Shingara Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) you still have not linked were its says there is only 4.6 million full subs? and it doesnt say 9.1 million full subs its says subscriber base for World of Warcraft was 9.1 million The 4.6 was declared in an investor report bliz did when they were at 12 mil, and the subs count is dont by people paying, not how much they pay, so theo9 or whoever runes it now gives bliz a number and bliz add that to there total, Australia is east but is under the western subs, same for russia and anyone else east of europe. And if someone paying full subs is paying 40 (or more) times what someone on Pay by the hour or reduced subs pays then for every 40 (or more) of those subs counts as 1 of the west subs when it comes to profit. Edited August 3, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varteras Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) You did fine too. Some here are bit too sensitive is all. Oh stop hitting on her. She's probably a dude and even if she truly is a chick you're not gettin lucky. Edited August 3, 2012 by Varteras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkirus Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Not sure if its been mentioned before but I read somewhere they said a lot of those subs are on Diablo 3 waiting for the next expansion, AND a big majority of those subs lost are from the East. Not too bad any way you look at it. It has been mentioned, but as usual, some skip over that. 10 million copies of D3 was sold. Without question, many WoW playes went to play it as they wait for MOP to release. Blizzard made record revenue sales also during that quarter. How many MMO's can lose 1.1 million subs and stiil say they made record profits?...lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthTHC Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 What I meaned is not that Funcom havent fixed some of the problems which where in the game on launch , but usually when MMOS lose a lot of subs once they have been launched in unfinished state and get bad reputation because of it they hardly regain good number of subs again . Yes... And what I was asking was do they fail to regain a good number of subscribers because of the reputation they earned or because they never made the game worth subscribing to? I don't think any have ever done the latter. I think they gave up, made the game F2P, and then did the minimum to scrape a modicum of profitability out of them. I think that's what's going to happen with SWTOR too. But maybe worse because EA could very well flip this puppy to P2W within minutes of the cash shop opening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkirus Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Oh stop hitting on her. She's probably a dude and even if she truly is a chick you're not gettin lucky. Lol. Nice try.but I am a happy married guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Durasturan Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Not sure if its been mentioned before but I read somewhere they said a lot of those subs are on Diablo 3 waiting for the next expansion, AND a big majority of those subs lost are from the East. Not too bad any way you look at it. Activision Blizzard has lost 40% of their total online revenue over the past 2 years. They have been padding their numbers by dropping the Asian market costs to attract more customers while bleeding NA/EU subs and most current estimates put the level of NA/EU subs at between 2M and 3M. Diablo 3 has lost 80% of it's playerbase over the last two months. So those subs CANT be on D3 because there isn't ANYONE on D3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) Maybe you could explain to me what he was trying to say. Because I have no idea. It looks like he's trying to magic the math so that WoW has fewer subscribers than TOR, but that can't be it... can it? No im not and stop being facetious and deliberately obtuse. When wow puts out there numbers and that is put along side western only sub counts from other games then people use the sub counts as if they are equal profit when infact they are not. Edited August 3, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varteras Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Lol. Nice try.but I am a happy married guy. Lies. Lies I say. You don't know women. You're on a forum for an MMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthTHC Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Lol. Nice try.but I am a happy married guy. Lies! Those don't exist! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavell Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 No im not and stop being facetious and deliberately obtuse. When wow puts out there numbers and that is put along side western only sub counts from other games then people use the sub counts as if they are equal profit when infact they are not. Ah, I see. You're trying to suggest that some other MMO is remotely close to WoW in terms of Western subscribers. You're still wildly wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeorgedk Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Why do you throw that 9mill figure around like its fact? WoW does not have anywher near that many subs. Yes, it's an old game, yes it is still doing well...very well compared to TOR but let's at least be objective. Maybe 4 mill subs would be accurate. Chinese players who do not have a subscription do not count as subscribers. Driz I don't get these kind of remarks. Cause they don't pay monthly fees they should not be counted towards the total? They're not paying as much as people in the west do but what does that matter for the total amount of people playing a game? It's like saying, 'well we have 100 people playing a game, but out of those 100 only 50 people pay the normal sub rate, the others don't so we actually only have 50 people playing'. I do hope you realize how silly your remark sounds now. Those other 50 don't really play the game cause they pay less..., they log in, they play but actually they don't... Afaik Blizzard's definition of a sub is someone who was paid within the last 30 days to play, apart from other limitations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leathfuil Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 No im not and stop being facetious and deliberately obtuse. When wow puts out there numbers and that is put along side western only sub counts from other games then people use the sub counts as if they are equal profit when infact they are not. Sorry, I guess I just can't fathom anybody in the 21st century trying to do three-fifths of a person style math. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Ah, I see. You're trying to suggest that some other MMO is remotely close to WoW in terms of Western subscribers. You're still wildly wrong. No what your doing is trying to assume i am saying something i am not. WoW has alot of full paying subs but no where near as many as it looks. WoW is the biggest MMO but its not as far infront as people think. If wow were making such huge gains as people think then vivienda wouldnt be selling it and would just sit back and survive on the returns from there investment. Your trying to suggest that WoWs sub count generates all the same profit, your trying to state that wow isnt loosing that many subs, they are. Your the one thats wildly wrong. This isnt about if swtor, aion, tera, rift or gw2 is close to WoW, this is Profits, you know that stuff that makes the world go around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunablade Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) Yes... And what I was asking was do they fail to regain a good number of subscribers because of the reputation they earned or because they never made the game worth subscribing to? I don't think any have ever done the latter. I think they gave up, made the game F2P, and then did the minimum to scrape a modicum of profitability out of them. I think that's what's going to happen with SWTOR too. But maybe worse because EA could very well flip this puppy to P2W within minutes of the cash shop opening. Their game wasnt worth a sub for a lot of players, it was bad and unfinished on launch and because of that they gained a lot of negative publicity and a bad rep , thats all connected. Just like SWTOR is getting it to because they rushed this game for release instead of waiting a bit more to get the game in a more polished state. Edited August 3, 2012 by Lunablade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Sorry, I guess I just can't fathom anybody in the 21st century trying to do three-fifths of a person style math. Ow im sorry, well lets see you do the math, how many hours a week do you play an mmo for. Now times those hours by $0.06 and see how much it costs you a month and the difference to what you actually pay a month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovefool Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 No, we don't. That link you posted is very specific on what content subscribers will be granted without having to pay additional cost. It does not say "all future content." It says "Unlimited access to regular Game Updates such as new Nightmare Mode content, a brand new Operation on the planet of Asation, a new Heroic mission series on the prison planet of Belsavis, and a brand new Warzone for our PvP lovers." They want to charge you for content, they just won't call it a regular Game Update. You know. Sort of like LotRO. Such updates like 1.2, 1.3,1.4 that bring new operations and similar stuff is going to be "free" for subscribers and they will not get charged whereas f2p will have to buy it if they want to play it. Expansions such as was Cata, or Lich King will be paid for by all just as it always was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavell Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 No what your doing is trying to assume i am saying something i am not. WoW has alot of full paying subs but no where near as many as it looks. WoW is the biggest MMO but its not as far infront as people think. If wow were making such huge gains as people think then vivienda wouldnt be selling it and would just sit back and survive on the returns from there investment. I've heard some laughable things on this forum before, but that honestly has to take the cake. You're saying a company - any company, really - would leave money on the table when there's more to be had? You're absolutely out of your mind. WoW's the market leader. By huge, huge margins. Even if we go with your ridiculous number - that you clearly made up - they're still so far ahead of their nearest competitors that it's not even remotely close. Your trying to suggest that WoWs sub count generates all the same profit, your trying to state that wow isnt loosing that many subs, they are. Your the one thats wildly wrong. This isnt about if swtor, aion, tera, rift or gw2 is close to WoW, this is Profits, you know that stuff that makes the world go around. Others have shown you repeatedly now that their subscription losses are coming from the East, not the West. You continue to insist the game is losing Western subs in massive numbers. WoW is making more money than anyone else in the business, by huge margins. By the time they're ready to go F2P - if they ever do, which I doubt - they'll have Titan ready to go. And if you don't think that thing will sell, well...I don't know what to tell you, except, "Wake up! It's time to go to school!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Durasturan Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 I don't get these kind of remarks. Cause they don't pay monthly fees they should not be counted towards the total? They're not paying as much as people in the west do but what does that matter for the total amount of people playing a game? It's like saying, 'well we have 100 people playing a game, but out of those 100 only 50 people pay the normal sub rate, the others don't so we actually only have 50 people playing'. I do hope you realize how silly your remark sounds now. Those other 50 don't really play the game cause they pay less..., they log in, they play but actually they don't... Afaik Blizzard's definition of a sub is someone who was paid within the last 30 days to play, apart from other limitations. What is the point in advertising that your game has 9M or whatever players? It's to say "look at all the people you can play with!" But if 6M of those 9M are actually Asian subs which play on Asian servers and not on servers you even have ACCESS to then saying "you can play with 9M people" is a lie, because you can't. It is also a misrepresentation of profit to potential investors. If I tell you "subs went up by 10%" as an investor at face value you would expect profits to increase by 10% (unless of course costs went up as well or whatever). Generally you would not expect revenue to drop by 40%. It is also a misrepresentation of popularity in that a good portion of those 9M players are actually bots. No matter how you slice it, WoW pads their numbers in an attempt to hook you into playing their game which is false advertising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavell Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Such updates like 1.2, 1.3,1.4 that bring new operations and similar stuff is going to be "free" for subscribers and they will not get charged whereas f2p will have to buy it if they want to play it. Expansions such as was Cata, or Lich King will be paid for by all just as it always was. You cannot guarantee that, so it's best not to pretend as though you can. The statement is vague at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) I've heard some laughable things on this forum before, but that honestly has to take the cake. You're saying a company - any company, really - would leave money on the table when there's more to be had? You're absolutely out of your mind. WoW's the market leader. By huge, huge margins. Even if we go with your ridiculous number - that you clearly made up - they're still so far ahead of their nearest competitors that it's not even remotely close. Others have shown you repeatedly now that their subscription losses are coming from the East, not the West. You continue to insist the game is losing Western subs in massive numbers. WoW is making more money than anyone else in the business, by huge margins. By the time they're ready to go F2P - if they ever do, which I doubt - they'll have Titan ready to go. And if you don't think that thing will sell, well...I don't know what to tell you, except, "Wake up! It's time to go to school!" No, what i have seen is a blue stating most are from the east and how many is most exactly, so again lets see you do the math, how many hours a week do you play an mmo for. Now times those hours by $0.06 and see how much it costs you a month and the difference to what you actually pay a month as most of there subs are still east. as for my numbers being made up... http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-1.png Edited August 3, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmillia Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 Oh stop hitting on her. She's probably a dude and even if she truly is a chick you're not gettin lucky. I am. I simply chose this avatar because I like twileks and the male avatars are fat and ugly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cavell Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 No, what i have seen is a blue stating most are from the east and how many is most exactly, so again lets see you do the math, how many hours a week do you play an mmo for. Now times those hours by $0.06 and see how much it costs you a month and the difference to what you actually pay a month as most of there subs are still east. Is English your first language? I'm honestly asking, not trying to be a jerk, because I think the confusion may lie in a failure to comprehend what was said. Saying that most of their subscription losses have come from the East does not mean that most of their subs are in the East. Just that most (more than 50%, less than 100%) of their subscription losses are in the East. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 This is ridiculous You can check the report. June 2010 : Blizzard report a 289 millons revenues for 3 months under the MMORPG tab. June 2011 and June 2012 : Blizzard report respectively 423 and 323 millions from digital channels (IE subs and DLCs) So A)It's pretty hard to tell if online income was slashed from 2010 to 2011, since they changed the wait of reporting it. (It's certainly not ''lying'', those revenues were put with PS3 and X360 before) B)Revenues from all online sources, including DLC was slashed indeed by 24% (not 40%) between 2011 and 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shingara Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 (edited) Is English your first language? I'm honestly asking, not trying to be a jerk, because I think the confusion may lie in a failure to comprehend what was said. Saying that most of their subscription losses have come from the East does not mean that most of their subs are in the East. Just that most (more than 50%, less than 100%) of their subscription losses are in the East. No, its a fact most of there counted subs are in the east. http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-1.png Which abrutly ends being counted as individual in 2010. Edited August 3, 2012 by Shingara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leathfuil Posted August 3, 2012 Share Posted August 3, 2012 This whole "how many are from the East" thing is the most ridiculous red herring I've ever seen on an internet forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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