Playing TOR with joint problems

[thecoffeecup]

Anyone have any experience managing to play despite having joint pain? I managed to get delightful stabbing pains in all fingers at once on both hands (exclusively finger pain, no wrist pain, no carpal tunnel either). Clearly I am about as much at risk as you can get as I am a software developer who likes gaming. At this point I am past the resting stage and trying to get back to where I was, and trying to figure out if this game is even playable anymore without provoking further injury.

 

Things I have done / am doing to avoid injury:

 

1. Hand stretches.

2. Lifestyle: more exercise and a better diet.

3. Frequent breaks.

4. Foot pedals to replace some of the mouse clicking.

5. Keeping wrists straight while using the computer.

6. A keyboard with low resistance mechanical keys (I use Cherry MX Reds but there are other good types).

7. Programmed some buttons on keyboard to handle things like shift-1 in one button (no, no automation or multiple actions per key press!). I just want to avoid twisting my hand while playing.

 

It would be nice to hear if others have any experiences or ideas to play with minimal risk of injury.

 

Oh, and if you're like me a year ago and you think you're immune to this kind of thing, think again. I have used computers quite heavily for many years with no indication of any kind of problem. All of a sudden, massive pain just came out of nowhere. It really creeps up on you and I can only hope that people are becoming more aware of the dangers of computer use. I sure wasn't.

 

I guess while I am in preachy mode I would also urge people to be careful in your choice of doctors. I was initally told to not move my hands even a little and later to take NSAIDs in spite of the fact that there was no inflammation. It actually got worse and my hands felt very cold. I then switched to physical therapy that focused on improving circulation and doing stretches and my condition improved almost instantly. That said, it took a month to get to use a keyboard again.

Edited July 31, 2013 by thecoffeecup

[AlrikFassbauer]

Apart from hand stretching, you should consider arm stretching, too.

 

Because I believe to have read that nerves are going through the elbows - and that at an later age they might get "squeezed" a little bit there, because there's not moch space left for them between tissue and bone.

Edited July 31, 2013 by AlrikFassbauer

[OddballEasyEight]

I got pains in my wrist from plaing on a "regular" keyboard that i had in my lap whilst sitting in the sofa.

I switched to using a G13 Advanced Gameboard from Logitech which i have perched on the sofa armrest, and now the pains are gone.

It took a while to set things up exactly right and then a while longer to get used to it, but im pretty good with it now. I only switch back to regular keyboard when recording since my musclememory is still best on that and when i record i turn off all the GUI.

[AlexDougherty]

Not had any pains from the Keyboard or mouse, but used to get pains in my hands from console controllers, those were bad, and still get pains when doing a lot of writing, fingers, thumbs and wrists, god I hate writing.

[Dallayna]

Actually, I've had hand problems for years and it sounds like you really do have have two problems going on. 1) Over use and 2) bad key combinations.

 

Now, let me explain before you start yelling: "BUT I DID THAT" at the screen because it sounds like yes, you have but that you haven't tried the solutions quite right (not surprising most doctors are idiots when it comes to chronic pain).

 

First off, by breaks, I'm assuming that you mean a few minutes every hour or so- that's what they recommend after all, problem there is that, as I've found, that never works. In fact, I honestly have less than zero idea why they keep pushing that tripe because that only prevents getting to where we are and does nothing once you get there. Because it's like telling someone with a sprained ankle that they're fine to go running so long as they sit down for a minute or two every half a mile- it's just too little too late.

 

Try a couple of days off curled up with a heating pad and an ice pack. Alternate between the two and none in half hour shifts. Half an hour with heat, half an hour with nothing, half an hour with cold, half an hour with nothing.... rinse and repeat. Just like a sprain (which is essentially what your joints are experiencing), the warmth should ease up the pain and keep you mobile and the cold will reduce swelling. You also might want to look into some icy-hot/tiger balm- anything with menthol, camphor or capsaicin- (again warmth is your goal) for when you're at work. Also, while at work and typing slow down a bit- just for a little while.

 

Naproxen Sodium (aleeve) or ibuprofen helps as well.

 

Now, as to hotbuttons. Believe it or not, but, you actually want to configure your keyboard so that you are doing two key combinations. I know, but it's true. The trick, you see is configuring it so that you are pressing two keys with different hands at the same time and NOT different FINGERS. I also have configured my buttons so that all powers that I use at the same time are gathered together on my keypad so that my fingers don't have to stretch that far at all in order to fight.

 

Here's my configuration:

Quick Bar 1: (keypad only) 1,2,...

Quick Bar 2: (Keypad and Ctrl key): Ctrl 1, Ctrl 2,....

Quick Bar 3: (Keypad and Alt key): Alt 1, Alt 2, ....

 

Get the idea?

 

This works for my pain at least because my right hand is dominant and ironically the least used for typing, so it gets most of the work. By all being in the same location, I really only use my first three fingers (sometimes thumb) just moving my hand up and down the keypad as needed leaving my weak and achy pinky out of the picture entirely. (When I'm feeling okay at least, when I'm not, I just use my index finger and move my arm). It's even less work for my left as it only moves and depresses only a single button at a time. No stretching, no weird moves and no bizarre dives for keys.

 

Now, obviously this means that where you group your powers is very important and I do have to admit that I have to reconfigure that sometimes as I gain new powers and my tactics change but when I have to do that, I usually go down to a low leveled planet and practice out the new configuration there where I can take my time and don't have to worry.

 

Anyway. That's what I do. Maybe it'll help you as well. Good Luck.

 

Oh! and, now that I'm thinking about it. If treating your hands like a sprain does absolutely nothing or very little, you might want to have your neck and upper back looked at because, believe it or not but a really bad neck caused over time can cause the same symptoms because the swelling in the neck and shoulders can depress the nerves that run the length of your arm and into your fingertips so, if anything's causing problems in that area, that's where you'll feel it. Try some neck stretching exercises as well and see if they feel really really tight because if it does, you may have to treat that area as well.

Edited July 31, 2013 by Dallayna

[thecoffeecup]

Wow, thanks, that's quite the answer

 

I actually barely played so far, so my breaks from the keyboard are 98% of my free time. I plan to only very, very gradually reintroduce games if I can and never let it cause any pain. With work, however, there is no such luxury.

 

I very much agree with how you map powers. In fact, that's how I've been doing it. Pressing the combinations with one hand is torture, but using two never really occurred to me because I always played with one hand on the keyboard and the other permanently attached to the mouse.

 

The footpedals are brilliant, by the way, but I use them very carefully, mostly for surfing.

 

Ibuprofen unfortunately does not work for me except for making my stomach ache. I would guess it's because there's no swelling, no inflammation. This isn't really the place for medical stories, but I'll keep it short and just say that I have a 1 year history of having crippling, unexplained joint problems in different areas, just not until recently in my hands. Many doctors have given up trying to explain it already, and they've taken so many blood tests I'm like a human pin cushion by now

 

Haven't tried switching between heating and icing. Will do so.

 

As for arm stretching and back stretches. Yes, I've been doing that and it has helped a bit.

 

Thanks again.

Edited July 31, 2013 by thecoffeecup

[Dallayna]

Wow, thanks, that's quite the answer

 

I actually barely played so far, so my breaks from the keyboard are 98% of my free time. I plan to only very, very gradually reintroduce games if I can and never let it cause any pain. With work, however, there is no such luxury.

 

I very much agree with how you map powers. In fact, that's how I've been doing it. Pressing the combinations with one hand is torture, but using two never really occurred to me because I always played with one hand on the keyboard and the other permanently attached to the mouse.

 

The footpedals are brilliant, by the way, but I use them very carefully, mostly for surfing.

 

Ibuprofen unfortunately does not work for me except for making my stomach ache. I would guess it's because there's no swelling, no inflammation. This isn't really the place for medical stories, but I'll keep it short and just say that I have a 1 year history of having crippling, unexplained joint problems in different areas, just not until recently in my hands. Many doctors have given up trying to explain it already, and they've taken so many blood tests I'm like a human pin cushion by now

 

Haven't tried switching between heating and icing. Will do so.

 

As for arm stretching and back stretches. Yes, I've been doing that and it has helped a bit.

 

Thanks again.

 

No problem. I know that one too. LOL. My favorite is what I call the "Surgeon Shuffle"- which is that Doctor that goes: "oh you have hand pain? Here, go to the surgeon" and of course, the surgeon just blinks at you: "Why are you here again?"

 

Anyway, Aleeve may help then. Granted, it doesn't get rid of the pain completely but it does reduce it for me. As for "running" around and general fighting, I actually find myself with far less pain if I don't bother with the mouse for anything other then AoE's, quick travels, NPC interaction and my mounts actually.

 

I use the arrow keys to move/run and Tab to target so, when fighting, I only touch the mouse when I'm about to drop an AoE- otherwise, it's all keyboard.

 

Toggle Autorun is also very nice for those long hauls because I hit my toggle Autorun button and just direct the movement with two arrows which needs much less work and more relaxed movement on my part. (Hot keying something easy to Target Team Member 1 and another key to Follow Target is also a nice combination when teaming with people who understand the problem because it saves my hands for just the battles instead of "wasting" them on travel).

 

Now, granted, this means that I have to move my right hand to switch from the arrows to the number pad and hit Tab with my left to target an enemy when fighting but really, I haven't noticed any difference from the default of mouse and ASWD as far as speed is concerned and a great deal as far as comfort. 1) I'm not hunched over the desk all the time (I can lean back and stretch a little while actually moving during long jaunts across planets because I really only need one or two fingers of one hand even when turning) and 2) I'm actually doing far move movement with my arms than my fingers.

 

I do hope that even a little bit might be helpful to you just don't give up hope and keep trying different things until you get something that can work for you. Good luck!

Edited July 31, 2013 by Dallayna

[MuratReis]

I use to to play the classical guitar multiple hours everyday. I started trying to develop a strong right hand technique like my favorite guitarist David Russell. I did things my hand was not strong enough for -- things that should not have been done on my instrument. One day, my knuckles swelled up. The only solution was to rest a long time and then start over and take it slow -- the strength of my hand determined my rate of progress, not my technical ability. I also bought a real classical guitar that didn't require so much force to get a good sound. I cut down my practice time (no more than an hour), as well, and never play if my knuckles feel sore. My advice is: (1) keep your hands in good physical shape (stretching and warm ups) ; (2) don't ask it to do things it's not ready for; (3) take breaks; (4) use good equipment; (5) understand exactly how your joints relate to each other and the rest of your body. I highly recommend seeing a specialist if you can. Hope it gets better soon. Edited August 1, 2013 by MuratReis

[OddballEasyEight]

Wow, thanks, that's quite the answer

 

I actually barely played so far, so my breaks from the keyboard are 98% of my free time. I plan to only very, very gradually reintroduce games if I can and never let it cause any pain. With work, however, there is no such luxury.

 

I very much agree with how you map powers. In fact, that's how I've been doing it. Pressing the combinations with one hand is torture, but using two never really occurred to me because I always played with one hand on the keyboard and the other permanently attached to the mouse.

 

The footpedals are brilliant, by the way, but I use them very carefully, mostly for surfing.

 

Ibuprofen unfortunately does not work for me except for making my stomach ache. I would guess it's because there's no swelling, no inflammation. This isn't really the place for medical stories, but I'll keep it short and just say that I have a 1 year history of having crippling, unexplained joint problems in different areas, just not until recently in my hands. Many doctors have given up trying to explain it already, and they've taken so many blood tests I'm like a human pin cushion by now

 

Haven't tried switching between heating and icing. Will do so.

 

As for arm stretching and back stretches. Yes, I've been doing that and it has helped a bit.

 

Thanks again.

 

I imagine this would be a godsend for you then:

 

http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-mice/razer-naga

[thecoffeecup]

Thanks for the advice. As for the Naga, I actually have the 2012 version of that and loved it for TOR. Unfortunately my thumb too is affected so the thumb buttons don't save me. It does seem like the button are easier to find without looking on the new model.

 

The soft mechanical keys on my new keyboard definitely help. Unfortunately I fear I've developed yet another new expensive taste for luxury equipment there

 

I had also heard that many musicians do indeed suffer from joint problems due to countless hours of practice. Human hands weren't really meant to play the guitar all day.

 

As for breaks and exercises, yeah, doing it. General exercise also helps, I've noticed. Circulation seems to be a key element of recovery. Actually I think this taught me exactly why it's important to get up from your computer regularly. A painful lesson, but probably a good one.

 

PS: I wish we could just get mechanical hands already. A bit of oil once in a while and you're good to go.

Edited August 1, 2013 by thecoffeecup

[Dallayna]

PS: I wish we could just get mechanical hands already. A bit of oil once in a while and you're good to go.

 

I know what you mean! In fact, I just went through a have to take a break night myself which reminded me that, even when you're not feeling the greatest- as long as you're not totally crippled up, there are still things you can do on MMO's. For example, last night, my hands were okay for some activity but my fingers just were not up to actually fighting so, I just made it a crafting night- which I have actually found to be very useful in the long run because the in-built breaks makes it about like light surfing but with the added bonus of making tons of credits for my characters as a side-effect.

 

Net Result is that I've got countless armors, crystals, pets, bikes and weapons in my collections and all of the crew skills on my 50+'s are set up so that the second I roll a character, they're set from level 11 - 55 with almost everything they need which ultimately means less time grinding. Macrobinocular and Seeker Droid missions or just digging is also good too for those nights- it's slow and mellow and keeps me sane because I'm still gaming but my fingers aren't getting nearly the workout that they do when I'm leveling or running FPs etc, etc, etc.

 

So, look at it this way- we may not be leveling but we're at least making bank enough to pay for all the nifty looking stuff we could possibly want!!!!