Market system is useless, what is the point of 2 day limit?

[Verce]

there's no point putting anything up for sale until the weekend. There simply isn't enough people to buy the stuff during the week.

 

No one buy's gear on the GTN. People only buy Orange gear and mods for the gear. They should just make everything orange and be done with it. ..

 

Not true for my server, Hydian Way EU.

 

I am selling a lot of purple rating 126 crafted armor for all classes, as well as augments and orange augmented gear.

 

The purple armor is far from useless. it is in fact extremely easy to make and is on par with columi gear, albeit less health. Best way of gearing up fresh 50's and companions.

[GnatB]

The point of the 2 day limit was (assuming more people were playing) to eat up more listing fees, a gold sink.

 

In WoW, 48 hours is more than long enough to sell your stuff, but in SWTOR, a week would be more like it, given the lack of players, at least on both of my servers.

 

We just need more people playing (per server), is the dilly-o, yo.

 

Except that you get your depost back. Given the assumption that far more people play during the weekend than during the weekday, a 2 day limit severely limits the stuff on the GTN for those who play during the week. especially the tail end of the week. At least with a 5 or 6 day limit they could pick through what hadn't yet sold. With a 2 day limit, there's presumably just only stuff being sold by other weekday players.

[ludakaf]

problems

-to put something for sale you need to put 20-30% fee that later is mailed back to you -.-

-to find how much something cost, you need to write its name. ( for something that may cost under 1k it simply pointless efort)

 

Solution:

- copy-paste auctionator(wow addon that in my eyes is the only reason wow have economy) to the game. Markets will get quadriple amount of items when people can post stuff in 2 clicks.

- remake fee, so its 2-3% of the wanted amount and the rest is taken from the gold mailed from the buyer.This will let people have more free ingame money to spend.

[Gokkus]

As someone with a lot of alts...I would prefer to be able to put up my gear for longer periods of time. I dont really see the point of the 2 day system either, with no auction attached to it, theres no real reason.

[BucMan]

There is no penalty for listing an item that doesn't sell. You get the item and your listing price back. SO if something doesn't sell, drop the price and retry, or if you are pretty certain the price WILL sell, do it again. While there are some things that sell well, alot of stuff doesn't. The orange armor thing does wonders for making everyone look different. But it kills the green/blue level item resale market. The companions help that somewhat, but not a lot of folks take the time to purchase gear for them.

[SentinelDranoel]

Good thread, the community has convinced me that the 2 day limit is a good idea. I have played MMO's with exorbitant prices. In fact, I even set the market price on a particular outfit set in one game(DFO), and watched as people bought the outfit and resold it at a much higher price. With the 2 day limit, people will have a harder time playing the market with different people logging in at different times. Someone can come around in 24 hours from now and sell something at a reasonable price. The problem is I might miss that awesome gear piece from time to time, but I could always ask people on the fleet or post a message in the server forums.

[Itukaaj]

4 dayswould be kewl.

[Havokk]

I like the time limit. It stops the stuff that doesn't sell from clogging it up even more (like white items - seriously folks, stop posting white items for sale!). I would like to see it increased to 3 days, however, that way I can post items on Friday night (my time) and have them in the trade network all weekend in both my timezone and the US timezones.

 

As for the bidding, please no. Auctions work fine when you have the time to sit and watch the bids (like buying a house or some fish at the market). They don't work when all you want is to buy something and move on. Personally, if there is not a "Buy Now" button them I move on. I don't want to spend the next 6 hours on the fleet bidding, losing, retrieving cash from the mailbox then bidding again.

 

 

Alternatively: Let us have an autobid system.

 

Alternatively (and better): let us bid from anywhere, using our holocommunicators. If Dark Lords of the Sith can contact my Jedi Knight via holocom then why can't she contact a trade network?

 

Even better: let us have a trade network for requests. I want to be able to post "I want 20 [Desh], I'm paying 15cr each" and have sellers of Desh choose to fulfil my order request.

[Kubernetic]

I'd be okay with extending the limit to 3 days so that you could cover the weekend with your products, as some players here have suggested.

 

I also expect to see some kind of bidding system (with a Buy It Now option) in the system at some point.

 

I also expect to see an upgrade where we can begin looking at the market values of items as they change over time. Entropia Universe has just such a system, and before you buy an item, you can examine it and look at the market sales trends for that item throughout its history, some items dating back a decade in the game.

 

Such an intelligence system would really let players know whether the price they're paying for an item is significantly overpriced or not. In the Entropia system, you can resort the market graph by day, week, month, year, or decade. It's a time-based line graph that shows every price point ever sold.

 

It's a fantastic system, and all of the metrics should be available to the SWTOR devs if they're keeping a master item sales list with every price that item has sold at and the time and date. If they AREN'T keeping that kind of info, they should be, soon.

[Sotaudi]

The idea of an auction system is fine, but not the way MMOs generally implement it. The problem is that, in a real auction, the auctioneer doesn't just take bids; he determines if there are any more offers coming in. Once he feels no one is going to place another bid, he ends the auction. In an MMO auction system, there is no auctioneer to decide if more bids are forthcoming. They typically place an artificial end to the bidding by means of a set timer. Once that timer expires, all bidding ceases whether people are actively bidding or not.

 

The problem is that this encourages an abuse of the system because people know that any bid made before the last few moments of the auction is a wasted bid. This is because, unlike a real system where the highest bid is the last bid, this system makes the last bid the highest bid (i.e., even if someone places a higher bid one millisecond too late, the bid just before the timer expires wins). Thus, only bid that matters is the last bid, so people won't even bother making a legitimate offer early in the bidding process (say, in the first day of a two day auction). They just wait until the last few moments of an auction and place an incrementally higher minimum bid hoping that no one else will be able to bid before the timer expires. Thus, you are no longer working an auction system, but a time lottery. In fact, this kind of system discourages a true competitive bidding system by rewarding people for holding off their bid so that no one can bid against them and force them to place a higher bid in return. It all comes down to whomever is fortunate enough to press the bid button last, not who was willing to outbid other players. The last bid wins the auction even if there were thousands of players willing to pay more.

 

I am completely against any auction system that does not address this issue. No auction system should be implemented unless the timer for the end of the auction extends each time someone makes a bid within the last minute or so of the auction. How ever long this buffer period is, the timer should extend a reasonable amount of time to give people a chance to review the latest bid and place a counter bid, and it should keep extending until no one bids within that same buffer period of the new end time. As long as higher bids keep coming in, the auction keeps going. Once bidding stops, the auction ends. People can still make minimum bid raises, but they are not rewarded for doing so by having lucky timing stop any further competing bids, and items will have a chance to sell at legitimate price.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Sotaudi

[NermalDetonator]

I like the time limit. It stops the stuff that doesn't sell from clogging it up even more (like white items - seriously folks, stop posting white items for sale!). I would like to see it increased to 3 days, however, that way I can post items on Friday night (my time) and have them in the trade network all weekend in both my timezone and the US timezones.

 

As for the bidding, please no. Auctions work fine when you have the time to sit and watch the bids (like buying a house or some fish at the market). They don't work when all you want is to buy something and move on. Personally, if there is not a "Buy Now" button them I move on. I don't want to spend the next 6 hours on the fleet bidding, losing, retrieving cash from the mailbox then bidding again.

 

Not to mention it slows down the game even more.

 

I like the 2 day market. It keeps it constantly churning, and frees us from zillions of listings of 2 bondar crystals for 10k...

Edited May 17, 2012 by NermalDetonator

[StrykerOne]

I can see it being a problem on servers with low GTN activity. For example, suppose that on your server there are an average of 2-3 purple starship shield generators posted to the GTN per week. If you need one you could be checking the GTN for quite a few days before getting lucky, especially if you don't play daily. If an item gets posted multiple times a day and you play 5-7 days a week then it shouldn't be hard to find it, but if you play 3 days a week and the item you are looking for gets posted only once every few days (and there's only enough demand to sell one every few days, so some still expire) then it gets a lot harder.

 

And yes, supply and demand really are that low on some servers. I used to play on one where you were lucky to see one single purple ship component (of any type) over the course of checking the market several times a day for an entire weekend.

[Kubernetic]

The idea of an auction system is fine, but not the way MMOs generally implement it. The problem is that, in a real auction, the auctioneer doesn't just take bids; he determines if there are any more offers coming in. Once he feels no one is going to place another bid, he ends the auction. In an MMO auction system, there is no auctioneer to decide if more bids are forthcoming. They typically place an artificial end to the bidding by means of a set timer. Once that timer expires, all bidding ceases whether people are actively bidding or not.

 

The problem is that this encourages an abuse of the system because people know that any bid made before the last few moments of the auction is a wasted bid. This is because, unlike a real system where the highest bid is the last bid, this system makes the last bid the highest bid (i.e., even if someone places a higher bid one millisecond too late, the bid just before the timer expires wins). Thus, only bid that matters is the last bid, so people won't even bother making a legitimate offer early in the bidding process (say, in the first day of a two day auction). They just wait until the last few moments of an auction and place an incrementally higher minimum bid hoping that no one else will be able to bid before the timer expires. Thus, you are no longer working an auction system, but a time lottery. In fact, this kind of system discourages a true competitive bidding system by rewarding people for holding off their bid so that no one can bid against them and force them to place a higher bid in return. It all comes down to whomever is fortunate enough to press the bid button last, not who was willing to outbid other players. The last bid wins the auction even if there were thousands of players willing to pay more.

 

I am completely against any auction system that does not address this issue. No auction system should be implemented unless the timer for the end of the auction extends each time someone makes a bid within the last minute or so of the auction. How ever long this buffer period is, the timer should extend a reasonable amount of time to give people a chance to review the latest bid and place a counter bid, and it should keep extending until no one bids within that same buffer period of the new end time. As long as higher bids keep coming in, the auction keeps going. Once bidding stops, the auction ends. People can still make minimum bid raises, but they are not rewarded for doing so by having lucky timing stop any further competing bids, and items will have a chance to sell at legitimate price.

 

Entropia's auction process takes care of this by extending the deadline by 5 minutes with every new bid that comes in.

 

You are correct... people will often not bid until the last few moments, but then the bidding can stay open for hours after the deadline if people are still bidding.

 

When the capital ships went on sale last year, bidding went on for hours for them as people slowly cranked the bids up to as much as $9,000.00 USD for each one. Some would piecemeal it, just bidding a few extra dollars, then someone would come along and drop another $100 down, or $250, or even $1,000 during the process... and each time, it would extend for 5 more minutes so that others could continue bidding.

 

It was definitely not set up like eBay's process, where you can snipe things at the last moment (which is usually how I purcahse, LOL). I'll literally wait and let that sucker refresh until there are like 2 seconds left and then place my intended killer bid 2 seconds before the auction closes. That way, no one has a chance to see that I've paid more than they did and have a chance to re-evaluate their value of the item.

 

As long as you make each new incoming bid extend the time by a certain amount, that can't happen.

[Lu_Bei]

Um, how does a two day limit on posting an item affect a buyer in any way? I'm very confused here.

Less types of items available on the market. An item doesn't sell well? Good luck EVER selling it. An item doesn't sell well? Good luck ever BUYING it. Why? Because that person isn't going to keep re-listing, they're going to sell it to the vendor after one or two tries.

[FITorion]

Not true for my server, Hydian Way EU.

 

I am selling a lot of purple rating 126 crafted armor for all classes, as well as augments and orange augmented gear.

 

The purple armor is far from useless. it is in fact extremely easy to make and is on par with columi gear, albeit less health. Best way of gearing up fresh 50's and companions.

 

Key word there ... 50's.

 

No one between lvl 1 and say 45 uses the GTN for anything but mods. There is no market for gear during the level up process because the level up process is too fast and too easy.

[Deewe]

The idea of an auction system is fine, but not the way MMOs generally implement it. The problem is that, in a real auction, the auctioneer doesn't just take bids; he determines if there are any more offers coming in. Once he feels no one is going to place another bid, he ends the auction. In an MMO auction system, there is no auctioneer to decide if more bids are forthcoming. They typically place an artificial end to the bidding by means of a set timer. Once that timer expires, all bidding ceases whether people are actively bidding or not.

 

The problem is that this encourages an abuse of the system because people know that any bid made before the last few moments of the auction is a wasted bid. This is because, unlike a real system where the highest bid is the last bid, this system makes the last bid the highest bid (i.e., even if someone places a higher bid one millisecond too late, the bid just before the timer expires wins). Thus, only bid that matters is the last bid, so people won't even bother making a legitimate offer early in the bidding process (say, in the first day of a two day auction). They just wait until the last few moments of an auction and place an incrementally higher minimum bid hoping that no one else will be able to bid before the timer expires. Thus, you are no longer working an auction system, but a time lottery. In fact, this kind of system discourages a true competitive bidding system by rewarding people for holding off their bid so that no one can bid against them and force them to place a higher bid in return. It all comes down to whomever is fortunate enough to press the bid button last, not who was willing to outbid other players. The last bid wins the auction even if there were thousands of players willing to pay more.

 

I am completely against any auction system that does not address this issue. No auction system should be implemented unless the timer for the end of the auction extends each time someone makes a bid within the last minute or so of the auction. How ever long this buffer period is, the timer should extend a reasonable amount of time to give people a chance to review the latest bid and place a counter bid, and it should keep extending until no one bids within that same buffer period of the new end time. As long as higher bids keep coming in, the auction keeps going. Once bidding stops, the auction ends. People can still make minimum bid raises, but they are not rewarded for doing so by having lucky timing stop any further competing bids, and items will have a chance to sell at legitimate price.

Indeed a proxy bidding system is still the best one. As long as people are keeping bidding the auction doesn't end. IMHO the 5 min is a bit too short especially since we have to be next to the GTN to be able to bid. Even a 1h timer is too short as for example if you are doing a flashpoint you might not be able to get back in time.

 

So as stated before:

• Proxy biding with a long timer (few hours)
  
• Access to the GTN (and emails) from anywhere through our datapads
  

 

 

Key word there ... 50's.

 

No one between lvl 1 and say 45 uses the GTN for anything but mods. There is no market for gear during the level up process because the level up process is too fast and too easy.

That and because quests rewards are very good. So good that it's not even worth crafting for ourselves.

I did and it just slowed my leveling without giving me something interesting.

Top that with the fact we don't get enough credits while leveling to buy things from the AH unless we already capped an alt and use it as sugar daddy.

Edited May 17, 2012 by Deewe

[Rhysling]

WoW has a 2 day limit.

 

It works out fine.

 

Limit is 5 days.