No hope for Dirty Fighting?

[eventidephoenix]

I have been talking to guildies as parsing Dirty Fighting and it seems to output very poor damage these days.

 

One problem I faced is that I cannot use Quickdraw on proc because I don't have the set bonus. If I am able to weave quickdraw into my rotation on cooldown always, will that help buff it up a little?

 

My current rotation on DF is

 

flourish -> Both Dots applied -> Hemorrhaging blast -> wounding shots -> Speed shot -> aimed shot -> quickdraw -> wounding

 

I feel I am doing something wrong here, and I am open to suggestions. Flyby to replace aimed shot when it coolsdown of course

 

 

 

But all in all should I just dump the spec and head on to Sharpshooter already? I get laughed at when I insist I like Dirty Fighting but I really like the spec a lot. Everyone claims that it is dead and uncompetitive =\

[bryceman]

I have been talking to guildies as parsing Dirty Fighting and it seems to output very poor damage these days.

 

One problem I faced is that I cannot use Quickdraw on proc because I don't have the set bonus. If I am able to weave quickdraw into my rotation on cooldown always, will that help buff it up a little?

 

My current rotation on DF is

 

flourish -> Both Dots applied -> Hemorrhaging blast -> wounding shots -> Speed shot -> aimed shot -> quickdraw -> wounding

 

I feel I am doing something wrong here, and I am open to suggestions. Flyby to replace aimed shot when it coolsdown of course

 

 

 

But all in all should I just dump the spec and head on to Sharpshooter already? I get laughed at when I insist I like Dirty Fighting but I really like the spec a lot. Everyone claims that it is dead and uncompetitive =\

 

I think the DF hype is over now in 2.0. The higher parsing gunslingers in my guild use either the hybrid spec with 3 dots, full SS, or Sab. Sab is especially good on large bosses with high hitboxes.

[VigDiath]

I dropped DF for full Sab (a few points in other trees) and have not wanted to go back. It performs well in PvP and in PvE. Great DoTs, Burst and consistent damage.

[namesaretough]

Until you get your 4pc bonus DF does lag behind the other specs. Quickdraw is huge for the spec. Until you can get that, I actually do recommend speccing SS, or the DF/Sab hybrid (if you like the dot-dot-dot-wounding playstyle). Once you do get the set bonus, your rotation is going to go

Shrap bomb->vital shot->hemo blast->wounding shots->quickdraw->speed shot->1GCD filler (sab charge, flourish shot, flurry of bolts)->wounding shot->quickdraw, and then back to the dots and repeat.

 

As long as you can quickdraw every proc, you'll do competitive damage to sharpshooter (especially if they only have 3 or 4 ticks on their flyby) and sab (if they can't land more than 2 bombs on the target) in gear the same level as you. I still find that I do more damage as the DF/sab hybrid than I do full DF, but that's mostly because I use a 2pc pvp bonus instead of keeping the 4pc pve bonus when I swap to the hybrid.

 

In short, you'll struggle to compete damage-wise until you get your 4pc, but after that you'll be just fine.

Edited May 21, 2013 by namesaretough

[eventidephoenix]

Until you get your 4pc bonus DF does lag behind the other specs. Quickdraw is huge for the spec. Until you can get that, I actually do recommend speccing SS, or the DF/Sab hybrid (if you like the dot-dot-dot-wounding playstyle). Once you do get the set bonus, your rotation is going to go

Shrap bomb->vital shot->hemo blast->wounding shots->quickdraw->speed shot->1GCD filler (sab charge, flourish shot, flurry of bolts)->wounding shot->quickdraw, and then back to the dots and repeat.

 

As long as you can quickdraw every proc, you'll do competitive damage to sharpshooter (especially if they only have 3 or 4 ticks on their flyby) and sab (if they can't land more than 2 bombs on the target) in gear the same level as you. I still find that I do more damage as the DF/sab hybrid than I do full DF, but that's mostly because I use a 2pc pvp bonus instead of keeping the 4pc pve bonus when I swap to the hybrid.

 

In short, you'll struggle to compete damage-wise until you get your 4pc, but after that you'll be just fine.

 

That was something I suspected as well, 4 pieces aren't easy to get these days...

 

I've done a few tests, with my gear and payload, full DF gets me 2200 DPS tops, and Hybrid gets me 2350 DPS. For unsustainable rotations, DF gets me to 2300 DPS tops, and this only lasts for at most 1 minute.

 

I guess this is still viable for end-game but it would be nice to have more still =\

 

Thanks for the help, will report back again when 4 pieces of set bonus are finally obtained!

[eventidephoenix]

sorry to post again, have some questions for the more experienced guys

 

1) I read somewhere that claimed flourish shot is mostly unncessary since it doesn't help with most skills on a full DF's rotation. Is this true?

 

2) if 1) were true, then illegal mods is solely for energy regen?

 

Thanks!

[namesaretough]

1) Flourish is certainly less important for DF than it is for the other specs, but speed shot, takedown, flyby, sab charge, aimed shot and charged burst (if you ever use them) and 1/3 of wounding shot are all mitigated by armor, so it's still a dps increase to keep it up, as long as you aren't disrupting your rotation to do so. Plus it should be up at all times in a raid, if you don't have a guardian or gunnery commando in the group you'll have to do it for everyone else.

 

2) The ideal spot to use illegal mods for a dps gain is right before a wounding shots after applying your dots, but generally it's just an energy regen ability.

Edited May 21, 2013 by namesaretough

[Grimsblood]

1) Flourish is certainly less important for DF than it is for the other specs, but speed shot, takedown, flyby, sab charge, aimed shot and charged burst (if you ever use them) and 1/3 of wounding shot are all mitigated by armor, so it's still a dps increase to keep it up, as long as you aren't disrupting your rotation to do so. Plus it should be up at all times in a raid, if you don't have a guardian or gunnery commando in the group you'll have to do it for everyone else.

 

2) The ideal spot to use illegal mods for a dps gain is right before a wounding shots after applying your dots, but generally it's just an energy regen ability.

 

Muwahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! I get to take you to school Flyby is Elemental damage.... Internal/Elemental = not mitigated by armor. You will have a pop quiz on this tonight

[namesaretough]

Muwahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! I get to take you to school Flyby is Elemental damage.... Internal/Elemental = not mitigated by armor. You will have a pop quiz on this tonight

 

My ignorance is now known. I'm sorry it had to go down like this, if I'm unguilded when I log in I understand and no hard feelings.

[Toolzy]

Is there a link somewhere to the sab/df hybrid spec? I've been sort of rummaging around the forums and other sites. I can't seem to find one and when I do, the spec's been reset to unused points.

 

Thank you.

[bryceman]

Is there a link somewhere to the sab/df hybrid spec? I've been sort of rummaging around the forums and other sites. I can't seem to find one and when I do, the spec's been reset to unused points.

 

Thank you.

 

This is what I use on non full sab. fights:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#700bcZbIMbRoZGbbkrMRRM.3

[Toolzy]

This is what I use on non full sab. fights:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#700bcZbIMbRoZGbbkrMRRM.3

 

Thanks! What do you mean by you "use on non-full sab fights"?

[bryceman]

Thanks! What do you mean by you "use on non-full sab fights"?

The best spec to get the most overall damage is Full Sab. Your hightail it bombs and your aoe fire pit thing bring massive numbers. Also with the sabotage ability you can get back to back hightail its and a cool head every 45 seconds (or w/e the cooldown for sabotage is). For ops bosses, any boss that has a pretty large hit box like the 2nd or 3rd boss in SnV will grant higher parses than full SS or Hybrid. On humanoid bosses though it would be a little tricky to match a full SS parse unless you get real lucky with the bombs. Unlike others who will be in full sab then change to hybrid or SS for certian bosses I tend to stay in full sab just because it is a fun spec to play and even though on some bosses I parse lower than in SS I stick it out.

Edited May 24, 2013 by bryceman

[Toolzy]

The best spec to get the most overall damage is Full Sab. Your hightail it bombs and your aoe fire pit thing bring massive numbers. Also with the sabotage ability you can get back to back hightail its and a cool head every 45 seconds (or w/e the cooldown for sabotage is). For ops bosses, any boss that has a pretty large hit box like the 2nd or 3rd boss in SnV will grant higher parses than full SS or Hybrid. On humanoid bosses though it would be a little tricky to match a full SS parse unless you get real lucky with the bombs. Unlike others who will be in full sab then change to hybrid or SS for certian bosses I tend to stay in full sab just because it is a fun spec to play and even though on some bosses I parse lower than in SS I stick it out.

 

Oh I see. I'll have to try it then. I only found out that the DF spec was no longer a high DPS spec and was reading through here. I'll have to play around with both the hybrid and the full sab spec. I don't know if I'll get used to adding hightail in my rotations as I've only used it before to get away from mobs.

 

Thanks for the info!

[eventidephoenix]

Hi guys just a quick update:

 

Using the rotation I have learnt from you guys, upgrading my earpiece to Verpine MK1 and Implants to BM, a pair of set bonuses, with a nano-infused stim, I managed to see some improvement in DPS, up to about 2300 ~ 2500. However I still have issues with energy and as long as I use quickdraw on cooldown, I cannot sustain the rotation for much (that's why I can't give an exact DPS figure for now)

 

I think maybe 4 piece is absolutely essential for full DF? effectively halving quickdraw's energy cost and allowing us to use it on cooldown?

 

I'm not too sure, but I'm hanging on a little to hope. I started off with full DF when I first raised my gunslinger tons of patches ago, and I find it hard to let go

[eventidephoenix]

Hi guys,

 

4 piece set bonus is up and I can achieve about 2500 on the dummy and that's just about the maximum this spec could go. (Nanotech Stim, some 72s, full 69, no adrenals (yet ) )

 

I am pretty much satisfied, but knowing that my peers on sab can pull a LOT higher, and so can sharp shooter with the ability to change targets without too much penalty (well it depends on what kind of fight), I am forced to start learning how to do another spec.

 

I think full Sab is the way to go as my off-spec, but learning it is not easy. And I have a feeling they'd fix the all-bombs-land-on-spot thingy. If they never fix it then Sab will unequivocally be the best spec to run.

[bryceman]

Hi guys,

 

4 piece set bonus is up and I can achieve about 2500 on the dummy and that's just about the maximum this spec could go. (Nanotech Stim, some 72s, full 69, no adrenals (yet ) )

 

I am pretty much satisfied, but knowing that my peers on sab can pull a LOT higher, and so can sharp shooter with the ability to change targets without too much penalty (well it depends on what kind of fight), I am forced to start learning how to do another spec.

 

I think full Sab is the way to go as my off-spec, but learning it is not easy. And I have a feeling they'd fix the all-bombs-land-on-spot thingy. If they never fix it then Sab will unequivocally be the best spec to run.

 

Full sab is the highest dps spec I think in the game at the moment but it is only fully useful on large bosses and also bosses that like to stay still (2nd boss in SnV). I will tell you that other than full sab the next highest spec seems to still be the sab/df hybrid with sharpshooter very close behind. Regardless of these facts I play SS because it is extremely fun and has really good burst.

[eventidephoenix]

You are quite right I've tested all 3 specs

 

I do think that DF is more challenging than the hybrid now. I find energy management and target switching to be incredibly challenging. THat used to be the case for hybrid but for some odd reason not anymore now! I find it incredibly easy to keep good energy using hybrid o.o

 

I literally grew up with DF, I'm gonna stick with my inferior DPS for a bit... see how things go