Hassat-Hunter Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 +1. But of course BW wont fix it since they so value their ganker PvP players more... and they need their fix too in what they see is a PvE centric game (which it is, and I would like BW to actually acknowledge rather than actively work against). The people who think it's just fine always use the same 'good' suggestions; Just stop playing for a few minutes (and hope that works, it don't always do), completely avoid grouping (good luck doing the Heroic or op) and being an absolute selfish basterd (what, you decided to buff/heal a random other player, WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU? You deserved this for being so non-me)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Autorch Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 How hard can it be? Here's my rule change for PVE servers: In order for players to interact (heal, damage, buff) they must be same-flagged. Differently flagged actions have no effect--you can't damage, heal, buff, or debuff a player that's not flagged as you are. I don't see how this is any harder to code than a range check; the rule just becomes must be in range, and must be same-flagged. The hard part is probably removing the previous stupid rules. Flagging is a 30 second channel outside of a warzone. In warzones you simply are flagged and on leaving the warzone you return to the flagged state you were in before you joined. Flag channeling rules are the same as quick travel: Can't be in combat, can be interrupted, brings you out of stealth, etc. You are insta-killed after the ten second warning for blundering into an open-world PVP area (Outlaw's Den, Gree, etc) if you have not flagged yourself. You cannot unflag while in such a zone. You must leave and do your channel. NPC guards of the opposite faction do 500% increased damage against players who are not flagged, and always have a 100% chance to hit. Normal rules apply to flagged players attacking NPC guards. The same insta-kill rule applies for blundering into opposite factional areas as well. Boom done. There are probably exploitable edge cases somewhere in there, but I can't think of any at the moment. PVP combat becomes truly by consent on a PVE server, as advertised, with max 30 seconds of down time instead of five minutes plus travel to a "safe" area. if you argue that's somehow inconvenient, I refer you to the million and one posts telling me to return to base and watch my screen for five minutes until I unflag, don't ever go to the Gree dailies, and so on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 (edited) To fix it with the convoluted rule-set, sure, but I cant see why on a PVE server, that the rule-set needs to be applied, especially when taking into account the frivolous nature that is pvp in the open world, ie, no loss or reward. I truly dont believe it would be hard to make it so no matter what you do, you simply cannot be flagged unless you turn it on, or venture into the FFA zones on ilum and tatt and of course in WZs. Being flagged leaves you open to be ganked, tough luck, it adds some more risk to the venture, and its not like it doesn't happen now anyway. The PvE servers still have active PvP. They are designed that way. Not really different from other MMOs either... other then some subtleties in mechanics. You know the rule mechanics for this game, be mindful of them, and you will rarely ever get flagged against your will. And when you do.. it's not the end of the world. As for healers, if you do not want to be flagged, do not heal/buff a flagged player... which is a pretty universal mechanics in MMOs to be honest. An accidental flagging does not submit you to prolonged ganking. Go to safe place, wait 5 mintues, continue with your game. I can think of maybe a half a dozen times since launch where I found one of my characters flagged against my will. Specific events, like the Gree event always brings out these threads and complaints. I guess because it puts players in more open opportunity for an accidental flagging. Just enter the event being a bit more prudent with your companion settings and which skills you are tossing where and you will be fine. And when you find that odd stealther trying to slip-stream the rule mechanics..... just go get some help and give him a proper and persistent spanking until he gives up and logs. TL;DR: as intelligent human beings.... most of what is being complained about is easily manageable without pleas for intervention by the devs. AND.. if you feel you were somehow exploited... /report and move on. Edited December 24, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveAmerica Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 Clever manipulation of weaknesses in game mechanics like that are why I enjoy playing MMO's. It's amazing to see the clever ways people can exploit/adapt to a system designed with prevention in mind. Half the fun of PVP is the unpredictability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Wes- Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 Yeah so annoying to be teamed with a flagged player when you're healer, I tried healing him/his companion in a "Heroic 4" with with surgical probe but I couldn't, said something like the target is not PVP flagged. So I'm forced to use channeled heals and end up getting flagged myself. Also I don't think they get heals from aoe heals like recuperative nanotech unless you're flagged yourself. Okay, so I laughed out loud when I read this thread title because it is so true! It is way, way too easy to become flagged for PvP. I like that we can flag without having to set it if we intentionally attack a "yellow" player, but being flagged through an AoE attack or taunt is just annoying as hell. That said, I also find the added tension/excitement of being flagged for PvP in areas like Ilum to be an additive component of the experience rather than a detractor. Herethos, everything you mentioned in your post is absolutely true. I'm generally the healer in my groups, so if the group doesn't want to be flagged, I respect that request. If we have a member who gets themselves flagged through carelessness, I tell them straight up that they need to avoid pulling aggro because they can no longer be healed. If a roving band of reds comes up and ganks him... well, 1 out of 4 isn't bad. I hate to just sit by and watch it happen, but I have to respect the wishes of the group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatleaf Posted December 25, 2013 Author Share Posted December 25, 2013 If it's so easy, then please explain how they should do this. I'm interested. It is a simple matter of introducing a 'check' in the code. So when you perform an action that would be considered under the current system to flag you for PvP then all the code has to do is to run a simple 'yes' or 'no' as to the state of the PvP flag and determine if that action can continue. it wouldn't add any lagg or further strain on computers as it is so simple. But as has been mentioned the real issue would be removing the current state of affairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barzarel Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 (edited) Well what actually happened was that the person got flagged by accident. He threw a snowball on a flagged person , why does that mark you as pvp I don't know. Then he admitted and you guys raged at him and kicked from the group. You deserved to be ganked for being so rude. Assuming its because the snowball mechanic share function with buff system, and seems any kind of buffing or healing target you as pvp flagged from my understanding. At least that would be my guess to why as illogical as it may be. Edited December 27, 2013 by Barzarel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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