spectreclees Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Nope. A dps guardian has as much right to a piece of strength dps gear as does a sent. The mods are what counts, not the shell. This is correct. The stats on the gear are what matters, not what type of armor it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icestar Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) This is correct. The stats on the gear are what matters, not what type of armor it is. It follows the same principle that you do not need healer gear or tank gear as dps or any way around. If there is a marauder in the group and a juggernaut takes the dps medium gear the marauder has every right to votekick and in most cases I have seen the juggernaut get booted. Edited July 9, 2013 by Icestar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratajack Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Nope. A dps guardian has as much right to a piece of strength dps gear as does a sent. The mods are what counts, not the shell. Would you be ok with a sentinel rolling need on DPS strength HEAVY armor that would be an upgrade for the DPS guardian? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuruVII Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) Yes (as long as it was an upgrade for the sentinel as well of course)... since he can strip the mods out and put it into a shell he can use. It is the stats that matter, not the armour type... needing on gear that doesn't have mods... that of course if a different story. Why is that so hard to understand? Edited July 9, 2013 by GuruVII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackavaar Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) Would you be ok with a sentinel rolling need on DPS strength HEAVY armor that would be an upgrade for the DPS guardian? If there was a DPS Guardian in the group, no. At least not without asking permission of said Guardian. Edited July 9, 2013 by Blackavaar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hchsiao Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) How can people think it is right to roll need base on mod instead the overall item? It is like saying dps shadow can roll need on sage healing gear because armoring and mod are upgrade to the shadow. Edited July 9, 2013 by hchsiao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagilante Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 How can people think it is right to roll need base on mod instead the overall item? It is like saying dps shadow can roll need on sage healing gear because armoring and mod are upgrade to the shadow. This is a terrible analogy. DPS shadows and Sages already roll on the same gear and don't use the same stats as healers. DPS Guardians and Sentinels do and can use each other's mods if they have an available shell. In fact, most of the armorings DPS Guardians want comes from medium shells since they are the ones with the higher STR stat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackavaar Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 This is a terrible analogy. DPS shadows and Sages already roll on the same gear and don't use the same stats as healers. DPS Guardians and Sentinels do and can use each other's mods if they have an available shell. In fact, most of the armorings DPS Guardians want comes from medium shells since they are the ones with the higher STR stat. That doesn't mean that they cannot still be courteous and ask first if there is a Sentinel in the group. I'm sorry, but a DPS Guardian (whom also quite often queue as a Tank role, BTW) who rolls Need on Sentinel gear when there is a Sentinel in the group and doesn't ask first still gets the vote kick in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagilante Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Then you are just being whiny. If the Guard can make just as much use from it (ie All modification slots are an upgrade) then there is no reason he shouldn't be able to roll on it. BW made our gear this customizable for a reason and I wouldn't let some punk who didn't understand mods to guilt me out of an upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackavaar Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Then you are just being whiny. If the Guard can make just as much use from it (ie All modification slots are an upgrade) then there is no reason he shouldn't be able to roll on it. BW made our gear this customizable for a reason and I wouldn't let some punk who didn't understand mods to guilt me out of an upgrade. I said he can roll on it if he asks. What? Do you have a problem with being polite and considerate of other people? Then I think the problem is yours, bud. Learn some manners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagilante Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 If it's an upgrade there is no need to ask. You seem to think it's rude to roll on upgrades for some reason. I don't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackavaar Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 If it's an upgrade there is no need to ask. You seem to think it's rude to roll on upgrades for some reason. I don't get it. If there is a Sentinel in the group that can put on that armor and use it immediately, it is rude for the DPS Guardian (who is in the Tank role usually) to roll Need on it without asking considering that he will have to rip out the mods and put them into something else, which usually means he won't be using it right away. To ask is to be polite, but go ahead and be a self entitled jerk and just roll Need if you want. Just don't be surprised when you get vote kicked from the group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuangTzu Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Would you be ok with a sentinel rolling need on DPS strength HEAVY armor that would be an upgrade for the DPS guardian? Yes, as long as it is an upgrade for that toon. It's about the mods which are the same for guardian and sent for DPS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuangTzu Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 If there is a Sentinel in the group that can put on that armor and use it immediately, it is rude for the DPS Guardian (who is in the Tank role usually) to roll Need on it without asking considering that he will have to rip out the mods and put them into something else, which usually means he won't be using it right away. To ask is to be polite, but go ahead and be a self entitled jerk and just roll Need if you want. Just don't be surprised when you get vote kicked from the group. Rolf. I will switch out mods mid flashpoint barely takes anytime at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OKandrew Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Vote to Kick was literally made for people like this guy... I <3 it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayseven Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well, if you think it's right and the other 3 people think it's wrong...you're gonna get kicked. It doesn't matter that you think it's okay for a Sent to need on a Guardian piece for the mods, if the people you are running with don't agree...buh-bye. That's why people are telling you to use common courtesy and ask. If you can't be bothered to use simple courtesy, don't be surprised to find yourself removed from the group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuangTzu Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well, if you think it's right and the other 3 people think it's wrong...you're gonna get kicked. It doesn't matter that you think it's okay for a Sent to need on a Guardian piece for the mods, if the people you are running with don't agree...buh-bye. That's why people are telling you to use common courtesy and ask. If you can't be bothered to use simple courtesy, don't be surprised to find yourself removed from the group. If they are like that then I would not want to run with them. There is nothing wrong with some1 rolling for an item that it an upgrade for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) was in a flashpoint and one the roll on a pair of purple pants well the group got pissed because of it and decided to kick me *** do they even have that option for thats retarded im so mad because i sit in thee dang que for almost and hour and a half and then this happens because people are cry babies when they lose a roll about retarded if u ask me. saying i dont need them because im level 55 well by that means i should go in and not roll on anything i guess do flashpoints for everyone so they can get rich and me just help outta the goodness of my heart bull freaking crap First Rule in running in a random group in an MMO: Spend 60 seconds to discuss and agree on loot rules before you kill the first mob. If the whole group is "dain bramaged" then spend 120 seconds and talk sloooooowly together and use flashcards if necessary. Second Rule in running in a random group in an MMO: don't break what was agreed to via rule one at the start. If you can't live with what is majority agreed to.. then politely take your toys elsewhere and save everyone the grief. Third Rule in running in a random group: follow rules one and two without wavering. Next time.. save them the trouble and just vote kick yourself, IMO. Edited July 9, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuangTzu Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 First Rule in running in a random group in an MMO: Spend 60 seconds to discuss and agree on loot rules before you kill the first mob. If the whole group is "dain bramaged" then spend 120 seconds and talk sloooooowly together and use flashcards if necessary. Second Rule in running in a random group in an MMO: don't break what was agreed to via rule one at the start. If you can't live with what is majority agreed to.. then politely take your toys elsewhere and save everyone the grief. Third Rule in running in a random group: follow rules one and two without wavering. Next time.. save them the trouble and just vote kick yourself, IMO. Good suggestions but I've never seen that happen. In lvl 55 PUG runs most ppl just want the GF daily and or weekly. So usually there is little sitting around and talking before during and after. Although I would be interested to hear ur view on the sent/guard DPS gear debate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayseven Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 If they are like that then I would not want to run with them. There is nothing wrong with some1 rolling for an item that it an upgrade for them. That's what you believe. Others believe that rolling need on something off class when it is an upgrade for someones AC is wrong, regardless of whether or not the mods are an upgrade. If you don't want to be kicked, be nice. If you don't want to be nice, expect to get kicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) Although I would be interested to hear ur view on the sent/guard DPS gear debate? If it's clearly DPS gear, then on calculus alone.. it's open to either the Sent or the Guardian, because let's face it.. the value rests in the mods, not the skins these days. There should also be a fairness scheme.. so if a second dps item drops... it goes to the party that lost the roll on the first one... and rinse and repeat if needed before the group finishes. But this is something that should be discussed and resolved before the first pull. That said... if the players can't be bothered to discus need rolls for loot before starting.. they all deserve the conflict that results. Personally, I also don't run in PUGs.. because people for the most part don't give a rats blow hole about the other players. I run in guild groups, and sometimes we backfill a spot with a non-guild member. And when we do.. we discuss loot before the first pull, and we don't play guild favoritism when we do. Edited July 9, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuangTzu Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 That's what you believe. Others believe that rolling need on something off class when it is an upgrade for someones AC is wrong, regardless of whether or not the mods are an upgrade. If you don't want to be kicked, be nice. If you don't want to be nice, expect to get kicked. The mods are the same, so it is an upgrade for their AC. The shell is meaningless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayseven Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 The mods are the same, so it is an upgrade for their AC. The shell is meaningless. To you. Others believe different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 (edited) To you. Others believe different. A convenient belief, but incorrect. IF, for some reason a shell is important.. that should be discussed before the first pull. Loot tables are pretty well known for instances these days, so if a shell is important...discuss it in advance. How hard is it for the group to agree and declare that shells apply for the run? Really? How hard is that? Personally, I feel in todays game, people are pretending shells are important.. as an excuse to get preference for the mods they contain. Edited July 9, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuangTzu Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 A convenient belief, but incorrect. IF, for some reason a shell is important.. that should be discussed before the first pull. Loot tables are pretty well known for instances these days, so if a shell is important...discuss it in advance. How hard is it for the group to agree and declare that shells apply for the run? Really? How hard is that? Personally, I feel in todays game, people are pretending shells are important.. as an excuse to get preference for the mods they contain. If Andryah says so it must be right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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