-Yui- Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) A few thousand replies and all we get is a nerf to GbtF and Force Camo immunity. I don't even play this game that much anymore but I'm still surprisingly disappointed -- as I think is every Sentinel/Mara right now. Bioware, any more updates on "the status of our class" as you called it? /salty Edited February 18, 2015 by -Yui- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dyvim Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) EAWare happened to it. Yep, huge disappointment. The community basically came to a consensus on the primary issues...time on target and mobility, plus watchmen rotation, precision switching to charges, etc. And it sounded like the devs did too, but what we get is a crap sandwich. An arguably mediocre change that is not a clear improvement with gbtf and a change to force camo that does little or nothing to address the core problems with the class. Extremely disappointing, and DOES NOTHING to appreciably improve the class in PvP, where we are a bottom tier performer or in PvE where we are amongst the LEAST attractive choices to have in a ops grp.... So in other words, epic fail and a complete waste of our time in giving feedback and trying to make this game better. And whatever developer put time into this...they should be removed. A blind idiot could see what was needed, and they totally failed to deliver. And the crippling throw situation IS STILL CRAP. Edited February 18, 2015 by Dyvim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Projawa Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) Marauders have been in such a good spot for most of the game's life that to the devs, it's ok if they languish on the bottom for a bit. These things don't happen by accident. In the last 6-8 months they've clearly devoted less time and care to mara/sents than BHs, for example. I think it's funny that most of the balance changes are PVP driven when this is clearly a PVE centric game in terms of playerbase and resource allocation. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to focus on boosting PVE performance to satisfy the bigger PVE marauder player bloc? Edited February 18, 2015 by Projawa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dyvim Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) Marauders have been in such a good spot for most of the game's life that to the devs, it's ok if they languish on the bottom for a bit. These things don't happen by accident. In the last 6-8 months they've clearly devoted less time and care to mara/sents than BHs, for example. I think it's funny that most of the balance changes are PVP driven when this is clearly a PVE centric game in terms of playerbase and resource allocation. Wouldn't it make more sense for them to focus on boosting PVE performance to satisfy the bigger PVE marauder player bloc? Why does it have to be either pvp or pve when time on target, or melee restrictions/mechanics figure prominently in both areas as problems with the class? Again, in a game where you just cookie cuttered every build, half the classes are reskinned clones of the other half, and each class shares a basic class with commonality with another class...all in a game that strictly follows the tank-heal-dps trinity that has been around forever...it shouldn't be too difficult for professionals to take the few classes in the game, with the few build options, and deliver a better, viable play experience across them, then we have now. Much better. Otherwise, why are we putting up with a basic, un-innovative trinity design that is decades old, and a batch of cloned, cookie cutter classes with no chance for even the limited hybrids that used to exist in the game? Classes that follow an equally old and unimaginative melee vs ranged set of restrictions. Where is the benefit to those trade offs? Edited February 18, 2015 by Dyvim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Projawa Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) Why does it have to be either pvp or pve when time on target, or melee restrictions/mechanics figure prominently in both areas as problems with the class? Again, in a game where you just cookie cuttered every build, half the classes are reskinned clones of the other half, and each class shares a basic class with commonality with another class...all in a game that strictly follows the tank-heal-dps trinity that has been around forever...it shouldn't be too difficult for professionals to take the few classes in the game, with the few build options, and deliver a better, viable play experience across them, then we have now. Much better. Otherwise, why are we putting up with a basic, un-innovative trinity design that is decades old, and a batch of cloned, cookie cutter classes with no chance for even the limited hybrids that used to exist in the game? Classes that follow an equally old and unimaginative melee vs ranged set of restrictions. Where is the benefit to those trade offs? You nailed it. Most of the classes share similar mechanics and design/build philosophies. For example, annihilation damage profile is just a rip off of hatred assassins. So why can't BW issue a more polished balance landscape after all this homogenization? The trinity is old and imperfect but it works. Many people assumed it would be easy to supplant or innovate beyond it. Then they tried Guild Wars and realized how good the trinity is. Edited February 18, 2015 by Projawa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dyvim Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 You nailed it. Most of the classes share similar mechanics and design/build philosophies. For example, annihilation damage profile is just a rip off of hatred assassins. So why can't BW issue a more polished balance landscape after all this homogenization? The trinity is old and imperfect but it works. Many people assumed it would be easy to supplant or innovate beyond it. Then they tried Guild Wars and realized how good the trinity is. Meh, I love what they did with GW2 classes, Mesmer is one of the most fun classes I have ever played. And they did away with melee vs ranged classes, and did away with the set in stone trinity. Having skills that are weapon based makes a ton of sense. It isn't a heavy raiding game, so it works. At least they TRIED to be a little innovative. But I digress. Don't mean to get sidetracked. Oh yeah, and watchmen isn't just a ripoff of serenity shadows, it is also a poor version of vigi guards.... so you have three classes with dots and dot spreading and guess who has the worst version, worst rotation, and yet the devs cant even be arsed to provide any fixes to it during "our" build, when there are TWO BETTER versions in the live game that we see everyday...go figure. That is kind of the epitome of my frustration atm. The game is full of similar classes with better tools. Yet they cant pull head from arse to do what they have done since launch...rip crap off, but do it in a way to IMPROVE sents. That is the trick they cant seem to grasp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastervalkar Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 This sums up the Sent/mara question quite nicely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dyvim Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 This sums up the Sent/mara question quite nicely Obviously you don't care about the class...so go be somewhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanis Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 This sums up the Sent/mara question quite nicely I will do what I always say to incompetent Players on overpowerd Classes that require no skill to run: "L2play OP Class and don´t die to a Sent and go ranting about Sents on the forums" Loves Epic Music when murdering Shadows/Sages I love how everyone always gets afraid when a 2nd Saber comes into play Damm I really like to take this anime for References lately;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 I will do what I always say to incompetent Players on overpowerd Classes that require no skill to run: You mean what sentinel used to be for over 2 years? Must be hard not be on the top for a short time, my condolences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkNecroCrusher Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 You mean what sentinel used to be for over 2 years? Must be hard not be on the top for a short time, my condolences. Hum ? LOL ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Yui- Posted February 19, 2015 Author Share Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) You mean what sentinel used to be for over 2 years? Must be hard not be on the top for a short time, my condolences. Sentinels haven't been regarded as top for quite a while now -- extending almost over a year back with patch 2.7 with the nerf to Smash. Even by then, most teams used Carnage instead of Smash (at least on the Bastion), and Carnage was never regarded as top. Really, by 2.0 most classes had been buffed to the level of Sentinels or beyond. The only time Sentinels were truly on top was perhaps 1.0 - 1.2. Then everyone rolled PT and Vanguard and realized what they could do with three buttons. Edited February 19, 2015 by -Yui- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cs_zoltan Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Sentinels haven't been regarded as top for quite a while now -- extending almost over a year back with patch 2.7 with the nerf to Smash. Even by then, most teams used Carnage instead of Smash (at least on the Bastion), and Carnage was never regarded as top. Really, by 2.0 most classes had been buffed to the level of Sentinels or beyond. The only time Sentinels were truly on top was perhaps 1.0 - 1.2. Then everyone rolled PT and Vanguard and realized what they could do with three buttons. Keep telling yourself that. Sents were op until the smash nerf and even after that Combat was top tier spec (not op, but very solid). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenphon Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Keep telling yourself that. Sents were op until the smash nerf and even after that Combat was top tier spec (not op, but very solid). The only reason people achieved such high number playing rage was because everyone in 8v8 stacked together. You'd never run rage in an arena, as people with brains would simply spread out and make sure you could do little to no real damage. Any skilled marauder in arenas would run carnage, which was, as you stated, solid, but not overpowered. In PvE marauders have always been in a good position. Bloodthirst added to the attractiveness of marauders for obvious reason. We were never overpowered, though. Marauders in progression teams were there because they were skilled raiders that knew their class in and out and knew how to adapt to new fights and mechanics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dyvim Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Keep telling yourself that. Sents were op until the smash nerf and even after that Combat was top tier spec (not op, but very solid). Only very, very bad players complained about smash. There were countless ways to mitigate it. Stupid lemmings that stacked and then forum whined, however, just aren't that bright. Combat was the build of choice for serious sentinels that were not comfortable with relying on their opponents utter stupidity as their primary strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanis Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 You mean what sentinel used to be for over 2 years? Must be hard not be on the top for a short time, my condolences. When has Watchman ever been OP? Or Fokus? They profited from incompetent rDPS not Decursing and/or huddling together and the lack of kiting ability among the non-Sentinel Main folk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Yui- Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Keep telling yourself that. Sents were op until the smash nerf and even after that Combat was top tier spec (not op, but very solid). So you agree with everything I've said? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor-Norton Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 (edited) Only very, very bad players complained about smash. There were countless ways to mitigate it. Stupid lemmings that stacked and then forum whined, however, just aren't that bright. Combat was the build of choice for serious sentinels that were not comfortable with relying on their opponents utter stupidity as their primary strategy. Yes, the only reason why the BiS Ranked 8v8 Setup was x2 Smash Maras (one going Carnage when you thought Carnage Pred was necessary) was because everyone in Ranked 8s were bad. And the reason why a double Smash Mara team in S1 on Pot5 went 126-2 was because everyone who did Team Ranked was bad. Carnage one of the above average specs (but not top tier, at least until 2.8 and it was only good for Team Ranked) after the Smash changes, but old Mara Smash was OP as **** and anyone who thinks differently is either clueless or lying. Edited February 20, 2015 by Emperor-Norton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Yui- Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Yes, the only reason why the BiS Ranked 8v8 Setup was x2 Smash Maras (one going Carnage when you thought Carnage Pred was necessary) was because everyone in Ranked 8s were bad. And the reason why a double Smash Mara team in S1 on Pot5 went 126-2 was because everyone who did Team Ranked was bad. Carnage one of the above average specs (but not top tier, at least until 2.8 and it was only good for Team Ranked) after the Smash changes, but old Mara Smash was OP as **** and anyone who thinks differently is either clueless or peddling an Agenda. Haha, actually, nobody brought Carnage. It was spec into Carnage, pred, and then spec back. It was OP, but OP in that era. Nowadays I actually don't think Smash would be that insane (hint, hint, that's my agenda). Afterall, one force storm (single target) does more damage than my ravage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trogusaurus Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 (edited) Keep telling yourself that. Sents were op until the smash nerf and even after that Combat was top tier spec (not op, but very solid). Top tier spec huh? I don't see many other classes out there that can have their main attack chains completely shut down with one mez. Edited February 20, 2015 by Trogusaurus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaellSolaris Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 (edited) The most funny thing is people who are still thinking sent/mara is fine. show me bro, show me your wonderfull skill as a sant/mara in a vid where you carry all the games where your are 'waiting ( probably for eternity ) Edited February 20, 2015 by KaellSolaris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shatterstar Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 Smash was a tad OP at that time, but it was also many other players being bad at the game, and clumping up so nicely for a sent/mara or two to crush them. With today's max health, and how hard some other classes hit for already, the old damage from smash would be right on target, and maybe even still a bit weak even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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