where those type of things are never going to happen.

 

Yeah I don't care.

 

It does not matter one bit to me about whether or not their bean-counters can sleep at night worrying about next years earnings report. I'm unsympathetic to faceless corporations because their game didn't give them the ROI that they wanted. I am not a charity.

 

Insanity, however, is just blithely accepting the status quo without question. So why should I?

 

Finally, on the subject of reusing art assets. New species are the best example of it. All of the mostly hominid species (Bothans, Rodians, Kel'dor, etc) use the same body shapes as the existing species. Furthermore the character meshes have already been built. They would still need tweaking and work to prep them for use in-game, but then again so did Togruta. Point is that they would not require near the same amount of effort as a from-scratch development. Their requirements are THEIR requirements. Like most things these are not set in stone and can be opened up.

 

And for the record, I do computer programming professionally and have done 3D artwork as a hobby for many many years now. Hell I'd rip the models from the client and do the work for them if I thought they would use them.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Bluerodian

[Darth-Obvious]

Finally, on the subject of reusing art assets. New species are the best example of it. All of the mostly hominid species (Bothans, Rodians, Kel'dor, etc) use the same body shapes as the existing species. Furthermore the character meshes have already been built. They would still need tweaking and work to prep them for use in-game, but then again so did Togruta. Point is that they would not require near the same amount of effort as a from-scratch development. Their requirements are THEIR requirements. Like most things these are not set in stone and can be opened up.

 

Wrong yet again.

 

A new species has to be built from scratch to allow player customization. Did you not notice how the playable Cathar don't even resemble the vanilla Cathar models?

 

You're probably completely oblivious to the fact that just about every non playable race has two character models, a male one and a female one, however they're not built like the player characters.

 

You never seem to realize that you are almost constantly wrong about everything, at every point but yet you continue to state your opinion as fact or just flat out lie about things.

 

http://torwars.com/2013/01/18/torwars-dev-watch-1182013/

 

Making an alien race fully human playable is a huge amount of work, at least if you want to give players the level of customization options that they have come to expect. It takes a lot of work to make all of the customization options work together and look good, while still ensuring people still can find looks that are unique to each other.

 

The Togruta provide a unique problem in this regard, in regards to the tentacles. Yes, the Twi’leks have tentacles too, but they are typically behind the player, whereas the Togruta’s canonically drape across the front of the character. This means that they struggle to work with the existing animations and gear without clipping — indeed, the first screenshot you see for Ashara if you google her is one with her chin ridiculously clipping through her tentacle. While this may be acceptable for a companion who is frequently offscreen while fighting, or NPCs who we can dress and pose carefully, its much more problematic for player characters who need to be able to wear anything and perform any animation and still look good. (The Twi’leks clip somewhat as well, but much art was tweaked to make this a lot less prevalent than it otherwise would have been)

 

I’m not trying to pour cold water in the species discussion. Quite the opposite – if the Cathar do well, I hope to expand your options even more, and we should know the answer to that ‘soonish’. I just don’t want anyone to think that just because an alien is currently in the game as an NPC, that it is trivial to turn it into player art — it’s a TON of work to do that, and do it well.

[Bluerodian]

Wrong yet again.

 

A new species has to be built from scratch to allow player customization. Did you not notice how the playable Cathar don't even resemble the vanilla Cathar models?

 

You're probably completely oblivious to the fact that just about every non playable race has two character models, a male one and a female one, however they're not built like the player characters.

 

You never seem to realize that you are almost constantly wrong about everything, at every point but yet you continue to state your opinion as fact or just flat out lie about things.

 

http://torwars.com/2013/01/18/torwars-dev-watch-1182013/

 

You never seem to realize that I do not care what they say. Has that not sunken in? You keep right on fuming and pulling your hair out, though.

 

Anyway, to put the discussion back on the rails. The OP wants Trandoshans. I think he should have them. Anyone else's feelings be damned.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Bluerodian

[Raphael_diSanto]

I will admit to some confusion here, bluerodian.

 

BioWare are the ones who set the rules, yet you claim you don't care what they say. You don't care what the rules are, but you're still governed by them, whether you like it or not. So it doesn't really matter whether or not you care - The rules still apply to you. You are still under their control (i.e. you can't yet make a rodian), and you don't have the power to change them - And unless you get the job in BioWare that determines which new races get added, you'll never have the power to change them.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Raphael_diSanto

[Bluerodian]

I will admit to some confusion here, bluerodian.

 

BioWare are the ones who set the rules, yet you claim you don't care what they say. You don't care what the rules are, but you're still governed by them, whether you like it or not. So it doesn't really matter whether or not you care - The rules still apply to you. You are still under their control (i.e. you can't yet make a rodian), and you don't have the power to change them - And unless you get the job in BioWare that determines which new races get added, you'll never have the power to change them.

 

You're right I can't change the rules, but when some goes throwing them around, especially Bioware, I simply say "so what? Change them." It's their rules and they can change them anytime they choose. Would it work? I have no delusions about whether it would or not, but I'm damn sure not just going to blindly accept it out of hand.

 

Throw discourse and disagreement in their faces in hopes of spurring thought and change.

 

And I'm done here. Time for sleep.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Bluerodian

[fdbgjfdhjgkjdhsg]

I have a dream!

That one day playable species will not

be judged by the clipping of their skin,

but by the needs of the players.

[Darth-Obvious]

You're right I can't change the rules, but when some goes throwing them around, especially Bioware, I simply say "so what? Change them." It's their rules and they can change them anytime they choose. Would it work? I have no delusions about whether it would or not, but I'm damn sure not just going to blindly accept it out of hand.

 

Throw discourse and disagreement in their faces in hopes of spurring thought and change.

 

And I'm done here. Time for sleep.

 

By that logic we should be trying to change the rules of gravity just because we want to fly.

 

Not everything can be changed simply because you want it to be that way. You need to learn to accept that somethings just aren't possible rather than constantly being deluded.

[Bluerodian]

By that logic we should be trying to change the rules of gravity just because we want to fly.

 

Not everything can be changed simply because you want it to be that way. You need to learn to accept that somethings just aren't possible rather than constantly being deluded.

Gravity is an immutable law of the known universe. Rules against species are something someone puked out into a design document.

 

Pretty clear difference there.

[Darth-Obvious]

Gravity is an immutable law of the known universe. Rules against species are something someone puked out into a design document.

 

Pretty clear difference there.

 

It has nothing to do with the game's design doc, it has more to do with what the game currently is and where it's at currently.

 

Like I said before had this game been the WoW like success they thought they would've "easily" been able to go back in and add playable Wookies or whatever because they would've had the budget, staff, resources, etc, to make that happen.

 

The situation as it stands right now is completely different and since launch it's become a would you rather situation, ie would you rather they focus resources on making Wookies playable or instead make new story content? You can substitute story content with anything else really. In the end though races like Wookies are never going to be the winner of that question because there's always going to be something that players want way more that is far more lucrative for BW to do.

[SgtJeremy]

Is not completely impossible to make a race that has no romances available? I mean at this point do we need to romance on every character we make. At this point I don't even romance anyone because it's pointless. And if they did a poll to ask if people would buy a race that has no romance options just to see. And maybe even check to see if people are for or against having limited customizations for races that aren't to Human spec.

[branmakmuffin]

Yeah I don't care.

 

It does not matter one bit to me about whether or not their bean-counters can sleep at night worrying about next years earnings report. I'm unsympathetic to faceless corporations because their game didn't give them the ROI that they wanted. I am not a charity.

Yeah, neither are they. And you are free to not care all you want. When the BluerodianMMO starts up, you can show us all how it's done.

[wilsonstone]

Yeah I don't care.

 

It does not matter one bit to me about whether or not their bean-counters can sleep at night worrying about next years earnings report. I'm unsympathetic to faceless corporations because their game didn't give them the ROI that they wanted. I am not a charity.

 

SWTOR isn't a charity either. They aren't going to spend time, money and resources on something that isn't going to turn a profit. They'd be insane to do that. So if the 'bean-counters' look at it and say, "whoa, we'll never get a profit out of making playable trandoshans/rodians/wookies" you can be fairly certain they ain't gonna do it, no matter how much you may want them to. I think its accurate to say if you don't care about their bottom line, they don't care that you don't care.

 

and in the long run, there aren't enough people that care enough about these races being added to make them care. (Because then they might lose paying customers). If there were you'd see it happening.

 

Insanity, however, is just blithely accepting the status quo without question. So why should I?

.

 

Because its not a status quo thing. Others have already noted the problems with adding trandoshans/wookies/hortas/whatever. No one is saying you have to like it, but it is what it is. You don't have to accept it, you can always unsub. But that's not going to change the reality of the situation.

 

I don't think anyone is 'blithely accepting the status quo". I think most players don't give a crap about adding these races. Personally I don't care if they do or not though I'd rather see them use resources for content. (I wouldn't play them anyway, the constant "alien-talk" would drive me bonkers)

[MbaxterBeau]

Man I hope not...I put Qyzen Fess in the deepest depths of my ship so I never have to see him again, or listen to his guttural whining about how Trandoshans are treated unfairly and how he lost his high score.

 

^^^ so true! He stinks as a tank also.

[Darth-Obvious]

Is not completely impossible to make a race that has no romances available? I mean at this point do we need to romance on every character we make. At this point I don't even romance anyone because it's pointless. And if they did a poll to ask if people would buy a race that has no romance options just to see. And maybe even check to see if people are for or against having limited customizations for races that aren't to Human spec.

 

Those things aren't the issue.

 

Does/Can X race use the 8 body types currently in the game? <-That is and will always be the most important factor to a race becoming playable.

 

Nearly every part of the game is built around those 8 body types, so if a race doesn't/can't use them then they're never going to become playable.

 

I'll use Wookies as an example...

 

- Would Wookies work within the existing cutscenes without any issues? No.

- Can Wookies use the existing armor sets? No.

- Do Wookies have all the class based animations mapped to their skeleton/mesh? No.

- Can Wookies use all of the currently available mounts in the game without issue? No.

 

Romances are not a part of the overall issue. There are multiple other problems that a race like Wookies, Trandos, etc, would have to overcome prior to ever having to worry about romances.