Thaed Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 No combat add-ons are required. The worst add-on ever developed for WoW was gear checker. Some players actually are skilled enough to be able to function quite highly without a specific number attached that is mandatory to play. It was bs in that game and it would be bs here. Any macros allowing casts are also unnecessary. Work for an advantage over your opponent by skill and not by having code execute your moves more quickly for you. DON'T DO IT BIOWARE. THE CASUALS WILL REVOLT. Actually, a certain level of gear was required to raid in order to be capable of producing enough dps/heals and withstanding enough damage, regardless of skill. Not the level of gear that anti-gearscore people complained that raiders wanted them to achieve, though I never ran into any of the problems they complained about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massamo Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 can do macros now with some keyboards and mouses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hages Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 No add-ons ,not a second wow. You can play this game perfectly without add-ons. If bioware aloud them it will only lead to unbalance and to requirement of add-ons The raids are not that hard that you need them. The thing is if you allow some; you can not stop the flood anymore.and it will only lead to problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPryde Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) I'm curious if the developers have considered changing their minds on having addons. Many features people want could be quickly implemented if they allowed them. This means more bug fixing and content development time. I am not claiming, that I wouldn't use some add-on, if there were any. But could you give a few examples (like 5 minimum) of add-ons, which "people want" without using any wow-terminology please? After all adding add-on support is not an easy task, so in order for it to be a reasonable time investment, you should right now be able to tell at least 5 issues which can be solved by add-ons, that are really "wanted" by the community. If it is less than 5 add-ons who are really in demand, I can assure you, that it would be easiert to just integrate them in the UI and not open pandoras box. Edited June 4, 2013 by JPryde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaed Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) I am not claiming, that I wouldn't use some add-on, if there were any. But could you give a few examples (like 5 minimum) of add-ons, which "people want" without using any wow-terminology please? After all adding add-on support is not an easy task, so in order for it to be a reasonable time investment, you should right now be able to tell at least 5 issues which can be solved by add-ons, that are really "wanted" by the community. If it is less than 5 add-ons who are really in demand, I can assure you, that it would be easiert to just integrate them in the UI and not open pandoras box. I'll let someone else answer with more, as I'm not especially well-informed about what addons can and cannot do, but in-game dps meters, gear-swap mods and dual specs, for starters (why we still don't have proper dual specs is absolutely beyond me). If Bioware were actually adding these QoL things, I don't think the subject would have ever been brought up. Edited June 4, 2013 by Thaed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hages Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I'll let someone else answer with more, as I'm not especially well-informed about what addons can and cannot do, but in-game dps meters, gear-swap mods and dual specs, for starters (why we still don't have proper dual specs is absolutely beyond me). If Bioware were actually adding these QoL things, I don't think the subject would have ever been brought up. They do have those things already in Some form. Dps meter = Nox gear swap mods. Not really sure what you mean by that? You mean switching from dps to healer or what for example? Dual spec = U get a free respec. that is in my eyes the same. it just takes a little bit more time but the result is the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modernpreacher Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 You don't NEED addons for WoW. You install the ones to assist in making game play a bit easier for you. They're almost always quality of life improvements. Some I wouldn't mind seeing for SWTOR would be a debuff tracker, a more robust visual or audio queues for dots and procs. A basic macro system to allow nonscript text like /dance to be tied to a button. I could add more, but those are just a couple of the ones I think would greatly improve the quality of life of the game for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaed Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) They do have those things already in Some form. Dps meter = Nox gear swap mods. Not really sure what you mean by that? You mean switching from dps to healer or what for example? Dual spec = U get a free respec. that is in my eyes the same. it just takes a little bit more time but the result is the same. Am I able to use Nox in game, the same way I was able to use Skada/DPS Meters in WoW? (serious question, because if I can I'll be downloading it). Gear swap = a button you press to equip a different set of gear, which goes hand-in-in hand with dual spec. And dual spec = a button you press to change to a pre-determined alternate specialisation, which also saves your quick-bar setups. Do we need those things? No, not at all. They'd certainly be nice, though. edit: Oh, and having a mod that showed which debuffs were mine on a boss would immensely increase my raiding experience. Edited June 4, 2013 by Thaed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvers Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 A lot of hate towards Addons, and I get it. It can, or should I say does cause issues when not used in a rational manner. I like addons, it gives me the ability to effectively measure my output with what I'm doing. It gives me details to work with to try and improve my effectiveness. I do not use it to pour negativity onto other players, I do not use them to be an elitist prat, I'm far from the top of the food chain in regards to 'top players'. I do agree with what others here have said, addons are not required to play swtor. Addons are tools, an aid. It can aid in identifying someone who may need a little help in regards to gearing or ability rotations. Those tools are good for the likes of guilds that are working on endgame content. They can try different builds, measure their effectiveness and actually have data they can use to make informed changes. It can aid in identifying someone who may need a little help in regards to gearing or ability rotations and their outputs. This is very helpful when you are trying to push through endgame content. The manner in which the player is approached is what is important here, not the actual addon itself. Without specific data, making effective and informed decisions is difficult at best. Our raid team uses one which has so far created some healthy competitiveness. This link will take anyone interested in the addon to it: http://memoriesofxendor.com/parser/desktop/ I'm not the perfect player, I'm not a number crunching theorycrafter. I'm just a gamer that enjoys swtor. The people that raid in my guild have lives outside of gaming, we use this stuff to help make the most of our time, in a positive way. If you don't like addons, that is your choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BewBo Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Bad idea! I remember the add-on snobbery of WoW. "What do you mean you don't have that add-on?! How can you possibly play without it?!". Leave all that **** out of SWTOR!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hages Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Am I able to use Nox in game, the same way I was able to use Skada/DPS Meters in WoW? (serious question, because if I can I'll be downloading it). Gear swap = a button you press to equip a different set of gear, which goes hand-in-in hand with dual spec. And dual spec = a button you press to change to a pre-determined alternate specialisation, which also saves your quick-bar setups. Do we need those things? No, not at all. They'd certainly be nice, though. edit: Oh, and having a mod that showed which debuffs were mine on a boss would immensely increase my raiding experience. Well i do not know skade so i can not help you with it. But what Nox does is saving youre dps in a file that will appear in youre combat log map. I agree that a button to swap gear and spec would be great. But those things should be already be in the game. The danger is that to many add ons will take all the challenge out of the game. raid boss warnings for example. people forget to be focust on boss fights. because youre computer screen give you a warning what will come.srry but that is not fun. and people complaining about dots. If a players looses health fast, you know theire is something wrong. Mostly dots. I have made my Ui so that it is alot bigger then normal so i can see it good. and players can also just call out if they need a cleanse. No big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfrost Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 So is youre comment..truly If you can only give answers like that. You can better do not commend at all. yes, you right. Maybe i stop commenting here. This war against addon's now realy boring, bcs oponents didnt understand things behind addon's development. If i remember correctly, works on API was announced on first guild counsil. And still no news, only endless cartel packs and recoloring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfrost Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 They do have those things already in Some form. Dps meter = Nox gear swap mods. Not really sure what you mean by that? You mean switching from dps to healer or what for example? Dual spec = U get a free respec. that is in my eyes the same. it just takes a little bit more time but the result is the same. Free respec != dual spec. Why i need to waste my time on useless action when i try to heal my dps sage? So, i don't heal at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvers Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) ...But what Nox does is saving youre dps in a file that will appear in youre combat log map. What is this Nox you are referring to? Are you and the other person here referring to MOX? If not can you please provide a link to Nox? Thanks. Edited June 4, 2013 by Silvers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaed Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Well i do not know skade so i can not help you with it. But what Nox does is saving youre dps in a file that will appear in youre combat log map. I agree that a button to swap gear and spec would be great. But those things should be already be in the game. The danger is that to many add ons will take all the challenge out of the game. raid boss warnings for example. people forget to be focust on boss fights. because youre computer screen give you a warning what will come.srry but that is not fun. and people complaining about dots. If a players looses health fast, you know theire is something wrong. Mostly dots. I have made my Ui so that it is alot bigger then normal so i can see it good. and players can also just call out if they need a cleanse. No big deal. re: debuffs, I mean the ones that are actually mine on the boss. As a Leth sniper, if there's another Leth sniper in the group, it can become confusing as to who's DoTs are who's, unless I were to stare at the debuffs and closely watch which ones were mine (which isn't terribly fun). In terms of boss-warnings, if you don't like them, you don't have to download them. I never did in WoW and was always able to avoid avoidable mechanics based on audio/visual queues already in the game. The only thing DBM did, so far as I'm aware, was make things more obvious/give more of a heads-up. Nox sounds like more effort than I'm willing to put in. I'd really just like an in-game, easy to read dps meter that updates on the fly. And dual spec/gear swap are things that absolutely should be in the game, but Bioware, for whatever reason, clearly doesn't have the time. However, if they'd opened up the game to the modding community from the get go, this wouldn't be an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hages Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 What is this Nox you are referring to? Are you and the other person here referring to MOX? If not can you please provide a link to Nox? Thanks. Srry it was Mox here is the link. http://memoriesofxendor.com/parser/desktop/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvers Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Srry it was Mox here is the link. http://memoriesofxendor.com/parser/desktop/index.html Thanks, that is what we're using. Once setup, easy as to use for both solo and group play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hages Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Free respec != dual spec. Why i need to waste my time on useless action when i try to heal my dps sage? So, i don't heal at all. All it takes is 5 min... field respec arrage youre skills and done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfrost Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 All it takes is 5 min... field respec arrage youre skills and done. again and again, 5 min. i didn't have extra 5 min for stupid actions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elear Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Any macros allowing casts are also unnecessary. Work for an advantage over your opponent by skill and not by having code execute your moves more quickly for you. This is reason why neither addons or macros can't be allowed to run free. If it would allow to increase one's performance, it would be used by most people, providing advantage over anyone not using it, altering gameplay for everyone. And since those addons would not be made by BW, they would lose control over their own game. Now, it doesn't mean no QoL features like some mentioned in this thread will ever appear. It only means that if they ever do, it'll be done by BW, not as addon. It also means it won't happen fast, because amount of things BW can do at once is limited, but there is no alternative, enabling addons to do anything also takes work, much much more work than doing it yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hages Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 re: debuffs, I mean the ones that are actually mine on the boss. As a Leth sniper, if there's another Leth sniper in the group, it can become confusing as to who's DoTs are who's, unless I were to stare at the debuffs and closely watch which ones were mine (which isn't terribly fun). well i agree that can be confusing and it would be nice if they did domething about that in the game.But what I do is follow my rotation then normaly i know when mine run out.But i agree with you about this one In terms of boss-warnings, if you don't like them, you don't have to download them. I never did in WoW and was always able to avoid avoidable mechanics based on audio/visual queues already in the game. The only thing DBM did, so far as I'm aware, was make things more obvious/give more of a heads-up. The thing is that once it is out their. guild,raids will say that you will need it to be able to raid. You can say no that will not happen.But i tell you it will. why? alot of people want a fast smooth raid without wipes. All add ones will be require then. Nox sounds like more effort than I'm willing to put in. I'd really just like an in-game, easy to read dps meter that updates on the fly. I am srry but a dps meter is a dps meter.You want one. You have one already... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPryde Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 5 minutes ?? I manage to switch my skills in between pulls of my trigger happy guild-maintank. I admit, that it would be nice to save certain skillsets (even wrote that as a legacy suggestion months ago), but I do not see any need for add-ons for this. Dual Spec should be part of the game, not done by players. So far I haven't seen an ammount of "add-on-needed" which makes the API-development more reasonable than just adding the needed functionality to the in game UI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaed Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 5 minutes ?? I manage to switch my skills in between pulls of my trigger happy guild-maintank. I admit, that it would be nice to save certain skillsets (even wrote that as a legacy suggestion months ago), but I do not see any need for add-ons for this. Dual Spec should be part of the game, not done by players. So far I haven't seen an ammount of "add-on-needed" which makes the API-development more reasonable than just adding the needed functionality to the in game UI. That's the thing about add-ons though, they aren't needed. I don't know much about API, though Carbine seems pretty happy that they've opened up their game for addons, with the pro's outweighing the cons (full quote on previous page), in addition to their own productivity doubling. Again, this wouldn't be an issue at all if Bioware was capable of providing us with these QoL updates, but they're obviously not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vfrost Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I am srry but a dps meter is a dps meter.You want one. You have one already... we don't have one. MOX is a monument to bioware developers lazynes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hages Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 we don't have one. MOX is a monument to bioware developers lazynes. okay what kind of dps mter would u like to have one. the top 5 of youre uber dps... Not showing that u stood in red circles 10 times.... That you keep on nuking elites mobs wen the normal mobs are killing the healer. Those situations will be commen if they will allow this... I been theire on wow. never again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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