Planetary Conquest is Dominated by LARGE Allied guilds

[ivanhedgehog]

The best fix for the system is for the guild that wins a planet to be locked out until that planet is once again up for conquest. They hold that one planet and gain perks from that one planet but are unable to conquer another planet until they lose control of their conquered planet.

 

The guild will still need to get benefits from conquest gains during subsequent weeks of the event in order to have a chance at the perks available, but the system needs to allow more than a handful of guilds to dominate week after week.

 

What will end up happening is that players will see the futility in trying to compete and just stop using the conquest system, dooming it to the trash heap where it can join the Seeker droid and other things players got tired of and frustrated with.

 

people are already dropping off of the conquest treadmill. they realize that while they can hit the leader board if they grind their brains out, they will never win. go do content that you actually want to do and have fun with it. people will start to burn out doing the same heroics for hours every day.

[dscount]

people are already dropping off of the conquest treadmill. they realize that while they can hit the leader board if they grind their brains out, they will never win. go do content that you actually want to do and have fun with it. people will start to burn out doing the same heroics for hours every day.

 

YUP... starting to see an interest in several guilds actually. Especially with PVE based guilds and the next couple weeks appear to be more "PVP" based conquests. (Based on data mined dates - which seem to be pretty spot on)

[Infernixx]

YUP... starting to see an interest in several guilds actually. Especially with PVE based guilds and the next couple weeks appear to be more "PVP" based conquests. (Based on data mined dates - which seem to be pretty spot on)

 

mentioning datamined info is a great way to get punted for a while. you should edit that

[SgtJeremy]

Instances, Instance everything and anything. I said it once I'll say it until I die. Unless they is another way to shut this down. Edited September 4, 2014 by SgtJeremy

[Uruare]

Mixed martial arts, military grade weapons and corporate sponsorship are all perfectly legitimate tools to utilize when attempting to win a game of checkers.

 

Rule 1 of winning in an mmo - if it isn't breaking the TOS or eula, you do it or you don't win.

 

If you're not willing to do anything it takes short of breaking laws, go home.

 

If you think you're going to play it like a recreational game and win, you're going to be disappointed.

 

You're competing with the no-lifingest no lifers. You're competing with those that are at the most extreme edge of what they will do to win in an mmo.

 

You're also competing with the most corporate guilds in the game, run like businesses and managed like para-militaries.

 

Are any of them crazy? Doesn't actually matter.

 

If you want to win, you'll do everything they're willing to do and you'll do it better than they're doing it, or you don't get to win.

 

Fair? Fair doesn't enter the equation past the terms of service and the hard coded rules of conquest itself.

 

It's a rather useless system to most players, sure. I'd bet that if 1% of the playerbase is ever even in a guild that wins a planet, it'd be a fluke.

 

Is it bad? I think it's a waste, personally, but if they cared what I thought, they'd have asked.

 

It doesn't exist in my sphere of concerns, however. I suggest you strike it from your own, unless you're willing to do what the winners do better than they do it.

[Ilayas]

It's quote cherry picking time!

 

You're competing with the no-lifingest no lifers. You're competing with those that are at the most extreme edge of what they will do to win in an mmo.

Most of the people in my guild are adults with families and full time jobs and or going school. The majority just hit the conquest point goal for the week on at lest one toon and call it good at that. It's not really that hard we are always getting runs for gf flash points and ops together. No one is required to do anything but many do because we enjoy playing together. There are certainly a few members that go above and beyond that but most it that just by doing what they normally would be doing any ways. We also have members that think this whole conquest thing is stupid and refuse to do anything on that front.

 

You're also competing with the most corporate guilds in the game, run like businesses and managed like para-militaries.

Why would anyone want to be in a guild like that? Do you think all big guilds are run that way? How many large guilds have you been in? I'm in 3 different rather sizable guilds 2 of which have been undefeated in planetary conquests. Honestly you are lucky of most of the time 1/2 the members are sober. Both guilds regularly organize drunk runs that get more hilarious as the night goes on. We play this game because it's fun, and we have lots of fun playing together.

 

Are any of them crazy? Doesn't actually matter.

Can't argue with that we are pretty crazy, but in a good way.

 

If you want to win, you'll do everything they're willing to do and you'll do it better than they're doing it, or you don't get to win.

Yes......... is it supposed to work a different way?

 

Fair? Fair doesn't enter the equation past the terms of service and the hard coded rules of conquest itself.

Depends what you consider fair I guess.

 

 

It's a rather useless system to most players, sure. I'd bet that if 1% of the playerbase is ever even in a guild that wins a planet, it'd be a fluke.

What percentage of the population does Nightmare content? What percentage of the population does ranked pvp? There is lots of things in this game that only a small dedicated percentage even attempts.

 

 

It doesn't exist in my sphere of concerns, however. I suggest you strike it from your own, unless you're willing to do what the winners do better than they do it.

There's a lot of venom in this post for someone that doesn't care.

[JacksonMo]

Most of the people in my guild are adults with families and full time jobs and or going school. The majority just hit the conquest point goal for the week on at lest one toon and call it good at that. It's not really that hard we are always getting runs for gf flash points and ops together. No one is required to do anything but many do because we enjoy playing together. There are certainly a few members that go above and beyond that but most it that just by doing what they normally would be doing any ways. We also have members that think this whole conquest thing is stupid and refuse to do anything on that front.

.

 

That's the best kind of guild to be in!

 

Once the guild ship is decked out, I'm not sure what benefit continuing to grind CP will be.

A good long term strat for the smaller guilds might be to wait out the early serge. Make friends with those nasty evil mean and ugly big guilds and they may lend a hand.

 

Why would anyone want to be in a guild like that? Do you think all big guilds are run that way? How many large guilds have you been in? I'm in 3 different rather sizable guilds 2 of which have been undefeated in planetary conquests. Honestly you are lucky of most of the time 1/2 the members are sober. Both guilds regularly organize drunk runs that get more hilarious as the night goes on. We play this game because it's fun, and we have lots of fun playing together.

.

 

Goes back to guild type. Lots of adults having fun playing a game together.

 

What percentage of the population does Nightmare content? What percentage of the population does ranked pvp? There is lots of things in this game that only a small dedicated percentage even attempts.

 

I'm one of the many who don't. And I'm ok with that. I'm 44 and have arthritis/carpal tunnel in both hands. You can't master NiM content with enrage timers that tight, and your hand doesn't work right. Story modes are forgiving enough I can switch hands in a pinch. HM is doable, but my learning curve is steeper and work schedule too much of a pain to maintain a commitment to a set group. So a nasty evil big social guild is just right for me.

 

 

There's a lot of venom in this post for someone that doesn't care.

 

This whole thread is.

[HaLeX]

My guild took second in week one, first last week, and in first place this week. The guild was a pvp guild that added gsfers, and when conquest was announced merged with a pve guild. So its a large well balanced guild with guild leaders who put alot of effort into winning. Primetime we have maybe 25 to 35 online, off peak between 3 and 15. I wouldn't classify us as a megaguild. Nor is everyone grinding away. We all contribute but mostly were just playing the game normally and helping out where we can. I've played other games that would have needed an alliance of 50 to 100 players to compete and all be online at the same time. This is a very casual version of the same thing. Almost any guild in this game is one merger away from placing, so if your gms can't do it, then they either don't care or their guilds arent really guilds at all, just a small group of players who have a name. Which is fine btw, but don't complain that you and your 3 friends can't place top 10, it's very easy to do if you have 15 active players and are making any effort.

[Tmeincke]

As it is now, larger guilds will run the server, because they're large. They have more people to craft, kill, run FP and Ops, etc.

I would like to see a system where smaller guild would have a chance too. Like. Maybe do a scale based on size or something. My guild would never be able to make it on the list, since we're a small guild, but it's sad that we don't even have a chance.

I know it would be 'unfair' for the bigger guilds that way, but i think you could find a balance that makes everyone happy and have a fair chance.

[Zharik]

So when Germany invaded Poland at the start of WW II, did Poland whine about the "bigger Guild" having an unfair advantage? No (well maybe they did, but the result was they still lost and quickly).

 

Did Germany bemoan that Russia was being unfairly helpful to the opposing faction? No, they just "dealt with it".

 

Could you imagine the horror of being placed in a WZ at 3:1 odds against? No, because the game forces a cap on the number of people per side. The thing is, you are allowed to bring 499 friends to conquest events... don't blame big guilds for coming close to that number. I'm sure you don't try to short-man other content and complain that you can't compete with full groups. This is the equivalent of saying that me and my 1 friend can't do 8 man operations but those "big groups" can do it cause they are more popular and we want our gear/titles/etc.

 

For the last couple of years I would occasionally make fun of the ads on fleet to "help me start a guild... you can leave after". What's the point of a small guild? What's the point of a big guild? Note that they are NOT the same and should not be treated the same.

[Nkya]

The current system favour the large guilds. Players in those guild have the guarantee to be in the top 10 no matter what, while other have to work to. This is an incitation to avoid joining the small/medium guilds and join the largest ones (and the most organized ones to finish at first place, but leaving an unorganised guild for an organised one not an issue to me)

 

An idea to fix this would be to the system give the rewards to the top legacy of the guilds instead to everyone having just completed their goal and stay idle after then.

 

Another idea would be the system give a fixed reward that shall be shared by all guild members/legacy having fullfiled the objectives, so large guild competing would get rid of the leachers by themselves.

[Jeweledleah]

every time I see people complain about those "mega guilds with 500 members" I have to wonder. did you all forget about existence of alts? are you seriously claiming that every one of those guilds with 100s of characters - all of those characters are unique individuals? no alts? no? never?

 

it doesn't take all that long to hop between your alts and queue up some crafting. especially this week, where you don't just get points for invasion force, you also get them for crafting prefabs. any and all prefabs. eo even leveling lowbie characters can contribute whether its by crafting, or pvp or running flashpoints. one of my guilds is relatively small. as in.. we can only really field one regular 8 man ops group. there are revolving member runs over the weekend (where half the time, we end up pugging a few out of guild members anyways), but I don't think I've ever seen more than 20 people online at the same time. usually - its about 10 during prime time, 3-4 during the day, and empty at night (I know becasue sometimes, like now, I have insomnia, so I pop in and I'm the only one online). 16 mans? what is that? and yet. we are on the top ten leaderboards and have been for all 3 weeks so far - we even managed to kill some commanders (incidentaly, nothing and I do mean NOTHING is stopping your small guild from teaming up with another small guild to kill commanders. seeing as encryptions drop for every single person in your ops group, ala commendations in a flashpoint or an operation). you don't have to be a large guild to place, even if it does help to win (although - willingness to play extra, craft extra does so much more than sheer member numbers).

 

honestly, it kinda sounds like sour grapes over your guild not being interested enough and/or active enough to do that little bit of extra towards overall guild success in conquests.

 

P.S. as an altoholic in a guild full of other altoholics - I resent any and all ideas that punish guilds for having characters that stop doing conquests once their personal goals has been reached. just because my alt is done gaining point, doesn't mean that I as a person am done gaining points.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Jeweledleah

[JacksonMo]

every time I see people complain about those "mega guilds with 500 members" I have to wonder. did you all forget about existence of alts? are you seriously claiming that every one of those guilds with 100s of characters - all of those characters are unique individuals? no alts? no? never?

 

honestly, it kinda sounds like sour grapes over your guild not being interested enough and/or active enough to do that little bit of extra towards overall guild success in conquests.

 

P.S. as an altoholic in a guild full of other altoholics - I resent any and all ideas that punish guilds for having characters that stop doing conquests once their personal goals has been reached. just because my alt is done gaining point, doesn't mean that I as a person am done gaining points.

 

What??? People can't be expected to actually WORK for it!! Alts you say? Oh no! that's too much effort. Me and my 3 buddies should be able to conquer an entire planet in a single afternoon the same as those big guilds with their dozen alts each burning through mats like there's no tomorrow.

We want a conquest system that recognizes that my single character, in a single afternoon, is higher QUALITY....

That's what this thread is all about, right?

[JadenYugari]

So when Germany invaded Poland at the start of WW II, did Poland whine about the "bigger Guild" having an unfair advantage? No (well maybe they did, but the result was they still lost and quickly).

 

Did Germany bemoan that Russia was being unfairly helpful to the opposing faction? No, they just "dealt with it".

 

Because comparing virtual themepark game to a real life historical events is full of logic.

 

Could you imagine the horror of being placed in a WZ at 3:1 odds against? No, because the game forces a cap on the number of people per side. The thing is, you are allowed to bring 499 friends to conquest events... don't blame big guilds for coming close to that number. I'm sure you don't try to short-man other content and complain that you can't compete with full groups. This is the equivalent of saying that me and my 1 friend can't do 8 man operations but those "big groups" can do it cause they are more popular and we want our gear/titles/etc.

 

For the last couple of years I would occasionally make fun of the ads on fleet to "help me start a guild... you can leave after". What's the point of a small guild? What's the point of a big guild? Note that they are NOT the same and should not be treated the same.

 

The thing is, you at least get something when you get steamrolled in WZs, which simply does not make it a total waste of time.

In conquest, you get what, 25k creds and some decortions for a week full of grind? No thanks, Ill rather run lvl55 dailies or do Warzones instead of grinding conquest for nothing. Have fun with the system when only a few guilds are bothering with it and everyone else just puts it in the trash section like seeker droid, macrobinoculars and such.

[Lacedemon]

This larger guild thing made me laugh. We are a small hardcore raiding guild and will be 3/3 for wining planets at the end of the week.

 

We wondered the same at the start but so far every large guild that has come our way we have sent packing, many avoid us for that reason. On TRE the large guilds I have seen have 30-50 people online at peak time compared to our 10 to 20.

 

So far what I have seen is being organised and playing smart beats the zerg.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Lacedemon

[Nkya]

This larger guild thing made me laugh. We are a small hardcore raiding guild and will be 3/3 for wining planets at the end of the week.

 

We wondered the same at the start but so far every large guild that has come our way we have sent packing, many avoid us for that reason. On TRE the large guilds I have seen have 30-50 people online at peak time compared to our 10 to 20.

 

So far what I have seen is being organised and playing smart beats the zerg.

 

For the same individual work, if your guild would have 3 times more active members (so 30 to 60, matching the largest guild ou mentioned) what would be your rank?

At least 3 times more conquest point than you have yet, because of multiplied opportunities since you're organised.

[Lacedemon]

For the same individual work, if your guild would have 3 times more active members (so 30 to 60, matching the largest guild ou mentioned) what would be your rank?

At least 3 times more conquest point than you have yet, because of multiplied opportunities since you're organised.

 

Our rank? Still first on the planets we invaded(we won Voss week 1, Corellia week 2 and now we are on CZ).

 

We could do that but mass recruiting I feel would massively change both the fabric and make-up of the guild in a way we would not be comfortable with. It is something that worried me about conquests, guilds would feel obligated to mass recruit to win/get the titles however that in turn would fundamentally change the guild probably for the worse. Added to that, what do we do with the massive amount of people when we have the Title and go back to focusing on raiding.

[Kantaso]

Everything depends on the effort of the guild members, right now this week I have not been able to contribute a lot because between doctors appointments and work I have few spare hours but still I have managed to achieved 19K points of the 25K I must do, but my guild has only 52K points, so basically if no one contributes, your guild will never get anywhere. It is a matter of commitment and the feeling also of grinding, I do the points out of my daily stuff, if I have to do it out of obligation the game is no longer fun and becomes a shore.

[tdmaha]

So what I'm getting out of this is those who are not 1st demand to automatically be granted first place because they are entitled to the same rewards as everyone else.

 

These people probably grew up getting a ribbon for finishing last in everything they did growing up. Well welcome to the real world things don't work that way get over it.

[LordBeeDoO]

Our rank? Still first on the planets we invaded(we won Voss week 1, Corellia week 2 and now we are on CZ).

 

We could do that but mass recruiting I feel would massively change both the fabric and make-up of the guild in a way we would not be comfortable with. It is something that worried me about conquests, guilds would feel obligated to mass recruit to win/get the titles however that in turn would fundamentally change the guild probably for the worse. Added to that, what do we do with the massive amount of people when we have the Title and go back to focusing on raiding.

 

The crazy recruiting which flooded the servers first days will finally lead to breaking and fall of such guilds anyway.

 

I am from small guild and we do not match the devotion of hard core playing guilds (when we landed on CZ you had already 1 mil points, nicely done) - however, this leaderboard is cool as it is - those guilds which make preparations and do maximum to achieve should win.

 

In long term, I see a problem of Conquest in what you have written here:

 

"Added to that, what do we do with the massive amount of people when we have the Title and go back to focusing on raiding."

 

The only motivation for conquest currently are the titles. You get no viable bonus, there is not long term growth, long term reward for continuously working on conquests in long-term perspective.

 

What I like in some limited way is Guildship principle in Star Trek Online for instance - the hard work to improve the guild ship is reflected in special on board vendors, special equip, etc. etc. I would want nothing which would compromise the balance ... but some bonuses based on the total sum of conquest points (or other measure connected to conquests) like faster crafting, presence bonus, speciality vendors, quick portals to various destinations, this would keep people in all guilds regardless size to slowly move forward in long term.

 

The problem mentioned here is the Commnader fights. Yesterday we allied with other guild take the commander. There was no Republic enemeis, but two other Imp guilds trying to reset the boss by taunting - this is nonsence. I doubt it was intended to work that way ... this is no PVP, just annoyance and arrogance.

 

I expected the strong faction wars ... It might help for example if there were some alerts on the Imperial fleet or a table of your commanders to see if there are some under attack to enable defense and counterstrike, but hard to say.

[Ocho-Quatro]

At peak my guild has 35ish people online, and that's usually on nights when there's two raid teams running. The most I think I've ever seen was 40, and that's been since Conquests released. We are at the 500 member cap, because of alts. Just myself, I have 5 toons in the guild. (Four 55s and a 44 I've been leveling) I try to hit my personal cap on all of them if I can, but real life doesn't always permit that. We are not a "mega guild", we are just an ACTIVE guild with enough people that want to partiticpate in Conquests and get the titles and unlock the rooms on our guild ship.

 

When we run GF operations, if we fill a spot or three with the group finder, by the end of the run, someone usually asks if our guild is recruiting and if they can join. We recruit by gameplay and interaction with players in the game, not blindly to boost member numbers and be Too Big To Fail in conquests by sheer numbers.

 

There is nothing wrong with small guilds. The tight knit friendships you make in a small community can be priceless. However, you can't expect to take 5 people to a tug of war match, and expect to win against a team of 20. And you can't expect for the rules of tug of war to be changed, because you don't have enough people (by your own decision) to compete with a team that outnumbers you 4 to 1.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Ocho-Quatro

[Kryand]

This larger guild thing made me laugh. We are a small hardcore raiding guild and will be 3/3 for wining planets at the end of the week.

 

We wondered the same at the start but so far every large guild that has come our way we have sent packing, many avoid us for that reason. On TRE the large guilds I have seen have 30-50 people online at peak time compared to our 10 to 20.

 

So far what I have seen is being organised and playing smart beats the zerg.

 

The large guilds on your server must not have any interested in conquests then, and everyone in your guild must be playing several hours every day. If their people put in the same time that you guys are, and actually did zerg the content (which clearly they are not), they would crush you like a bug. So yes, being organized and playing smart is great and all, but your wins have a lot more to do with being lucky that your server has no real competition for planets than any preparation on your part.

[DarthTHC]

This is a load of garbage.

 

I'm in a guild that's fairly large, or at least I consider it large, because we can field 2 full 16-man raid teams on Friday nights. Others may not consider that large. I mean, it's really probably only 40-50 players.

 

Anyway, looking over the conquest points my guild (currently in first place) has amassed, the vast majority - over half - have come from exactly two players.

 

That means that a "guild" of FIVE PLAYERS as interested in taking a planet as the two main point-getters in my "big" guild are would beat us handily - win the conquest running away.

[Tavend]

Why even bother mentioning that you placed in the top 10? So what? You spent time doing conquest for absolutely nothing. Something has to change or the same guilds are going to win week after week.

[Tavend]

This is a load of garbage.

 

I'm in a guild that's fairly large, or at least I consider it large, because we can field 2 full 16-man raid teams on Friday nights. Others may not consider that large. I mean, it's really probably only 40-50 players.

 

Anyway, looking over the conquest points my guild (currently in first place) has amassed, the vast majority - over half - have come from exactly two players.

 

That means that a "guild" of FIVE PLAYERS as interested in taking a planet as the two main point-getters in my "big" guild are would beat us handily - win the conquest running away.

 

Perhaps on your server, but the big guilds on Ebon Hawk usually have over 3 mil points before the first 24 hours has elapsed.