Suggestion for the premade groups and veterans this week

[Wainamoinen]

My internet was down on Tuesday, but I played a couple of games last night, and the second was ridiculous: started with two-thirds of the Reps having five-ship loadouts and all the Imps on two or three, and swiftly degenerated into a spawn camp. I went Imp for the rest of the evening, which was at times frustrating, but won a few.

 

Galactic Starfighter is a lot of fun, but it does require some skill to perform well. This comes with practice. This needn't take long - a day or two of playing is enough to start doing well. I was in closed beta so I'd amassed some experience, and when GS went live I was like some vengeful god among the newbies - until some of them started getting the hang of it and I started getting regularly shot down again. This is why I say a couple of days, because that's about how long it took to level out. Not that long, but the initial difference based on experience (not talent) meant it was a hopeless mismatch. I'd concede that some people do simply seem better than others - that's life, and measns there is actually a return on ability in the game.

 

If you like GS too, you'll want more people playing it, so you can enjoy it more. Helping newbies cope with the inital brutalisation ("don't worry about it, try this", vets switching to play the weaker side for a few days) can help all of us longer term. People who are new to PvP try it, and many of them aren't used to being horribly, repeatedly butchered, it takes time to learn to accept it...

 

This will probably apply double when GS opens for F2P.

 

TL;DR: Not sure I'm comfortable with going easy, but try and be willing to explain stuff, and if you're good maybe play the weaker side short-term to balance things up. Helping newbies over the initial hump helps you long term.

Edited January 16, 2014 by Wainamoinen

[Warhams]

Another thing a lot of people don't seem to understand is unlike ground pvp warzones where there is bolster to help 'even' things up abit there is nothing in starfighter to help balance the upgrades. What tends to happen, Yay, New player jumps in, fly boosts towards enemy, 2 things will happen : Either he gets killed in 3 seconds by a flashfire who he cannot hit due to maxed and upgraded distortion fields plus evasion armour or he gets stunlocked to death by a quarrel with fully upgraded Ion cannons. Now, if the teams were balanced it won't be so bad but if the newbie team has no one who can counter these, they just die 3-5 times and just quit.

 

I've had many games vs Rep vet premades where my side (Imp) started off with 12 players and finished with only 2-4 of those who started, the others quit and got back filled. It might sound crazy but that was what happened in many games, new players just quit and rarely come back.

 

To the previous posters who said the Reps might start to take it easy, I seriously doubt it will happen, they might feel remorse for 1 game, then go back to their Newbie farming premades for the rest of the day.....

[CloudCastle]

I've had many games vs Rep vet premades where my side (Imp) started off with 12 players and finished with only 2-4 of those who started, the others quit and got back filled. It might sound crazy but that was what happened in many games, new players just quit and rarely come back.

 

Ah, this must explain the experience I had last night. I joined a match and found that it was already more than half over with the enemy team having over 700 points and my team having 4. Now I understand that maybe people were bailing mid-match I was pulled from the queue to fill in.

 

Since GSF was opened up to premiums I have had nothing but constant team losses where I get so beaten down that I was very tempted to quit mid-game myself. These were not games. It was just the same group of vets killing us over and over before we could even reach a satellite. There's no way to learn the game this way or get better. How can I get better if I spend most of my time dead?

 

On my server it's the Imps slaughtering the pubs though.

 

Can I ask an etiquette question? Is it poor form to quit mid-match? It had never occurred to me to do this until this week, but last night after game after game of being slaughtered I was sorely tempted. I didn't because it didn't seem right, but it's excruciating to get stuck in a match where you have no chance of even staying alive, let alone winning. By mid-match, I couldn't even get far off the capitol ship without being killed. I even considered just hitting x and sitting there on top of the dang ship, until the match was over, but that seemed bad too.

 

I decided to do the next best thing and I just stopped queueing altogether. I'm still a beginning player, but at least I had a few fun matches last month. If I were a brand new player though? Forget it. After last night's experience, I would never come back.

Edited January 16, 2014 by CloudCastle

[Warhams]

Can I ask an etiquette question? Is it poor form to quit mid-match? It had never occurred to me to do this until this week, but last night after game after game of being slaughtered I was sorely tempted. I didn't because it didn't seem right, but it's excruciating to get stuck in a match where you have no chance of even staying alive, let alone winning. By mid-match, I couldn't even get far off the capitol ship without being killed. I even considered just hitting x and sitting there on top of the dang ship, until the match was over, but that seemed bad too.

 

I decided to do the next best thing and I just stopped playing altogether. I'm still a beginning player, but at least I had a few fun matches last month. If I were a brand new player though? Forget it. After last night's experience, I would never come back.

 

Normally in Land based warzones, its considered rude quitting mid game but in starfighter, honestly no. Simple because in land based pvp you can still get medals/commendations by healing/tanking/DPSing even when you are losing. In starfighter however you can only get medals/requisition by Guarding satellites, Killing turrets, Capping satellites, Killing enemy ships or assisting in Killing. However when the game is so imbalanced your more or less being spawn camped and you cannot do any of the above at all, feel free to bail. The only people who would complain are your enemies as theres 1 less free kill for them.

 

Think about it this way, if you already finished your daily and weekly, you only play for fun or to get requisition. If there is no chance of getting either, why waste time waiting to lose and increase your stress and bad mood.

[DEATHICIDE]

I have an even better idea for all you "vets":

 

Try flying without your premades and headsets for the week and discover how bad of a pilot you really are without your safety net

 

*Does a giant TROLL howl*

[Armonddd]

I have an even better idea for all you "vets":

 

Try flying without your premades and headsets for the week and discover how bad of a pilot you really are without your safety net

 

*Does a giant TROLL howl*

 

Are you still on about this?

 

I've done around half my matches queued solo, and I still have my Space Ace title before most.

[DEATHICIDE]

Are you still on about this?

 

I've done around half my matches queued solo, and I still have my Space Ace title before most.

 

I sure am!

But for the record, that wasn't directed at yourself or any other single person.

[Kain_Turinbar]

I've solo queued (which you guys seem to be calling PUGs???) since day one of joining SWTOR (30 days ago) and have had plenty of fun doing it. Sure, every now and then you come across a group that seems VERY coordinated and facerolls you but it isn't often.

 

During the minute before the match starts how hard is it to say "top squadron hold A, middle squadron B. Bottom Squadron harass C to force them to commit forces to it and reinforce other sats as needed"?

 

Some don't or won't listen but just hashing it out in the OPS chat before the match starts can pay dividends. The worst matches I've ever been in were when not one person on my team put a single message into the chat the entire time.

Edited January 16, 2014 by Kain_Turinbar

[Wainamoinen]

...feel free to bail. The only people who would complain are your enemies as theres 1 less free kill for them.

 

Wrong, you're screwing the person who gets backfilled into your spot and has no time to even earn any comms in a losing game. Never mind deserting the rest of your team who may still be trying to at least cap a node.

 

People who quit make excuses, but it's purely emotional and selfish behaviour that harms everone else. If you're having a bad game and have had enough, play it 'til the end and stop queueing then.

[Armonddd]

I sure am!

But for the record, that wasn't directed at yourself or any other single person.

 

I'm a vet. You directed your comment at vets. Therefore, you directed it at me.

 

There's not a single person in either of my guilds that doesn't do well in solo queues. Sure, we do better in premades, but that doesn't mean we don't hold our own (i.e. 50%+ win/loss ratio) no matter the situation. I can name another couple dozen who aren't guilded with any of my characters but can claim the same. I can even name a few who decline to group with anyone for similar reasons you do and have carried PUGs to victory against my premades. And, of course, all of these people play because they love GSF, not because they love being in premades, so they solo queue whenever they're on and their friends aren't.

 

Saying that good players are only good because they have an advantage your social handicaps prevent you from (attempting to) earn is both wrong and, frankly, kind of offensive. We didn't learn how to play by joking around in vent, after all. It's like going up to an Olympic competitor and saying "you're only here because your friends helped you out", except safer, because certain pilots would probably want to punch you in the face for it.

Edited January 16, 2014 by Armonddd

[HuaRya]

 

The premades are doing an excellent job of killing all interest in GSF this week. Not sure why anyone would be so worried about losing that they form a premade and purchase massive upgrades for their ships with cartel coins.

[BrianDavion]

it's not premades doing it folks it's just good pilots. I run sometimes with a "pre-made" and we're some of the better players on our server, we don't win because of some superior cordination (we don't cordinate very much beyond "ohh yeah I'm going here and taking the flashfire out" etc) we mostly just fly. but the thing is, we know what we're doing and fly approperatly. we fight on the sats. etc. and thats how we win. premades are a "problem" in MMO PVP that they supply cordination. However GSF's structure makes cordination at a tight level less nesscary to do well. what it IS however, is skill.

don't get me wrong though, the ability to shoot someone off a buddy's back is nice, but it's not exactly a game changer

[MColes]

REALLY trying to help 'em out here, going so far as to handicap myself against clearly newbie teams (No missiles, no blasters, not spending req I have). I would go so far as to hope BW gives new players a boost in requisition or something. Kind of a Bolster effect that lasts your first 5 matches or something.

[Warhams]

Wrong, you're screwing the person who gets backfilled into your spot and has no time to even earn any comms in a losing game. Never mind deserting the rest of your team who may still be trying to at least cap a node.

 

People who quit make excuses, but it's purely emotional and selfish behaviour that harms everone else. If you're having a bad game and have had enough, play it 'til the end and stop queueing then.

 

Did you read the 2 sentences before what you quoted? Tell me, if your team is so utterly Outclassed that its being Spawn Camped, what can you do? Within the skill limit of the team of course, aka brand new Prefs with zero upgrades etc.

[BrianDavion]

REALLY trying to help 'em out here, going so far as to handicap myself against clearly newbie teams (No missiles, no blasters, not spending req I have). I would go so far as to hope BW gives new players a boost in requisition or something. Kind of a Bolster effect that lasts your first 5 matches or something.

 

the thing isn't gear so much as skill.

situational awareness is IMHO key. know when you're being shot at, by who, what's his "worst case scenerio capabilities?"

 

even if you're JUST flying a strike fighter, make sure you're famielr with scouts and gunships. if you're just flying a scout know your strikers and gunnies. etc.

 

know your enemy and all that jazz.

[Desunder]

Well, today, I had a first hand experience with the premades vs new players. In a 12 man there was only 2 of us that had more then 2 ships. It got to the point that the Reps had all three sats and were spawn camping. I was followed by a player named T'zeal all the way back to the main base. Because it was a gunship he was able to take me out even when i was past the spawn point. As a gunship my self ,on different toons, I know how easy it can be to dominate a battlefield at times. (other times i'm running for my life) But its this kind of game play that will turn off people from playing GSF and slowly the que times will get worse and the pilots like T'zeal that switch from scout to gunship to camp bases will soon run up against better equiped and better teamwork from other premades and will probably be leaving when that can't "pwn" the battlefield. As for me, I'll take my lumps and put that person on ignore on my republic toons. i will continue to beat my head against the spawn point on the imp side to get the few reqs i can get.

 

Holy wall of text Batman.

[Warhams]

Mine are worse, hehe but according to Wainamoinen , we should just stay in the game and die until the timer runs out. Again, it mine be fine for you and me to just take it but for new players, they will get so turned off they will quit. I wouldn't be surprised in your game that once it got to the spawn camping phase, all your new teammates just left. Starfighter does not have a player had left or player had joined notification.

[Armonddd]

Did you read the 2 sentences before what you quoted? Tell me, if your team is so utterly Outclassed that its being Spawn Camped, what can you do? Within the skill limit of the team of course, aka brand new Prefs with zero upgrades etc.

 

I've fought those out, both on new ships and mastered, in premades and solo. It's never worth leaving early.

[Warhams]

I've fought those out, both on new ships and mastered, in premades and solo. It's never worth leaving early.

 

That's You, you have some or a lot of skill and know what to do. What about a full team of Prefs who haven't even played the game before (except the tutorial)?

[-KeggER-]

That's You, you have some or a lot of skill and know what to do. What about a full team of Prefs who haven't even played the game before (except the tutorial)?

 

How else are they supposed to learn and get better? Not by quitting that's for sure

[ptwonline]

How else are they supposed to learn and get better? Not by quitting that's for sure

 

But if their experience is bad enough, they won't even WANT to stay around to get better.

[Sadishist]

But if their experience is bad enough, they won't even WANT to stay around to get better.

 

Not everyone is cut out for PVP. You need a thick skin.

[ptwonline]

Not everyone is cut out for PVP. You need a thick skin.

 

And yet with a few simple changes the pool of players would grow, and perhaps some of these players you are driving away might even learn to like it.

 

Instead, GSF might be barren in 6 months.

[DEATHICIDE]

 

Saying that good players are only good because they have an advantage your social handicaps prevent you from (attempting to) earn is both wrong and, frankly, kind of offensive. We didn't learn how to play by joking around in vent, after all. It's like going up to an Olympic competitor and saying "you're only here because your friends helped you out", except safer, because certain pilots would probably want to punch you in the face for it.

 

Damn, I even said *Lets out troll growl* so like... really man, sorry for the pinched nerve lol

Because you got so worked up about this, all I have to say is, thanks for the illustration.

 

I'm SURE your WHOLE TEAM and EVERYONE who rapes PUGs with voice com is just AWESOME solo.

You totally pwnd me there with the social handicap remark too, I mean, OWCH..

 

I retract my statement, and will go on record saying "Playing GSF with a premade on voice com does not give you an unfair advantage, and everyone who does this are totally awesome players who have massive grapefruits and are totally better than everyone even without their headsets because they are just really REALLY good players and THAT is why they use headsets, because they are just taking being better than everyone to a whole new level. They are my GODS!"

 

Happy now

[Armonddd]

That's You, you have some or a lot of skill and know what to do. What about a full team of Prefs who haven't even played the game before (except the tutorial)?

 

My first few matches were pretty much exactly like that. I realized pretty early that leaving or getting disconnected meant no req for that match, which meant no progress towards getting an advantage over the guys rolling me.

 

Happy now

 

lol

 

if you're not going to even try to consider that you might have been wrong, i won't bother