3.0 assault dps - auto attack bonanza?

[cvak]

So, come 3.0 commandos now have a skill window or 4 instead of 3 between each mag shot, which severely guts our energy regen. This is to some part offset by the usage of supercharge, which puts up a dot and gives 10 energy back. However, to my understanding, what we got back doesn't make up for the energy lost, meaning post 3.0 assault dps goes energy starved very quickly.

 

Personally, I've managed to stay long term stable by skipping assault plastique from the rotation, but that also guts my dps. I can of course use it every now and then whenever recharge is up, and a free full auto every 1m30s also helps some, but I still feel I cannot possible keep afloat if I am to use all my skills.

 

Has anyone found something that works? Weren't bw supposed to ease energy management for us? Please tell me I'm just stupid (I did hit 4k dummy pre 3.0 though, so I at least knew the old rotation).

[TACeMossie]

So, come 3.0 commandos now have a skill window or 4 instead of 3 between each mag shot, which severely guts our energy regen. This is to some part offset by the usage of supercharge, which puts up a dot and gives 10 energy back. However, to my understanding, what we got back doesn't make up for the energy lost, meaning post 3.0 assault dps goes energy starved very quickly.

 

Personally, I've managed to stay long term stable by skipping assault plastique from the rotation, but that also guts my dps. I can of course use it every now and then whenever recharge is up, and a free full auto every 1m30s also helps some, but I still feel I cannot possible keep afloat if I am to use all my skills.

 

Has anyone found something that works? Weren't bw supposed to ease energy management for us? Please tell me I'm just stupid (I did hit 4k dummy pre 3.0 though, so I at least knew the old rotation).

 

The rotation is ridiculously tight, but you can keep almost everything important on Cooldown. I haven't been able to pull it off, but people like Gyro and some members of Zorz have been able to, and when they have pulled it off they've pulled ludicrous numbers.

 

Things to remember:

 

Get the talent for +16 energy on Recharge Cells

Reserve Powercell on Full Auto

Only use recharge cells immediately before a proc, or it will need another attack (due to how alacrity works) and screw you over

Use full auto to proc every second Mag Bolt, and an instant power shot for every other one.

[Gyronamics]

Your maximum autoattacks in a 15 second cycle will be two and you do everything once in that aside from two mag bolts.

 

This demands a strict rotation. The kind of thing where you will end up crawling up the walls in frustration if you're asked to do junk like add control.

 

In many ways its horrible, flexibility and resource control is totally shot.

 

If you get to tunnel something for say... a minute or more its likely to blow away most other competition.

 

 

 

#godliketrainingdummyspec

Edited December 5, 2014 by Gyronamics

[cvak]

Your maximum autoattacks in a 15 second cycle will be two and you do everything once in that aside from two mag bolts.

 

This demands a strict rotation. The kind of thing where you will end up crawling up the walls in frustration if you're asked to do junk like add control.

 

In many ways its horrible, flexibility and resource control is totally shot.

 

If you get to tunnel something for say... a minute or more its likely to blow away most other competition.

 

#godliketrainingdummyspec

 

I tried at first using everything in a 15 second window, but if you are to do that you can't fit either full auto, nor 2 auto attacks. See super thought out paint picture: http://imgur.com/tEXrHeR

 

Are you delaying mag procs? Or just using 1 CB and praying it will proc it (and thusly half of the time delay it)? Because the **** in the picture drains your energy at a rate that makes you think you're in the wrong cell.

[Gyronamics]

I'm not in a good place to discuss rotations right now since someone else frankly has dibs on my detailed thoughts on that at least in the short term.

 

But I'll tell you right now that spamming charged bolts is over.

 

Charged Bolts and Full Auto now guarantees a proc by ONE use.

 

As long as you time it right you use Charged Bolts or Full Auto once per 15s for two separate procs 7.5s apart. And you fill the rest of the time with everything else. And two hammer shots.

[Dalthanar]

Pretty new to Merc but right now having decide to stop tanking 2 days before release and levelling one from scratch.

 

A week in I am pulling higher and more sustained dps from Assault than Pyro, I get better procs on supercharged gas and a good bit of burst for pvp. On experience of other toons I think that I am missing a trick with Pryo (dots etc) but the rotation and heat management is eluding me, especially when you take it away from a dummy and into a raid.

 

I read once that if you are good with a merc then you will be awesome with pretty much anything else. Is that still the case?

 

 

(I know that the they change the names from assault and pyro but whatever)

Edited December 5, 2014 by Dalthanar

[cvak]

Charged Bolts and Full Auto now guarantees a proc by ONE use..

 

You just made my day.

[Volcan]

The rotation is ridiculously tight, but you can keep almost everything important on Cooldown. I haven't been able to pull it off, but people like Gyro and some members of Zorz have been able to, and when they have pulled it off they've pulled ludicrous numbers.

 

Things to remember:

 

Get the talent for +16 energy on Recharge Cells

Reserve Powercell on Full Auto

Only use recharge cells immediately before a proc, or it will need another attack (due to how alacrity works) and screw you over

Use full auto to proc every second Mag Bolt, and an instant power shot for every other one.

 

Pretty sure I have something very similar to what these guys are doing, I've seen a couple hundred points DPS INCREASE since 2.10, I was not expecting that... Looking forward to seeing whoever has "dibs" on this info (not sure I understand that mentality, but that's fine.) I swear BW basically made a complicated puzzle with only one solution for Assault 3.0. Ops should be quite a challenge for us Assault/Pyro players. I see Gunnery still having a place at the table 3.0 operations for sure.

[cvak]

Things to remember:

 

Get the talent for +16 energy on Recharge Cells

Reserve Powercell on Full Auto

Only use recharge cells immediately before a proc, or it will need another attack (due to how alacrity works) and screw you over

Use full auto to proc every second Mag Bolt, and an instant power shot for every other one.

 

I've gotten my dps up a bit now. The rotation is a bit funky compared to the clear style of pre 3.0, but if you go at it in an exact shedule, I at least get 3.7k now in BiS 186, which due to the nerf I probably should be happy with. Or would, if one of our shadows hadn't pulled 3.9, but oh well.

 

So anyway, on to the topic. I'm using FA to proc one of the 2 mag bolts, but I can't see the reason to use instant CB to proc the other one. My reason for this is that if you use instant CB the proc chance is at the beginning of the 1.5 ability window, whereas if you hard cast it, it will happen in the end and due to the very slight latecy, you can then proc it again with like 0.02 seconds of becoming available.

 

TL;DR: Using BOTH FA and instant CB to proc mag bolt seems bad. One of them works as you can delay usage, but not proc, of MB.

[BreakingNews]

Link a ss of parsec to see # of hits for your abilities

[TACeMossie]

I've gotten my dps up a bit now. The rotation is a bit funky compared to the clear style of pre 3.0, but if you go at it in an exact shedule, I at least get 3.7k now in BiS 186, which due to the nerf I probably should be happy with. Or would, if one of our shadows hadn't pulled 3.9, but oh well.

 

So anyway, on to the topic. I'm using FA to proc one of the 2 mag bolts, but I can't see the reason to use instant CB to proc the other one. My reason for this is that if you use instant CB the proc chance is at the beginning of the 1.5 ability window, whereas if you hard cast it, it will happen in the end and due to the very slight latecy, you can then proc it again with like 0.02 seconds of becoming available.

 

TL;DR: Using BOTH FA and instant CB to proc mag bolt seems bad. One of them works as you can delay usage, but not proc, of MB.

 

Since FA procs at the start of the GCD, it means that using the instant CB for every second proc will always line up perfectly

 

Something like:

 

IR -> MB -> CB -> MB -> Filler x3 -> FA -> Filler x2 -> IR -> MB -> CB -> MB ->...

 

I'm probably wrong there, but this way the instant CB/SR will always be on CB, and the proc will always happen on the use of CB or FA

 

Filler = Assault Plastique, Serrated Round, Fusion Missile, Hammer Shot, Explosive Round (sub 30), electro net, etc...

[Volcan]

Link a ss of parsec to see # of hits for your abilities

 

Are you one of the Zorz heroes pushing out 'ludicrous' numbers? If so, what is ludicrous and what's your APM at? I'm trying to see if my rotation is pretty good as it stands or if I need to scrap what I got and go back to the drawling board. Cause if you guys are pulling close to 5k or something in 186s, I must be doing something wrong.

 

I'm starting to get a bit tired of testing rotations. Something to shoot for or something to compare to would be most appreciated.

 

The highest parse I've done so far is 4.1k dps (500k dummy so i can practice sub 30% more often) in a mix of 180s/186s (mostly 180s with 156 augs).

[TACeMossie]

Are you one of the Zorz heroes pushing out 'ludicrous' numbers? If so, what is ludicrous and what's your APM at? I'm trying to see if my rotation is pretty good as it stands or if I need to scrap what I got and go back to the drawling board. Cause if you guys are pulling close to 5k or something in 186s, I must be doing something wrong.

 

I'm starting to get a bit tired of testing rotations. Something to shoot for or something to compare to would be most appreciated.

 

The highest parse I've done so far is 4.1k dps (500k dummy so i can practice sub 30% more often) in a mix of 180s/186s (mostly 180s with 156 augs).

 

The Zorz guys were closer to 5k in 192s/186 augs, so it does look like you might be doing something right.

[shleefin]

Are you one of the Zorz heroes pushing out 'ludicrous' numbers? If so, what is ludicrous and what's your APM at? I'm trying to see if my rotation is pretty good as it stands or if I need to scrap what I got and go back to the drawling board. Cause if you guys are pulling close to 5k or something in 186s, I must be doing something wrong.

 

I'm starting to get a bit tired of testing rotations. Something to shoot for or something to compare to would be most appreciated.

 

The highest parse I've done so far is 4.1k dps (500k dummy so i can practice sub 30% more often) in a mix of 180s/186s (mostly 180s with 156 augs).

 

Not sure why everyone is being so secretive about it. Like it's some competitive advantage. I did exactly 2 parses last night in the new pyro, still in my old gear, the first was 3.4k. 2nd, after some adjustments was 3.55k. Far from optimal parses. Before 3.0 my absolute best parse with lucky critting was 3.95. And I am far from BiS 186s. So I dropped off a bit, but not much. Maybe ~5%.

 

This is the opener I am using:

casted SS (Serrated Shot), IM, TD, MS, UL, MS, PS (instant), PS, MS, SS, IM, TD, PS, UL

 

At this point I use vent heat when my heat reaches 70, and start the heat conservative rotation, starting with MS. This is repeated until vent heat comes off cooldown:

MS, PS, PS, MS, SS, IM, TD, rapid shots, UL

 

That's it, just repeat that ad naseum until sub 30% where you replace one of the power shots for missle blast:

MS, PS, MB, MS, SS, IM, TD, rapid shots (may not be required every time sub 30), UL

 

You can work in supercharged gas too. But I haven't yet figured out the optimal time. Discuss.

[shleefin]

Not sure why everyone is being so secretive about it. Like it's some competitive advantage. I did exactly 2 parses last night in the new pyro, still in my old gear, the first was 3.4k. 2nd, after some adjustments was 3.55k. Far from optimal parses. Before 3.0 my absolute best parse with lucky critting was 3.95. And I am far from BiS 186s. So I dropped off a bit, but not much. Maybe ~5%.

 

This is the opener I am using:

casted SS (Serrated Shot), IM, TD, MS, UL, MS, PS (instant), PS, MS, SS, IM, TD, PS, UL

 

At this point I use vent heat when my heat reaches 70, and start the heat conservative rotation, starting with MS. This is repeated until vent heat comes off cooldown:

MS, PS, PS, MS, SS, IM, TD, rapid shots, UL

 

That's it, just repeat that ad naseum until sub 30% where you replace one of the power shots for missle blast:

MS, PS, MB, MS, SS, IM, TD, rapid shots (may not be required every time sub 30), UL

 

You can work in supercharged gas too. But I haven't yet figured out the optimal time. Discuss.

 

Heh, well I should have done some more parses before posting it seems. The following seems to work better. Just hit 3.8 by swapping the ordering in my heat conservative rotation, and using TSO in the opener on UL:

MS, PS, PS, MS, SS, IM, rapid shots, TD, UL

 

Still not sure about supercharge. When I use it, it seems to throw off the timing of my proc, probably due to the alacrity increase, requiring the insertion of an extra PS somewhere to proc MS.

[TACeMossie]

Heh, well I should have done some more parses before posting it seems. The following seems to work better. Just hit 3.8 by swapping the ordering in my heat conservative rotation, and using TSO in the opener on UL:

MS, PS, PS, MS, SS, IM, rapid shots, TD, UL

 

Still not sure about supercharge. When I use it, it seems to throw off the timing of my proc, probably due to the alacrity increase, requiring the insertion of an extra PS somewhere to proc MS.

 

Use Supercharged Celerity immediately before a proc cooldown (so right after the last one). I doesn't affect cooldowns in progress if it changes) and it won't screw you over.

[cvak]

Since FA procs at the start of the GCD, it means that using the instant CB for every second proc will always line up perfectly

 

Something like:

 

IR -> MB -> CB -> MB -> Filler x3 -> FA -> Filler x2 -> IR -> MB -> CB -> MB ->...

 

I'm probably wrong there, but this way the instant CB/SR will always be on CB, and the proc will always happen on the use of CB or FA

 

Filler = Assault Plastique, Serrated Round, Fusion Missile, Hammer Shot, Explosive Round (sub 30), electro net, etc...

 

Ah heck, now that rotation looks exactly 0 like the old one. Tried it out, with one modification:

IR -> MB -> CB -> MB -> Filler x3 -> FA -> Filler x1 -> IR -> MB -> CB -> MB ->...

 

The one I put together wasn't like that, but I'm not going to post it since it made use of a hard casted CB to proc MB, which after thinking about it, is bad in a movement heavy fight. Using the above, the only penalty of movement is when casting serrated bolt, which can be mitigated by using tech override. Using the forced march passive, everything else can be casted on the move, aka the complete opposite of pre 3.0 assault.

[TACeMossie]

Ah heck, now that rotation looks exactly 0 like the old one. Tried it out, with one modification:

IR -> MB -> CB -> MB -> Filler x3 -> FA -> Filler x1 -> IR -> MB -> CB -> MB ->...

 

The one I put together wasn't like that, but I'm not going to post it since it made use of a hard casted CB to proc MB, which after thinking about it, is bad in a movement heavy fight. Using the above, the only penalty of movement is when casting serrated bolt, which can be mitigated by using tech override. Using the forced march passive, everything else can be casted on the move, aka the complete opposite of pre 3.0 assault.

 

As I said, I could be wrong, and I was. Gave myself too many fillers

 

You could probably delay the second mag bolt a little if you wanted, the reason the 'first' one is delayed is to synch up with the proc for an instant charged bolts, and delaying the second one would get moar plasma cell ticks and spread out resource consumption a little.

Edited December 6, 2014 by TACeMossie

[BreakingNews]

From some of my parses, I've been getting an average of about 100 rapid shot hits, or 10 casts of rapid shots.

[cvak]

From some of my parses, I've been getting an average of about 100 rapid shot hits, or 10 casts of rapid shots.

 

Could you please tell what an average (not top crits) parse would be, as in, ballpark numbers, as well as your apm?

[BreakingNews]

Could you please tell what an average (not top crits) parse would be, as in, ballpark numbers, as well as your apm?

 

With the current gear I have right now, which is still primarily 186, with whatever 192/198 I could get from comm vendors, as well as the new 2pc set bonus, I've been averaging around 4500-4600, with good crits landing me at about 4700. My apm is always at about 39.5-40. Been getting some lag on harb tho, so I'll do more parsing after maintenance this week

Edited December 7, 2014 by BreakingNews

[Pagy]

i have 761 accuracy and im missing attacks on the targeting dummy

 

***

[BreakingNews]

i have 761 accuracy and im missing attacks on the targeting dummy

 

***

 

If you have sub 100 acc, you're gonna to miss an attack here or there.

[TACeMossie]

i have 761 accuracy and im missing attacks on the targeting dummy

 

***

 

Merc or Mando? Cause mercs will always miss with some offhand attacks.