predicament Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 So, after picking my ac as vanguard as I love huge health pools, high armor, and going (ranged) toe to toe w the enemy I moused over all the talents. They are bad. All in all across all three, THREE trees, I saw a total of 3 to 4 actual survivability talents. Really? REALLY? I think the entire tree should be dedicated to surv. I don't need help holding agro... I've never had any issues holding agro. Why all the damage boosting/proc abilities to do damage? It doesn't make sense to me. please someone shine some light on as to why tanks need to have more damage talents than surv talents. I love tanking. Im not rerolling. If all you're going to pose is a couple of qs then don't waste your time. I want constructive, non patronizing posts please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregP Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 (edited) You do realize that Vanguard is, by design, able to be a tank or dps, right? Shield spec for tank, tactics/assault for dps. There aren't any pure tank AC's in this game. Most classes are hybrids. Edited December 15, 2011 by GregP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
predicament Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 I did see the difference in the trees, but it just seems to me that even the tank tree is a more dedicated dps tree than tanking. There's hardly any survivability talents. Idk granted im only level 11 im just a little...offput by the whole deal. Oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying_toaster Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 I wholeheartedly agree... The whole "tanking" aspect of the tank tree is a bit underwhelming. I still like the talents they put there, mind you. I think they are the most fun out of all the other talents of the Vanguard, so I'm taking those anyway. But to call it a tanking tree when it seems more like a "bash in skulls with stockstrike" tree? Not so much... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canobeansPL Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 (edited) There are hardly any super-powerful survivability talents because you don't really need them. We are very tough by default due to our itemization and the overall class design. On top of that the Shield Specialist tree gains top-notch resilience by improving the utility of our Ion Cell (which you receive at level 14). The Ion Cell provides +60% armor, +5% damage reduction and +15% shield chance. This game is in general of a somewhat different nature than WoW when it comes to encounter design. BioWare has put a premium on action and control of the battlefield and it shows - the Vanguard is not a walking tank, he's just tough enough for what he is supposed to do: take the heat off allies, provide utility and, in PvP, discourage the enemy from action. Our one serious defensive cooldown - Smoke Grenade - is very powerful. Being a Trooper also entitles us to Reactive Shield (-25% damage for 12 seconds) and Adrenaline Rush (15% self-heal). We have a very low cooldown interrupt in Riot Strike, and near level 50 we also gain access to a long duration AoE stun. The Shield Specialist additionally receives a very versatile mobility/disengage tool in Storm, which can be used both offensively and defensively. All Vanguards can use Harpoon, another very powerful control ability. The damage bonuses you are so unimpressed with come very useful in later fights, especially when non-trivial adds start factoring in. That guaranteed Ion discharge coupled to much quicker Stockstrike vastly improves our quality of life . We are also PvP powerhouses. Our taunts (one is AoE) and the Guard mechanic are brilliant and turn us into perfect bodyguards. Coupled with all our control abilities and a healer, a Vanguard is largely unkillable . Just ask any Beta veterans. We are a freaking nightmare. Edited December 16, 2011 by canobeansPL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yadad Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 ^^^ what he said, played a VG up to lvl 17 on the 2 beta weekends and was wrecking pve & pvp only people I had a hard time with was the lvl 30+ players because they had more abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying_toaster Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 Hmmm, I'm a lot less worried now. I never got higher than level 10 in beta (didn't wanna spoil tio much of the game before release) so I haven't had any experience with the other skills. However I did spend a good 2 weeks playing around with the skill calculator on torhead and I fell in love with Storm, Harpoon and Ion Cell-related stuff. Hence why I'm going for a Vanguard. And I see how fun/powerful their abilities are, I love them in theory and can't wait to try them out in practice! But I still have to agree with the OP a little bit on this one. The Shield Specialist tree lacks a little something. It could be as ridiculously small as replacing the top skill with something else (yes I know it's good. But it's NOT something I want to get as a top "shield" skill D: ) that said, I wouldn't want to lose ANY of the skills we already have in the Shield tree. (Except maybe for the +running speed on Storm skill.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elithrar Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 All your key survivability abilities are abilities. You get a "Shield Wall" and other key stuff from your trainer. The trees just give you some focus and gravy on top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evin Posted December 16, 2011 Share Posted December 16, 2011 I wholeheartedly agree... The whole "tanking" aspect of the tank tree is a bit underwhelming. I still like the talents they put there, mind you. I think they are the most fun out of all the other talents of the Vanguard, so I'm taking those anyway. But to call it a tanking tree when it seems more like a "bash in skulls with stockstrike" tree? Not so much... Errrr I don't see where the problem is. You go shield spec, you can tank with it - IT WORKS. So why is it so bad that you can deal some damage with that tree, too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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