Top 10 under-rated Force Users

[Aurbere]

Agreed. Was Darth Nyriss nominated?

 

Yes, for undisclosed reasons.

[ShadowMudkip]

Yes, for undisclosed reasons.

 

Good, she's pretty baus.

[marcelo_sdk]

I nominate Darth Nihilus. For me, a character often under-rated due to his Force Hunger skill. I think he deserves more credit than that, he was a great tactician and was the responsible for the First Jedi Purge.

[ZahirS]

I nominate Darth Nihilus. For me, a character often under-rated due to his Force Hunger skill. I think he deserves more credit than that, he was a great tactician and was the responsible for the First Jedi Purge.

 

But was so easily killed by Meetra, I mean Nihilius is a stain in the pages of galactic history.

[Beniboybling]

I nominate Darth Nihilus. For me, a character often under-rated due to his Force Hunger skill. I think he deserves more credit than that, he was a great tactician and was the responsible for the First Jedi Purge.

Great tactician? Don't know about that. Traya orchestrated the First Jedi Purge.

[Beniboybling]

But was so easily killed by Meetra, I mean Nihilius is a stain in the pages of galactic history.

A stain, good one.

[Selenial]

But was so easily killed by Meetra, I mean Nihilius is a stain in the pages of galactic history.

 

Because she was his polar opposite, created by the force to end him

[marcelo_sdk]

But was so easily killed by Meetra, I mean Nihilius is a stain in the pages of galactic history.

 

As Selenial said, that's only because she was a wound. In terms of power, he was the strongest Force user of his time.

 

Great tactician? Don't know about that. Traya orchestrated the First Jedi Purge.

 

And where's that stated? I agree that probably the Purge was her idea, since she was the head of the Triumvirate, but in the end, it was executed by Nihilus and Sion.

Edited May 4, 2014 by marcelo_sdk

[Beniboybling]

And where's that stated? I agree that probably the Purge was her idea, since she was the head of the Triumvirate, but in the end, it was executed by Nihilus and Sion.

Traya organised the Sith Triumvirate and its implied that the whole thing was her plan, correct. And its also implied that once she was betrayed they went their separate ways, Sion went off hunting the last of the Jedi and Nihilus - driven totally by hunger - tracked down and consumed any Force Sensitive planet they could fine.

 

The point is however that there was no strategy to Nihilus action, he was a being of pure hunger, driven by pure hunger and Traya led him by the nose. He just went wherever he sensed the Force, gobbled the planet up, then moved on.

 

The only reason the Jedi/Republic could respond was because the Jedi were so depleted they had gone into hiding at the Republic have been devastated as well, they also didn't know where the Sith were attacking from.

[Wolfninjajedi]

As Selenial said, that's only because she was a wound. In terms of power, he was the strongest Force user of his time.

 

 

 

And where's that stated? I agree that probably the Purge was her idea, since she was the head of the Triumvirate, but in the end, it was executed by Nihilus and Sion.

 

Yet he couldn't kill Mandalore who has no defense against Force attacks....there was no reason why he shouldn't have been able to outright destroy Mandalore.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Wolfninjajedi

[Beniboybling]

Yet he couldn't kill Mandalore who has no defense against Force attacks....there was no reason why he shouldn't have been able to outright destroy Mandalore.

I don't want to just say game mechanics, so I'll try to explain:

 

You are dust motes in a storm… a grain upon the beach… and as insignificant as a body that orbits the graveyard of Malachor.

 

And later, or perhaps before, its stated that Nihilus doesn't really care or even notice your presence on the ship - you are that insignificant. Canderous is a non-Force sensitive, there is very little Nihilus can devour, therefore I doubt that he even properly acknowledged Canderous' presence - his attention was totally focused on Visas and the Exile.

 

And in the battle itself, he was significantly weakened, so he may not have been able to drain Canderous either way.

[Wolfninjajedi]

I don't want to just say game mechanics, so I'll try to explain:

 

You are dust motes in a storm… a grain upon the beach… and as insignificant as a body that orbits the graveyard of Malachor.

 

And later, or perhaps before, its stated that Nihilus doesn't really care or even notice your presence on the ship - you are that insignificant. Canderous is a non-Force sensitive, there is very little Nihilus can devour, therefore I doubt that he even properly acknowledged Canderous' presence - his attention was totally focused on Visas and the Exile.

 

And in the battle itself, he was significantly weakened, so he may not have been able to drain Canderous either way.

 

I'm not talking about draining Canderous, just why not outright kill him? He shouldn't have been that drained that he would be unable to kill a non-force sensitive and we know that he did feed on other worlds before going to Telos.

 

In the meantime, Darth Nihilus led his Sith forces from his flagship, the Ravager, drawing more and more power from worlds that he blasted into ruin.

 

--Taken from The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

 

Also Tobin is the last person I would actually take saying something as worth of anything.

 

Also Nihilus having poor reactions to noticing people doesn't help him.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Wolfninjajedi

[Selenial]

Yeh, Nihilus didnt care about Canderous.

 

Nihilus wasnt even a body, Canderous was probably barely even scratching him. The battle was won by the exile.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Yeh, Nihilus didnt care about Canderous.

 

Nihilus wasnt even a body, Canderous was probably barely even scratching him. The battle was won by the exile.

 

That doesn't matter, Canderous should have died either way.

 

On that Nihilus is more overrated then underrated tbh.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Wolfninjajedi

[Selenial]

That doesn't matter, Canderous should have died either way.

 

On that Nihilus is more overrated then underrated tbh.

 

Why? Spend energy killing someone who doesnt pose the remotest of threats?Surik and Visas were protecting him with the blade, and Nihilus would have to fry him through Mando armor, it would have been a waste of energy.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Why? Spend energy killing someone who doesnt pose the remotest of threats?Surik and Visas were protecting him with the blade, and Nihilus would have to fry him through Mando armor, it would have been a waste of energy.

 

Because as Nihilus stunned all 3 of them for quite some time to have a conversation, he couldn't just kill him? We know he has enough TK strength to choke beings, he could have just snapped Canderous' neck like that.

 

But even then, his reactions and ability to notice others just makes him a poor being.

 

His only notable accomplishments are...

 

Force Concealing

 

Force Stun

 

Force Drain

 

TK.

 

Which even then only his Force Concealing and Drain are anything to take note of, everything else he isn't as impressive in or just does not have at all.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Wolfninjajedi

[Beniboybling]

I'm not talking about draining Canderous, just why not outright kill him? He shouldn't have been that drained that he would be unable to kill a non-force sensitive and we know that he did feed on other worlds before going to Telos.

 

Also Tobin is the last person I would actually take saying something as worth of anything.

 

Also Nihilus having poor reactions to noticing people doesn't help him.

1. Every planet has a Force signature, just look how much power the Sith Emperor got from Nathema. Not that we don't know what these planets were not strong in the Force.

 

2. Lol what? He's a fictional character Wolf, not a real person. What he tells you was in fact written by another guy who was trying to convey something of importance to the player about Nihilus nature. Note that that quote is said by Visas and Tobin in conjunction - both of whom have been exposed to Nihilus presence, and therefore are the most reliable sources of information on him. Or do you have an actual reason for doubting his words?

 

EDIT: Here is the other quote:

 

I do not believe he knows his ship has been boarded... and if he did, he would not care.

 

--Visas Marr.

 

3. That's nice, is this a vs thread or something? The fact of the matter is that Nihilus perceives the galaxy in a much wider sense, and so to him the player and Canderous are insignificant. Weakness or not this is a fact.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Beniboybling

[Wolfninjajedi]

1. Every planet has a Force signature, just look how much power the Sith Emperor got from Nathema. Not that we don't know what these planets were not strong in the Force.

 

2. Lol what? He's a fictional character Wolf, not a real person. What he tells you was in fact written by another guy who was trying to convey something of importance to the player about Nihilus nature. Note that that quote is said by Visas and Tobin in conjunction - both of whom have been exposed to Nihilus presence, and therefore are the most reliable sources of information on him. Or do you have an actual reason for doubting his words?

 

EDIT: Here is the other quote:

 

I do not believe he knows his ship has been boarded... and if he did, he would not care.

 

--Visas Marr.

 

3. That's nice, is this a vs thread or something? The fact of the matter is that Nihilus perceives the galaxy in a much wider sense, and so to him the player and Canderous are insignificant. Weakness or not this is a fact.

 

Yet if Nihilus was as powerful as everyone was saying he was(which they can be biased) then he shouldn't have had any problems killing the group. Not draining, killing...and yet he did not and was defeated.

 

I guess he could be on this list, but he isn't underrated by any means, and Beni I take it you have read this?

 

http://www.comicvine.com/profile/shootingnova/blog/overrated-sith-lords-darths-nihilus-and-sion/97357/

[Selenial]

Yet if Nihilus was as powerful as everyone was saying he was(which they can be biased) then he shouldn't have had any problems killing the group. Not draining, killing...and yet he did not and was defeated.

 

I guess he could be on this list, but he isn't underrated by any means, and Beni I take it you have read this?

 

http://www.comicvine.com/profile/shootingnova/blog/overrated-sith-lords-darths-nihilus-and-sion/97357/

 

He was weakened.

[Wolfninjajedi]

He was weakened.

 

He wasn't that weakened.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Wolfninjajedi

[Beniboybling]

Because as Nihilus stunned all 3 of them for quite some time to have a conversation, he couldn't just kill him? We know he has enough TK strength to choke beings, he could have just snapped Canderous' neck like that.

 

But even then, his reactions and ability to notice others just makes him a poor being.

 

His only notable accomplishments are...

 

Force Concealing

 

Force Stun

 

Force Drain

 

TK.

 

Which even then only his Force Concealing and Drain are anything to take note of, everything else he isn't as impressive in or just does not have at all.

Nihilus didn't stun Canderous actually. Further proof that he didn't really care. In fact Canderous stands a way off and doesn't even appear in the cut-scenes, one could argue game mechanics were the only things keeping there.

 

Anyway, I really don't know what your point is. Even if Nihilus could see Canderous its obviously well within his power to kill him. He's drained Sith Lords, he can take down one non-Force Sensitive with ease.

 

In regards to his accomplishments, yeah, those are his powers, but you failed to note the magnitude:

 

• Was capable of Force Draining entire planets in moments.
   
   
  
• Force Drained Darth Traya, a powerful Sith Lord, with ease.
   
   
  
• Could use TK to lift a dreadnought off the surface of a planet with a massive gravitation pull and will it to fly.
   
   
  
• Used a potent form of essence transfer to bind essence to his armor and so escape death.
   
   
  
• Was capable of incapacitating the Jedi Exile, an extremely powerful Force User, with ease.
   
   
  
• Possessed senses that allowed him to perceive the presence of Force Sensitives across the galaxy.
  

Nihilus powers fluctuated depending on how much energy he has consumed, but as a practical black hole he has the ability to harness potentially limitless power. And when constantly consuming the essence of entire planets, one of which was enough to make the Sith Emperor "vastly" more powerful, the extent of his powers are immense.

 

I expect if Nihilus demonstrated feats in other aspects of the Force, they would be equally impressive.

 

I wouldn't nominate him for this list however, I believe his powers to be well-respected and understood.

[Wolfninjajedi]

Nihilus didn't stun Canderous actually. Further proof that he didn't really care. In fact Canderous stands a way off and doesn't even appear in the cut-scenes, one could argue game mechanics were the only things keeping there.

 

Anyway, I really don't know what your point is. Even if Nihilus could see Canderous its obviously well within his power to kill him. He's drained Sith Lords, he can take down one non-Force Sensitive with ease.

 

In regards to his accomplishments, yeah, those are his powers, but you failed to note the magnitude:

 

• Was capable of Force Draining entire planets in moments.
   
   
  
• Force Drained Darth Traya, a powerful Sith Lord, with ease.
   
   
  
• Could use TK to lift a dreadnought off the surface of a planet with a massive gravitation pull and will it to fly.
   
   
  
• Used a potent form of essence transfer to bind essence to his armor and so escape death.
   
   
  
• Was capable of incapacitating the Jedi Exile, an extremely powerful Force User, with ease.
   
   
  
• Possessed senses that allowed him to perceive the presence of Force Sensitives across the galaxy.
  

Nihilus powers fluctuated depending on how much energy he has consumed, but as a practical black hole he has the ability to harness potentially limitless power. And when constantly consuming the essence of entire planets, one of which was enough to make the Sith Emperor "vastly" more powerful, the extent of his powers are immense.

 

I expect if Nihilus demonstrated feats in other aspects of the Force, they would be equally impressive.

 

I wouldn't nominate him for this list however, I believe his powers to be well-respected and understood.

 

1. Yes

 

2. No, both him and Sion stripped Traya of her power.

 

But Traya underestimates her disciples' depravity. They turn on her and drain her Force powers.

 

--Taken from the Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide

 

3. Yes he could lift it off of Malachor, a darkside nexus which would have greatly amped him. Plus the Ravager could have very well been seeped in darkside energies. Plus he has not shown this level of TK anywhere else, he has only shown to choke others. The one TK feat doesn't resemble his TK ability at all.

 

4. Yes he did, forgot that bit.

 

5. Yes he did, but I noted as Drain/Concealment as being his only notable things, I was speaking of scale.

[Beniboybling]

Yet if Nihilus was as powerful as everyone was saying he was(which they can be biased) then he shouldn't have had any problems killing the group. Not draining, killing...and yet he did not and was defeated.

 

I guess he could be on this list, but he isn't underrated by any means, and Beni I take it you have read this?

 

http://www.comicvine.com/profile/shootingnova/blog/overrated-sith-lords-darths-nihilus-and-sion/97357/

Like Selenial says, he was weakened. Your assuming that "he wasn't that weakened" but your just making the up, clearly he was, that is why he is dead. That said they had to weaken him again before they could actually win.

 

Did I not say that I don't think he should be on this list? His powers are well-respected IMO. In regards to that article yes I have read it, but its not really relevant as it either stating the obvious or disproving abilities can be used on combat.

 

But to pick apart the conclusion:

 

So honestly, Nihilus's only real combat-applicable abilities are TK (which he can use to Choke beings, but not anybody of substantial power)...

 

Entirely dependent on how much chow he's had that day. If he can lift a ship from a gravitation death trap however after having a big mac, a standard meal is more than enough to choke out most powerful Force Users. I mean this is a feat that even Darth Sidious probably wouldn't have been capable of, not quite as strong as that is still vastly powerful.

 

I'd of course add to that that Nihilus on an average day could consume entire planets which despite being a massive wound in the Force still demands colossal amounts of raw dark side energy to pull off.

 

...his Stasis, which can be used to Stun others but again, cannot be used on beings of substantial power,

 

Meetra Surik is not a being of substantial power? Well I never got that memo.

 

...and his Drain, which will work but there are a number of characters who are immune to it.

 

One character, Meetra Surik. Game mechanics/circumstantial evidence is not enough to invalidate an obvious ability to Force Drain highly powerful Sith Lords such as Darth Traya with little difficulty. I'm sure he could kill Visas.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Beniboybling

[Beniboybling]

1. Yes

 

2. No, both him and Sion stripped Traya of her power.

 

 

 

3. Yes he could lift it off of Malachor, a darkside nexus which would have greatly amped him. Plus the Ravager could have very well been seeped in darkside energies. Plus he has not shown this level of TK anywhere else, he has only shown to choke others. The one TK feat doesn't resemble his TK ability at all.

 

4. Yes he did, forgot that bit.

 

5. Yes he did, but I noted as Drain/Concealment as being his only notable things, I was speaking of scale.

Sion did not have a hand in stripping Traya of her power, he just watched:

 

Darth Traya indeed teaches the newly christened Darth Nihilus to harness his life-draining gift to radical heights—so effectively, in fact, that Nihilus saps Traya's powers in a calculated double-cross.

 

No mention of Sion there. And in the cutscene Sion doesn't seem to do anything.

 

Again Nihilus' powers are constantly in flux and difficult to pin down. He doesn't have a base level of power so we can't really used terms like "amped" - all Nihilus power comes from external powers. But still valid depending on the field of battle, however note that Nihilus outside of Malachor's influence was still able to hold the ship together.

 

EDIT: Note however that this is pure fan speculation, and not actually anywhere stated in any legitimate sources. For all we know Nihilus may not have used its power and was simply capable of this. After all Tobin does say:

 

He tore it from the mass shadows of Malachor, along with his fleet... that is a measure of his power.

 

As in this is the extent, this is an accurate portrayal, this is a measuring stick etc.

 

Having senses that span the entire galaxy is certainly a matter of scale.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Beniboybling

[Wolfninjajedi]

Like Selenial says, he was weakened. Your assuming that "he wasn't that weakened" but your just making the up, clearly he was, that is why he is dead. That said they had to weaken him again before they could actually win.

 

Did I not say that I don't think he should be on this list? His powers are well-respected IMO. In regards to that article yes I have read it, but its not really relevant as it either stating the obvious or disproving abilities can be used on combat.

 

But to pick apart the conclusion:

 

So honestly, Nihilus's only real combat-applicable abilities are TK (which he can use to Choke beings, but not anybody of substantial power)...

 

Entirely dependent on how much chow he's had that day. If he can lift a ship from a gravitation death trap however after having a big mac, a standard meal is more than enough to choke out most powerful Force Users. I mean this is a feat that even Darth Sidious probably wouldn't have been capable of, not quite as strong as that is still vastly powerful.

 

I'd of course add to that that Nihilus on an average day could consume entire planets which despite being a massive wound in the Force still demands colossal amounts of raw dark side energy to pull off.

 

...his Stasis, which can be used to Stun others but again, cannot be used on beings of substantial power,

 

Meetra Surik is not a being of substantial power? Well I never got that memo.

 

...and his Drain, which will work but there are a number of characters who are immune to it.

 

One character, Meetra Surik. Game mechanics/circumstantial evidence is not enough to invalidate an obvious ability to Force Drain highly powerful Sith Lords such as Darth Traya with little difficulty. I'm sure he could kill Visas.

 

I never said Nihilus wasn't weakened, I just am saying he wasn't weakened so badly.

 

Also again he lifted up the ship while on a darkside nexus, that isn't an indicator of his standard power.

 

Also yes he can drain planets and yes he does get weakened over time with not feeding, but according to sources he fed on planets before arriving at Telos and also together both Suirk and Visas defeated him, makes no mention of him being weakened.

 

Although Darth Nihilus managed to stun the Exile, he was unprepared for the devotion of his former pupil Marr to the young woman. Marr tried to exchange her life for that of the Exile, giving the former Jedi time to recover. Together, they confronted Darth Nihilus. The Sith Lord was no match for their combined might, and he fell in battle.

 

--Taken from The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

 

But fine Beni, let's just move on with this list anyway.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Wolfninjajedi