Article on why WoW's subs are dropping (for the devs)

[Necrolepsy]

http://www.gatheryourparty.com/articles/2012/05/03/world-of-warcraft-what-happened/

 

I think it brings up excellent points and if the devs do read this, please take into consideration that when you're changing the game you don't sacrifice major components of it like WoW has, such as exclusivity.

[llesna]

That's just one person's opinion there and it's quite a biased one as it appears to be from the relative minority of hardcore gamers.

 

I've nothing against hardcore players, but you can't pander solely to them at the expense of everyone else, especially when it means losing convenience tools like LFG and LFD tools, which we're desperately fighting for here.

 

I don't think the writer quite realises how elitist they are coming across as, but I seriously do not want the devs to listen to such things without also taking it with a big pinch of salt.

[eldisper]

horribly biased opinion, I also remember the days of constant spamming for agroup i mean 4 hours at least to get a group .It was hrorrible.

[RachelAnne]

That's just one person's opinion there and it's quite a biased one as it appears to be from the relative minority of hardcore gamers.

 

I've nothing against hardcore players, but you can't pander solely to them at the expense of everyone else, especially when it means losing convenience tools like LFG and LFD tools, which we're desperately fighting for here.

 

I don't think the writer quite realises how elitist they are coming across as, but I seriously do not want the devs to listen to such things without also taking it with a big pinch of salt.

 

I dont see anything elitist there tbh.

 

From my point of view, wow vanilla and tbc was a great game for the casual player. You did log on and could play, every had its niche, I was doing high end pvp and raiding - other "highend casual content" and others did just RP and some did mix all that.

 

Today I am just a casual and since wotlk and Cata I feel lost at wow. You have no chance to play, if you are new or didnt play for some weeks.

 

Your whole gear is completely worthless then, you get destroyed in pvp, if you want to do a new dungeon or raid you face a strong elitist domination that does not allow you to be new, that does demand dps numbers you can never deliver etc.

 

If people leave the game then its the casuals and not the elitist´s, but this is something people dont want to see - as they interpret the "elitist" term completely wrong.

 

Players that play wow semi pro or professionel are more helpful and forgiven than those wanne-be pro´s who can only insult other players and destroy their gaming experience in every damn LFG group.

[HeavensAgent]

Why have a few people posted a link lately and felt it served as a game suggestion? Summarize the content of the link; put it into your own words or don't create your thread at all.

[llesna]

I dont see anything elitist there tbh.

 

The writer is complaining that the game is too easy, too friendly to casuals and wants WOW to get rid of group finding tools in favour of people manually searching for ages for a group.

 

That's the elitism, as the writer wants a return to the halcyon days where only the few could do many things in the game and where it was less casual-friendly.

Edited May 4, 2012 by llesna

[turjake]

I would have guessed that the biggest reason for leaving WoW is that it is about 7 years old and people who have been playing 3+ years or more have most likely seen everything they are going to see in that game. In other words they are bored and need a real change.

 

Most of the new content is in a way like the old content, with different textures and modified game mechanics and new dungeons.

 

I guess that guy looks the game too close atm, so he cannot distinquish the scenery from the facts. Those dungeon fights in vanilla WoW were exciting for him because he was doing them for the first time. Now he has 7 years of experience, like his raider friends, so everything is a lot easier for them. Example: there is a reason why experienced workers get paid more than beginner workers while they work in the same factory.

 

Uhm, not much to do with SWTOR suggestions, sorry

Edited May 4, 2012 by turjake

[Necrolepsy]

Uhm, not much to do with SWTOR suggestions, sorry

 

I disagree entirely so you must be wrong.

[Mikesglory]

It is a 7 year old game, competing with newer releases.

 

Of course it's subs are now going to start falling, that doesn't make it any less of a great game though (especially with how awesome MoP is currently looking).

[Mikesglory]

In addition I fail to see how this at all applies to SWToR.

 

The two key points he uses as his arguments are "things are too accessible" and "they keep reusing crap" (both perfectly valid points I must add).

 

Yes Bioware dropped the ball on T1 with its accessibility, it was so easy a monkey wearing a giant mitten could complete NiM. But they do seem to have stepped it up with T2 and considering how many people are having trouble with just HM EC I think NiM could be a real challenge for guilds out there. They also have raid patches coming approximately every 3 months on average and have promised us monthly "content" patches for the rest of this year.

Seriously if they keep to what they say they're going to do over the next year this game is going to be amazing, exclusive for the hardest difficulties (and personally to me the graphics are absolutely BEAUTIFUL!)

Edited May 4, 2012 by Mikesglory

[Katahn]

The valid point I took from this post is there is a fine line between "accessible" and "too easy". Whether or not WoW has gone too far to the latter or SWTOR is too far to the former is a matter of opinion. On a more populated server I don't find getting groups for heroics or flashpoints impossible, but I can definitely sympathize with people on lower pop servers in that regard.

 

The trick here is to provide tools that make it easier to find groups or guilds, to get access to the content and eventually beat it, but to do all of that without making everything "too easy" to the point where no player interaction is needed and the people you are running with could just as easily be 3, 7, or 15 AI-driven companions.

[RachelAnne]

The writer is complaining that the game is too easy, too friendly to casuals and wants WOW to get rid of group finding tools in favour of people manually searching for ages for a group.

 

That's the elitism, as the writer wants a return to the halcyon days where only the few could do many things in the game and where it was less casual-friendly.

 

But this is where I disagree.

 

Vanilla and TBC was the perfect game for a true casual (those with less time). You could pvp in a ranked environment, whenever you wanted (except deep at night, but casuals dont play then anyways). You could make it to a pvp set in a few months, playing 2-3 games a day.

 

Not possible anymore, as you must now have a fix team for arena to get good gear. A casual cant do that and nobody picks a casual anyways.

 

Then you had a lot of 5 men content that did increase in size up to 40 men raids. Every server had pick up groups for those raids and not every role was that demanding. If a mum had to go afk for 10-15 minutes, NP! The raid just went on.

You did not had to face elitst behaivour like at wow today, where people exclude others from the content all the time as they think that those casuals dont fit their elite standards.

 

Lets face it, if a casual does queue for a LFG dungeon then he can be lucky and finish it in time (seldom), he can get into a group thats allready at the last boss or he ends up in a group where he is insulted for his gearscore, lack of achivements or dps, not chainpulling... (happens in 4 out of 5 runs).

 

I fail to see how wow is casual friendly, did you play it in vanilla and then today?

 

The game has become a farce, you MUST always deliver - there is no relaxed playing anymore, it has become a job where stat´s, meters and achivements are needed to actually access the content.

 

Yes Blizz gave tools for queueing up faster, but the community has gone totally goofy and does have too high standards now - so that even if you could theoretically enter dungeons, you get kicked faster than you can say peep.

 

At vanilla you always got into a raid, pvp team or 5men - nobody did care for your gear, dps meter or achivements; today a player must play 10 hours a day to keep up with the demands and all those "stat´s" that give access to content.

 

And its also wrong that good guilds are bad to casuals, the highend guilds always gave new players a chance in their raids when they went with twinks or had a spot in their pvp team - the elitist behaivour does not come of them, but of players that play 10 hours a day.

 

Many of my friends left wow for those reasons and so did I, there is no fun for casuals in that game anymore - but for bad players with tons of time who pretend to be casual.

Edited May 4, 2012 by RachelAnne

[SageOfSixPath]

He meant to say to SWTOR DEV'S TO NOT Re-use old model with new color, to bring new content & think about actual consumer's and not new. There is so many people that already left that game because the lack of content.

[llesna]

But this is where I disagree.

 

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree there.

[Roccobb]

Umm, pretty sure a lot of subs are going elsewhere because they have had too many years of the same. It's why I left. It's why my friends left. It was nothing Blizzard did. It was just time to move on.

[RachelAnne]

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree there.

 

 

Guess so ^^

 

I dont know, but even with all those tools, daily´s etc. for me its become a nightmare to actually try and do stuff at wow - as the doors that Blizz might had opened, the players have closed and are not willing to let anyone in, who is not like them.

 

Those gearchecks, dps measuring at the training dummy´s that you must do before you can join a pug and the constant "only 2,4 rating players" for pvp - is killing my fun, I dont want to work in games