Sniper lacks positioning possibilities in WZs

[TufassNailz]

I've been reading forums for a while now. I love my sniper - god knows I do! I don't do 300k damage or 500k damage like otehrs, but I like shooting things - after a day at work get into cover and shoot randoly (maybe a reason why I don't do max damage) PEW PEW!

 

But regarding cover - and since we are quite dependent from that - speaking form a pvp point of view only there are almost no good cover places in WZs - LOS is a paiin in the rear already and since our range is nothing that can't be overcome easily I'd totally wished there would be more sniper friendly positions in WZs. That would almost balance out all other issues we have.

 

e.g. Turrets in Civil War:

 

you can t position yourself without having a blind spot side you can't hit another player. Or you die take the lift down again and have to run up the stairs cover down and start shooting ...

 

You don't give us 60m tange? Fine - then give us at least sniper friendly positioning!

[-Fal-]

There are plenty of places to kill people from.

[TufassNailz]

Come on that can tbe your reply - I know there are plenty of places to kill my favorite ofc being the elveated balcony for middle. - but thats exactly what I think is need more over all pvp maps ...

[Livelyhound]

Wait till you try the new, novare coast, map. It's tiny and the main battle for the middle node is ... wait for it ... on top of a hill. The other two nodes are also on raised areas but not so badly.

 

That's right to get los you have to run up to the 10m square (approx) kill zone that everyone else is in. Not only that but the capping point is surrounded on 3 sides so if people are capping inside you can only attack from the open face which is you guessed it, pointed toward that 10m square kill zone I mentioned. You can't stand in that direction further back, say 30m, and shoot inside because there is a massive gun turret nicely blocking the line of sight. Stand too far back anyway and the slope of the hill wil block you. So much for ranged advantage.

 

On the flip side if you control the mid, you can stand on top and shoot poeple on the way up. But then from that point of view it may aswell be flat, although there should be fewer los issue as the hillsides have few (if any) obstacles to hide behind.

 

I don't have a sniper on the PTS just my lowbie powertech but I can already see a number of inherent problems for a sniper in NC. The one saving grace is that you might get some good numbers from a nicely timed Orbital Strike, although as it isnt instant like death from above your less likely to do well from it. To do this you have to be completely exposed out in the open in a kill zone however

[Cyberfairy]

The BEST Sniper position ever is in Civil War! Stand on top of any of the turrets, does it make you a target? Sure does. Can you hit almost anyone from that vantage point? You bet. Hook up with a healer to defend a point and you can squash most attacks, or at least give them enough casualties for your backup to mop up the rest easily.

 

Now Voidstar on the other hand... a nightmare... It's ok when you're the attacker because you can use range to your advantage, but defense bleh.

[DroidDreamer]

Yes, Civil War is less than ideal. On the side points, if you position yourself on the edge of the platform you have a great vantage point and LOS but then you have your back to the control point and there's nothing stopping a stealth class from sneaking behind you and capping the point. If you position yourself so you can better see anyone capping the point, you break LOS on bad guys moving up to the point and lose your hit-them-at-range abilities.

 

That's why it takes at least two people to guard the point on the sides... but that rarely happens because people want to farm kills, get bored etc. even though the path to victory is get two points and then defend. The middle point has better cover options (the stairs on the ground level, the balcony, even the lip of the platform).

 

Voidstar is not really worth discussing. As a defender, I often find myself running to get back to the defense point with attackers in front of me... not much room for a defensive stand there much less getting into hard cover.

 

Huttball is good but LOS is your friend more than hard cover. Use LOS to break the channeled abilities of your foes, run out and drop interrogation probe, corrosive dart, shatter shot or nades if the bad guys are bunched up, then retreat behind LOS cover which can be as simple as moving elsewhere on the platform. A lot of the hard cover on Huttball prevents *you* from having LOS on the ball carrier and his buddies.

[Lithy]

Now Voidstar on the other hand... a nightmare... It's ok when you're the attacker because you can use range to your advantage, but defense bleh.

 

Just stand off to one side and have a tank guard u and a healer sit on top of u you'll be fine. did that today. its super fun being invincible

[Livelyhound]

Just stand off to one side and have a tank guard u and a healer sit on top of u you'll be fine. did that today. its super fun being invincible

 

Love it,

 

Have two supporting players and you're a viable class...

 

Tell me how many other class have to have two others in support?

 

Is it one none, two, seven, or 15, I forget?

 

/facepalm

[durvas]

A lot of positioning/los problems could be solved if casts didn't break on those small things like someone running behind boxes in voidstar or the consoles in civil war (not hiding, just running from one place to another). IMO, if the cast starts and ends and you can see the person, it should go off. Los is also our friend more than foe, I think. If we don't use it ourselves, we get blown up even faster.

[Kalliadies]

Civil War Vantage points

 

• -Mid Balcony’s
  

• -set up on top of a capture node. Takes a certain approach to get on top but it will make you very hard to kill for melees.
  

• -any piece of high ground you can get. The rubble heaps are good if you are fighting off point (don’t know why you are. Just saying)
  

 

 

Voidstar Defending

 

• First set of doors is a *****. The surroundings work against you here and as you are backed into a corner.
  

• The second doors have a high ground (ramp) in between them with LoS to both doors. If they come after you, you can manoeuvre to knock them into the abyss
  
  • 
    

  [*]Last doors aren’t ideal. There is no “good” vantage point for LoS on both doors. Plenty of obstacles for cover/kiting however.

 

Voidstar attacking

 

Pretty straight forward. You can fall back as much as you need.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Kalliadies

[ShakesMcQueen]

I find I have my best PvP rounds in Voidstar, actually. People are usually so focused on either getting the doors, or keeping people away from the doors, that they leave me alone behind cover, off the the side - where I'm free to do what I like, and cast the odd Orbital Strike in front of the doors. It's byootiful.

 

In the event someone comes after you. just stun them and run to into the fray - someone will generally pick them up for you as they come running into the fray as well. Then resume your place around the perimeter of the door. 90% of the rounds I have where I break 400k damage, are Voidstar.

 

Civil War is fun as a sniper too. The balcony surrounding the middle node is a great place to hang out, and if someone comes up after you that you can't handle alone - just hop down and switch to the other side, and hope someone picks him up as he comes across the middle after you.

 

Sitting on top of the nodes I will also do occasionally, but I find myself getting caught in AoE too often, since most of the heavy fighting is done around the node. It's a good place to be if only one or two of you are guarding it, though.

 

Huttball can be a real pain, because if you're not careful about what catwalk you're hanging out on, you can inadvertently become a jumping point for a ball carrier, or a pass target. Which seems kind of broken to me from a gameplay perspective, since snipers are all about sitting above or off to the side from the main fray. And because the battle for the ball is constantly moving around the map, I find myself running to a new position too often, which hurts my damage output.

Edited April 4, 2012 by ShakesMcQueen

[Lithy]

Love it,

 

Have two supporting players and you're a viable class...

 

Tell me how many other class have to have two others in support?

 

Is it one none, two, seven, or 15, I forget?

 

/facepalm

 

 

It was just a joke for defending on voidstar, other than that positioning is easy and I almost never die.... I'm sorry but if on huttball and alderaan and MOST of voidstar you can't find good positioning... no amount of forum posts will help.

[TufassNailz]

Hey mate ofc I find positioning in the WZs that was not my point. I stated that all the positions are not ideal! Being a sniper I still bear in mind that I need to find a spot somewhere elevated to be able to shoot things at Max Distance (in my ideal rainbow pony world). In VS yoiu roll into cover behind the crates and if at least one of the other team knows what he is doing he is coming after you like the wrath of god, knocking you out of your cover snareing you rooting you stuff like that.

 

I don t say youi have to agree with my point of view but at least don t belittle me.

Peace

M.

[Livelyhound]

It was just a joke for defending on voidstar, other than that positioning is easy and I almost never die.... I'm sorry but if on huttball and alderaan and MOST of voidstar you can't find good positioning... no amount of forum posts will help.

 

I can find positioning thanks, the trouble is that we have a small pvp population on my server and everyone now knows where the snipers position. There are four of us. The other three now use my spots. We chat, we all have the same problem. We're known and sniper pvp defence is zero, especially if the opposition have a stealth class. We are constantly targetted. We move in pairs and focus targets whenever we're on the same teams.

 

Look, I'm lucky to get 30seconds alone in huttball. That means you either take the deaths a lot, or you fight away from where you need to be and have no real effect on the game. In alderaan there are some nice positions that EVERYBODY knows about, then its just a case of how much you annoy the other team whether they come kill you or not. Voidstar is the one zone where you can be left alone a bit because the objectives are so much more forced on you that people headbang the doors a lot. The new Novare Coast, well good luck is all I'll say.

 

If you almost never die, I would suggest upping your damage and getting known.

 

At the end of the day the positioning options we have run out fast because the maps are not designed with us in mind. For example how hard would it have been to put in a tower in alderaan with a spiral staircase to get to the top. As we have leap to protection it would be a great sniper spot, it would take us time to get to the top, we have no run buffs... but once there it would take an effort to get us out, whereas at the moment if someone wants us gone, 3 seconds later we're gone. How about a ledge with a path up a hillside round the back. If we take the time to get up there we deserve the bonus of being hard to reach and having ranged advantage. As a sniper you rely on being out the way, hidden and picking a target off before the know whats hit them, then you reposition, and repeat. You cant do this in SWTOR becuase we have the worst of movement abilities, we have no stealth, we dont have enough damage and the maps are too limited in scope for multiple repositions.

 

/sorry rant off.

 

Look I'm not saying snipers are useless, but we are subpar. Positioning and the lack of really viable sniper locations is a part of that.

Edited April 6, 2012 by Livelyhound

[Livelyhound]

Oh and going back to the original post.

 

Take the middle set of sandbags on the paltform above the ball respawn in Huttball. If you take the roll-to-cover position there, you can't actually hit anything below you because the sandbags los you. How stupid is that for a cover point from a map design point of view.

 

This is not the only case like that.

Edited April 6, 2012 by Livelyhound

[Upurss]

I've been reading forums for a while now. I love my sniper - god knows I do! I don't do 300k damage or 500k damage like otehrs, but I like shooting things - after a day at work get into cover and shoot randoly (maybe a reason why I don't do max damage) PEW PEW!

 

But regarding cover - and since we are quite dependent from that - speaking form a pvp point of view only there are almost no good cover places in WZs - LOS is a paiin in the rear already and since our range is nothing that can't be overcome easily I'd totally wished there would be more sniper friendly positions in WZs. That would almost balance out all other issues we have.

 

e.g. Turrets in Civil War:

 

you can t position yourself without having a blind spot side you can't hit another player. Or you die take the lift down again and have to run up the stairs cover down and start shooting ...

 

You don't give us 60m tange? Fine - then give us at least sniper friendly positioning!

 

lol please give me a break man....i've seen snipers sitting on walls shooting people in cover and of course nobody can charge them so they just sit there ignored killing everyone

 

I know you want to be able to shoot people across the map from some location nobody can get to before you kill them, but unfortunately for you this is a balanced game

[Dasamukha]

You ratted me out. Civil War top of the wall dividing mid from either east or west depending. You can support the mid, forcing people to one side. You kill the healer standing back trying to heal. You can't be leaped at. Stealthers don't normally come up to get you. If you get focused, you jump down and heal up. Try again. If your side is attacked, you support your side.

 

In lost game the other night, I had 3 pubs trying to figure out how to get me. And I had three targets for my OB. That really poured a little salt in the wound.

 

I am sorry no point is invulnerable in huttball. Some are better than others, but no point is invulnerable.

 

Finally in Void Star. Support the attack from the sides. Pick a side and stay with it. You have natural cover and are in OB range for the door. Of course you will get focused fired. You are the only class that can literally wreck their entire team in 10 seconds or less. Your team is supporting you, unless they are complete idiots. If alone melee breaks off the attack to come and get you, well, he is out of the game unless and until he can kill me. Make it hard for him. One he has to run in and break through all of you shields, stuns and knock backs. And he has to hope that I don't kill him in the process. Sometimes they get me, and sometimes they don't. That's called balance.

[Kiri]

I've been reading forums for a while now. I love my sniper - god knows I do! I don't do 300k damage or 500k damage like otehrs, but I like shooting things - after a day at work get into cover and shoot randoly (maybe a reason why I don't do max damage) PEW PEW!

 

But regarding cover - and since we are quite dependent from that - speaking form a pvp point of view only there are almost no good cover places in WZs - LOS is a paiin in the rear already and since our range is nothing that can't be overcome easily I'd totally wished there would be more sniper friendly positions in WZs. That would almost balance out all other issues we have.

 

e.g. Turrets in Civil War:

 

you can t position yourself without having a blind spot side you can't hit another player. Or you die take the lift down again and have to run up the stairs cover down and start shooting ...

 

You don't give us 60m tange? Fine - then give us at least sniper friendly positioning!

 

What you are essentially saying is that everyone lacks positioning, because Snipers are not any more dependent on the terrain than anyone else. You can crouch in place and get the full benefits of cover - as soon as you take your advanced class. I never use the green cover spots. I simply changed F to crouch in place.