jarjarloves Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 This is going to be a hot topic but it could be fun as well. Please keep it civil. So a student of mine told me to watch A New Hope again and pay attention to the opening crawl. After watching it several times I finally noticed it STAR WARS It is a period of civil war. Rebel spaceships, striking from a hidden base, have won their first victory against the evil Galactic Empire. So that means every EU story that takes place before A New Hope and After Revenge of the Sith that has the Rebels winning is completely non canon. Thoughts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djmothra Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I always took it to mean - the first victory was stealing the Plans to the Death Star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Are there EU stories of the Rebs winning pre New Hope? But really, only thing I find non canon is Boba surviving a fight with Vader. I can let it slide that he got out of the sarlacc, I can even let it slide that he got injected with a magic needle...but can I let it slide that he survived a fight with Vader? HELL NO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilikaa Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 (edited) First, the only thing that I would not consider canon is the story of The Force Unleashed 2. In that we see the "first vicotry" of the Rebellion over Kamino. Of course I am not a big fan of the TFU games so I am a bit bias here. However...LA has retconned quite a bit of SW over the years. It would not surprise me to find out that this little piece of ANH story was also retconned to fit to ever growing Star Wars Universe. But to call 1/4 of the EU non-canon is going too far. It would be a much, much smaller amount, if any. Edited September 20, 2012 by Kilikaa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaerisKiran Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Are there EU stories of the Rebs winning pre New Hope? But really, only thing I find non canon is Boba surviving a fight with Vader. I can let it slide that he got out of the sarlacc, I can even let it slide that he got injected with a magic needle...but can I let it slide that he survived a fight with Vader? HELL NO! Well they did manage to steal x-wings... Garm Bel Ibliz and his Katana dreadnaughts did manage to do some limited damage to the empire... but overall those "victories" did not matter in greater scheme of things... It did negligent damage to imperial fleet and goverment in general. Theft of DS1 plans was first significant achievement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted September 20, 2012 Author Share Posted September 20, 2012 Well they did manage to steal x-wings... Garm Bel Ibliz and his Katana dreadnaughts did manage to do some limited damage to the empire... but overall those "victories" did not matter in greater scheme of things... It did negligent damage to imperial fleet and goverment in general. Theft of DS1 plans was first significant achievement. exactly i would say the DS plans would have been what was the victory as that's where the story picks up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I guess they should have tweaked it, and put their first MAJOR victory against the Empire. Being that stealing the plans to a planet destroying battle station, in order to destroy it would be pretty big. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted September 20, 2012 Author Share Posted September 20, 2012 I guess they should have tweaked it, and put their first MAJOR victory against the Empire. Being that stealing the plans to a planet destroying battle station, in order to destroy it would be pretty big. remember it was supposed to be the first movie and not episode 4. The entire back story hadnt been written first. Of course it is suprising he didn't change it in his many changes to the movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 remember it was supposed to be the first movie and not episode 4. The entire back story hadnt been written first. Of course it is suprising he didn't change it in his many changes to the movies. Ya I know, but the little things count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digimanbyte_ID Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 First, the only thing that I would not consider canon is the story of The Force Unleashed 2. In that we see the "first vicotry" of the Rebellion over Kamino. Of course I am not a big fan of the TFU games so I am a bit bias here. However...LA has retconned quite a bit of SW over the years. It would not surprise me to find out that this little piece of ANH story was also retconned to fit to ever growing Star Wars Universe. But to call 1/4 of the EU non-canon is going too far. It would be a much, much smaller amount, if any. That wasn't really the biggest victory, it was more of keeping the rebels alive. Remember Vader was told to hunt down all the rebels so they wouldn't rise up to be a threat. He knew who the leaders were and went after them relentlessly. Even so the EU of a new hope is meant by the fact of the death star station plans. Remember this weapon was designed to be unstoppable in enforcing the rule of the empire. The plans were kept secret and the fact the rebels stole them meant moral against the rebels would be a lot higher. Also keep in mind the EU on contains information backdrop before the start of that episode ala flash gordan style, its not a past history of the entire fight. Just a reason why a giant ships is trying to take over another smaller vessel, and why Vader is determined not to blow it out of the sky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malles Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 This is going to be a hot topic but it could be fun as well. Please keep it civil. So a student of mine told me to watch A New Hope again and pay attention to the opening crawl. After watching it several times I finally noticed it STAR WARS It is a period of civil war. Rebel spaceships, striking from a hidden base, have won their first victory against the evil Galactic Empire. So that means every EU story that takes place before A New Hope and After Revenge of the Sith that has the Rebels winning is completely non canon. Thoughts At the time that meant stealing the plans to the Death Star. So let's look at what lead up to that. Vader traveling the galaxy hunting down Jedi: Written in various novels, referenced in many more, so that's canon. The birth of the Rebellion: Unoffically started when Senator Amidala gathered some like-minded senators to try and peacefully and politcally force Palpatine to give up the powers he had gained during the Clone Wars. Started forming after Amidala mysteriously vanished (she left for Mustafar without telling anyone and died out in an asteroid field, so yeah, "mysterious" to the general public) and became an official rebellion through the Corellian Treaty, seen in Star Wars: The Force Unleashed. Now, THIS is where it get's iffy. Galen Marek is not considered canon by some of the SW fandom simply because in the TFU games and novels he was ridiculously powerful. But way I see it, we're talking about a guy who was groomed from the terrible twos to well into his 20s to help Darth Vader kill the Emperor by Darth Vader himself. So, yeah, I can see someone like that killing a Jedi Council member and holding his own against Palpatine. As to the HOW the Rebel Alliance was founded, that's debatable. On one hand, Palpatine and Vader said it was a plan to lure out the Emperor's enemies and provoke them into doing something he would have a publicly legal reason to execute them for. On the other hand, I believe Vader truly did intend to have Marek try and help him kill the Emperor but got cold feet when Palpatine discovered the apprentice. Maybe the Rebellion was VADER'S idea as a way to distract the Emperor so Vader could scheme and plan with no hassles, and it just got out of control. TFU 2: This is debatable as well. The Rebel Alliance launches an attack on Kamino and actually takes the planet. Most if not all of the cloning facilities are destroyed during the attack and Marek's fight with Vader, which would explain why in Star Wars: Battlefront 2 the clone narrator states that most of the clones were reinforced and later replaced by conscripted human grunts. The questionable part is when the Rebels take Vader hostage and the game ends with him being held on Galen Marek's ship. I have an open mind when it comes to Star Wars and even I almost called BS on that. Star Wars: Battlefront 2: Most of the Empire half of the campaign deals with putting down various uprisings on various planets, like a rebellion on Naboo and a newly-built droid army on Mustafar. Could be just video game padding. But I will say that basing what's canon and what's non-canon off of the opening lines of a movie not even George Lucas expected to be a hit is just illogical thinking. Pretty much, anything with the LucasArts logo on the back of it is considered official Star Wars canon. Even if ol' Georgio says he doesn't like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamqd Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 (edited) I look at the EU as in-universe Mythology rather than real-world theology, makes things a lot more easy to digest and more importantly stress free and enjoyable. Look at the opening crawl... A Long Time ago, in a Galaxy far, far, away... A long time ago from when? Far away from where? Who's telling this story? is it based in truth or myth? This helps with differing ideas, design styles and powers throughout the Vast expanse of the franchise. "Why do Republic Troopers of 3,300 BBY have Stormtroopers armor of 1 ABY on?" Well because that's how the guy telling the story remembers it, or had it explained to him. I spent a lot of time and energy over the years stressing about continuity gaffs, the fact that Tales of the Jedi looked so Archaic compared to KotOR which was only 40 years later, why is Galen Marek more Powerful than Luke! etc etc, then I adopted this outlook, and I just get 100% more enjoyment from the franchise as a whole, I even like the Clone Wars now Edited September 23, 2012 by adamqd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omnitheo Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 I look at the EU as in-universe Mythology rather than real-world theology, makes things a lot more easy to digest and more importantly stress free and enjoyable. Look at the opening crawl... A Long Time ago, in a Galaxy far, far, away... A long time ago from when? Far away from where? Who's telling this story? is it based in truth or myth? This helps with differing ideas, design styles and powers throughout the Vast expanse of the franchise. "Why do Republic Troopers of 3,300 BBY have Stormtroopers armor of 1 ABY on?" Well because that's how the guy telling the story remembers it, or had it explained to him. I spent a lot of time and energy over the years stressing about continuity gaffs, the fact that Tales of the Jedi looked so Archaic compared to KotOR which was only 40 years later, why is Galen Marek more Powerful than Luke! etc etc, then I adopted this outlook, and I just get 100% more enjoyment from the franchise as a whole, I even like the Clone Wars now I agree completely with you. Everything we learn about the Star Wars universe is just the perspective of the story teller. Sometimes details are embellished and exaggerated, and sometimes details are missed, or one storyteller makes mistakes. It all comes together though to give you a broad idea of the story as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormcloudx Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 two things...well tow in one actually....ahem 1) for all intensive purposes that garbage that is TFU needs not be included in cannon at all...in fact it needs to be fired fro ma cannon into space, drift through the sun land in a hutts toilet and get flushed down the drain with the incoming rain of crap. 2) The clones..the clones were replaced after the kaminoans attempted a rebellion by making their own clones. This prompted palapatine to mix up the clone dna pool and include non clones as well. Not the TFU 2 version( aka the ****ed up story 2:mad::mad:). That is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts