Mallorik Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Rift, living proof that 250k players wanted x-server LFG. The other 750k who didn't want it, left. WOW, so now youre just outright lying to try and prove your point? Just like swtor, rift lost most of those subs before the x server came out and saved the game, and it is now growing. Its funny that if you read your numbers correctly they prove the EXACT opposite of what you are trying to make people believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 They had just over a million subs, they are now sitting comfortably with 16 shards and roughly 250k players Actually, no, they didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kharnis Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 WOW, so now youre just outright lying to try and prove your point? Just like swtor, rift lost most of those subs before the x server came out and saved the game, and it is now growing. Its funny that if you read your numbers correctly they prove the EXACT opposite of what you are trying to make people believe. It's interesting that you accuse someone else of lying while in the same breath trying to make the argument that a cross server LFG is the only thing that "saved" Rift. You do know there were other features the game provided after launch, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallorik Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 (edited) It's interesting that you accuse someone else of lying while in the same breath trying to make the argument that a cross server LFG is the only thing that "saved" Rift. You do know there were other features the game provided after launch, right? Yes you are correct, and i dont mean that x server only saved Rift, it was the addition of many different features. Most of which swtor does not have either. So what is your point? And I wasnt lying, i just didnt want to list for the 50th time all of the things swtor is missing because anyone with a brain already knows what they are. Edited May 30, 2012 by Mallorik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discosoc Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 And look what happened to the people playing World Of Warcraft when the LFG cross server was implemented. Instead of actual decent players, they became wordless, mindless idiots who cared for nothing but themselves. People who would need on loot they didnt actually need just to sell, or leave a group if a boss they fought didnt drop the loot they wanted, even when it was only the first boss. Why should they care about other people? It is not like they would ever see them again, and even if they did, they can just leave the group and LFG using the tool again. Yes THAT is what you are promoting, the lack of moral fortitude, or willingness to be patient. So I vow here and now, the day cross server LFG is added, I am GONE!!!!! The only change I noticed when the LFG tool was added was that I got groups faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timesjoke Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Put simply, the claims of widespread abuse and ninja looting "just because of a x-server tool" are lies. Sure, there is an exception to every rule and every now and then some idiot will take something he should not take or get angry and pull something on purpose just to wipe the group but these things are so very rare it does not do any justice to the tools to even mention them. I have 7 lvl 85 toons on one server in WoW, making number 8 right now, I have used the x-server tool many, many hundreds of times and I can only vaguely remember a few times that any one idiot had acted poorly enough to cause me to notice him. The other claims of eliminating all guilds and such, are also false, WoW has more guilds now than ever before because there are more geared players to form good raiding teams and more guilds in the first place. Without the LFG tool you have fewer geared players and less guilds with raid ready members, period. I love the "accountability" lies the best, what accountability are we speaking about? The ability to spam attacks on some guy in chat because you are pissed off? BW has already officially said it is okay to roll for alts and companions so based on game rules, there is no such thing as a ninja..........so what do you have to complain about? I for one ignore idiots who spam attacks in channels because most of the time it is pure BS, there is always 2 sides to every issue and no way to know for sure who is right so it is better to just tune the garbage out. 99% of players tune out the attacks and other spam garbage as static, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skidrowbro Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Actually, no, they didn't. You might be right but I am 100% sure that chart is off. I was looking back at their sales and not their subs. My bad. Still trying to find the article that has it listed somewhere between 700-900k subs. Either way they still lost roughly 60-75% of their playerbase Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 (edited) You might be right but I am 100% sure that chart is off. I was looking back at their sales and not their subs. My bad. Still trying to find the article that has it listed somewhere between 700-900k subs. Either way they still lost roughly 60-75% of their playerbase Well, since box "sales" usually include giveaways, it's a poor baseline to start with for any MMO. Many people never even install and enter the code for the free 30 days. Thus, those people don't even know or care what the game does or doesn't have. So they were never considered "the playerbase", because they were never part of the playerbase. Edited May 30, 2012 by JeramieCrowe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeyb Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Thats cause EA is running the show Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skidrowbro Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Well, since box "sales" usually include giveaways, it's a poor baseline to start with for any MMO. Many people never even install and enter the code for the free 30 days. Thus, those people don't even know or care what the game does or doesn't have. http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-02-24-rift-1-million-accounts-servers-named Is that better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skidrowbro Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 So they were never considered "the playerbase", because they were never part of the playerbase. Oh gee, isn't that what someone from EA just said about their playerbase and the sub loss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iselin Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 What triggers "last resort" < 3 full servers? < 100K subs? Just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Oh gee, isn't that what someone from EA just said about their playerbase and the sub loss? Probably. That truth needs to be applied across every MMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moofanchu Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Because then no one would use the local one. I don't necessarily agree with the devs on this one, but if they are dead set on creating some sort of server community than they can't give cross server options. I would be more in line with this philosophy if we were to condense servers dramatically so that servers actually could support such a community. I actually like that idea. You can still be in a local group if you're queued as cross server. Queing for cross-server shouldn't limit you to ONLY cross-server groups. It just "allows" you to create your group from members of other servers. Even then, I don't really see the advantage of cross-server over local. You are still populating the same group makeup ratio: 1 tank, 1 healer, 2 dps. Cross server you'll just have more DPS competing for the 2 DPS spots. You'll still be waiting on tanks and healers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeramieCrowe Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-02-24-rift-1-million-accounts-servers-named Is that better? Yes, thank you. That says exactly what I said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cupelixx Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 For all of the posturing that happens on both sides of the debate, there are still two simple facts: -Grouping only with people on your realm isn't immunity to being grouped with jerks. The only way to avoid this is to only group with people you know. This is not an option for everyone -The population on most realms makes a realm-only LFG tool worthless Since people are sharing stories, back when WoW launched I was a well-known healer on my realm. People liked grouping with me, I got tapped by big guilds to fill spots in raids. My rep and connections also got me into one of the top 2 raiding guilds (both guilds tied for #1 in Naxx 40 progression, for a while we held #1) on the realm. There was no LFG tool back then. I still pugged like a madman when I wasn't raiding. I got grouped with randoms where people were just terrible. Ninjas, bad behavior, you name it. Luckily, experiences like that were few and far between. Fast forward to the LFG implementation. In all the time I used LFG to a few months ago when I quit WoW for good, I can count on one hand the times I ended up with a truly intolerable group. When you play an MMO you take the good people as well as the bad when you pug, LFG tool or not. Hate the group? Leave, wait a while and queue again. Don't want to oug with randoms at all? Don't. Given the choice of cross-realm LFG or nobody to do instances with, I will take the LFG tool every time even if I risk getting a bad or a jerk in the group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skidrowbro Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Yes, thank you. That says exactly what I said. You're welcome. Ya, there was so many sights that either inflated or deflated the numbers i just couldn't remember which one it was that was the most accurate:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timesjoke Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Yes, thank you. That says exactly what I said. You know what he meant JC, why is it you are always playing semantics and avoiding the easy to understand points people make? He was pointing out they started out with 1 million accounts and are now down to about 250,000, subs are a different matter because even SWtor has had a false boost from the 30 days free they offered and when that is gone, I wonder what the true number of subs will be? This discussion is actually pretty silly, BW created a game with the look and feel of a 8 year old game, it was released without tools (like server transfers) that every major MMO has as standard today and put simply, the attempt to go "old school" has failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skidrowbro Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 This discussion is actually pretty silly, BW created a game with the look and feel of a 8 year old game, it was released without tools (like server transfers) that every major MMO has as standard today and put simply, the attempt to go "old school" has failed. Name one game that is out right now or has been released in the past ywo years that came with these so called industry standards. Also, make sure it's still active with a subscription base and not free to play please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oddzball Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Name one game that is out right now or has been released in the past ywo years that came with these so called industry standards. Also, make sure it's still active with a subscription base and not free to play please. Right... because if a F2P game came out with those features it would just be embarrassing for SWTOR... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skidrowbro Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Right... because if a F2P game came out with those features it would just be embarrassing for SWTOR... If you are going to get involved with a conversation, learn to follow it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timesjoke Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Name one game that is out right now or has been released in the past ywo years that came with these so called industry standards. Also, make sure it's still active with a subscription base and not free to play please. Wow, slow down a little and try reading what I said again. I never said the games were released with these tools (some were added pretty darn fast though) I said they had these tools currently so it is only common sense that the average MMO player is used to having these tools and have come to expect a modern MMO to have them. The only tool I believe they should have had ready at launch is the transfer tool because everyone in the industry knows there was going to be a decline after the first 30 days. I do believe tools like the basic LFG limited to server only should have been done by now though, we have to remember these are not new tools, the program knowledge is already done and in use with many other games, they do not have to create these tools from nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skidrowbro Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Wow, slow down a little and try reading what I said again. I never said the games were released with these tools (some were added pretty darn fast though) I said they had these tools currently so it is only common sense that the average MMO player is used to having these tools and have come to expect a modern MMO to have them. The only tool I believe they should have had ready at launch is the transfer tool because everyone in the industry knows there was going to be a decline after the first 30 days. I do believe tools like the basic LFG limited to server only should have been done by now though, we have to remember these are not new tools, the program knowledge is already done and in use with many other games, they do not have to create these tools from nothing. And you slow down and try reading what many people have posted about the transfer already being in place and the legacy system breaking it. It was there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilosoldier Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 And you slow down and try reading what many people have posted about the transfer already being in place and the legacy system breaking it. It was there ..but it wasnt. Thats like saying I would have won the lottery if I had picked the right numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthTHC Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 ..but it wasnt. Thats like saying I would have won the lottery if I had picked the right numbers. I tend to believe it was there and that Legacy broke it. I recall (though I'm too lazy to search for) a BioWare statement saying exactly that. Plus this is one of the ultra-rare things I agree with skidrow on, so it must be troof. Yet another example of the horribly broken development process at the core of this game and team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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