Stormtroopers and stardestroyer lookalikes and other anachronisms in swtor/kotor u.

[Ksolkenny]

I was leveling my Jedi consula on Taris just today when I saw a platoon of suspicially "stormtroopy" looking republic troopers..it kinda got me reflecting on what have been a constant nuisance in this game,and it is its appearant lack of confidence in its player base that we cant take swtor being set in its unique time period and therefore unique universe from the later one without constantly being bombarded with carbon copies of familiar stuff thousands of years before its even supposed to have begun prototype development.

 

Example,Imperial officers uniform and rank badge,do they really think we are that stupid that we cant see that the rank badge is just vertical instead of horizontal? or that the whole empire feels like a very generic version of the movie empire?

 

Now in these time,when people are having this canon freakout,I would really like to feel we are living in a different era of star wars not just a cheap generic version of it,I feel I have to apply a lot of good will towards it to not break immersion,cause that is something that constantly happening..breaking immersion..what happened to this being a legitimate extension of Kotor and its universe.

[TylerAcalan]

*cracks knuckles and warms up the Loremaster 9001*

 

The Imperial Stormtrooper armor appearance design is the adaption and continuation of the Republic Trooper armor from this time frame. Both appearances were designed to adapt an intimidating visage to inspire fear and panic among their enemies.

 

It would make sense that the Empire of the Galactic Civil War would adapt a design from it's Republic Roots.

 

In the case of the Star Destroyers, the design is Sith in origin. That is why the Empire of TOR has the familiar triangle shape. As Palpatine was a Sith, he was starting to ramp up the Republic into a War Machine to counter the armies of the CIS and had no standing Navy. So he would approve a design of Sith Origin with no one the wiser. Hence the beginnings of the dagger shaped Acclamator Class Cruisers steadily working their way toward the familiar imperial Star Destroyer we know of Episode IV.

 

TOR's "blatant copying" as you call it, is paying homage to the orginal and proving a very realistic Lore base for appearance design and development from the very distance past we play now to the more modern look.

 

After all, there was a Dark Age in which much was lost between now and the GCW.

 

Be offended all you want. I for one approve of this paying homage to the original.

[Ksolkenny]

Where say "blatant copying" didnt even use that term,but I get it,your paraphrasing on account that you had this discussion before,maybe I posted this thread in the wrong forum as I cite mostly gameplay/immersion reasons ,this would be a lovely opportunity to say "your citing non canon sources" right,but that even leaves a bad taste in my own mouth so yeah.

 

This is a massivelly departure from designs that the games that this game is based/a sequel of (KOTOR1+2),to suspiciously look like a generic version of "present day" star wars.

 

It could even be set in the future from "present day star wars" ,

I know its tempting to come up with in universe reasons for this like you do,but honestly the whole thing just feels insulting to us as players

 

Its not just the troopers or the star destroyers(they are even called that by Lance henriksens character),its "Grand Moffs",Imperial officers designed slightly different,same with countless other instances that suddenly seems changed from the original game like they were so afraid to alianate the licenced IP's fanbase that they had to conform it as closely to star wars galaxies timeline as possible with as close resembling buildings and ships and organizational structures 1000s of years before they rightly shold be there,with a key difference,now people could make as many Jedis or Sith without difficulty,the whole reason they cited for setting an MMO in this time period.

Edited May 1, 2014 by Ksolkenny

[DarthDymond]

There's no doubt that a lot of these anachronisms were motivated by "we've got to make this seem recognizably 'Star Wars' to give this game the broadest possible appeal" and the lore justifications followed to make it work.

 

But for me personally, I'm okay with that. If you're going to use the Star Wars brand, you may as well put out a product that feels like Star Wars, and the aesthetic of your universe goes a long ways towards establishing that feel - especially for new-comers.

 

I can understand and respect that others may find it immersion-breaking, or may not be satisfied by the "Well Palapatine deliberately drew on the Sith Empire for inspiration as he formed the Galactic Empire because he was a Sith" explanations that try to justify it, but I find them the lesser of two evils.

 

It would be different if SWTOR was trying so hard to stick to familiar ground that the actual storytelling and characters were retreads of what we'd seen before. But I'm okay with a game that gives me original and interesting content underneath a familiar-looking coat of paint (and a few deliberate homages and shout-outs) , as long as they're not just 'playing it safe' with the core of the game as well.

 

(I also may be a bit more forgiving simply because as far as the host of Star Destroyer-style ships we've seen over the past decades go, the Harrower is by far my favorite since the Executor. )

[TaboriHK]

This game does take place like 4,000 years before the films, right? So why do they still have things like thermal detonators? That would be like us opening up the history book and reading that one of the pharaohs of Egypt was killed by a hand grenade.

 

There's all sorts of items in this game like this that wouldn't work even with the loretron handwave. It does occasionally take me out of it because it does ring of lack of confidence. That, and apparently tech innovation in Star Wars hits a major wall, because again, thousands of years of tech staying at the same level (more or less) doesn't seem possible.

 

That said, it's just a game, and it is Star Wars-y.

[TylerAcalan]

That, and apparently tech innovation in Star Wars hits a major wall, because again, thousands of years of tech staying at the same level (more or less) doesn't seem possible.

 

How many times do I need to keep pointing out the Fourth Great Schism that takes place roughly 1500 years after this game resulting in a Dark Age for the Republic resulting in a similar loss of knowledge as the European Medieval Dark Ages before the Ruusian Reformation which is the Italian Renaissance and the reclamation of that lost knowledge?

 

Seriously. The tech level does not stay at the same level. It has suffered gains a losses with the rise and fall of Empires.

 

First the Architects who crafted things like the Maw and Centerpoint station. They were shattered by the fall of their civilization by the rise of the Rakata allegedly.

 

The rise and fall of the Infinite Empire saw the rise of things like the Star Forge before they were lost to time and history.

 

The constant clashing of the Republic and Jedi Orders against Sith Empires causing a rise and fall of tech to ultimately the above Reformations.

 

For the love of the Force, stop assuming the Tech goes no where. It's not a straight line. It dips and rises with history.

 

For your poor example of a Pharaoh being killed by a grenade. That probably happened but instead of calling it a grenade, it was a fireball from an ambitious magician. The knowledge of how was lost as a magician's secret before being rediscovered during the Italian Renaissance as a Scientific Achievement known as a weaponized timed explosive.

[TaboriHK]

How many times do I need to keep pointing out the Fourth Great Schism that takes place roughly 1500 years after this game resulting in a Dark Age for the Republic resulting in a similar loss of knowledge as the European Medieval Dark Ages before the Ruusian Reformation which is the Italian Renaissance and the reclamation of that lost knowledge?

The dark ages didn't lose spaceships or thousands of years of knowledge. I'm glad that you can accept the handwave, but I don't. By the way, the dark ages weren't really all that dark, either.

[Shadowsentinel]

This game does take place like 4,000 years before the films, right? So why do they still have things like thermal detonators? That would be like us opening up the history book and reading that one of the pharaohs of Egypt was killed by a hand grenade.

 

There's all sorts of items in this game like this that wouldn't work even with the loretron handwave. It does occasionally take me out of it because it does ring of lack of confidence. That, and apparently tech innovation in Star Wars hits a major wall, because again, thousands of years of tech staying at the same level (more or less) doesn't seem possible.

 

That said, it's just a game, and it is Star Wars-y.

 

And Rakata tech would make any scientist in films time line die from jealousy.

[DarthMintCake]

*cracks knuckles and warms up the Loremaster 9001*

 

The Imperial Stormtrooper armor appearance design is the adaption and continuation of the Republic Trooper armor from this time frame. Both appearances were designed to adapt an intimidating visage to inspire fear and panic among their enemies.

 

It would make sense that the Empire of the Galactic Civil War would adapt a design from it's Republic Roots.

 

In the case of the Star Destroyers, the design is Sith in origin. That is why the Empire of TOR has the familiar triangle shape. As Palpatine was a Sith, he was starting to ramp up the Republic into a War Machine to counter the armies of the CIS and had no standing Navy. So he would approve a design of Sith Origin with no one the wiser. Hence the beginnings of the dagger shaped Acclamator Class Cruisers steadily working their way toward the familiar imperial Star Destroyer we know of Episode IV.

 

TOR's "blatant copying" as you call it, is paying homage to the orginal and proving a very realistic Lore base for appearance design and development from the very distance past we play now to the more modern look.

 

After all, there was a Dark Age in which much was lost between now and the GCW.

 

Be offended all you want. I for one approve of this paying homage to the original.

 

Well said.

 

Some people really need to do there research before posting

[Chrisweaver]

The dark ages didn't lose spaceships or thousands of years of knowledge. I'm glad that you can accept the handwave, but I don't. By the way, the dark ages weren't really all that dark, either.

 

Oh snap Wikipedia I know everything about the dark ages now!

 

When this game started it needed to capture as many Star Wars fans as it could. To do this they needed to put everyone in an environment they were familiar with. Over time we start to see tools not seen in the movies, like a ship that can destroy an entire fleet, or even the different types of ships that you see on GSF. So over time we will start to see new environments different from the normal Star Wars archetypes (oricon).

 

Also the designs from the original episodes had to come from some where. Before the clone wars the Republic had been peaceful for a 1000 years so there had been no need to be innovative with the military or even technology. So when war did come the designers went back through the archives the used whatever they found.