priest Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 Heh, reading that blog is a bit like reading a method-actor's treatise on narcissism, isn't it? I felt like I was reading Paul's letter to the Corinthians. She is speaking down the mount to her loyal parishioners. Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CassusVerda Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 I think Karen should write again......How to become a Social Pariah within a Fictional Universe's fanbase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 I think Karen should write again......How to become a Social Pariah within a Fictional Universe's fanbase. I would read that. But it would mostly talk about Mando's and the like so... maybe not:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 I would read that. But it would mostly talk about Mando's and the like so... maybe not:D Reading her blog made me /facepalm more than anything else I've ever read... and YES, that includes the Sword of Truth novels. After Wizard's First Rule (which was frelling AWESOME), that series went downhill pretty quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 Reading her blog made me /facepalm more than anything else I've ever read... and YES, that includes the Sword of Truth novels. After Wizard's First Rule (which was frelling AWESOME), that series went downhill pretty quick. I think she was hit by the "I'm so good they will love me no matter what" train. May her humility rest in peace... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmthethird Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 I think she was hit by the "I'm so good they will love me no matter what" train. May her humility rest in peace... seems to be a trend in star wars. George Lucas got hit by the same train Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 seems to be a trend in star wars. George Lucas got hit by the same train He got hit by that train shortly after the first three Indiana Jones movies and their success. I think the success of the Indy movies made him overconfident in his movie-making abilities. Don't get me wrong, the Indy movies are great, but they led to the PT being not very good. At least that's my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirdthestrill Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 I suggest you go read Revelation again, carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfessorWalsh Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 He got hit by that train shortly after the first three Indiana Jones movies and their success. I think the success of the Indy movies made him overconfident in his movie-making abilities. Don't get me wrong, the Indy movies are great, but they led to the PT being not very good. At least that's my opinion. ... Uhm... The first three Indiana Jones movies were Spielberg not Lucas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aximand Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 ... Uhm... The first three Indiana Jones movies were Spielberg not Lucas. Which explains why they were so much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 (edited) Reading her blog made me /facepalm more than anything else I've ever read... and YES, that includes the Sword of Truth novels. After Wizard's First Rule (which was frelling AWESOME), that series went downhill pretty quick. Yup. Unfortunately, Mr. Goodkind is a bit of a windbag. If I wanted to read Ayn Rand's philosophy, I could just, you know, read Ayn Rand's books. (Edit: That said, Terry Goodkind is about eight thousand times more successful than Ms. Traviss is. Just thought I'd mention that, given all the talk about Ms. Traviss' laughing her way to the bank, and whatnot.) Edited June 23, 2012 by Invictos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 (edited) I suggest you go read Revelation again, carefully. To whom are you addressing the above-quoted advice? Edited June 23, 2012 by Invictos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 Which explains why they were so much better. You beat me to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirdthestrill Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 To whom are you addressing the above-quoted advice? Everyone here. I know for myself that I was debating something I hadn't read in six months. Always good to do a quick check-up on the source material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoshiRaphElan Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 So you agree with her "Mandalorian pacifists"? In a culture of warriors where children are trained from birth to fight, very similar to the ancient Spartans, you really think that there would be room for pacifists in that culture? There would be room for them... at the bottom of the chasm below the cliff. . Let's get one thing clear right now. Karen DID NOT create the Mando pacifists. The Clone Wars TV series did. Karen actually OPPOSED the pacifists, and it is one of the reasons she stopped writing Star Wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 (edited) ... Uhm... The first three Indiana Jones movies were Spielberg not Lucas. Well I thought Lucas had a hand in them, didn't he? Either way Lucas was still hit by that train. Edit: Okay I just did some research and GL was a Producer of the Indy series. And we know he has an ego to him so he probably thinks that Indy was successful because of him. Edited June 23, 2012 by Aurbere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 (edited) Well I thought lucas had a hand in them, didn't he? Either way Lucas was still hit by that train. Yes, Lucas co-wrote and produced the Indiana Jones movies. The difference is that Spielberg (Lucas' long-time friend*) has the chops to speak his mind to George -- and there's no question that Spielberg is the better director. The funny part is that before I even saw Crystal Skull (the last, and by far the worst, Indiana Jones movie, IMO), I heard Spielberg remark in interviews that originally no one (not Spielberg, not Harrison Ford) bought into Lucas' idea for the movie; Lucas had to talk them all into it. So Lucas threw his weight around more than usual on the last Indiana Jones project, and we end up with Shia LaBeouf communing with CGI monkeys. Wish I could say I was surprised. Lucas is a very creative guy. He deserves a lot of credit. But it seems clear to me that he didn't have (had gotten rid of) any moderating influences in LucasFilm by the time he started to make the Star Wars prequels. Instead, he surrounded himself with yes-men. (* - Lucas and Spielberg reputedly invented Indiana Jones, together, over the course of casual conversation. So they both had a stake in, and a claim to, the Indiana Jones franchise. It's nice to dream about what the prequels might've been like if Spielberg had stepped in to help, but I'm sure he didn't want to intrude. Star Wars is, after all, Lucas' baby.) Edited June 23, 2012 by Invictos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 Yes, Lucas co-wrote and produced the Indiana Jones movies. The difference is that Spielberg (Lucas' long-time friend*) has the chops to speak his mind to George -- and there's no question that Spielberg is the better director. The funny part is that before I even saw Crystal Skull (the last, and by far the worst, Indiana Jones movie, IMO), I heard Spielberg remark in interviews that originally no one (not Spielberg, not Harrison Ford) bought into Lucas' idea for the movie; Lucas had to talk them all into it. So Lucas threw his weight around more than usual on the last Indiana Jones project, and we end up with Shia LaBeouf communing with CGI monkeys. Wish I could say I was surprised. Lucas is a very creative guy. He deserves a lot of credit. But it seems clear to me that he didn't have (had gotten rid of) any moderating influences in LucasFilm by the time he started to make the Star Wars prequels. Instead, he surrounded himself with yes-men. (* - Lucas and Spielberg reputedly invented Indiana Jones, together, over the course of casual conversation. So they both had a stake in, and a claim to, the Indiana Jones franchise. It's nice to dream about what the prequels might've been like if Spielberg had stepped in to help, but I'm sure he didn't want to intrude. Star Wars is, after all, Lucas' baby.) Interesting... to say the least. Lucas should have gotten Spielberg in on the PT. Or maybe Spielberg didn't want to do it. We don't know, but if the latter is true some of the blame for how poorly the PT turned out, can be laid at Spielberg's feet. But that's if Spielberg was approached by George, but turned him down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 Interesting... to say the least. Lucas should have gotten Spielberg in on the PT. Or maybe Spielberg didn't want to do it. We don't know, but if the latter is true some of the blame for how poorly the PT turned out, can be laid at Spielberg's feet. But that's if Spielberg was approached by George, but turned him down. It's hard to say that Lucas would've even been interested in having Spielberg direct the Star Wars prequels. They're friends, and like many prominent and successful friends, they probably have a bit of a friendly rivalry. In other words, George probably wanted to prove that he could direct again, and on the flipside, he probably respects that Spielberg has his own pet projects. It's also doubtful that a director of Spielberg's caliber (arguably the greatest living film director) would be genuinely interested in directing a whole trilogy's worth of George's pet franchise. IIRC, George complained quite a bit about how difficult it was for him to direct the first Star Wars movie. He didn't like spending all of that time in Tunisia (IIRC, the location that "played" Tatooine), and I'm sure he didn't like answering to 20th Century Fox on a day-to-day basis. It's understandable, then, that he had someoone else direct Empire and Return of the Jedi. (Irving Kershner and Richard Marquand, respectively.) But by the time the prequels rolled around, George had convinced himself that he could direct again. (Lawrence Kasdan, who'd helped George write both Empire and Return of the Jedi, was long gone, too.) Lucas was, I think, also encouraged by the immense advances in technology that would allow him to direct almost every scene in front of a green screen. Amidst all the comedy of RedLetterMedia's reviews of the prequel trilogy, there are actually some pretty amazing insights about George's lazy directing style -- and references to commentary by George himself revealing a preference for rather lazy directing habits. By 1999, in short, George had become the stereotypical aging and self-satisfied fat cat who could delude himself that he was still capable of hanging with the big dogs. The truth is that George was never a particularly good director; he wasn't a terrible director at his peak, but he needed a lot of help. He needed the studio to tell him he was spending too much money or that his editing sucked (A New Hope had to be recut because George's original pacing was apparently awful). He needed the practical constraints that gave birth to the innovations of Industrial Light and Magic. If Necessity is the mother of Invention, then unlimited resources and unlimited power are the parents of mediocrity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 It's hard to say that Lucas would've even been interested in having Spielberg direct the Star Wars prequels. They're friends, and like many prominent and successful friends, they probably have a bit of a friendly rivalry. In other words, George probably wanted to prove that he could direct again, and on the flipside, he probably respects that Spielberg has his own pet projects. It's also doubtful that a director of Spielberg's caliber (arguably the greatest living film director) would be genuinely interested in directing a whole trilogy's worth of George's pet franchise. IIRC, George complained quite a bit about how difficult it was for him to direct the first Star Wars movie. He didn't like spending all of that time in Tunisia (IIRC, the location that "played" Tatooine), and I'm sure he didn't like answering to 20th Century Fox on a day-to-day basis. It's understandable, then, that he had someoone else direct Empire and Return of the Jedi. (Irving Kershner and Richard Marquand, respectively.) But by the time the prequels rolled around, George had convinced himself that he could direct again. (Lawrence Kasdan, who'd helped George write both Empire and Return of the Jedi, was long gone, too.) Lucas was, I think, also encouraged by the immense advances in technology that would allow him to direct almost every scene in front of a green screen. Amidst all the comedy of RedLetterMedia's reviews of the prequel trilogy, there are actually some pretty amazing insights about George's lazy directing style -- and references to commentary by George himself revealing a preference for rather lazy directing habits. By 1999, in short, George had become the stereotypical aging and self-satisfied fat cat who could delude himself that he was still capable of hanging with the big dogs. The truth is that George was never a particularly good director; he wasn't a terrible director at his peak, but he needed a lot of help. He needed the studio to tell him he was spending too much money or that his editing sucked (A New Hope had to be recut because George's original pacing was apparently awful). He needed the practical constraints that gave birth to the innovations of Industrial Light and Magic. If Necessity is the mother of Invention, then unlimited resources and unlimited power are the parents of mediocrity. I can only say that I fully agree with everything you said. And Spielberg is made of pure champion stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirdthestrill Posted June 23, 2012 Share Posted June 23, 2012 OFFICIAL RTA (Rabbit Trail Alert) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invictos Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 OFFICIAL RTA (Rabbit Trail Alert) Hey, if you want to make a point, feel free. Your previous comment, "Go reread Revelation," addressed to no one in particular and for no obvious purpose, isn't exactly an invitation to substantive discussion, on-topic or otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirdthestrill Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Hey, if you want to make a point, feel free. Your previous comment, "Go reread Revelation," addressed to no one in particular and for no obvious purpose, isn't exactly an invitation to substantive discussion, on-topic or otherwise. I invited everyone to reread the work in question and reopen the debate using specific passages. Perhaps I should have been more clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Zone Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 (edited) Let's get one thing clear right now. Karen DID NOT create the Mando pacifists. The Clone Wars TV series did. Karen actually OPPOSED the pacifists, and it is one of the reasons she stopped writing Star Wars. No duh, Sherlock. If you had read the REST OF THE POSTS, you would have seen that! Now, as to why she left, she got fired. Edited June 24, 2012 by Captain_Zone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forgon Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I can only say that I fully agree with everything you said. And Spielberg is made of pure champion stuff. As far as I know, Lucas asked Spielberg and Irving to direct the prequels and they said no. So he took it upon himself and did it, for better or for worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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