Assault Build

[Cormacus]

I'm a bit tired of running as Gunnery Commando for lot of reasons (useless against a good team..) I tried using a hybrid Assault/Gunnery build but it really didn't work out (as many people already mentioned on here).

 

Would like to test running a full Assault build instead but unsure about some talents and if they are worth it or not. Not been able to find any examples of Assault builds either.

 

I'm thinking of using this for PvP:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#8000cZMckZcGrrdhhMs.1

 

BUT unsure about missing some of the top talents.. are they any good.. they should be being so high up in the tree..?

 

Adrenaline Fuelled & Reflexive Shield:

They both reduce time on some very good skills but they rely on chance and doesn't sound very good. Am I wrong? Are they actually very good?

 

instead I've put in 4 points into:

 

Nightvision Scope:

I really choose this over Adrenaline Fuelled or Reflexive Shield. I noticed the stealth detection really did work as I spotted all the Assassins/Shadow etc and could apply dots to them. The extra 2% dmg reduction sounds very good.. but is it?

 

Parallactic Combat Stims

I took this because it feels like you're constantly affected by some type of snare, root, slowness or knockdown in pvp.

 

 

Any advice from a Assault Spec Commando would be great.

[Deusmortis]

I'm not a fan of Nightvision Scope. It may just be a playstyle thing. I rarely go off alone, and don't seem to attract too many stealthers. When I am alone, I can usually flush them out with stealth scan.

 

Adrenaline Fueled and Reflexive Shield are both good talents. I prefer AF since it is something I have more control over. Remember, it procs on all crits, even from your DOTs.

 

Rapid Recharge is good as well, since Assault is less ammo friendly than Gunnery.

[Cormacus]

I'm not a fan of Nightvision Scope. It may just be a playstyle thing. I rarely go off alone, and don't seem to attract too many stealthers. When I am alone, I can usually flush them out with stealth scan.

 

Adrenaline Fueled and Reflexive Shield are both good talents. I prefer AF since it is something I have more control over. Remember, it procs on all crits, even from your DOTs.

 

Rapid Recharge is good as well, since Assault is less ammo friendly than Gunnery.

+

 

I quite like Rapid Recharge but not got enough talents to cover it.. How would your build look like? Anything other than Nightscope you would drop?

[Deusmortis]

That's probably the only thing I'd change, though I do play around with different variants from time to time.

[germil]

As said above I would drop 2 talents out of the 3 : degauss/nightvision scope/parallactic stim to get rapid recharche and adrelaline fueled (which is very good actually) Edited March 2, 2012 by germil

[Niconogood]

Assault is a vanguard tree. Dont really know why we have it as an option as commando, cause it is utter useless for us. We could just as well have a random pebblethrowingtree.

 

The viable specs for commando is atm. full gunnery DpS, full medic og medic/gunnery hybrid. Assault is subpar in every respect, unless you want to sacrifice 50% of your DpS to feature a weak and insanely ammointensive DoT.

[Cormacus]

Assault is a vanguard tree. Dont really know why we have it as an option as commando, cause it is utter useless for us. We could just as well have a random pebblethrowingtree.

 

The viable specs for commando is atm. full gunnery DpS, full medic og medic/gunnery hybrid. Assault is subpar in every respect, unless you want to sacrifice 50% of your DpS to feature a weak and insanely ammointensive DoT.

 

I did try it all day yesterday and unfortunately you seem to be right. It's more fun to play because of being mobile but you can't actually do anything or make no real difference in pvp. You end up running around a lot and putting up dots on people, running out of ammo then getting killed or run away. It seems like a much more viable option for Vanguard.. too bad I didn't choose vanguard.

 

I think it could be a good option for commando with a few tweaks, mainly reducing the ammo costs and improving some of the top talents.

[Niconogood]

It seems like a much more viable option for Vanguard.. too bad I didn't choose vanguard.

 

Unfortunately I think most of us commandos feel the same ;( Unless they for some reason really enjoy being a simplistic immobile DpS- or healingturret with no utility whatsoever.

 

Would reroll if I had the patience. But with so many better games in the horizon that actually take PvP seriously, and not just to be a last resort gimmick, I dont find it to be worth it.

Edited March 2, 2012 by Niconogood

[panickiss]

Well I'm using an assault spec since the release, I never used Grav spec in live game. I'm doing fine, usually top dmg and above Grav/Tracer builds, which you should actually read as: ess burst, longer uptime on target

 

The thing with assault spec is that the main source of damage is Hammer shot/Plasma cell proc, you always have to have Hammer shot on rotation and force the proc on plasma cell.

 

The only thing that I cast is Full Auto and Plasma Grenade (the later usually only during "blow cd" phase) and depending on situation Charged Bolts.

 

In all fights you have to be mobile, you can't go toe-to-toe vs any class. If you are out in the open you either blow all cooldows and hope for some nice procs on HIB or you'll die. VS melee kiting works to a certain degree (get out of 10m range, use stun and pushback when needed) but still depending on Plasma Cell procs (for the slow down and DoT)

 

I'm not lucky enough to be full BM (not even BM weapon like it matters) and my Hammer Shot does around 1000dmg on BM targets and Plasma Cell tick crits for 500-600.

 

Assault plastique -3300-3800 crit, Charged Bolts 1400-1600 non crit , HIB 2900-3100 crit.

 

This should give a rough idea where assault spec is for Commando.

[Figmentus]

with regards to the OP build, i would get rid of the 2 points in paralytic stim, and the 1 point in muzzle fluting for sure. I prefer sticking those three points in soldiers endurance and heavy trooper, simply because you need the endurance to stay alive longer because it takes longer for you to do any damage. DoT damage = slow damage. In my assault build I also don't put any points into Adrenaline Fueled, Reflexive Shield, and rapid recharge. Any assault rotation has heavy hammer shot presence so ammo really isnt an issue. Refelxive shield is less attractive because if are taking enough damage to make it worth it, you are not playing commando correctly. And adrenaline fueled gives a cooldown bonus to a weak broken skill i never use, plus reserve powercell is kinda gimmicky, i only use it along with tech override to throw an instant plasma grenade, that's it. what other channeled high ammo cost skill would an assault specialist use? (concussive round? lawlz)

 

I have said it before, but Commando dps specs are only good for pve. Commandos lack any utility to be useful in pvp. Can't pull, can't push, can't close gap, can't snare (reliably in assault, or at all in gunnery), no speed burst, 1 combat cc, no talents in skill tree to increase effectiveness of cryo-nade, etc...

 

If you want to pvp dps play vanguard.

[Cormacus]

The thing with assault spec is that the main source of damage is Hammer shot/Plasma cell proc, you always have to have Hammer shot on rotation and force the proc on plasma cell.

 

The only thing that I cast is Full Auto and Plasma Grenade (the later usually only during "blow cd" phase) and depending on situation Charged Bolts.

 

In all fights you have to be mobile, you can't go toe-to-toe vs any class. If you are out in the open you either blow all cooldows and hope for some nice procs on HIB or you'll die. VS melee kiting works to a certain degree (get out of 10m range, use stun and pushback when needed) but still depending on Plasma Cell procs (for the slow down and DoT)

 

.

 

Interesting. You don't use Assault Plastique?

 

And a silly question.. But if you're kiting someone how do you hammer shot them effectively to slow them down when they are behind you? Maybe I'm just an old fart but i have to more or less stop, quickly turn around, shot.. then run again which doesn't seem to be very effective.

[Cormacus]

I have said it before, but Commando dps specs are only good for pve. Commandos lack any utility to be useful in pvp. Can't pull, can't push, can't close gap, can't snare (reliably in assault, or at all in gunnery), no speed burst, 1 combat cc, no talents in skill tree to increase effectiveness of cryo-nade, etc...

 

If you want to pvp dps play vanguard.

 

I wouldn't say Commando's are useless in PvP, Gunnery can still take down targets very quickly with a good team. But yes, it has a lot of faults and downsides.

 

And I would have gone Vanguard if I had a choice now. But I simply cannot face leveling another toon.

 

Good tips with the talents for assault - but do you mean for PvP or PvE or both?

[Figmentus]

I meant for pvp

[HileyQuiggley]

Only way to play Assault as Commando:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#8000cZMcoZcIrrzMurs.1

 

IA isnt worth it in our Assault tree, not as good as Gunnery since you cant get Steadied Aim to go along with it without losing alot of Crit%. The spec above you are fully mobile and have good survivability. You only have 2 stationary attacks and those are Mortar Volley and Hail of Bolts. Also use Plasma Nade but I always cast it as an insta. The guy before me stating the use of Hammer Shot is correct, I do run out of Ammo some of the time if im in a big or longer fight but thats why you have Rapid Recharge and HS proc.

 

Assault is a good spec in the Commando lines, ive done alot better with it than I have ever using Gunnery. Sucks that the new patch is going to hurt us being group friendly on objectives but I still dont see myself going back. I like Gunnery in PvE and I switch back every now and then but its just not as good.

 

#1 reason Assault>Gunnery: You dont get ganged on constantly. When I ran Gunnery before Ive never seen so many flying monkeys swooping in on me.

 

Edit: On the Plasma Nade, I never use a single drop of ammo. Reserve Powercell in combination with AF its up all the time. So you dont run out of ammo as much as you would think. Sure IR costs 3 but thats about it. AP only costs 2 and other than that if your not using MV/HoB you only have HIB left. Not that ammo costly unless you are just spamming IR all over the place.

Edited March 2, 2012 by HileyQuiggley

[Cormacus]

Only way to play Assault as Commando:

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#8000cZMcoZcIrrzMurs.1

 

IA isnt worth it in our Assault tree, not as good as Gunnery since you cant get Steadied Aim to go along with it without losing alot of Crit%. The spec above you are fully mobile and have good survivability. You only have 2 stationary attacks and those are Mortar Volley and Hail of Bolts. Also use Plasma Nade but I always cast it as an insta. The guy before me stating the use of Hammer Shot is correct, I do run out of Ammo some of the time if im in a big or longer fight but thats why you have Rapid Recharge and HS proc.

 

Assault is a good spec in the Commando lines, ive done alot better with it than I have ever using Gunnery. Sucks that the new patch is going to hurt us being group friendly on objectives but I still dont see myself going back. I like Gunnery in PvE and I switch back every now and then but its just not as good.

 

#1 reason Assault>Gunnery: You dont get ganged on constantly. When I ran Gunnery before Ive never seen so many flying monkeys swooping in on me.

 

Edit: On the Plasma Nade, I never use a single drop of ammo. Reserve Powercell in combination with AF its up all the time. So you dont run out of ammo as much as you would think. Sure IR costs 3 but thats about it. AP only costs 2 and other than that if your not using MV/HoB you only have HIB left. Not that ammo costly unless you are just spamming IR all over the place.

 

Its funny you mentioned "flying monkeys", that's exactly why I started to look into Assault. More and more it feels like they focus on you straight away and rarely can you remain stationary for very long unless you have a very good team. Doesn't matter how good you are at positioning yourself, only very new or bad pvp players won't notice you. Any half decent player will get to you quickly.

 

But so you don't use Full Auto or Charged Bolt at all and only HiB when the cooldown is off as nothing that can proc it's reset?

 

What would a fight for you look like? IR -> Hammer -> HiB -> Plastique?

 

Isn't it very difficult to take someone down on your own (even if they don't focus on you)?

[HileyQuiggley]

Its funny you mentioned "flying monkeys", that's exactly why I started to look into Assault. More and more it feels like they focus on you straight away and rarely can you remain stationary for very long unless you have a very good team. Doesn't matter how good you are at positioning yourself, only very new or bad pvp players won't notice you. Any half decent player will get to you quickly.

 

But so you don't use Full Auto or Charged Bolt at all and only HiB when the cooldown is off as nothing that can proc it's reset?

 

What would a fight for you look like? IR -> Hammer -> HiB -> Plastique?

 

Isn't it very difficult to take someone down on your own (even if they don't focus on you)?

 

IR-HIB-AP-HS with Plamsa nade thrown in there if available. I dont go out looking for solo fights I follow the team and its great at AoE dps and slowing targets down. Its not like I hit like a wet noodle. If in a 1v1 against ranged just use the terrain, you have instas they are casting, they dont have to be able to hit you. If its melee you can kite although they dont have the monkey jump but you have a little CC to help out. I dont have near as many problems with this spec as I did with gunnery and a target painted on my face the whole match. No CB though, absolutely hate it. When you dont really need the DPS its doing 2-3k and when its gets down to surviving its either a miss/deflect or 900 damage. Ill never use it again.

[panickiss]

Interesting. You don't use Assault Plastique?

 

And a silly question.. But if you're kiting someone how do you hammer shot them effectively to slow them down when they are behind you? Maybe I'm just an old fart but i have to more or less stop, quickly turn around, shot.. then run again which doesn't seem to be very effective.

 

I just side running (with strafe) firing hammer shot continuously. And Assault Plastique it's one of the first skills to use.

[germil]

I would have the opposite advice on this one. If you want to reach optimum DPS, you NEED to use Power SHot and Full Auto, to gain the free High Impact Bolt, which gains one ammo on burning target. To me this is the core mechanism (ammo managment) of the spec. Taking into account this mechanism, the ratio damage/ammo of these attacks is far higher than Incendiary Round (which should be use wisely, only to get the previous effect in case plasma cell is not up, don't spam IR on several targts) or even assault plastique. Hammer shot should of course be part of the dps cycle, as a filler to always be in the best ammo generation zone, and if it proc the fire dot it is cool, but its priority is lower than FullAuto/PowerShot.

 

Don't think assault as a dot/instant ONLY spec, you would loose its main benefice. It is like being gunnery without the ammo-on-crit talent, but even worst (as the ammo regen mechanism of assault if really great).

[whataboutbob]

Interesting. You don't use Assault Plastique?

 

And a silly question.. But if you're kiting someone how do you hammer shot them effectively to slow them down when they are behind you? Maybe I'm just an old fart but i have to more or less stop, quickly turn around, shot.. then run again which doesn't seem to be very effective.

 

 

Work on your kiting abilities by using the strafe keys and the right mouse button for camera control to stay on target. It takes practice but it's a life saver in some fights. In PVE I rarely go below 3/4 HP bar on elites.

 

In PVP its another matter but, still very usefull when there are objects for you to weave around and fire your instant casts.

[Cormacus]

Work on your kiting abilities by using the strafe keys and the right mouse button for camera control to stay on target. It takes practice but it's a life saver in some fights. In PVE I rarely go below 3/4 HP bar on elites.

 

In PVP its another matter but, still very usefull when there are objects for you to weave around and fire your instant casts.

 

But if you're using the strafe keys how can you fire your Hammer Shot at the same time (while also using the mouse to change the camera)?

 

I mainly move with the W button and steering with mouse... or move entirely with mouse while firing off Shortcut keys with my other hand.

 

I tested running again with the suggested Assault build. It's actually working much better this time in PvP. It's not bad at all as long as I do as you guys mentioned. Avoid 1-to-1 and if I can't then dot them up and run about kiting them.

 

it's actually good fun now and doing very well on medals. Just have to figure out the best way for my keyboard shortcuts.... what I need to use or not and where.

 

I did just look at Vanguard though, would have been much better to be Vanguard Assault then Commando, the skills they learn compared to Commando are much more suitable with interrupts etc. Few of the basic Commando skills are that useful vs what they have.

[Cormacus]

I would have the opposite advice on this one. If you want to reach optimum DPS, you NEED to use Power SHot and Full Auto, to gain the free High Impact Bolt, which gains one ammo on burning target. To me this is the core mechanism (ammo managment) of the spec. Taking into account this mechanism, the ratio damage/ammo of these attacks is far higher than Incendiary Round (which should be use wisely, only to get the previous effect in case plasma cell is not up, don't spam IR on several targts) or even assault plastique. Hammer shot should of course be part of the dps cycle, as a filler to always be in the best ammo generation zone, and if it proc the fire dot it is cool, but its priority is lower than FullAuto/PowerShot.

 

Don't think assault as a dot/instant ONLY spec, you would loose its main benefice. It is like being gunnery without the ammo-on-crit talent, but even worst (as the ammo regen mechanism of assault if really great).

 

I am wondering if that will suit my style better actually. I don't seem to have much ammo problems so might not need the Rapid Recharge and the buffs from Adrenaline Fuelled isn't doing much for me. Difficult to tell yet though.

[Pourekos]

Is gunnery really that bad in PvP? I am speced assault (pre-50 still) and with the proposed Dot change for 1.1.5 I was thinking to give gunnery a go. I do love my slow (especially for dealing with strong/elite mobs), however I feel that this will be the only plus left for the spec against a mountain of negatives in comparison to gunnery. Additionally, as gunnery you'll be free to spend talent points in the combat medic tree to increase even a bit your healing utility, and healing is what I do most of the time anyway until i can get into a reasonably clear spot and do some dmg.

[NDiggy]

I did try it all day yesterday and unfortunately you seem to be right. It's more fun to play because of being mobile but you can't actually do anything or make no real difference in pvp. You end up running around a lot and putting up dots on people, running out of ammo then getting killed or run away. It seems like a much more viable option for Vanguard.. too bad I didn't choose vanguard.

I think it could be a good option for commando with a few tweaks, mainly reducing the ammo costs and improving some of the top talents.

 

When it comes to PvP I think its safe to say that we all regret not choosing Vanguard, but damn if that big assault cannon doesn't look nice even if its just a big signal flare telling Imps to single me out and destroy me for a free kill.

[NDiggy]

Is gunnery really that bad in PvP? I am speced assault (pre-50 still) and with the proposed Dot change for 1.1.5 I was thinking to give gunnery a go. I do love my slow (especially for dealing with strong/elite mobs), however I feel that this will be the only plus left for the spec against a mountain of negatives in comparison to gunnery. Additionally, as gunnery you'll be free to spend talent points in the combat medic tree to increase even a bit your healing utility, and healing is what I do most of the time anyway until i can get into a reasonably clear spot and do some dmg.

 

For Commando PvP its heal or go home. Gunnery has no mobility, poor defense, and merely decent damage considering all the drawbacks of the spec. Your basically a turret and your assault cannon is like have a big sign on your back telling people "free kill".

[HileyQuiggley]

I would have the opposite advice on this one. If you want to reach optimum DPS, you NEED to use Power SHot and Full Auto, to gain the free High Impact Bolt, which gains one ammo on burning target. To me this is the core mechanism (ammo managment) of the spec. Taking into account this mechanism, the ratio damage/ammo of these attacks is far higher than Incendiary Round (which should be use wisely, only to get the previous effect in case plasma cell is not up, don't spam IR on several targts) or even assault plastique. Hammer shot should of course be part of the dps cycle, as a filler to always be in the best ammo generation zone, and if it proc the fire dot it is cool, but its priority is lower than FullAuto/PowerShot.

 

Don't think assault as a dot/instant ONLY spec, you would loose its main benefice. It is like being gunnery without the ammo-on-crit talent, but even worst (as the ammo regen mechanism of assault if really great).

 

Yes you can do as much or more DPS going that way but again, same as Gunnery you are a sitting turret. I still manage 300k easily with DoT's and instas. Ive ran everything there is to run in Assault and my spec is my favorite. I did good DPS with other specs but like I said before about flying monkeys I dont have that much of a problem with them anymore. Even this morning on a CW match I was late joining by 6 minutes and ended with 260k and 38-0. Of course it could have been just the same with just spamming HS the whole time because that team was horrible but it works for me. Just my spec nobody else has to use it I just find it more forgiving.