Trooper Healing post 1.2

[Saltydogg]

Why hasnt more people posted on how bad they nerfed this class post 1.2. Spamming a heal now burns out all my ammo, getting cced then spell locked pretty much ends me even though i wear full armor. Melee jump to me and what can i do? Nothing just stand and try to false cast, pray to god i time it right the cc and run. This patch killed pvp healing for this class. Not to mention pve healing damage. There is on viable dps tree for pvp but because its aoe speck it would never work pve. This game is total garbage when it took a prefectally fine healling class and slaughtered it. It was hard to heal on a CM before now its not even worth filling a WZ slot.

[Javelina]

Adding my thoughts. The melee classes - knights and sith warriors were made so damaging, that commandos on pure spec heals in full gears cannot heal enough to cover the damage. Also the damage is so great when they leap to you and stun, push, leap - you are dead. There is nothing you can do when you can only purge 1 stun and get stunned or imobilized multiple times for a couple seconds - which is enough for them to drop you.

 

Prior to the 1.2 patch. troopers could heal themselves with another healer on them at same time and withstand an onslaught of 5-6 sith warriors/jedi knights for a good amount of time(as long as 15 to 20 seconds). Now, with same trooper and another healer healing them - cannot last more than 3-4 seconds with only 2 or 3 hitting on them. Troopers are suppose to be a damaging/healing class - yet the functionality of what they once were has been removed.

 

When you nerf the heals you nerf the damage, nerf the damage you nerf the heals - as both are hinged on the same stats.

 

We have lost 6 people from our guild that were level 50 pvp players that have completely quit the game due to total frustration with the way the tropper class was nerfed to a point they can't compete, not 1 on 1, but as a group element the trooper is no longer a viable pvp class.

Edited April 30, 2012 by Javelina
2 words were added to make it clearer to understand

[Chirru]

Why hasnt more people posted on how bad they nerfed this class post 1.2. Spamming a heal now burns out all my ammo, getting cced then spell locked pretty much ends me even though i wear full armor. Melee jump to me and what can i do? Nothing just stand and try to false cast, pray to god i time it right the cc and run. This patch killed pvp healing for this class. Not to mention pve healing damage. There is on viable dps tree for pvp but because its aoe speck it would never work pve. This game is total garbage when it took a prefectally fine healling class and slaughtered it. It was hard to heal on a CM before now its not even worth filling a WZ slot.

 

Plenty has been posted on this topic. Will any post change the Dev's opinion? I do not think so.

Only dwindling player numbers will....maybe...

[spootoo]

topic is done to death

 

tl;dr: melee dps can now outdamage my heals

 

working as intended

 

i will take a commando healer for any pve run, and i always like seeing them when i queue for warzones.

[Echouza]

not only is the healing nerfed but the gunnery class is too, just as stated above, you die way too fast for your abilities to take about 1.5 seconds to get out. seriously without a tank guarding and a healer healing (or the enemy just not knowing you're there) its impossible to last long enough to even put out any damage.

[Saltydogg]

topic is done to death

 

tl;dr: melee dps can now outdamage my heals

 

working as intended

 

i will take a commando healer for any pve run, and i always like seeing them when i queue for warzones.

 

The topic is not beaten to death. Until the class is changed

[artillerybait]

I think we're in a pretty good spot right now, PVP-wise. I don't see ammo problems that often, and I have figured out how to stay alive against multiple DPS, while still getting some (albeit less) heals out to my team.

 

I have to be much more mobile, turret healing just gets you killed. I use Kolto Bomb quite a bit, as it hits 4 people now and can crit for over 2k. I typically, on 4 people, will get about 4-6k off one bomb. Field Aid I use a lot more, as cleansing DoTs and effects is now better than healing through them.

I don't find myself using my SCCs, because I can't stand and turret heal to make use of the CD-less AMPs.

 

I dont know, those are just a few things I've found that have helped.

I definitely don't feel like the monster tank/healer combo we were before 1.2 (having 4 DPS on us while healing the team), but I definitely feel strong enough to change the tides of games.

[Epyionn]

I think we're in a pretty good spot right now, PVP-wise. I don't see ammo problems that often, and I have figured out how to stay alive against multiple DPS, while still getting some (albeit less) heals out to my team.

 

I have to be much more mobile, turret healing just gets you killed. I use Kolto Bomb quite a bit, as it hits 4 people now and can crit for over 2k. I typically, on 4 people, will get about 4-6k off one bomb. Field Aid I use a lot more, as cleansing DoTs and effects is now better than healing through them.

I don't find myself using my SCCs, because I can't stand and turret heal to make use of the CD-less AMPs.

 

I dont know, those are just a few things I've found that have helped.

I definitely don't feel like the monster tank/healer combo we were before 1.2 (having 4 DPS on us while healing the team), but I definitely feel strong enough to change the tides of games.

 

I've had much the same experience, though my commando healer is only 47. I have had to adjust since 1.2 (I've been leveling her off an on for a couple of months), but the adjustments weren't really that bad. Sure, I can't stand there and heal through a ton of damage anymore, but what fun is there in that?

 

This biggest change I've made is mobility. Learn when to run and when to stay in and heal. Also, let your dps and tanks engage the team before you run in with guns blazing and start casting heals. When you do that you are just asking for the closest marauder or assassin to leap to you or gank you.

 

Finally, spec into the talent that makes you invulnerable to interrupts while reflective shield is up. This talent, along with cleanse has saved me more times than I can count.

 

So, the most important things to remember:

1. Learn when to run.

2. Allow your tanks and dps to engage first.

3. Just try and have fun.

 

Change isn't always bad, so adjust and make due until Bioware finally decides that we could use a minor buff. Until then, please quit beating a dead horse.

Edited April 30, 2012 by Epyionn

[Saltydogg]

I've had much the same experience, though my commando healer is only 47. I have had to adjust since 1.2 (I've been leveling her off an on for a couple of months), but the adjustments weren't really that bad. Sure, I can't stand there and heal through a ton of damage anymore, but what fun is there in that?

 

This biggest change I've made is mobility. Learn when to run and when to stay in and heal. Also, let your dps and tanks engage the team before you run in with guns blazing and start casting heals. When you do that you are just asking for the closest marauder or assassin to leap to you or gank you.

 

Finally, spec into the talent that makes you invulnerable to interrupts while reflective shield is up. This talent, along with cleanse has saved me more times than I can count.

 

So, the most important things to remember:

1. Learn when to run.

2. Allow your tanks and dps to engage first.

3. Just try and have fun.

 

Change isn't always bad, so adjust and make due until Bioware finally decides that we could use a minor buff. Until then, please quit beating a dead horse.

 

This change is bad when everyone is out to get you. Before I could kite around get some heals on me pop back out throw some heals on my target keep us both going in the fight (as it should be) This is not the case anymore. I get one marauder on me and my whole entire fight consists of running and healing just myself. Even then with the spell lock and cc abilities its makes it very difficult just to keep myself up, not to mention anyone else. How is it that people see this change as ok? You know whats fun, its to be actually usefull in a WZ. I guess the bad Commando healers dont get it, they are left alone. Me on the other hand I am focused with so much hatred on my server that I constantly have two people assigned to me to keep me from tossing healing. That was fun by the way, to be able to take a beating but yet still keep other people up around me. Now its a joke. By the way you cant run as a commando healer, tanks and dps can go first but they need some sort of heals and this is not fun right now

[artillerybait]

This change is bad when everyone is out to get you. Before I could kite around get some heals on me pop back out throw some heals on my target keep us both going in the fight (as it should be) This is not the case anymore. I get one marauder on me and my whole entire fight consists of running and healing just myself. Even then with the spell lock and cc abilities its makes it very difficult just to keep myself up, not to mention anyone else. How is it that people see this change as ok? ... ...

 

That was the problem pre-1.2. As healers we could kite 3 DPS, keep ourselves healed, and heal the team. Now, when 1 or 2 (decent) DPS focuses on you, it takes you out of the role of healing the team (or you heal them as you die), which is closer to what it should be.

 

I find we are still pretty difficult to shut down unless focused on by good players.

 

And before you lump me in to the "bad Commandos" category that don't get it, I get focused on in WZs before I've even dropped a heal, because the other teams know me, so I'm in your boat there.

[Bluetickone]

I think we're in a pretty good spot right now, PVP-wise. I don't see ammo problems that often, and I have figured out how to stay alive against multiple DPS, while still getting some (albeit less) heals out to my team.

 

I have to be much more mobile, turret healing just gets you killed. I use Kolto Bomb quite a bit, as it hits 4 people now and can crit for over 2k. I typically, on 4 people, will get about 4-6k off one bomb. Field Aid I use a lot more, as cleansing DoTs and effects is now better than healing through them.

I don't find myself using my SCCs, because I can't stand and turret heal to make use of the CD-less AMPs.

 

I dont know, those are just a few things I've found that have helped.

I definitely don't feel like the monster tank/healer combo we were before 1.2 (having 4 DPS on us while healing the team), but I definitely feel strong enough to change the tides of games.

 

 

Thats the whole friggin point; SCC defines this class' healing and, yes, it basically gets you killed in pvp. Its broken, badly. The whole suggestions of adapt, learn to be mobile is utterly laughable. So you're basically just spamming HS and BI every 18 secs....lol

Edited May 1, 2012 by Bluetickone

[artillerybait]

Thats the whole friggin point; SCC defines this class' healing and, yes, it basically gets you killed in pvp. Its broken, badly. The whole suggestions of adapt, learn to be mobile is utterly laughable. So you're basically just spamming HS and BI every 18 secs....lol

 

There's a big gray area between "Turret healing" and "Just spamming HS and BI". Since turret healing isn't an option against a good team, you do have to be more mobile. Keep yourself off the radar as much as possible. That doesn't mean "Don't use a cast time heal", it means don't stand there and try to get off 8 heals during SCC.

 

Especially now that AMP doesn't reduce MP by 2 ammo, getting the CD'less ones isn't as big a deal, so I keep the 3% heal bonus from a full 30 charges of CSC most of the time.

 

Has healing changed a bit, yes, is it "broken badly", I would have to disagree there, but its all personal opinions

 

Besides, I also throw in a KB with my HS and BI rotation ...

[Saltydogg]

That was the problem pre-1.2. As healers we could kite 3 DPS, keep ourselves healed, and heal the team. Now, when 1 or 2 (decent) DPS focuses on you, it takes you out of the role of healing the team (or you heal them as you die), which is closer to what it should be.

 

I find we are still pretty difficult to shut down unless focused on by good players.

 

And before you lump me in to the "bad Commandos" category that don't get it, I get focused on in WZs before I've even dropped a heal, because the other teams know me, so I'm in your boat there.

 

. See maybe the problem is this game is to casual. We were good pre 1.2 in the hands of people that knew how to play a healer. I would constantly have 3 people on me but because I know how to los and I know my heal rotation I could heal through alot of damage even while healing one other person. I have won 4 and 2 and 5 on 2 fights all the time. Alas that was against undergeared and undertalanted people. Going up against people who actually knew what they were doing was a challange. False casting, changing the heal rotation, more kiting, that stuff was exciting. Now any old scrub with a lightsaber will pick me apart, so what good am I in a WZ if i cant heal anyone else other than myself?

 

I picked a commando because if needed i could do some dps to help burn down a player, they wore heavy armor so they were supposed to take more damage, and the heal tree looked fairly solid. Overall the changes has wasted my time. Grinding this toon to full battlemasters and valor 70+ takes alot of free time that I will never get back. I refuse to roll a ops healer because they will be hit with the nerf bat next. How do you figure its right to let a light armor supposed dps class out heal a commando healer? This is not soemthing the community wanted, they said that the gear would off set the changes, they pretty much lied to our faces. The commando healer and their gunny tree for dps is pretty much shattered. So whats left to do? Well I tell you I rollled the most OP class right now. Welcome Saltydog Sith Marauder #3556323166867896564563

[MrHotter]

It takes so little time to gear up for PvP at 50 that you don't have to play just one character to 'keep up with the Jonses'.

 

When one class is pissing you off, switch to another. If you are not 50 on the other character that's no problem because the 10-49 zones are more forgiving than 50 PvP.

[affirm]

I can't get my head around this "you have to move around" explanation to the nerf we got in 1.2.

 

You have to be stationary to heal as a combat medic. Our two largest heals require you to stand still. The kolta bomb and other insta-heal skill is not a replacement for these two heals. When players do 1000+ in damage per hit, a heal that does less than that isn't helping. (Yes, obviously if you get a critical heal it will be for more.) To be a healer with a trooper you need to stand still.

 

"Moving around" doesn't change the targeting system in this game. Targets are locked in and no amount of WASD smashing will "un-target" you. This is part of the RPG model. This isn't a first person shooter. The closest it comes is that you have to keep your target in front of you (by front I mean not in that 30 degree cone directly behind you). Moving around won't keep melee characters from hitting you. "Balance" dictates that ranged damage cannot be greater than melee damage. (The "P" in RPG where we pretend that bringing a knife to a gun fight isn't a stupid idea.) As a result, the only thing you can do is "try" to keep distance between you, but this is often a fruitless endeavor (see "Balance").

 

Healing requires being stationary, and targeting isn't affected by moving around, so what's wrong with "turret healing." Why shouldn't you be able to "turret heal" if the game is setup that way? Further, why aren't more people complaining when the changes make that setup broken?

Edited May 2, 2012 by affirm

[Leiralei]

Commando healing is simply not designed for pvp. Everything we do can be interrupted aside from bacta, and we have no way to get away from melee. Without dual spec, there's no point even playing one in pvp if you need to be a healer for pve for your guild.

 

On my server I usually get focused by 3-5 people the entire match. As a healer, I got 1 medal per match (2.5k heal) since 1.2 dropped. Before that I got usually 7-8. I'm not saying I'm the best ever, but I am saying that my fun shouldn't be dependent on the other team being morons. I switched to dps and in same gear now getting 5-6 medals per match.

 

Sure I've done well in some matches after the patch, when the enemies are completely clueless. It's not fun to win only because the other team is simply bad. Look. They know it's not fun like this, so obviously they intend the game to not be fun. *Shrug*

 

Skill should be more important than gear and class. But that's now how Bioware wants the game to be. So respec to dps, have a pet tank follow you around on a leash every match, or quit. Those are our options.

[Syricide]

Commando healing is simply not designed for pvp. Everything we do can be interrupted aside from bacta, and we have no way to get away from melee. Without dual spec, there's no point even playing one in pvp if you need to be a healer for pve for your guild.

 

On my server I usually get focused by 3-5 people the entire match. As a healer, I got 1 medal per match (2.5k heal) since 1.2 dropped. Before that I got usually 7-8. I'm not saying I'm the best ever, but I am saying that my fun shouldn't be dependent on the other team being morons. I switched to dps and in same gear now getting 5-6 medals per match.

 

Sure I've done well in some matches after the patch, when the enemies are completely clueless. It's not fun to win only because the other team is simply bad. Look. They know it's not fun like this, so obviously they intend the game to not be fun. *Shrug*

 

Skill should be more important than gear and class. But that's now how Bioware wants the game to be. So respec to dps, have a pet tank follow you around on a leash every match, or quit. Those are our options.

 

Maybe you just need to play a simpler class, It sounds like you do not know how to pvp with a CM properly.

Edited May 3, 2012 by Syricide

[affirm]

Maybe you just need to play a simpler class, It sounds like you do not know how to pvp with a CM properly.

 

There is no shame in admitting something is wrong with combat medic. You don't have to defend it like it's your first born child.

[Saltydogg]

Maybe you just need to play a simpler class, It sounds like you do not know how to pvp with a CM properly.

 

LOL what a smug little comment. Why do you think all the imps that had BH healers rolled a OPs healer. Same with Pubs. They have better healing and better survivability now due to the patch. How the hell is that possible? They have a insta 4-5k heal where as ours is lucky to break 3 on a crit. I want a challenge in pvp but i also dont want to be a damn punching bag. It sounds like you need to play a CM Medic against good pvp premades. If you do pvp alot then maybe you will notice the lack of Commandos in general. Grav round has been shut down so there goes a whole dps tree and the heal tree got a pretty bad nerf. Sorry but you are just plain wrong

[Syricide]

I should have been more specific - What is your definition of success / failure for this class/spec? topping the HPS table or winning WZs? This isn’t a spreadsheet class - You have to play as a unit to succeed; and success is defined by winning WZs, not topping DPS or HPS tables. Topping the DPS/HPS tables in Huttball is a tertiary priority to controlling mid and establishing lanes.

 

If your gauge of success is the metric of an instant heal or topping the HPS table’ then back to my original comment - you need to roll something else. Understand what you want to do- properly played CMs win WarZones and there is a difference

 

in regards to going against more pre-mades comment - all of the major guilds on both factions all know eachother and we face off regularly. in that we know the rosters of each just as they know I am a CM and I am usually targeted immediately. This isn't the thread for tactics but it plays out like a chess match; I will go in with a 23K HP Conquerer VG as my guard and I wil initially focus on keeping up cross heals and their guards as the burstier healers are focusing on keeping up the DPS.

 

I'm not trying to be smug or condescending; but if this class isn't fun for you; roll something else. but don't tell me CMs don't win WZs - I clash with our servers best and well, we win more than we lose.

Edited May 4, 2012 by Syricide
grammar

[Arakhian]

On my server I usually get focused by 3-5 people the entire match. As a healer, I got 1 medal per match (2.5k heal) since 1.2 dropped. Before that I got usually 7-8. I'm not saying I'm the best ever, but I am saying that my fun shouldn't be dependent on the other team being morons. I switched to dps and in same gear now getting 5-6 medals per match.

 

Is that really true? I only started pvping (in full recruit gear) after 1.2, and the first 5 games or so were 0-1 medal games, given that I was learning how to play pvp as a CM and had lousy gear compared to most others. But after about 100 games and in half battlemaster gear I normally get 5-6 medals in a bad team, and 7+ in a good one. I don't see myself as a good pvper either. This is my experience in any case.

 

People need to realise that keeping 2-3 players hitting on you for 5-10 sec and then dying is not necessarily a failure. During that time the rest of your team may have captured stuff, killed of a lot of the opposing teams healers/dps and so on. Of course, from time to time you will get focused and killed in no time by 2-3 people, but then those are likely very good and well-geared people, and I don't really think we should be able to stay alive for long in those situations.

[Aaoogaa]

 

People need to realise that keeping 2-3 players hitting on you for 5-10 sec and then dying is not necessarily a failure. During that time the rest of your team may have captured stuff, killed of a lot of the opposing teams healers/dps and so on. Of course, from time to time you will get focused and killed in no time by 2-3 people, but then those are likely very good and well-geared people, and I don't really think we should be able to stay alive for long in those situations.

 

It is a failure when a dps class will live just as long without heals due to cooldowns AND do damage to the other team. All we do is a) heal ourselves and die b) heal our team for a couple seconds and die.

 

I cannot count the number of times when 2 of use running guardian dps and sentinal dps come across BM geared healer/tank combos and just destroy them. It isn't even a fight. Focus on the healer and watch the tank die from guard damage then the healer dies. This takes about 10 seconds or so. The only healer that has a chance is scoundrel/op. They can extend their death to about 20 seconds (or they vanish and slink away).