Osloares Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 So untill you hit the sorcs assasins and ap ptechs with the nerf bat im cancelling this subscription cya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Bob- Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 tl;dr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nidzolino Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 tschööö Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teclado Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 What class(es) do you play mostly? I think it's more a matter of boosting the weak ones than nerfing the strong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osloares Posted January 15, 2015 Author Share Posted January 15, 2015 What class(es) do you play mostly? I think it's more a matter of boosting the weak ones than nerfing the strong. But whats the chances of that happening? Little to none, i mostly play merc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkSaberMaster Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 tschööö 5char Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanceCorporalDan Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 So untill you hit the sorcs assasins and ap ptechs with the nerf bat im cancelling this subscription cya Very good thread. So many details on what the issues are and suggested fixes without breaking ACs or specs. I can't possibly see any counter argument to this post!!! Nerf operatives... /sarcasm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teclado Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 (edited) But whats the chances of that happening? Little to none, i mostly play merc. I think that they will eventually do something. They just move rather slowly with their balancing. Yeah, Mercs in arenas are really not so good. For regular warzones, mercs aren't all that bad, are they? I can understand how sorcs do seem to be superior in every way, except burst damage. Sins...yeah, I think everybody can agree hatred is ridiculous. PT really aren't all that crazy good, TBH. Other than the no-GCD shoulder cannon, I don't see too much of a problem. I have a 55 merc and 55 commando. I haven't played them much in 3.0, but I can't imagine that it's that bad (except arenas), is it? Arsenal's burst is pretty good, and electro net will tick off many mara / sin. Edited January 15, 2015 by teclado Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master-Nala Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I mostly play merc. Poor you. God speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhancelot Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Very good thread. So many details on what the issues are and suggested fixes without breaking ACs or specs. I can't possibly see any counter argument to this post!!! Nerf operatives... /sarcasm Pretty sure there are hundreds of threads created with ideas on what could help pvp, and all of them are greeted by many on these forums with "that's stupid", "Nothing is wrong with mercs you need to L2P", etc., etc. I can see why many people do not offer their ideas here. This guy is frustrated and needed a place to vent before making a decision he obviously doesn't really want to make. Hopefully the devs do something that helps the PVP aspects of the game. It's got tons of problems right now. Otherwise there will be more people like this fellow, who will drop their subs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master-Nala Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Otherwise there will be more people like this fellow, who will drop their subs. One can only hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brunner_Venda Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 The only biofail people worse at their jobs than the combat team, are the forum mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanceCorporalDan Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 (edited) Pretty sure there are hundreds of threads created with ideas on what could help pvp, and all of them are greeted by many on these forums with "that's stupid", "Nothing is wrong with mercs you need to L2P", etc., etc. I can see why many people do not offer their ideas here. This guy is frustrated and needed a place to vent before making a decision he obviously doesn't really want to make. Hopefully the devs do something that helps the PVP aspects of the game. It's got tons of problems right now. Otherwise there will be more people like this fellow, who will drop their subs. A majority of those threads are full of misinformation and half thought out ideas. Every once in a while you will come across a reasonable one and some posts in the underdeveloped threads shedding light on better alternatives than "NERF THIS CLASS, BUFF MINE!!! :(" I have no doubts the devs will get around to balancing, but as with everything else it may be some time. Many people that consider themselves PvPers just roll with the blows. If this causes people to drop their subs then they should look at the past 3 years of BW's "fixing" PvP. I just shrug it off, less QQ more Pew Pew! Edited January 15, 2015 by LanceCorporalDan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osloares Posted January 15, 2015 Author Share Posted January 15, 2015 (edited) A majority of those threads are full of misinformation and half thought out ideas. Every once in a while you will come across a reasonable one and some posts in the underdeveloped threads shedding light on better alternatives than "NERF THIS CLASS, BUFF MINE!!! :(" I have no doubts the devs will get around to balancing, but as with everything else it may be some time. Many people that consider themselves PvPers just roll with the blows. If this causes people to drop their subs then they should look at the past 3 years of BW's "fixing" PvP. I just shrug it off, less QQ more Pew Pew! You want reasons? I've got tons of reasons heres a short list Advanced Prototype / Tactics Burst damage is ridiculous Shoulder Cannon Faster then a tier 1 mount for 10 seconds (25 second cd) Shoulder Cannon Magnetic Blasts damage increase from Fire Burst (w.e its called) Shoulder Cannon Assasins/Shadows Force Shroud on all classes Stun lock without Stun bar moving (cant remember the name at the time) Absurd amount of damage Absurd Mobility Completely made Lethality/Concealment Useless to practically not played Sages/Sorcs Force Barrier Can heal while in Force Barrier Force Barriers short cd Dps specs can heal better then every other dps spec Force Barrier Ridiculous damage And even though the title says nerf. I'd much prefer a buff to arsenal mercenary but until then i don't see myself enjoying ranked or unranked pvp until it happens. Im all for being able to cast tracer missle on the move and never having to stop. But thats equally unbalanced as Sorcs and Tactics so i dont see that happening. Edited January 15, 2015 by Osloares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bosfordjd Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I have a 60 Merc that I only PVP with that's arsenal, I also recently leveled my Sorc and just started PVP'ing with him in 3.0. In regular warzones the Merc isn't terrible and if ignored you can turret enemies down quite easily(except healers), but against an equally geared opponent 1 on 1 you're noticeably weaker unless you have all your cooldowns and they don't have theirs. You just don't have enough defensive cooldowns for 1 on 1 fights, if you get good at pole dancing(line of sight) you can survive alright managing your the CDs and using power surge for another instant heal, but odds are you'll still get worn down with DoTs/stuns. In all honesty just changing the cooldown on our interrupt, and electronet would be a huge improvement. it doesn't need to be anything too drastic....or some kind of real speed burst. On my sorc it's so much easier even with only a few pieces of PvP gear at this point to stay alive and keep your health topped off with your static barrier healing you, plus a 25% damage reduction and reducing your enemies damage 25% when specced into those, a knockback, and speed burst 1 v 1 is much more manageable. I suspect I'll feel OP in regulars once I have at least a full exhumed set. I do regret not leveling and PvPing with sorc to start with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osloares Posted January 15, 2015 Author Share Posted January 15, 2015 I have a 60 Merc that I only PVP with that's arsenal, I also recently leveled my Sorc and just started PVP'ing with him in 3.0. In regular warzones the Merc isn't terrible and if ignored you can turret enemies down quite easily(except healers), but against an equally geared opponent 1 on 1 you're noticeably weaker unless you have all your cooldowns and they don't have theirs. You just don't have enough defensive cooldowns for 1 on 1 fights, if you get good at pole dancing(line of sight) you can survive alright managing your the CDs and using power surge for another instant heal, but odds are you'll still get worn down with DoTs/stuns. In all honesty just changing the cooldown on our interrupt, and electronet would be a huge improvement. it doesn't need to be anything too drastic....or some kind of real speed burst. On my sorc it's so much easier even with only a few pieces of PvP gear at this point to stay alive and keep your health topped off with your static barrier healing you, plus a 25% damage reduction and reducing your enemies damage 25% when specced into those, a knockback, and speed burst 1 v 1 is much more manageable. I suspect I'll feel OP in regulars once I have at least a full exhumed set. I do regret not leveling and PvPing with sorc to start with. Have you looked at mercs utility points? they have 2 that buff their defense. 2 TWO DOS and they suck DICK. Literally every other class has near 7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 (Hugs) Sorry you feel so bad. I kindda felt AC envy too when I discovered PvP because I had a Slinger, a Sniper, and a Sage, and no Scoundrel/Op, and all I wanted was to heal. Look, things change. But whatever works for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adovir Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Very good thread. So many details on what the issues are and suggested fixes without breaking ACs or specs. I can't possibly see any counter argument to this post!!! /sarcasm Nerf operatives.... Fixed it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanceCorporalDan Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 You want reasons? I've got tons of reasons heres a short list Advanced Prototype / Tactics Burst damage is ridiculous Shoulder Cannon Faster then a tier 1 mount for 10 seconds (25 second cd) Shoulder Cannon Magnetic Blasts damage increase from Fire Burst (w.e its called) Shoulder Cannon Assault/Pryo was a burst spec prior to 2.0 BW just switched the names. Burst is fine compared to survivability. Only thing really needing to be addressed could be IC on SC and maybe HtL/Range on skills. And that's being extremely generous. SC - See above. Hits hard, adjustment may be needed in overall damage, but takes a decent amount of wind up time to be of any use. SC - Again? See above. Assasins/Shadows Force Shroud on all classes Stun lock without Stun bar moving (cant remember the name at the time) Absurd amount of damage Absurd Mobility Completely made Lethality/Concealment Useless to practically not played Sins have always had this skill, regardless of spec. I don't really see your point. If you wanted to advocate change, you may have wanted to started back when they first got this. Don't take your meaning. Sorry. Hatred? Yes very strong, their survivability could be toned down in turn. Mobility? Depends on the spec played. But this seems to be a nonissue to me. They are a melee class, not casters after all. Ops could use love sure, but this has no bearing on Sins. Sages/Sorcs Force Barrier Can heal while in Force Barrier Force Barriers short cd Dps specs can heal better then every other dps spec Force Barrier Ridiculous damage What about it? They stay useless for a few seconds and can't aid their team *golf clap* I think this is a pretty nice tool for them honestly. Was it shortened? I didn't really look tbh. Either way they kind of needed it in the survivability department IMO. Agreed, but if you spend too much time healing you aren't really DPSing are you? See above. What is your definition of "ridiculous?" There should be small tweeks sure, but nothing drastic. And even though the title says nerf. I'd much prefer a buff to arsenal mercenary but until then i don't see myself enjoying ranked or unranked pvp until it happens. Im all for being able to cast tracer missle on the move and never having to stop. But thats equally unbalanced as Sorcs and Tactics so i dont see that happening. Oh yes I agree, I would rather see small tuning and buffs given to the underperforming specs instead. Mercs could use love for sure, but I am still having plenty of fun on mine. Is this really something worth leaving over? It's PvP. Dealing with balancing changes comes with the water just as fighting other players does. I have no doubts the devs will get around to changes. The questions really are: When, and how drastic? I personally only hope for small tweaks. BW has a history of having a heavy hand with buffs/nerfs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhobin Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I can't believe you made it through the smash and stun bubble era. Or the OP pyro era before it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bosfordjd Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Have you looked at mercs utility points? they have 2 that buff their defense. 2 TWO DOS and they suck DICK. Literally every other class has near 7. yeah, the are not very good. The other thing is there are so many stuns and snares that work when you're supposed to be immune to movement impairing effects. Hydraulic override is essentially useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanceCorporalDan Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 (edited) yeah, the are not very good. The other thing is there are so many stuns and snares that work when you're supposed to be immune to movement impairing effects. Hydraulic override is essentially useless. It doesn't provide immunity from stuns. Only physics.... being roots, pushes/pulls, slows etc. And I've never run into an issue with HO/HtL negating that. Edited January 15, 2015 by LanceCorporalDan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bosfordjd Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 It doesn't provide immunity from stuns. Only physics.... being roots, pushes/pulls, slows etc. And I've never run into an issue with HO/HtL negating that. Hence why it's useless. It does say movement impairing effects, apparently stuns aren't movement impairing /sarcasm. There are way tooo many stuns to start with and not considering them movement impairing...idiocy. I will give it one prop, it's good for the occasional huttball final run to prevent the knockback, but again nearly every other class has a superior move/speed burst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmbuddah Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I think that they will eventually do something. They just move rather slowly with their balancing. Yeah, Mercs in arenas are really not so good. For regular warzones, mercs aren't all that bad, are they? I can understand how sorcs do seem to be superior in every way, except burst damage. Sins...yeah, I think everybody can agree hatred is ridiculous. PT really aren't all that crazy good, TBH. Other than the no-GCD shoulder cannon, I don't see too much of a problem. I have a 55 merc and 55 commando. I haven't played them much in 3.0, but I can't imagine that it's that bad (except arenas), is it? Arsenal's burst is pretty good, and electro net will tick off many mara / sin.E Net is now cleansable, and all our defensive passives were removd from the trees and we have to pick them as utilities. Whereas other classes get their defensive passives in their trees, and they can choose things to make their class stronger with utilities. BW royally raped commando / merc class in 3.0. I guess that is the trade off for being more mobile? Oh wait......sorcerers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LanceCorporalDan Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Hence why it's useless. It does say movement impairing effects, apparently stuns aren't movement impairing /sarcasm. There are way tooo many stuns to start with and not considering them movement impairing...idiocy. I will give it one prop, it's good for the occasional huttball final run to prevent the knockback, but again nearly every other class has a superior move/speed burst. If you think HO/HtL is useless then there is really no hope for you as a trooper/BH. I'm sorry but that skill is FAR from useless, especially in the hands of an experienced player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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