Weapon Proficiency: Blaster Rifle (Account)

[Grimmig]

1500 Cartel Coins go go go.

 

Come on already, every Bounty Hunter since beta has wanted this and asked for it. You'll make a mint, we'll all pay for it even though it really should have been implemented 18 months ago.

 

At the very least, make it a character perk that can be unlocked?

 

EDIT:

I will admit I was primarily thinking of Powertechs, but really the idea isn't just limited to Bounty Hunters getting Blaster Rifles. That was just the most glaringly obvious example to use, since it's been on the wishlist since early Beta.

 

Ideally a whole slew of Weapon Proficiency unlocks would become available, or perhaps something like this:

 

Weapon Proficiency: Blasters (Account)

Grants Troopers Smugglers, Bounty Hunters, and Agents access to Blaster Rifles, Blaster Pistols, Sniper Rifles, Assault Cannons. This unlock applies to all characters on your account of the appropriate classes.

 

Weapon Proficiency: Force Weaponry (Account)

Grants Jedi and Sith characters access to Lightsabers, Dual Lightsabers, Saber Staves, and Force Foci. This unlock applies to all characters on your account of the appropriate classes.

 

Obviously with something like the Force Weaponry one, tanking Juggernauts & Assassins (and their Jedi counterparts) would be choosing single or saberstaves along with a shield generator... unless offhand sabers were introduced with inherent shielding stats? The same scenario would apply to Powertechs and Vanguards with respect to dual wielding pistols.

 

Now alongside this, as mentioned below by other posters, abilities would have to have their use-case requirements modified to accept a weapon category instead of a specific weapon type - but that part of it should be relatively minor, I would think,.

Edited December 20, 2012 by Grimmig

[TheHunterC]

I agree totally. I think many classes should have different weapon profficiencies. For example, all agents no matter what AC should have sniper rifles, I know force users no matter what class can use almost all melee weapons which is good. I also think bounty hunters should be able to use rifles like you said and cannons too but also a handful of melee weapons (not lightsabers, more like vibroswords techblades and techstaffs) because I mean they're bounty hunters — no rules. I also think troopers should be able to use vibroknives and scatter guns in addition to they're rifle/cannon.

 

Sorry if I got carried away

[Grimmig]

There are good arguments for that.

 

Torian Cadera uses Techstaves, Kaliyo uses Blaster Rifles, etc, etc.

 

The weapons could be opened up a bit, after all the animations are already done so it's mostly just a cosmetic change - but it's something people want. Sure, there is some coding involved for skills that require certain weapons, but turning those fields into arrays is certainly within their ability to manage.

[Grimmig]

Up for the PM readers/posters. Hopefully get some momentum behind this idea.

[TORPlayer]

This idea is great.

[Amyas]

This should be free

[Holinyx]

of course most Merc abilities, you need 2 pistols to activate, rendering it useless to have a rifle.

[Grimmig]

In response to the above poster:

 

The weapons could be opened up a bit, after all the animations are already done so it's mostly just a cosmetic change - but it's something people want. Sure, there is some coding involved for skills that require certain weapons, but turning those fields into arrays is certainly within their ability to manage.

 

I will admit I was primarily thinking of Powertechs, but really the idea isn't just limited to Bounty Hunters getting Blaster Rifles. That was just the most glaringly obvious example to use, since it's been on the wishlist since early Beta.

 

Ideally a whole slew of Weapon Proficiency unlocks would become available, or perhaps something like this:

 

Weapon Proficiency: Blasters (Account)

Grants Troopers Smugglers, Bounty Hunters, and Agents access to Blaster Rifles, Blaster Pistols, Sniper Rifles, Assault Cannons. This unlock applies to all characters on your account of the appropriate classes.

 

Weapon Proficiency: Force Weaponry (Account)

Grants Jedi and Sith characters access to Lightsabers, Dual Lightsabers, Saber Staves, and Force Foci. This unlock applies to all characters on your account of the appropriate classes.

 

Obviously with something like the Force Weaponry one, tanking Juggernauts & Assassins (and their Jedi counterparts) would be choosing single or saberstaves along with a shield generator... unless offhand sabers were introduced with inherent shielding stats? The same scenario would apply to Powertechs and Vanguards with respect to dual wielding pistols.

 

Now alongside this, as you mentioned abilities would have to have their use-case requirements modified to accept a weapon category instead of a specific weapon type - but that part of it should be relatively minor, I would think,.

Edited December 20, 2012 by Grimmig

[Grimmig]

Up for day shift.

[Trooperclay]

By the way, no one that is an Imp can use Blaster Cannons like Commandos can. Correct me if im wrong...

[Trooperclay]

 

Weapon Proficiency: Force Weaponry (Account)

Grants Jedi and Sith characters access to Lightsabers, Dual Lightsabers, Saber Staves, and Force Foci. This unlock applies to all characters on your account of the appropriate classes.

 

,.

I disagree with dual lightsabers, as they should only be for marauders and sentinels. Think about it; Giving a Guardian or Juggarnaut or even an assassin or shadow would definitly make them way too powerful.

[Grimmig]

By the way, no one that is an Imp can use Blaster Cannons like Commandos can. Correct me if im wrong...

 

You are correct in this, because there are no Imperial classes that have the weapon proficiency. This idea would immediately fix that.

 

Also, regarding making Juggernauts or Assassins too powerful by allowing them to wield dual sabers is kind of a non-issue. I'm not suggesting revamping skills to allow them to attack with both weapons, or for skills to utilize both weapons for damage calculation. The change in their case would merely be cosmetic since they can still equip equivalent items as "stat sticks" in the same slots.

 

The basic idea behind this is that allowing people to equip any weapon appropriate for their class lets you customize the way your character looks, without changing how they play or the current class balance. After all, we all have the same number of equipment slots - what I propose is that you should be able to wield whatever type of weapon your class would reasonably use.

 

Obviously Troopers and Bounty Hunters should not be running around with lightsabers, and we all know Obi-wan has great disdain for blasters. But it is realistic to assume that a Trooper or Bounty Hunter would be familiar with virtually any firearm, and a Jedi or Sith would choose one or more styles of lightsaber to fight with.

Edited December 20, 2012 by Grimmig

[TheHunterC]

You are correct in this, because there are no Imperial classes that have the weapon proficiency. This would idea immediately fix that.

 

Also, regarding making Juggernauts or Assassins too powerful by allowing them to wield dual sabers is kind of a non-issue. I'm not suggesting revamping skills to allow them to attack with both weapons, or for skills to utilize both weapons for damage calculation. The change in their case would merely be cosmetic since they can still equip equivalent items as "stat sticks" in the same slots.

 

The basic idea behind this is that allowing people to equip any weapon appropriate for their class lets you customize the way your character looks, without changing how they play or the current class balance. After all, we all have the same number of equipment slots - what I propose is that you should be able to wield whatever type of weapon your class would reasonably use.

 

Obviously Troopers and Bounty Hunters should not be running around with lightsabers, and we all know Obi-wan has great disdain for blasters. But it is realistic to assume that a Trooper or Bounty Hunter would be familiar with virtually any firearm, and a Jedi or Sith would choose one or more styles of lightsaber to fight with.

Yes

[Grimmig]

Up for night crew.

[LordExozone]

100% agree! Make this so Bioware!

[Grimmig]

Up again.

[PetFish]

No thanks. I have a Bounty Hunter and don't want this, never have.

 

Powertechs have built-in weapons in their offhand and it would be silly for them to have to use 2 hands to hold their big gun but then have the strength to Rambo it in one hand while they flamethrower someone or launch a rocket... do you want Mercenaries to also have these rocket/dart weapons?

 

Classes need to have some way to be identifiable to another player from a distance and allowing multiple proficiencies destroys that.

 

Also, please stop bumping your own threads.

[Grimmig]

do you want Mercenaries to also have these rocket/dart weapons?

...

Classes need to have some way to be identifiable to another player from a distance and allowing multiple proficiencies destroys that.

...

Also, please stop bumping your own threads.

Mercenaries already have their own and shared rockets so I fail to see why that is even relevant to the discussion. The only cosmetic difference between Mercenaries and Powertechs is how many Blaster Pistols they hold.

 

Need to identify classes quickly because you can't figure it out based on their behavior and proximity to others? Turn on the class icons. Now your problem is solved.

 

Your opinion seems to be the minority on this topic. Thankfully I did bump my own thread after it sat idle for 10 days or you would not have found a place to put your two cents in. If you are going to contribute to the topic then I don't see why you are annoyed that it got back to the front page. Perhaps you needed that last line to guarantee your post took up more space than your signature block?

Edited January 2, 2013 by Grimmig

[PetFish]

You bumped this four times, which is about half of the actual number of posts.

 

I don't know why you're taking personal shots at me suggesting I'm stupid (here and in another thread) or that I have some ridiculous need to make my post bigger than my signature when all I'm doing is responding to the topic.

 

Should I just say something like "dumb idea is dumb"? No, I try not to cuz that *would* be dumb and disrespectful, I try and at least say something semi-worth reading. I say my bit and try and back it up. So if I can't contribute to the discussion, and I can't say a tiny statement without substance, what am I supposed to do?

[Grimmig]

You bumped this four times, which is about half of the actual number of posts.

 

I don't know why you're taking personal shots at me suggesting I'm stupid (here and in another thread) or that I have some ridiculous need to make my post bigger than my signature when all I'm doing is responding to the topic.

 

Should I just say something like "dumb idea is dumb"? No, I try not to cuz that *would* be dumb and disrespectful, I try and at least say something semi-worth reading. I say my bit and try and back it up. So if I can't contribute to the discussion, and I can't say a tiny statement without substance, what am I supposed to do?

I wasn't suggesting you were stupid. But it does seem like your chief objection to two similar ideas is a non-issue that was solved quite some time ago. If you somehow inferred that this makes you stupid then so be it, who am I to convince you otherwise? FYI, it would be good if you could contribute to the discussion. It would be better if you could do so in a meaningful way though, by bringing up a well reasoned objection instead of something that can be fixed by an existing checkbox in the Preferences menu.

 

Since this is your first MMO, I will assume that this is your first MMO forum you have participated in as well. People do bump their own topics to solicit further discussion. The usual etiquette is to refrain from bumping a post if it is still on the front page of a forum. If you have a problem with that, perhaps you can make a post here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=575264 where it will be reviewed and ignored.

 

And now, back to the topic at hand.

 

Some people want to wield different weapons for aesthetic reasons. It doesn't have to have an impact on class balance at all. Jedi/Sith who want to choose what style of lightsaber they run around with, Troopers and Bounty Hunters, Agents and Smugglers who want to tote around more or less firepower. Is there really a valid argument against this? They removed the restrictions from color crystals a long time ago. Adaptive weight armor took things further in this direction. This is really just the next step of the trend, but it should have happened quite awhile ago. Like... prior to launch.

 

If there wasn't a desire for this, then threads like this (and the lightsaber counterpart) wouldn't keep showing up all the time.

[althene]

While this idea isn't dumb, and I don't normally agree with The Fish, in not so sure it's a good one.

 

If its a global unlock for all characters on your account, the potential is there for force users to run around with blaster rifles and bounty hunters to run around with lightsabers. I know you refined your ideas later, and they've started to take a more elegant form, but I'm still not sure it would fly.

 

I do feel the weapon restrictions are somewhat arbitrary and designed to pigeonhole us into what the writers envisioned when they wrote the scripts. On one hand, this is fine since outside of the aesthetics of the weapon, there is very little difference between say, a blaster pistol and an assault cannon from a basic "I shot you in the face" perspective. I'm told polesabers and lightsabers actually differ in damage even with identical mods, but I'm still thinking this has more to do with the extra damage awarded to the shadow/assassin due to AC perks. On the other hand, it's somewhat unacceptable (in my humble opinion) to force a player to do something, especially from an aesthetic standpoint, just because it's convenient for some reason or another. If weapons legitimately did vastly different amounts of damage, such that, putting a blaster rifle in the hands of a smuggler created a rift vortex which completely obliterated an opposing team or raid boss, then yeah, limit the weapons by class. However this does not seem to be the case with the vast majority of them and in cases where there is a difference, I'd be willing to bet it's well within the devs 5% rule.

 

As far as making the weapon proficiencies themselves a global unlock, I'm more inclined to make this a legacy perk conditional upon reaching some particular goal with a class that uses the particular weapon. Furthermore, these proficiencies should be highly restricted in such a way as to prevent force users from obtaining ranged weapons and ranged users from acquiring saber skills. I'm on the fence about ranged classes acquired melee proficiencies at all because it could lead to massive imbalances from a PvP perspective, but I'm thinking they might end up more like the sage/sorcerer where it's simply a fancy stick that they wave around to scare pigeons (not that that's very compelling either).

 

As a legacy perk, subs could use credits or coins while f2p players could potentially use credits if they were cheap enough to unlock, but would more likely pay for the coins instead.

[Grimmig]

I would be all for these ideas to be legacy unlocks, I simply figured it would appeal to EA/Bioware more as Cartel purchases. Trying to play on corporate greed to achieve player desires, for a change. In an ideal situation though, weapon proficiency unlocks for your legacy (for the appropriate additional classes only) would come with hitting level 50 on a given class. Sabers for Force users, firearms for the rest.

 

I do feel like the idea of the proficiency unlock should be limited to appropriate classes, in the proposed descriptions in my initial post while it says (Account) in the unlock title it specifies limited classes in the description. I suppose as a class limited character perk it would work too, but I'm a fan of account-wide / legacy wide unlocks. I would see this operating in a similar way as some of the custom gear currently does. Something like this: http://db.darthhater.com/recipes/6909/professionals_gauntlets/ but say... Weapon Proficiency: Blaster Rifle (Account) would be applied to Bounty Hunters, Troopers, Imperial Agents, and Smugglers. I believe Agents and Troopers can already use them, but certain advanced classes have abilities restricted to other weapons and it would only be fair to unlink those from their specific weaponry as well.

[Velenias]

I like this but to be honest I don't trust BW to not screw it up. Seeing all the other legacy or cartel market stuff, it would need something like legacy lvl 30 and 3,000,000 credits or 920 CC just to unlock a single proficiency for a single character. Which seems way too expensive. Some kind of account wide option sounds better, perhaps linked to the legacy system so theres a way to get them without Cartel Coins. Edited January 2, 2013 by Velenias

[althene]

I agree. Like I said, I feel the current proficiencies seem quite arbitrary. The only rationale I can possibly see behind it is loot drops. It's rare, currently, for 2 different (base) classes to role on the same piece of gear legitimately. If it happens, it's done for one players companion(s). I can see how this might have been their intent, but with companion need rolls becoming more and more common, it simply isn't required.

 

Besides, they're weapon options, not requirements. If you don't want to use a blaster rifle on your bounty hunter, then don't. The only caveats to this could be specific skills such as snipe and ambush. But since both the gunslinger and the sniper use the snipe and ambush skills with 2 very different weapons (and the extreme sniping range of... 35 meters) I don't see how it would really mater and they could drop skill weapon requirements altogether.

[MentalCase]

No thanks. I have a Bounty Hunter and don't want this, never have.

 

Powertechs have built-in weapons in their offhand and it would be silly for them to have to use 2 hands to hold their big gun but then have the strength to Rambo it in one hand while they flamethrower someone or launch a rocket... do you want Mercenaries to also have these rocket/dart weapons?

 

Classes need to have some way to be identifiable to another player from a distance and allowing multiple proficiencies destroys that.

 

Also, please stop bumping your own threads.

 

You're forgetting that a Commando, who uses a cannon, uses his OFF hand to throw grenades, summon medical probes, ect. so your point is invalid.

 

As for the OP's idea, I support it completely. There is no reason for this to not be capable in the game. Yes, a Juggernaut would be able to wield dual lightsabers in tank spec, but they wouldn't be effective because lightsabers lack shields. This is a very good idea and I hope to see it in the future.