And what are roleplayers getting with these updates?

[JudasMagnus]

What's wrong with this community? The TC has legitimate concerns and the common sense thing to do is to agree, not make fun of him and his ways. Childish.

[Dezzi]

Because it's one or the other. Chat bubbles are a feature and would be the responsibility of the UI team which is currently working on the LFD tool or rather was. I'd rather have the LFD tool over chat bubbles.

 

It's not one or the other, but you're right that it's prioritization. From the developers themselves:

 

November 2011: Fan Site Summit: Day 1 -- Q&A with James Ohlen, Fan Site Summit 2 Q&A Wrap-Up

Articles about the Fansite Summits from November 2011, where Bioware's Studio creative director James Ohlen promised chat bubbles to be a "high priority in BioWare's list of things to do". On a side note, Georg Zoeller confirmed this on the beta forums as well by posting "chat bubbles are a high-priority feature for launch or shortly thereafter" around the same timeframe.

 

February 17th, 2012: Community Q&A: Feb 17th 2012 -- in the February 17th 2012 Community Q&A post, Bioware's Damion Schubert confirmed that chat bubbles will be implemented: "They're definitely on the list. We’ve got many active roleplayers in the dev team and chat bubbles have always been important to us. We actually had chat bubbles in beta, but there was unfortunately some serious performance issues that our implementation caused that, for example, made things really suck in warzones and the fleet. They’ll be coming soon, but in priority, the GUI team is focused first on GUI customization. I'll have a better idea of timing once we get past that. And yes, for people who hate them, whenever we do them, they'll be toggleable."

 

March 5th 2012: STAR WARS: The Old Republic - Guild Summit 2012 Roleplaying Panel -- Bioware's new Lead Designer Daniel Erickson confirmed on the topic "The future of roleplaying" that chat bubbles are indeed coming and issues with chat bubbles having a negative effect on performance have been resolved: "Chat bubbles...yeah, chat bubbles. *bows his head in shame while applause roars through the room* So...this is...this is one of those weird...like... *sigh* ... there are things that you can always tell from our faces when we talk about it. There are things that are just kind of embarassing. Like we had chat bubbles in the game and for whatever reason there was a really strange technical... thing... with the chat bubbles that they totally dragged the performance of the game down. [takes a deep breath] We were like "chat bubbles...really? That's what's doing it?!" And you know, a tech came over and turned off the chat bubbles and framerate went way up and we were like "Oh god, okay." So...uh. We think we've got that worked out though. So chat bubbles: YES!"

 

Sourced here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=41864

 

We're way past GUI customization. Where's the update? They were originally a priority, but now chat bubbles have filtered back to the bottom of the barrel. Or are they not even in the barrel anymore?

 

The fact of the matter is that the developers have dragged their feet on the issue of roleplaying support. Period.

[Jaavik]

I am a true roleplayer, but the fact remains if an MMO doesn't support roleplay with game mechanics (like chat bubbles, actions emote (sitting down in a chair for example) it makes the roleplay less enjoyable.

 

You have a point there are no "pure Rp servers", but look at the number of servers that do have "RP" as part of their title then look at the complete lack of support and improvements for roleplayers.

 

It isn't good tennis campers.

 

I know it's been said until we all want to drive our fists through the monitors, but "be patient". This game has much bigger problems that they are trying to resolve to save the game. They are hemmoraging subscriptions because we don't have enough of a population on most servers to take part in some of the most basic elements of the game.

 

Let them get the stability of the game fixed and then they can add more of the smaller "fun elements". I've seen Chat Bubbles acknowledged by the devs, so it is being worked on, I'm sure...

 

Chat bubbles and sitting in chairs is purely cosmetic. It won't keep you from being able to RP. Only your imagination can do that.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Jaavik

[Dezzi]

I know it's been said until we all want to drive our fists through the monitors, but "be patient". This game has much bigger problems that they are trying to resolve to save the game. They are hemmoraging subscriptions because we don't have enough of a population on most servers to take part in some of the most basic elements of the game.

 

Let them get the stability of the game fixed and then they can add more of the smaller "fun elements". I've seen Chat Bubbles acknowledged by the devs, so it is being worked on, I'm sure...

 

Chat bubbles and sitting in chairs is purely cosmetic. It won't keep you from being able to RP. Only your imagination can do that.

 

The same argument can be made about the LFG tool: You can still group up and socialize with people without a LFG tool--we've been doing so for six months. The LFG tool also does not solve the population problem, only makes it less obvious. It's purely a band-aid.

 

Chat bubbles are paramount to large-scale roleplaying--a fact admitted by the developers themselves. Other players get use out of them when teamed up and can more easily read what their mates are saying without having to manage the space between their chat box and toolbars.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Dezzi

[metalgearyoda]

The same argument can be made about the LFG tool: You can still group up and socialize with people without a LFG tool--we've been doing so for six months. The LFG tool also does not solve the population problem, only makes it less obvious. It's purely a band-aid.

 

Wait, so I can imagine 3 other group members and they will tank, dps, and heal for me?

 

This is amazing!

 

BRB TESTING.

[Dezzi]

Wait, so I can imagine 3 other group members and they will tank, dps, and heal for me?

 

This is amazing!

 

BRB TESTING.

 

Tell me, how exactly does the LFG tool solve the population problem? Hm?

[Socialist]

Spoiled brats, you have a *********** virtual environment open for you to roleplay and you complain about chat bubbles?

 

You certainly weren't around early 90's when roleplaying meant an obscure group of friends transforming a piece of cardboard into the Middle Earth. That was hard, but more rewarding too.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Socialist

[metalgearyoda]

Tell me, how exactly does the LFG tool solve the population problem? Hm?

 

It doesn't. Transfers and the LFG tool together do.

[jgelling]

Spoiled brats, you have a *********** virtual environment open for you to roleplay and you complain about chat bubbles?

 

You certainly weren't around early 90's when roleplaying meant an obscure group of friends transforming a piece of cardboard into the Middle Earth. That was hard, but more rewarding too.

 

The piece of cardboard didn't cost $50 and $15 a month either, in fairness. But for that price you do get a lot of cardboard in SWTOR, it's true.

[Dezzi]

Spoiled brats, you have a *********** virtual environment ope for you and you complain about chat bubbles?

 

You certainly weren't around early 90's when roleplaying meant an obscure group of friends transforming a piece of cardboard into the Middle Earth. That was hard, but more rewarding too.

 

Spoiled brats! You have a **** virtual environment open for you and you complain about LFG tools?

 

You certainly weren't around in the early 00s, when MMO developers hadn't even considered the idea of a group tool. It was hard to form groups, but more rewarding too.

[Mordresh]

I couldn't disagree more. We've gotten tons of RP stuff compared to other games from patches. New emotes, legacy tree, the option to wear whatever gear we want at end game. Yes chat bubbles would be nice, but they are being worked on.

[Dezzi]

It doesn't. Transfers and the LFG tool together do.

 

So you admit it doesn't. Good job.

 

http://www.childhealth-explanation.com/images/story-books-for-children-woody-gets-dunked-21607796.jpg

[TheBBP]

Roleplayers do need some love. BioWare will lose them too. All of this "you just need your imagination" is garbage. For pvp, all you need is other people to fight, yet PVPers are waiting for devs to spoon-feed them places and other mechanics to fight.

[GnatB]

Meh, chat bubbles are irrelevant to RP. More hindrance than help, IMO.

 

Now sitting on chairs? Ok. I'll give you that one. I'll also ask for hide companions head slot and hoods up/down toggles

 

Another thing that would be useful is only display emotes w/ animations in the emotes lists. You don't need all of the ones that have no emote there since you can just do" /emote wonders why so many emotes in the list don't have animations". if you want to make up your own "animationless" one.

[Dezzi]

I couldn't disagree more. We've gotten tons of RP stuff compared to other games from patches. New emotes, legacy tree, the option to wear whatever gear we want at end game. Yes chat bubbles would be nice, but they are being worked on.

 

Really? As opposed to, say, Guild Wars 2--which features all of the above plus chat bubbles, and it's still in beta.

 

I don't count the Legacy family tree because it cannot be shared with other players. Had that been the case, however, it would have been a fantastic addition to roleplay. As it is, I can write my family tree on a napkin with the leftover sauce from my lips and get the same use out of it.

 

Actually...

 

I could get more use out of the napkin since I can manage to draw up more than two relationships per character.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Dezzi

[metalgearyoda]

So you admit it doesn't. Good job.

 

http://www.childhealth-explanation.com/images/story-books-for-children-woody-gets-dunked-21607796.jpg

 

I said that transfers AND lfg solve the population issue.

[Dezzi]

I said that transfers AND lfg solve the population issue.

 

Which you means you didn't answer the question.

[ThiborF]

I understand roleplayers and their wishes are not the most important thing SWTOR needs right now (hello open PvP support and class balance). That said, there really shouldn't be any resistance from you guys as the things we're asking for won't take anything away from you and in fact will add much more than you think.

 

Roleplayers, when they have the right support can do really amazing events.

 

The resistance isn't in the developers adding those features.

The resistance is in prioritization of those features.

 

When SWG was in its death throws it was primarily the RPers and those wanting a predominantly sandbox experience that remained. And where exactly did that subscription line trickle along at for the last 12 months before the plug got yanked? While the game peaked early on around 300k, in around 3yrs time it was down to just over 100k and by mid '09 down to 50k.

http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-2.png

 

It's not that the requests of the RPers don't matter or that they should be ignored. They shouldn't. However, as a business BW is going to take swings initially trying to plug the biggest gaps and shore up the weakest points. Server population sits at the forefront of that list. End-game content, extended leveling content/story and PvP aspects (world PvP incentivization, class balancing, etc.) are likely next in-line.

 

Those are things that are going to speak to larger subsets of the playerbase than adding chat bubbles or being able to sit in any chair you come across.

 

As I said, it's not that those things should be ignored altogether. They should be addressed. But, as someone else pointed out, having more people to RP with (via server transfers) should likely be higher on your own priority list than being able to sit down and pop a chat bubble up. Afterall, if few to no one is around to see you do it, what's the point?

[metalgearyoda]

Which you means you didn't answer the question.

 

The population problem is both a concurrent player issue and ease of networking issue.

 

You might have players interested in running foundry but they are spread across 3 planets and fleet. The players are unable to group easily creating the feeling of being alone.

 

It is also a problem when the number of concurrent players on your server is low making the instancing of players even more problematic.

 

By consolidating players with transfers you might still have the first problem. Some instances land in the level range between two planets.

 

By offering a LFG system without transfers, people on low populated servers will still have issues finding groups even with the LFG system.

 

By offering them both you solve the server population issue.

 

All better?

[Dezzi]

The population problem is both a concurrent player issue and ease of networking issue.

 

You might have players interested in running foundry but they are spread across 3 planets and fleet. The players are unable to group easily creating the feeling of being alone.

 

It is also a problem when the number of concurrent players on your server is low making the instancing of players even more problematic.

 

By consolidating players with transfers you might still have the first problem. Some instances land in the level range between two planets.

 

By offering a LFG system without transfers, people on low populated servers will still have issues finding groups even with the LFG system.

 

By offering them both you solve the server population issue.

 

All better?

 

So once again you admit that your answer to the question "How does the LFG tool solve the population problem?" is "It doesn't." Gotcha. It requires another feature altogether (transfers) to be of any use at all. This, by your own admission.

 

So really, it isn't the LFG tool that will solve the population problem--the issue you brought up as central to this discussion about chat bubbles--but the server transfers, which we can only hope will alleviate the population troubles plaguing this game.

 

Why does this invalidate the need for chat bubbles? Does it?

Edited June 11, 2012 by Dezzi

[Fanforran]

I am still waiting to get re-imbursed for my disco ball . 100k and they just took it out of the game . no refund . kinda just sums these muppets up . Its only fluff but still winds me up tbh .

[Mordresh]

Really? As opposed to, say, Guild Wars 2--which features all of the above plus chat bubbles, and it's still in beta.

 

I don't count the Legacy family tree because it cannot be shared with other players. Had that been the case, however, it would have been a fantastic addition to roleplay. As it is, I can write my family tree on a napkin with the leftover sauce from my lips and get the same use out of it.

 

Actually...

 

I could get more use out of the napkin since I can manage to draw up more than two relationships per character.

 

Okay first off, the question I answered, "what have we gotten with updates?" Is a small set of RP additions I listed, on top of the ones we already had. So comparing those things exclusively is misleading. For open world RP utilization we have different things as well. Awesome locations such as the bridge of the ziost shadow, player ships to RP on, cross faction speech, surnames,...

 

Secondly taking legacy trees out of the equation because you don't like its limitation is nonsense, its only purpose is RP fluff. That's constitutes it being an RP update.

 

Then what you seem to be forgetting is that the entire leveling experience is completely done by roleplaying. It's the only mmorpg in existance to actually deserve the RPG suffix. Companions, class story, faction story, story story story. How you can possible complain about RP in this mmorpg is mind boggling to me.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Mordresh

[Dezzi]

Okay first off, the question I answered, "what have we gotten with updates?" Is a small set of RP additions I listed, on top of the ones we already had. So comparing those things exclusively is misleading. For open world RP utilization we have different things as well. Awesome locations such as the bridge of the ziost shadow, player ships to RP on, cross faction speech, surnames,...

Another game has those things (great RP locations like bars and houses, overlooks, and hidden nooks), ships to roleplay on, server-wide communication support, and more than just surnames. How is SWTOR supposed to compete for the attention of roleplayers?

Secondly taking legacy trees out of the equation because you don't like its limitation is nonsense, its only purpose is RP fluff. That's constitutes it being an RP update.

I take it out because it offers no practical gameplay function--as opposed to chat bubbles and interactive chairs. The goal here is to provide tools to roleplayers that all players can garner use out of. I stand by my napkin example.

Then what you seem to be forgetting is that the entire leveling experience is completely done by roleplaying. It's the only mmorpg in existance to actually deserve the RPG suffix. Companions, class story, faction story, story story story. How you can possible complain about RP n this mmorpg is mind boggling to me.

So are you saying that just because an MMORPG is called an MMORPG, that it automatically makes it a good RPG?

 

Really?

 

We're clearly not talking about the same kind of roleplaying at this point. What roleplayers are asking for are features that make interaction with other roleplayers more intuitive (chat bubbles) and provide more options for play (interactive chairs). The key here being that these features are geared toward interactive play, not hiding in an instance behind canned dialogue.

Edited June 11, 2012 by Dezzi

[Rhysling]

We are getting all sorts of RP hooks and abilities!

 

Guild Capital Ships

Chat Bubbles

Chairs, yes chairs you can sit in!

Voice over emotes

Mounts that can carry more than one person

A space ship that can carry more than 4 people

Pants for those people who like to play male Sages

 

All these things are coming, soon.....

[Izorii]

I have the feeling that SWTOR is not designed for roleplayers in the traditional sence. Why read text when you can listen to pre determined answers inside a flash point? Why bother creating your own hero when you can have Captain Shepard or Hawk? So much of the game is designed for the hero bioware wanted you to play that I think roleplayers are going to have to wait a long time before they can actual have their own adventures rather than the scripted ones they have been given.