Heat-Wave Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 PvP Premade groups of friends in all PvP gear should not be matched via the groupfinder to groups of PUGs. What continues to amaze me is that people even still try PvP, given the nonsense going on. Yea, yea, someone will reply, "L2P", I'm sure... Keep it up and you won't have anyone to play with but yourselves. Bioware, you changed skill trees partly to balance PvP, yet you didn't fix the problem. Perhaps you don't care, but you will, when it hits your bottom line as subs start leaving the next few months due to all the problems you won't fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahWSD Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Not that I disagree with you about the group finder, but it's really an issue of low population. There's nothing Bioware can do about it except cross server queues. Unfortunately, that ship has not only sailed but been sunk by an iceberg and had it's wreck filmed by James Cameron. Regarding deserting subs... I'm afraid that three years into this system that argument lacks teeth. Edited January 10, 2015 by RebekahWSD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howieloader Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 If you're PvPing enough that this bothers you, you should be in PvP gear to start with... It literally takes a Saturday to grind a full set of PvP gear... The only time this becomes a real problem is 6 mans or double premades with perfect comps... Sometimes, yeah its annoying if you're running into the same premade 5 or 6 games in a row... It happens to me on Jung Ma all the time because the Pub population is so low... Usually though, its not a big deal and I prefer playing against coordinated competition... That's the whole point of PvP: overcoming obstacles to succeed as a team... Premades don't stack the deck so severely against you that it removes any chance for the pug to win... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 Not that I disagree with you about the group finder, but it's really an issue of low population. There's nothing Bioware can do about it except cross server queues. Unfortunately, that ship has not only sailed but been sunk by an iceberg and had it's wreck filmed by James Cameron. Regarding deserting subs... I'm afraid that three years into this system that argument lacks teeth. That is funny, your James Cameron joke is well placed... That being said, one thing Bioware can do is to limit the number of people who can group together and be matched with PUGs, perhaps no more than 2. If you have a group of 4, the other side needs a group of 4 as well. If that means the group of 4 doesn't get a pop, well, then there isn't enough demand for that and they won't be missed. But what is happening is that they get into PvP and they are in the "right" classes and talking to each other, probably in TeamSpeak or something similar, and winning match after match. Regarding the sub issue, maybe so, you have a point... but then so perhaps do I... This game doesn't have millions of subs, it doesn't even have 500k subs anymore... Perhaps this is part of why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted January 10, 2015 Author Share Posted January 10, 2015 If you're PvPing enough that this bothers you, you should be in PvP gear to start with... It literally takes a Saturday to grind a full set of PvP gear... The only time this becomes a real problem is 6 mans or double premades with perfect comps... Wow, you must get more comms than I do... A Saturday of grind doing match after match, with no daily or weekly to tag towards? That sounds... horrible! But ok... fair enough... I guess I'll go find something else to play for awhile, the issues of PvP have gotten worse in the past month, not better. Perhaps I won't be missed, but this is just silly. --- Here is a thought for you... would you want to play a sports game over and over against a professional team if you're just a weekend player? When you lose 100 to nothing, 5 games in a row, would you keep playing? We don't do that in the real world because it is silly, you don't pit professional players against amateurs, yet somehow this is considered ok here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JattaGin Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 You haven't played Swtor-PvP back in 2012, haven't you? The current situation is like bliss compared to back then. (I nonetheless agree with you. I have always hated the premade vs. pug thing going on. Especially the premades that are not willing to e. g. accept an invitation for a ranked 4 vs. 4, premade vs. premade game. Instead they keep on facerolling the pugs. But that topic has been discussed plenty of times in the PvP section of this board.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 To take such things into account would be detrimental to queue times with the current population (even if it was cross server) Never going to happen unless the PvP population goes up by two orders of magnitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prisoner Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Yes let's stop people from playing with their friends in an MMO, because you're too lazy to grind a basic set of gear and find your own friends to play with! That's a fantastic idea, OP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yezzan Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Yes let's stop people from playing with their friends in an MMO, because you're too lazy to grind a basic set of gear and find your own friends to play with! That's a fantastic idea, OP! PvP gear does not win a match Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saremun Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 PvP Premade groups of friends in all PvP gear should not be matched via the groupfinder to groups of PUGs. What continues to amaze me is that people even still try PvP, given the nonsense going on. Yea, yea, someone will reply, "L2P", I'm sure... Keep it up and you won't have anyone to play with but yourselves. Bioware, you changed skill trees partly to balance PvP, yet you didn't fix the problem. Perhaps you don't care, but you will, when it hits your bottom line as subs start leaving the next few months due to all the problems you won't fix. I agree, because i have some guild mates who stoped PVPing because Premades on The progenitor server, its not enough we have this terrible design by BW called PVP but to top it we have premades too... I think that Premades should only be for Ranked WZs and not with pugs.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saremun Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Yes let's stop people from playing with their friends in an MMO, because you're too lazy to grind a basic set of gear and find your own friends to play with! That's a fantastic idea, OP! Sooooo i have to find friends just to enjoy PVP...genius idea for sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Sooooo i have to find friends just to enjoy PVP...genius idea for sure... Its what the PvPers do and its the single biggest reason they win as often as they do. Perhaps there is a lesson to be learned here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prisoner Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) PvP gear does not win a match Agreed. Coordination, teamwork and skill generally do. Which is why people play together on teams. The only reason I mentioned it was because the OP was crying about it. However, gear is helpful in making sure you don't get globaled though. Sooooo i have to find friends just to enjoy PVP...genius idea for sure... LMAO. In an MMO? YES. Yes you do. I mean, unless you enjoy being grouped with a bunch of players wearing 1300 expertise, there to farm conquest points, who sit on your one node all game crying on their keyboards about the fairness of PVP and yet fall magically silent when they need to shout an inc call. That's just the nature of a group based game. If you don't like it, there are plenty of single player games to play. In a group of four a team gets to control half of that ops frame - although frankly the fail on the other half is so strong sometimes that even that can't be overcome. Plus, it's fun to play with friends. Finally, let's get real. Not all premades are created equal. Grouping up with four people doesn't make a team unstoppable. I've been in plenty of matches where pugs end up winning against premades. Edited January 10, 2015 by Prisoner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howieloader Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Its what the PvPers do and its the single biggest reason they win as often as they do. Perhaps there is a lesson to be learned here. Not even ******* close... I mean, if you really believe that, that is just sad beyond sad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Not even ******* close... I mean, if you really believe that, that is just sad beyond sad... You're setting off my terrible pug alarm. Edited January 10, 2015 by jedip_enguin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howieloader Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 You're setting off my terrible pug alarm. I don't know what that is, feel free to elaborate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 I don't know what that is, feel free to elaborate... It like Spidermans 'spider sense' except it tingles when bads are near. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howieloader Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 It like Spidermans 'spider sense' except it tingles when bads are near. So because I disagree with you that the reason PvPers "win as often as they do" is because they are often in groups, that tickles you in some special way that gives you a type of clairvoyance to be able to tell through reading a few sentences on a message board that a person is bad at PvP??? I mean, feel free to read that again, and you tell me if you think that that would be described as something an intelligent person might say, or something a stupid person might say... Take your time, there's a lot of words there for you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howieloader Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 It like Spidermans 'spider sense' except it tingles when bads are near. You know, I just went through your last 500 forum posts, and shockingly I couldn't find 1 single post you've made in the PvP forums... I would certainly think that someone with your clear and obvious skill to detect someone's PvP skill through forum posts would have managed their way over to the PvP forums at least once in their last 500 messages... Please come over there and grace us with your presence, and help us to weed out other bads through your amazing gift... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tolunart Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 You know, I just went through your last 500 forum posts, and shockingly I couldn't find 1 single post you've made in the PvP forums... I would certainly think that someone with your clear and obvious skill to detect someone's PvP skill through forum posts would have managed their way over to the PvP forums at least once in their last 500 messages... Please come over there and grace us with your presence, and help us to weed out other bads through your amazing gift... The gift is like the fortune teller in the Scorpion King or one of the James Bond movies from the 70s... it only works so long as one remains a virgin. If one were to, er, engage in the activity, one would lose the gift to sense bad PVPers. That's why they stand on the sidelines and type helpful messages like "stop being bad!" instead of actually playing the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 A post so good you quoted it twice. Dare I say it but you seem...rustled? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alssaran Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 The gift is like the fortune teller in the Scorpion King or one of the James Bond movies from the 70s... it only works so long as one remains a virgin. If one were to, er, engage in the activity, one would lose the gift to sense bad PVPers. That's why they stand on the sidelines and type helpful messages like "stop being bad!" instead of actually playing the game. Or they might choose to read on a forum rather than post something, because any discussion has the possibility to become a "I'm better than you!" argument really quickly. I have a lot of friends who play in the top 5% of PvE and PvP tier in their respective MMO/on their respective server. Not only SW:TOR, but ESO and WoW too. Guess what? They choose not to engage in any forum thread because it bores them to no end. They don't need to change the game, they adapt. His argument was simply the truth: This is an MMORPG, with a focus on MMO. PvP is a...social interaction. You will enhance your experience when you participate with friends. And, let's be honest, it isn't really hard to make online friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howieloader Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 A post so good you quoted it twice. Dare I say it but you seem...rustled? No, I don't get "rustled" by people who converse in Spiderman references and memes yet ignore logical conclusions and counter-points... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) No, I don't get "rustled" by people who converse in Spiderman references and memes yet ignore logical conclusions and counter-points... PvPers primarily winning frequently because they play as a team against disorganised pugs is hardly an illogical conclusion. Skill, gear, the current meta (hello Shadows!), bugs and out and out luck are also factors but working as a team is in my experience the single biggest decider of WZ's. And Spiderman is awesome, he does whatever a spider can after all. Edited January 10, 2015 by jedip_enguin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howieloader Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 PvPers primarily winning frequently because they play as a team against disorganised pugs is hardly an illogical conclusion. This is painting with a broad brush since the use of "PvPers" includes anyone who PvPs... Now, I know the type of people you're talking about, but there are just as many (probably a larger amount of) people that PvP without grouping... There are some people on Jung Ma who I know absolutely will not queue unless they are in a group, but most of those people need a group and perfect comps to make up for their lack of skill and delicate egos... Also, there is no written rule that all pugs are disorganized... It takes about 2 vocal people in a group full of others who are willing to listen that can make a pug nearly as effective as a premade... I don't disagree with you that there are people who PvP that have to be in a group and faceroll pugs... I just contend that not all players do that, and not all pugs V premades are automatic losses for the pugs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts