About the Sorc nerf (1.2)

[Scyrar]

lol there are classes that have NEVER had a 5k medal. The majority of snipers, gunslingers, mauraders, sentinels don't get 5k medals and you are worried about missing out on your auto 5k medal?

 

About what "auto 5k medal" are you talking? I'm valor rank 76(so played alot of pvp), did usually 400-650k dmg in a bg (know how to do dmg) and NEVER got the 5k dmg medal.

So many clueless people in this forum talking about sorc.

 

@Op I agree. With the Wrath/chain lightning nerf they destroyed our hybrid/aoe burst spec and are forcing us to go madness. I always played in every mmo(and diablo) a mage/sorc and don't want to play a dotting warlock. But now I have no other choice. So Bioware ist destroying a whole playstysle, because some bad players started whining instead of trying to get better. But to be honest, I don't care much. I have not logged in since Mass Effect 3 released and after this a whole playstele destroying nerf I have no more motivation to play this game.

[tekhiun]

I got infringed last time I called someone an idiot, so ill elaborate.

 

Lightning strike does less dps then force lighting spam, so just casting it reduces our dps. Casting chain lightning with a wrath proc gave us 20% more damage on our only real damaging ability.

 

Crushing darkness did not gain a 20% buff to damage, the first portion of crushing darkness already gained the 20% buff from wrath, the change ends up being about a 10% buff on a spell that we only cast when it procs from spamming force lightning which took roughly a 6% damage decrease (when you include everything) and deals the bulk of all of our damage.

 

Overall we now do less damage, not a whole bunch less damage but still less damage, and we almost entirely lose the aoe portion of that same damage.

 

The only spec that remains basically unchanged is the lol31lightning spec. 31 madness comes off roughly even but slightly down.

 

 

you don't seem to understand what the word add means. It is not a synonym to replace.

[fungihoujo]

this...

 

Sorcs- our ability to do burst dps in any viable spec is gone, our ability to do decent aoe damage in any viable spec is gone.

 

Other people- you're still an OP dps class cuz of heals, bubble, sprint and knockback

 

Sorcs- so, your only counter to sorcs wanting to be able to do comparable DAMAGE in a DAMAGE spec is that sorcs have good HEALING/DEFENSIVE abilities? And oh, let's see how OP that healing ability is- hmm, 3 second heal.... for about 2.2k health, if nobody interrupts... good thing 7 of 8 ACs have an interrupt, and the other one can do two TMs in those 3 seconds for 3k each.

 

That's why we don't have either burst or AoE... we have a heal that a blind clicker can interrupt.

 

YES, balance achieved!

[FlamingShade]

It seems that most of the replies are not made of full knowledge and insight of the sorcerer class.

I have been playing sorcerer since the beta, and I realized also the great impact coming with the 1.2 changes. It is not as terrible as the OP thinks. BUT he is right on 1 single point concerning the Wrath nerf. He is wrong about the others:

-Force bending: is a healing capability, no impact on burst damage

-Force surge: same as above, and was a near-to-zero use

-Force lightning: gains less from talents, but this lost is compensated by Affliction being up with same talent.

 

In terms of final DPS, full madness or lighting/madness are both equal, but completely different play-style. Full madness is based on a combination of debuffs and dots on the target in order to make it un-healable. Lightning/Madness spec is based on DPS bursts thanks to the use of the 2 most damaging single target capabilities of sorcerers' trees: Death Field+Chain Lightning within 2 GCDs. Yeah, that is so stupid that the most damaging SINGLE target capabilities are in fact ... MULTI-TARGET.

 

So what does really the Wrath change imply? Basically Lightning/Madness Sorcerers will not be able to cast Chain Lightning as an instant directly from wrath, instead they will have to cast Lightning Strikes (low damage) which in the long term will proc an instant Chain Lightning each 3-4th LS.

 

In theory this is a small nerf, but seriously... Playing lightning/madness before the 1.2 patch is like playing to the lottery:

1. Channel Force Lightning, if you get lucky, you got a wrath proc on the first channel, if not, on the second.

2. Pop/drink/use everything you have so that this spiky damage burst occurs

3. If everything crits, you may end with a 6k damage burst, if nothing crits, you would be lucky to do 3-4k damage.

4. Wait and try not to die until both Death field + Chain Lightning are not on CD and the next Wrath proc

 

After this 1.2 patch, you have to get more lucky on the proc rate so that this Wrath procs+Lightning Strike would procs the Chain lightning proc. Erm... sorry but, this sounds like it will never happen more than twice in a match.

 

So every Sorcerer will switch back to full madness, unable to do any kind of burst damage, being useless in killing healers or DPS being healed. Still on the top of the chart, but useless against large heals.

 

Ok now, Bioware, you should focus on giving Sorcerers the ability to gain this 5k damage Medal before planning another nerf. Full BM set + mods and enhancements with only Power/Willpower/Force/Surge + Expertise buff + Force/Crit&Surge trinkets gets me to a 4k once in a while when I am lucky.

 

I dont know if you ever played healing spec but FOrce bending nerf as well as force surge are very relevant nerf on that spec.

 

The nerf on force bending makes dark infusion useless (no one is gonna get arsed over a 3 secs cast, Stuns interuptions rollback etc...)

ANd dark infusion is one of the main healing ability as it has no CD compared to the other talents.

 

As for force surge if you go full tree you basically have no Mana issue whatsoever, you might consider that again with this stupid nerf.

[FlamingShade]

Sorcs- our ability to do burst dps in any viable spec is gone, our ability to do decent aoe damage in any viable spec is gone.

 

Other people- you're still an OP dps class cuz of heals, bubble, sprint and knockback

 

Sorcs- so, your only counter to sorcs wanting to be able to do comparable DAMAGE in a DAMAGE spec is that sorcs have good HEALING/DEFENSIVE abilities? And oh, let's see how OP that healing ability is- hmm, 3 second heal.... for about 2.2k health, if nobody interrupts... good thing 7 of 8 ACs have an interrupt, and the other one can do two TMs in those 3 seconds for 3k each.

 

That's why we don't have either burst or AoE... we have a heal that a blind clicker can interrupt.

 

YES, balance achieved!

 

+1 i dont even know why people mention our heals i mean they are close to irrelevant in a combat already engaged as for the shield, its basically gone in 2 shots at most

 

As for hitting 5k lol best i ever did is 4.5k with full buff out on **** geared people (and yes i am full battle master with power crit surge)

 

Fun when people mention shield when most classes with more defense have stealth, defense, shields, damage reduction and the list drags on... not to forget mass control etc.

[Labowski]

Ummm what did i miss i read this

 

 

Lightning

 

Electric Induction now correctly affects Affliction.

 

 

Madness (Sorcerer)

 

Disintegration now increases the critical chance of Force Lightning and Lightning Strike by 3% per point.

 

Calcify now increases the damage dealt by Shock, Force Lightning, and Affliction by 2% per point.

 

Wrath now affects Lightning Strike and Crushing Darkness only. Crushing Darkness's periodic damage now benefits from the 20% damage bonus when it is used to consume the Wrath buff.

 

The Force in Balance no longer heals the caster if no targets are hit.

 

if anything that is a buff because when we proc wrath we get our 20% damage bonus on the perodic damage.

 

is there something i am missing. not seeing this as a nerf?

 

 

Edit ohhhhhhhhh no chain lightning

Edited March 19, 2012 by Labowski

[Xigfrid]

I dont know if you ever played healing spec but FOrce bending nerf as well as force surge are very relevant nerf on that spec.

 

The nerf on force bending makes dark infusion useless (no one is gonna get arsed over a 3 secs cast, Stuns interuptions rollback etc...)

ANd dark infusion is one of the main healing ability as it has no CD compared to the other talents.

 

As for force surge if you go full tree you basically have no Mana issue whatsoever, you might consider that again with this stupid nerf.

 

I have played from lvl1 to lvl50 in full heal tree, after realizing that my pet couldn't help me in Ilum to defeat one single DPS without hiss pet, I decided to go half healing/dps tree. After many attemps making a good surviving spec for WZ, it sad to say that a BM healing/dps Sorcerer cannot sustain the high burst damage from BM dps thanks to the inifinite kick/stun/bump/whatsoever that interrupts.

So to me, the spec that brings more survival and utility in WZ was going to full dps and taking flashing bubule / rooting bump / instant whirlwing. If one wants to heal in Warzone, he'd better go into an Heavy Armor class.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Xigfrid

[FlamingShade]

Ummm what did i miss i read this

 

 

 

 

if anything that is a buff because when we proc wrath we get our 20% damage bonus on the perodic damage.

 

is there something i am missing. not seeing this as a nerf?

 

 

Edit ohhhhhhhhh wrath is on lightning strike and not force lightning. well lightning strike sucks and is out of my rotation. humm well this sucks

 

 

Cant use it on chain lightning so its a major nerf

Edited March 19, 2012 by FlamingShade

[FlamingShade]

I have played from lvl1 to lvl50 in full heal tree, after realizing that my pet couldn't help me in Ilum to defeat one single DPS without hiss pet, I decided to go half healing/dps tree. After many attemps making a good surviving spec for WZ, it sad to say that a BM healing/dps Sorcerer cannot sustain the high burst damage from BM dps thanks to the inifinite kick/stun/bump/whatsoever that interrupts.

So to me, the spec that brings more survival and utility in WZ was going to full dps and taking flashing bubule / rooting bump / instant whirlwing. If one wants to heal in Warzone, he'd better go into an Heavy Armor class.

 

Hebce why it s a total nonsense to nerf healing on sorc when they cant withstand burst from other classes while other healing classes can

[Labowski]

Cant use it on chain lightning so its a major nerf

 

got it thanks. missed that part

[Desgarden]

fine lets compare sorc dmg to sniper dmg

 

the difference is PITIFUL

 

sniper/gunslinger single target burst is probably near double ours, with a very long root and cover making them immune to charge and interrupts

 

 

what we did have before was great aoe dmg

 

 

now thats being taken from us

 

 

we will have poor single target dmg and poor aoe dmg

 

all while our weak and worthless 31 pt talents havnt been touched

 

i feel abused

 

 

It is convenient to forget...

 

1. that snipers have no heals

2. have no way to get away when a melee is on them

3. your cc is simply better (stun is ranged, aoe knockback on the run etc)

4. snipers' energy mechanic is very restricting...a sorc can go full out with no penalty. Try that with a sniper and see how that works out.

5. The burst is from marksman spec...which damage is mitigated by ALL available defenses. Go and try your great burst damage on heavily armoured guys...or tanks

 

Point is: you cannot just take one aspect of a class and then say it is better and "give me, give me".

Edited March 19, 2012 by Desgarden

[Vaklain]

Weakest defensive class? With a shield, a knockback, force speed and force slow and a dot that snares on a 9 second cool down.. really? Try being an Op. I have 3 seconds of +100% defensive and vanish on a 3 minute cool down, with a melee snare and a weak bubble on a 45 second cool down.

 

What I hear you saying is that you wanted something very specific, which isn't available at the moment. That without actually playing the new changes you already know exactly how they will play out. You rolled a sorc for massive burst.. and got massive utility instead. I suggest if you want massive burst you chose a different class, rather than moaning that the class you've got a hard on for isn't what you expected.

 

I also hear you saying that you didn't read much about the legacy changes or bother to think about how they might be able to impact your class.

 

You think you die first in WZs? Trust me you are not the first focus. It might seem like you're the first focus but that is because any ops stupid enough to be out of stealth get insta gibbed by being attacked by everyone and it happens so fast you get confused and can't believe 3 Ops have died before anyone even looked for a sorc.

 

You get a new war zone within 4 months (which you haven't played yet of course) and you're complaining?! In my day we had to run around making our own PVP content (with no reward system at all) because we enjoyed killing other players.

 

The sorc nerfs aren't major compared to what the rest of us are going through. Go and have a look at what they're doing to healing mercs/commandos now that is a nerf, or the concealment ops who are already free kills getting nerfed again because of all the sorcs/sages in greens dying to a BM.

 

Quick summary of the OP: Spoilt sorc cries "I want the burst of sniper, the durability of a jugg, the utility I've got and make it all cool with lightning please. OR ELSE!!"

 

Exactly! Learn to play your class. Also Your server did NOT GO from heavy to light because of a content update. I can gaurentee that. Just more pointless QQ.

[Vaklain]

It is convenient to forget...

 

1. that snipers have no heals

2. have no way to get away when a melee is on them

3. your cc is simply better (stun is ranged, aoe knockback on the run etc)

4. snipers' energy mechanic is very restricting...a sorc can go full out with no penalty. Try that with a sniper and see how that works out.

5. The burst is from marksman spec...which damage is mitigated by ALL available defenses. Go and try your great burst damage on heavily armoured guys...or tanks

 

Point is: you cannot just take one aspect of a class and then say it is better and "give me, give me".

 

The seem to be comparing the classes strongest points toward their classes weakest point...

[its_them]

With all your survivability skills why do you feel you should have anything close to sniper dps?

 

If you want to see a nerf try making a Opretive now.

Edited March 19, 2012 by its_them

[LancelotOC]

I agree with you 100%. You can't kill anyone if you go high in the healing tree. Especially equal geared players. You can heal through if you manage your LOS well. You need to constantly be on the move and use mostly bubbles and the HOTs on people with the occasional channled heal if time permits or need dictates it.

 

I don't know if this if much less than the healing armored healers put out but I seem to be able to stay close to them in warzones in heal totals. Just not sure if armored healer's totals are also mostly healing themselves as is teh case with us.

 

By managing your LOS I mean find an object you can rotate around and if 2 players come and head at you at different rotations then you use your sprint to find a new object.

 

The big heal is about saving yourself behind LOS. The proposed nerf takes this away from you because already good players come around corners you've LOSed them spamming interupts. It only is barely castable at its current short cast time following the HOT as I distinctly remember not being able to cast it before I was geared with a lot of alacrity.

 

Following the nerf we will not be able to ever use the big heal against competent opponents in WZs.

 

This means to adjust we will have to switch to the small heal and hope for crits. This lower heal output coupled with the power nerf means they simply want us to die to anyone chasing us much faster and they dont want us to be able to heal anyone but oursleves in those situations. As well as they want us to die anytime more than 1 person is chasing us rather quickly.

 

We've been reduced to a 15-20 second single person mezz for warzones. By that I mean we will be able to kite/los a person for that long, half that against 2 people and so on.

 

They are forcing us to play with a tank and be guarded or play out in the open. I imagine the Devs play either Marauders or Snipers and can't handle being LOSed for their loljumps and turret firing.

 

Either that or this is all about Snipers not being to kill us and maybe they can't kill anyone so to appease them they are nerfing us down so they have someone to kill as well and stop asking for buffs.

 

I wonder how Bioware will handle all the complaining when people stop playing healers and people don't have the easy kills their coding us to be.

[zStrife]

Instead of comparing to maurauders you should compare to classes like gunslingers who don't have any single heal abilities or scoundrels who have it bad as sorc players did.

 

Its so funny how people always compare a class thats is fundamentally different from another and insisting their classes sucked, when they should be comparing it against other similar classes that're weaker than them.

 

You want to compare sorceror's damage against Maurauder? Fine,

 

Strip away all of sorceror's healing abilities, then we can talk about damage.

 

Didn't you know? It is the best form of crybaby to call the counter to your class OP. Once they get nerfed you win every game of rock paper scissors.

 

I am talking about Sent/Mara > Sorc/Sage for you slow few.

Edited March 19, 2012 by zStrife

[MrHotter]

Sorc/Sage is fine and will still be fine after 1.2.

 

Learn to play and all that jazz.

 

If you only play one class then I can see why you man not be able to see the 'big picture' on your class. Feel free to roll one of the classes that you think are 'better' than you so you can complain about that too.

[indelible]

I've said it again and I'll say it before.

 

Madness Sorcerers have been buffed.

 

The damage reduction on FL and the Wrath proc change is inconsequential. Madness is a horrific spec in 1.2 with the 6% Affliction buff and the 20% Crushing Darkness buff (or fix). You WON'T be popping people like you were pre-1.2 but you'll be topping damage by a massive margin and you most certainly won't be dying. Ever.

 

Spec Madness (favouring damage and force efficiency over CC), stack crit (until DRs) = unkillable sorc in 1.2.

[Xigfrid]

Well that's remind me why I quitted WOW because I would have to level and play 3 toons at high level to counter these 3-monthly "minor class balances". I definitely won't enjoy doing 3 times the 2 swotr dailies to keep up with class balance and upgrades.

 

Concerning Madness Sorcerer, sure they will be pure annoyance, un-killable and top-of-the-DPS-chart... Also, who would care about channelling the new "nerfed" Force Lightning once all the dots are out, I would personally just run the opposite way, hoping my dots don't get healed. Guess what, that play-style doesn't suits me, and Madness Sorcerer will deserve a big nerf soon after patch 1.2.

[FlamingShade]

Well that's remind me why I quitted WOW because I would have to level and play 3 toons at high level to counter these 3-monthly "minor class balances". I definitely won't enjoy doing 3 times the 2 swotr dailies to keep up with class balance and upgrades.

 

Concerning Madness Sorcerer, sure they will be pure annoyance, un-killable and top-of-the-DPS-chart... Also, who would care about channelling the new "nerfed" Force Lightning once all the dots are out, I would personally just run the opposite way, hoping my dots don't get healed. Guess what, that play-style doesn't suits me, and Madness Sorcerer will deserve a big nerf soon after patch 1.2.

 

Whatif we dont *********** want to play with DOTS. I didnt roll a *********** sorc to put tick on peoplethis is just a ridiculous Comment. I want *********** choice to play what i want and not be forced to play d dtaly that i dont like just because Bioware is unable to sort things our properly on my class.

 

I do not like full madness built and i dont want to be told i have to play it do you understand? Especially considering that against some healing class its totally useless and insignificant. If you wan to nerf wrath at least dont strip force lightning and boos shock and affliction. but putting on 2 nerf on the same built please dont make me laugh

[FlamingShade]

Well that's remind me why I quitted WOW because I would have to level and play 3 toons at high level to counter these 3-monthly "minor class balances". I definitely won't enjoy doing 3 times the 2 swotr dailies to keep up with class balance and upgrades.

 

Concerning Madness Sorcerer, sure they will be pure annoyance, un-killable and top-of-the-DPS-chart... Also, who would care about channelling the new "nerfed" Force Lightning once all the dots are out, I would personally just run the opposite way, hoping my dots don't get healed. Guess what, that play-style doesn't suits me, and Madness Sorcerer will deserve a big nerf soon after patch 1.2.

 

+100 cant say it better

[Celebrus]

Yes sorc in hybrid spec can do damage BUT WE ARE AS FAR AS DEFENSE IS CONCERNED THE WEAKEST CLASS IN THE GAME

 

 

Can't believe I actually read this far, but this is absolutely *********** hilarious.

[nogell]

You can't have it all. You want burst dmg, heal, bubble? why not just throw in heavy armor, stealth and vanish. geesh

I swear in every mmo, people complained about their class not being op. If you don't like your class, play something else.

[Rendolphe]

I played most of the time with a hybrid sorc (Madness / lightning). I tried the full madness spec recently and the damage is pretty good. Less AOE without chain lightning but better dps on a single target. I did 4900 damage with death field !!!

 

The biggest problem of this spec is the force management. On a big fight in Alderaan or Voidstar you will miss force really fast and become useless trying to using cosumption or hinding out of combat getting back your force.

Edited March 19, 2012 by Rendolphe

[MinguesDew]

Well that's remind me why I quitted WOW because I would have to level and play 3 toons at high level to counter these 3-monthly "minor class balances". I definitely won't enjoy doing 3 times the 2 swotr dailies to keep up with class balance and upgrades.

The only reason you had to re-roll is because you are bad and couldn't hack it with your chosen class so you re-rolled FOTM.

 

Unsurpringly, you chose sorc/sage, an AC that has been FOTM for some time.

 

Also not surprising is that FOTM bads don't know how to play the class and think that having the weakest passive defense is the same as being defensively weak; nothing could be further from the truth, your active defenses make you very strong defensively, but these are the kind of nuanced abilities that are lost on FOTM folks.