This magic 24% crit i keep reading about

[CIhe]

This might have been answered somewhere else but i can't seem to find it.

 

I keep reading in a bunch of threads that Anni Marauders hit some sweet spot at about 24% crit. Is this Melee 24% or force 24%?

[NogueiraA]

This might have been answered somewhere else but i can't seem to find it.

 

I keep reading in a bunch of threads that Anni Marauders hit some sweet spot at about 24% crit. Is this Melee 24% or force 24%?

 

Melee.

24% for me is not enough for Anni, annihilate crit makes all the difference.

[arkitip]

Melee.

24% for me is not enough for Anni, annihilate crit makes all the difference.

 

Good luck then. You'll need 300-350 crit rating to hit that. HUGE power sacrifice for those returns.

[Yeochins]

Good luck then. You'll need 300-350 crit rating to hit that. HUGE power sacrifice for those returns.

 

Huge power hit yes, your bonus damage and melee damage range suffer. However the extra crit helps refund rage (when you critical hit Annihilate on a bleeding target) which allows you to throw in Vicious Slash along with Vicious Throw when your stacks of Annihilate are at 4 instead of using Assault.

 

Without a higher critical rating you'll find yourself pretty scarce on Rage when you hit 4 stacks of Annihilate.

Edited May 12, 2013 by Yeochins

[DarthSpooky]

Is this 24% buffed or unbuffed? Edited May 15, 2013 by DarthSpooky

[Luckeyduckey]

Is this 24% buffed or unbuffed?

 

Unbuffed. 25% is the soft cap

[Omophorus]

Huge power hit yes, your bonus damage and melee damage range suffer. However the extra crit helps refund rage (when you critical hit Annihilate on a bleeding target) which allows you to throw in Vicious Slash along with Vicious Throw when your stacks of Annihilate are at 4 instead of using Assault.

 

Without a higher critical rating you'll find yourself pretty scarce on Rage when you hit 4 stacks of Annihilate.

 

I don't know about that.

 

Especially considering *Bleed Crits* generate Rage. Whether they're supposed to or not.

 

So Berserk is almost guaranteed to dump large piles of Rage in your lap, and significantly de-values Crit rating.

 

And even if that is regarded as a bug and gets fixed, Rage starvation just isn't really a problem, even without extensive use of Assault. You spend 11 Rage every 12 seconds just from 2 Annihilates and 1 Deadly Saber usage. You gain back a little less than 10 from Force Charge + Battering Assault (averaged over time, due to BA's CD) in that same timespan. One crit during that 12 second timespan brings your core priority elements to Rage neutrality.

 

Add in Rage as per normal from Bleed ticks, other ancillary crits, and you're left with a significant amount of Rage to play with. Rarely ever will more than 1 or 2 Assaults (if that!) be needed per 12 second interval, and dumping a ton of Power for Crit will not drastically change that.

 

The math, for the general case (not Anni Marauder-specific), shows that the per-point value on Crit Rating is simply too low, and stacking Power is a DPS gain. Add in forced crits on a spec, and Crit Rating gets devalued further.

 

I find myself oftentimes concerned about *wasting* Rage as Anni at the moment, rather than worrying about starvation. I'm not always using Battering Assault to CD as too frequently it would lead to wasted Rage. I'm making *very* little use of Assault in many fights as Anni, because it simply isn't needed.

 

That said, most of my results on Anni are inferior to Carnage, even though I'm still not as comfortable with the latter's playstyle post-2.0 as I'd like. If I got the chance to play Marauder more, I'm sure I'd settle in better, but that's just not in the cards, and Rage is just way too useful for way too much (other than raid bosses) that it's my go-to spec maybe 80% of the time.

[Luckeyduckey]

I don't know about that.

 

Especially considering *Bleed Crits* generate Rage. Whether they're supposed to or not.

 

So Berserk is almost guaranteed to dump large piles of Rage in your lap, and significantly de-values Crit rating.

 

And even if that is regarded as a bug and gets fixed, Rage starvation just isn't really a problem, even without extensive use of Assault. You spend 11 Rage every 12 seconds just from 2 Annihilates and 1 Deadly Saber usage. You gain back a little less than 10 from Force Charge + Battering Assault (averaged over time, due to BA's CD) in that same timespan. One crit during that 12 second timespan brings your core priority elements to Rage neutrality.

 

Add in Rage as per normal from Bleed ticks, other ancillary crits, and you're left with a significant amount of Rage to play with. Rarely ever will more than 1 or 2 Assaults (if that!) be needed per 12 second interval, and dumping a ton of Power for Crit will not drastically change that.

 

The math, for the general case (not Anni Marauder-specific), shows that the per-point value on Crit Rating is simply too low, and stacking Power is a DPS gain. Add in forced crits on a spec, and Crit Rating gets devalued further.

 

I find myself oftentimes concerned about *wasting* Rage as Anni at the moment, rather than worrying about starvation. I'm not always using Battering Assault to CD as too frequently it would lead to wasted Rage. I'm making *very* little use of Assault in many fights as Anni, because it simply isn't needed.

 

That said, most of my results on Anni are inferior to Carnage, even though I'm still not as comfortable with the latter's playstyle post-2.0 as I'd like. If I got the chance to play Marauder more, I'm sure I'd settle in better, but that's just not in the cards, and Rage is just way too useful for way too much (other than raid bosses) that it's my go-to spec maybe 80% of the time.

 

Bleed crits don't give you rage. Melee crits on targets that are bleeding give you rage.

[Mr_Fuzzle]

Bleed crits don't give you rage. Melee crits on targets that are bleeding give you rage.

 

This is true, but you do get a 30% chance to generate Rage from bleed ticks in your skill tree. This is on top of crits from ordinary attacks generating rage on bleeding targets.

[Omophorus]

Bleed crits don't give you rage. Melee crits on targets that are bleeding give you rage.

 

Then there's probably a bug active, because popping Berserk of late has been almost a guarantee of a full Rage bar.

[NogueiraA]

Then there's probably a bug active, because popping Berserk of late has been almost a guarantee of a full Rage bar.

 

There's nothing with Berserk.

1 - direct crit atacks(white damage) in a bleed target build 1 rage.

2 - Each bleed tick has 30% chance to build 1 rage, can not occur more than once every 1.5sec.

 

1 assault can build 4~5 rages if crit the hits, it's pretty nice.

[Leonalis]

If you have 25% Crit (meele)

 

How many AP you will have? (And Bonusdamage)

 

All unbuffed of course

[grallmate]

There is no 'goal crit percentage' and it is a fundamentally floored idea as the returns from Crit rating and Strength are on independent DR curves. You are interested in two comparisons: Strength vs Power (augments) and Power vs Crit (mods and enhancements) thanks to the way gear is itemized.

 

For Carnage, Power seems to win out in both comparisons and I believe the same is true for Rage. Watchman is up for debate thanks to the Focus generated by crits. If you're concerned about crit chance as Watchman I'd grab Strength augments and then only enough crit rating to make it 'feel' right. Yes, I said FEEL right, there is no set number for you to aim for.

[Lostpenguins]

Then there's probably a bug active, because popping Berserk of late has been almost a guarantee of a full Rage bar.

I hate to ask, but are you in the wrong stance and using "Shii-Cho" form when popping 'zerk?

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

I hate to ask, but are you in the wrong stance and using "Shii-Cho" form when popping 'zerk?

 

I was thinking that exact thing.

 

Back to the thread. Crit is almost a moot point for Anni because of Juyo Mastery, Indefegitble Onslaught, and Malice. All together your bleeds have a 6 * 3 =18% + 11% = 29% Chance to Crit. thats with 6 stacks of Juyo, and No extra crit chance minus Malice's 6% crit. throw in the Agent Buff. thats 34% Crit WITHOUT factoring in Crit Rating from gear. Crit is an incredibly moot point. Case Closed.

[Yeochins]

I was thinking that exact thing.

 

Back to the thread. Crit is almost a moot point for Anni because of Juyo Mastery, Indefegitble Onslaught, and Malice. All together your bleeds have a 6 * 3 =18% + 11% = 29% Chance to Crit. thats with 6 stacks of Juyo, and No extra crit chance minus Malice's 6% crit. throw in the Agent Buff. thats 34% Crit WITHOUT factoring in Crit Rating from gear. Crit is an incredibly moot point. Case Closed.

 

Silly theory-crafters.

 

Your bleeds give you rage yes. But your refund on critical hitting your direct attacks is based off of your crit percentage alone, not your Juyo form bonus. The difference between someone who understands this, and someone who doesn't, is the ability to throw in a Vicious Slash, along with Vicious Throw while having 4 stacks of Annihilate.

 

I don't know about you, but an attack that deals 2000+ weapon damage and has a 110% chance to hit (when geared for PvE) and can finish the cooldown of rupture, is much better than Assault at a 100% chance to hit (subject to the 10% resist from bosses).

Edited May 23, 2013 by Yeochins

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

Silly theory-crafters.

 

Your bleeds give you rage yes. But your refund on critical hitting your direct attacks is based off of your crit percentage alone, not your Juyo form bonus. The difference between someone who understands this, and someone who doesn't, is the ability to throw in a Vicious Slash, along with Vicious Throw while having 4 stacks of Annihilate.

 

I don't know about you, but an attack that deals 2000+ weapon damage and has a 110% chance to hit (when geared for PvE) and can finish the cooldown of rupture, is much better than Assault at a 100% chance to hit (subject to the 10% resist from bosses).

 

At what point were we talking about melee abilities? umm nowhere... I think you meant to post this somewhere else.

[Yeochins]

At what point were we talking about melee abilities? umm nowhere... I think you meant to post this somewhere else.

 

I think you need to understand how the Annihilation spec works before you come posting your opinions.

 

You can start by attempting to describe what every skill in the annihilation tree does for you. Maybe it'll click.

Edited May 23, 2013 by Yeochins

[TarristerWelm]

At what point were we talking about melee abilities? umm nowhere... I think you meant to post this somewhere else.

 

Actually, they were talking about melee crit, and melee crits on bleeding targets giving extra rage. I believe that is what he/she was referring to, for that is where you can throw in a vicious slash+throw, if your melee attacks are critting (therefore granting extra rage on bleeding targets).

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

Actually, they were talking about melee crit, and melee crits on bleeding targets giving extra rage. I believe that is what he/she was referring to, for that is where you can throw in a vicious slash+throw, if your melee attacks are critting (therefore granting extra rage on bleeding targets).

 

Ah gotch'a. well either way Crit from Main Stat SHOULD be enough crit to hold you over for melee crit.