Suggestion: Merge TOFN, Darth Nihilus and Jar'Kai Sword

[MidichIorian]

This is not 1970, we've overcome the language barrier. But assuming that it's still a problem, have you people been to TOFN? That server is not "English", it's international. On a normal day you'll come across ten different languages in chat and warzones and it still works. The Russians, Hungarians, Norwegians etc all seem to be able to find eachother, in the event that they feel the need to play with their country men, so why is it that the Germans and Frenchies need special treatment? Is it a legal issue? Do the French and Germans have special laws and regulations? Seems to be working just fine in other games and on other platforms.

 

So what's more important, that one or two don't get to speak in their native language at all times (they still have the option to form guilds with other people from their countries) or that we have a healthy population where things such as ELO actually can kick in and do what it's supposed to do? X-server is apparently not even on the table so this is the most reasonable approach, merge before it's too late.

 

I'm a form believer that Swtor, in it's youth, lost a lot of people due to the delay in server merges. A lot of people left because the game didnt meet their expectations but it created a snowball effect where those who actually liked the game followed because they had no one to play with anymore. The server merges came way too late, don't let that happen to the PvP servers and Arena communities.

Edited March 2, 2014 by MidichIorian

[Altheran]

If it's special treatment, then how wouldn't it be special treatment to only have English as a language ?

 

You're looking too deep into it. If they were able to do it, they would give at least one server per language. But they can't. So they only do the ones that wouldn't be money sinks, that's all. No special treatment.

 

By the way, lots of French and German would probably not play the game if forced to play in a foreign language... For various reasons. Swedens, Hungarians, or people that come from other countries that play in English are dedicated enough to do so. But not anyone would be whether they come from France or Hungary... So you'd be bound to lose a good part of that community.

Edited March 2, 2014 by Altheran

[MidichIorian]

If it's special treatment, then how wouldn't it be special treatment to only have English as a language ?

 

You're looking too deep into it. If they were able to do it, they would give at least one server per language. But they can't. So they only do the ones that wouldn't be money sinks, that's all. No special treatment.

First. i wasnt trying to have a go at the French or Germans, which"special treatment" might have insinuated. The point was that TOFN, in practice, isnt an English server. Sure, most people there are trying to communicate in English because it makes life a whole lot easier for everyone but it's a server where all countries come together, all but two nations and the few other countries in which French or German are the native languages. And that's fine as long as it's not affecting the overall experience. At this point though I'd say that server segrergation, based on languages, does affect the expereince and I believe all three servers would benefit from a merge, for PvP specifically. Edited March 2, 2014 by MidichIorian

[Aehgo]

TOFN is an english server.Maybe Im wrong but this requires you to speak english in general chat etc?

Anyway didn't all the arena teams already come to tofn?chabos inka bunka etc,whats the point in merging if all the top teams are already here?

[AngusFTW]

there is even a few french guilds on here as well i think?

also i'm pretty sure 60% of the server is swedish ;_;

Edited March 3, 2014 by AngusFTW

[MidichIorian]

TOFN is an english server.Maybe Im wrong but this requires you to speak english in general chat etc?

Anyway didn't all the arena teams already come to tofn?chabos inka bunka etc,whats the point in merging if all the top teams are already here?

We rarely hear anything about the French and German teams unless we go to their version of the site, which I never do on behalf of not being able to speak French of German well enough to understand the posts. I sure hope they havent all transfered though because the latest "team list" in the TOFN forum suggests that only a handful teams are still queueing and from the look of things I'd say that the vast majority of them are original otfn teams.

 

But there's more to it than just team ranked, it would benefit the normal queues and foremost yolo too.

also i'm pretty sure 60% of the server is swedish ;_;

It's well established that Sweden has the best and best looking gamers, regardless of game and genre.

Edited March 3, 2014 by MidichIorian

[Altheran]

First. i wasnt trying to have a go at the French or Germans, which"special treatment" might have insinuated. The point was that TOFN, in practice, isnt an English server. Sure, most people there are trying to communicate in English because it makes life a whole lot easier for everyone but it's a server where all countries come together, all but two nations and the few other countries in which French or German are the native languages. And that's fine as long as it's not affecting the overall experience. At this point though I'd say that server segrergation, based on languages, does affect the expereince and I believe all three servers would benefit from a merge, for PvP specifically.

But you're assuming that the entire French and German player base would accept to play in those conditions. The reality is that if you remove the comfort of native language server, many would leave... Like a lot.

 

Having a server in which you can speak your own native language freely is invaluable. Just imagine that one day you play a MMO, and the English server is closed and you're told that you can still play if you play on a French server. Honestly, what do you do ?

[Evolixe]

Well here's a thing though, I don't mind people having their own little nice communities and stuff.

 

But I absolutely do not want any players on my server that do not understand english one bit. That just won't work.

[MidichIorian]

But you're assuming that the entire French and German player base would accept to play in those conditions. The reality is that if you remove the comfort of native language server, many would leave... Like a lot.

 

Having a server in which you can speak your own native language freely is invaluable. Just imagine that one day you play a MMO, and the English server is closed and you're told that you can still play if you play on a French server. Honestly, what do you do ?

I would play, I'm not here for the social expereince. And I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of Germans and French can make themselves understood in English or, again, find their peers.

 

But perhaps i don't fully understand how things work in MMO'es, on behalf of this being my first one. I will say this though, I have never had as few social interactions with other players in an online game as I've had in this one. In shooters I'd talk to a ton of players every day but in this one there's really no need for it, give or take team arena and a first run through some Hm/NiM (this only affects a small % of the population). Are people hoarding to MMO'es to sit and chat? Maybe that's the part I dont get. The social interactions I've had in other games have always been a side-effect of required in-game talk, you start by talking about what you're going to do in the game and it leads to more personal conversations.

Well here's a thing though, I don't mind people having their own little nice communities and stuff.

 

But I absolutely do not want any players on my server that do not understand english one bit. That just won't work.

Has it been estaliblished that the French and Germans can't speak English? I live in southern sweden and come across visiting germans all the time and they all seem to be speaking perfectly fine English. Same with all the Germans/Frenchies I've come across on Xbox Live. So should we implement an english test? I bet that a lot of people from the nations that are forced to roll on tofn, on behalf of not having their own national servers, wouldnt pass such a test. So I still think it's silly ´to segrergate people based on some languages when we could have needed those people on one and the same server.

Edited March 3, 2014 by MidichIorian

[Altheran]

Well here's a thing though, I don't mind people having their own little nice communities and stuff.

 

But I absolutely do not want any players on my server that do not understand english one bit. That just won't work.

 

That's why, as a non-English native guy, even though I'm fluent enough to post here on a daily basis, would not board that ship if that kind of merge were to happen. I've seen once how chaotic it becomes, how the mood on general chat worsens... I won't try a second time.

[MidichIorian]

The reality is that if you remove the comfort of native language server, many would leave... Like a lot.

Objection, speculative.

 

Out of all the reasons for leaving that people have posted in their "bye"-threads, have you ever come across "I'm leaving because there's no server to support my native language". This game is available in a lot of countries, covering a bunch of languages, and you are saying that only zeh Germans and the French would come up with such a reason for leaving?

Edited March 3, 2014 by MidichIorian

[TheSupaCoopa]

Duran'del here:

 

There is something called "connection". In order for the computer to connect to the server, the server must be located nearby. The farther away the server, the weaker the connection.

Edited March 3, 2014 by TheSupaCoopa

[TheSupaCoopa]

Objection, speculative.

 

Out of all the reasons for leaving that people have posted in their "bye"-threads, have you ever come across "I'm leaving because there's no server to support my native language". This game is available in a lot of countries, covering a bunch of languages, and you are saying that only zeh Germans and the French would come up with such a reason for leaving?

Duran'del here:

 

The thing is that there is no global language that everyone knows. We have not gotten past the language barrier. If we did, we'd have a global language.

 

Your idea is stupid and completely illogical for numerous reasons.

[TheSupaCoopa]

Well here's a thing though, I don't mind people having their own little nice communities and stuff.

 

But I absolutely do not want any players on my server that do not understand english one bit. That just won't work.

 

^this.

 

I don't have anything against non-english speakers, but if I can't understand you and you can't understand me, then there cannot be any interaction at all.

[Vaerah]

There's also the "why would anyone vaguely sane ever want to touch ToFN with a stick".

 

The one (English) EU PvP server that manages to bleed enough players to permanently be "light" usually even right past super-prime time.

The one server where you'd be mad to want to roll imp on. There are like 3-4 good or even epic PvP guilds (impossible to join for the mere mortal), the rest is so deep and unrecoverable garbage (with fitting quality players!) that makes it a shocking, unforgivable, traumatic experience to just do a PvP daily.

 

I take 30 minutes getting PvP PUG dailies done on my rep character, 2+ hours for each imp character.

 

And Arena does not get any better. I usually end up last man standing...

 

 

..on a sorc.

 

Yay 26k juggs, 25k sorcs, 25k maras! And some truly rare 38k PvEers!

Edited March 3, 2014 by Vaerah

[MidichIorian]

Your idea is stupid and completely illogical for numerous reasons.

First, are we sure that not all EU servers, regardless of language, arent located in the same spot (I'm actually asking)? Also, the English servers are supposedly located in Ireland and these are the servers people, all across EU, who don't have a native server to connect to are using. Germany and France are fairly close to Ireland compared to a bunch of other countries here.

 

I'd like to hear these illogical reasons and how you justify how two languages, out of all the languages in the world, require their own servers when those two populations could have improved the expereince for everyone on internationa/EUl servers, or in this case the servers labeled English.

There's also the "why would anyone vaguely sane ever want to touch ToFN with a stick".

 

The one (English) EU PvP server that manages to bleed enough players to permanently be "light" usually even right past super-prime time.

The one server where you'd be mad to want to roll imp on. There are like 3-4 good or even epic PvP guilds (impossible to join for the mere mortal), the rest is so deep and unrecoverable garbage (with fitting quality players!) that makes it a shocking, unforgivable, traumatic experience to just do a PvP daily.

 

I take 30 minutes getting PvP PUG dailies done on my rep character, 2+ hours for each imp character.

 

And Arena does not get any better. I usually end up last man standing...

 

 

On a sorc.

I've been beating around the bush in an attempt to avoid the doomsday speech but what you just posted is the real issue here, tofn is IMO dying. I recently transfered back to tofn and I can't even get a normal warzone pop at hours when I used to be able to play a few months ago (4'ish months). In the afternoon you'll have 1,5 fleet and you'll encounter the same players in basically every game. There is a problem and since we obviously don't have a netto gain of new players we have to take players from existing sources.

Edited March 3, 2014 by MidichIorian

[Altheran]

Objection, speculative.

 

Out of all the reasons for leaving that people have posted in their "bye"-threads, have you ever come across "I'm leaving because there's no server to support my native language". This game is available in a lot of countries, covering a bunch of languages, and you are saying that only zeh Germans and the French would come up with such a reason for leaving?

Objection, illogical.

 

Those who would not play because they haven't a server in their native language would not come at all if there isn't any of the said server in the first place. For that reason, those "I quit" post can't exist yet.

 

They can exist only if the said language was first available, then disabled.

 

The fundamental difference is that foreigners coming to play on English servers or the one you can ran into Xbox live or even here on the forums, usually come knowingly that they'll have to speak in English. So there's a kind of natural selection, and those unable to speak in English simply don't come. It's not that foreigners mostly know how to speak in English, but rather than you only encountered those who were able to.

 

Now, with a server merge, you're taking everybody. Those who can speak English well, as well as those who are terrible at speaking in English. These one have two choices : leaving or carrying on.

Edited March 3, 2014 by Altheran

[TheSupaCoopa]

First, are we sure that not all EU servers, regardless of language, arent located in the same spot (I'm actually asking)? Also, the English servers are supposedly located in Ireland and these are the servers people, all across EU, who don't have a native server to connect to are using. Germany and France are fairly close to Ireland compared to a bunch of other countries here.

 

I'd like to hear these illogical reasons and how you justify how two languages, out of all the languages in the world, require their own servers when those two populations could have improved the expereince for everyone on internationa/EUl servers, or in this case the servers labeled English.

1. Different Cultures: Something may be socially acceptable in one culture while being totally unacceptable in another.

2. Different Languages: Say a German person is looking for a PuG of DF. He says it, and wonders what is going on and why no one is saying that they want an invite. The reason- THEY CAN'T UNDERSTAND HIM.

3. Politics: Say something happens to the French Ambassador in England. The french start to harass English players in PvP, PvE, or even through PMs.

 

These are my top 3 reasons.

 

Now, please post something productive, perhaps, say, a matchmaking system for Solo Ranked.

[MidichIorian]

Objection, illogical.

 

Those who would not play because they haven't a server in their native language would not come at all if there isn't any of the said server in the first place. For that reason, those "I quit" post can't exist yet.

 

They can exist only if the said language was first available, then disabled.

I've seen plenty of people online use google translate, with ¨varying results. I have never come across another swede say "oh no, I can't play that game because there's no Swedish server". Console gaming is in most cases utilizing P2P so that would exclude the possibility of non-English speaking people playing. I bet the Microsoft and Sony would be all over that if it turned out to be true. Edited March 3, 2014 by MidichIorian

[nitroyoshi]

murica

[MidichIorian]

1. Different Cultures: Something may be socially acceptable in one culture while being totally unacceptable in another.

2. Different Languages: Say a German person is looking for a PuG of DF. He says it, and wonders what is going on and why no one is saying that they want an invite. The reason- THEY CAN'T UNDERSTAND HIM.

3. Politics: Say something happens to the French Ambassador in England. The french start to harass English players in PvP, PvE, or even through PMs.

 

These are my top 3 reasons.

 

Now, please post something productive, perhaps, say, a matchmaking system for Solo Ranked.

Mr. TheSupaCoopa, what you've just posted is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever read . At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this site is now dumber for having read it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

murica

Now available in Spanish.

Edited March 3, 2014 by MidichIorian

[Altheran]

I've seen plenty of people online use google translate, with various results. I have never come across another swede say "oh no, I can't play that game because there's no Swedish server". Console gaming is in most cases utilizing P2P so that would exclude the possibility of non-English speaking people playing. I bet the Microsoft and Sony would be all over that if it turned out to be true.

 

Investment, hypothetical gains...

 

Countries like Sweden, Hungary are in a completely different league from France and Germany when it comes to this.

 

Microsoft and Sony know that if they were to translate a game in Swedish, it wouldn't boost sells enough to be worth the investment. For that reason they sell games in English, and gamers are all dedicated enough to know English.

It's why you will never meet a Swede like you describe, their situation is binary.

 

In the other hand, in France for exemple, nearly all games are translated because it's worth the investment. So if a game is released without translation, you will find people saying "I'll not play that game because of lack of translation".

 

So when you speak of foreigners on an English server, remember that you're speaking about dedicated people, not random people.

However, when you speak of people on French and German servers, you speak of a much wider range of people, including those who aren't quite dedicated to gaming to the extent of being willing to use English.

Edited March 3, 2014 by Altheran

[Vaerah]

I've been beating around the bush in an attempt to avoid the doomsday speech but what you just posted is the real issue here, tofn is IMO dying. I recently transfered back to tofn and I can't even get a normal warzone pop at hours when I used to be able to play a few months ago (4'ish months). In the afternoon you'll have 1,5 fleet and you'll encounter the same players in basically every game. There is a problem and since we obviously don't have a netto gain of new players we have to take players from existing sources.

 

The problem is that ToFN is basically the weak link of the chain so the ongoing decline of this game reflects over there in a quick, sharp way.

It's truly going pear shaped.

Back when the situation was still bearable, you could end in the umpteenth "super-bads with no hope for redemption" WZ / arena, quit it and requeue and pray for the best.

Now it does not work. You leave... you SHALL end up with them again. Because there's really just those 10-15 guys queuing for PvP any longer, there's no place where to escape!

 

You leave terrible WZ and either you end back in it (even waiting for a while before requeuing) or you have to wait for it to end because it's the ONLY WZ being spawned. And then, after the long wait, you are back with the terribads. Yes, the very same ones. Every day. From all those assorted useless tiny guilds that manage to fail either at being a level up guild (no help doing LFG for instances), at PVE ("International guild blah blah (usually big name with sabers, honor and whatever RP) WE CLEARED < enter here name of basic HM instance >, and at PvP (3-4 badly assorted, low skilled, bad geared guys whose ONLY achievement is to trigger the "match against other (usually top, uber double)" enemy premade

 

Of course if you play imp it's even harder. You have basically to stalk the hours when imps play against imps. THEN you stand a chance to win a WZ.

I have done scientific tests, proving that if I go AFK close to a pylon or even alt tabbed pressing "taunt" or casting a shield and then ALT tabbing again off the game, I STILL manage to get in the top 3-4 positions!

 

That is, they manage to do less than a guy who purposedly goes AFK!

Edited March 3, 2014 by Vaerah

[TheSupaCoopa]

Mr. TheSupaCoopa, what you've just posted is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever read . At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone on this site is now dumber for having read it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

 

Now available in Spanish.

 

"I'm going to say this one thing and since I said it, it must be true"

 

^ That is you. I believe I forgot something:

 

4. Racism: totally unavoidable, but since language divided servers are isolated, no real harm is done. If servers were merged, however, this isolation would vanish.

[MidichIorian]

"I'm going to say this one thing and since I said it, it must be true"

 

^ That is you. I believe I forgot something:

 

4. Racism: totally unavoidable, but since language divided servers are isolated, no real harm is done. If servers were merged, however, this isolation would vanish.

I've come to the conclusion that you're either:

A. Trolling

B: The dumbest person to ever discover and somehow figured out how to navigate the internet

 

Do you even know where Germany and France are located on the map or their positions in international politics and economics? There are two reason to why they have their own servers, they are highly populated and leading countries in the developed world. That's it. They are markets that in most cases can hold their own and they're currently doing better than the international/English server. Infact, Germany is the nationality most represented on swtor.com according to Alexa.. And granted that the French, according to several studies, arent experts at the English language but this is true for a lot of countries in Europe, those countires arent as big though so they're not worth the extra cost.

This is where you, in your complete ignorance, are trying to make it political. How did you even come to that conclusion? The kicker is that you tried to involve other countries too. The likelyhood o´f France starting a war with England is literally zero. You don't think EU contains a bunch of countries that would take higher priority if avoiding political conflicts was the determining factor here?

 

So the point still remains, the English server needs the French and German populations before it's too late. Once we reach a point where it's not even possible to get a queue pop until noon, and we're not far away, you'll have even more people, people who otherwise like the game, jump ship.I think tofn is dangerously close to the point where the snowball effect starts and people realize that they're playing a RPG that doesnt have enough people to support the MMO part. Label the new server French or German, I' don't care, I'm just interested in condensing the populations as damage control before it's too late.

Edited March 3, 2014 by MidichIorian