Marauder VS Assassin PVP

[Kurfer]

Dot kings exist not for wins just numbers its simple want bigger numbers just dot everyone death field spam its simple doesn't mean jack but epeen numbers for the lose.

 

You're still not reading...there are three different people here who clearly have PLAYED THIS SPEC with EFFICIENCY saying that dot spamming gets you nowhere.

 

In one thrash crit I can do more damage than 2 dots while generating a potential free cast from raze proc or a duplicity proc. You wont have enough force to spam dots constantly...look at the replies above.

 

Brunt of this damage comes from the melee side, dots are king for this spec as it's efficiency and usefulness. I can't tell you how nice it is to be able to walk away from a door to jump on a healer who is smart enough to utilize max range/efficient healing concepts. Creeping terror has like a 30m range...so fun to be hitting a healer like a truck and throw a random weak *** dot on some dude capping the door 30 meters away.

 

Try the spec, show me the damage with just spamming dots. Be prepared for disappointing results!

Edited February 17, 2012 by Kurfer

[LordbishopX]

Spamming dots and aoe for those numbers is meh lets see a vid of u taking down 3 on 1 even 1on 1 and we can talk other than that keep the dots flowing for ur numbers.

[Kurfer]

Spamming dots and aoe for those numbers is meh lets see a vid of u taking down 3 on 1 even 1on 1 and we can talk other than that keep the dots flowing for ur numbers.

 

You just don't get it do you.

 

[LordbishopX]

You just don't get it do you.

 

 

 

Madness played poorly = 200-250k damage

Madness played properly = 350-600k +

 

Keep dots up on at least 3 people, learn how to master tab targeting. There is a true skill difference in how well people target. Good players don't have issues changing targets fast and identifying healers.

 

Deathfield (recklessness on cooldown with this)

Dot 3 people (save creeping terror for long range door/node capper stopping)

Thrash on focus target (or healers)

I like to use maul when dup procs

 

The trick is to ALWAYS be around the fight, ALWAYS be engaged in combat and ALWAYS be doing something. You have to be a wild little kid and constantly have your abilities on global cooldown. If you find your force bar is full often and stagnant then you need to work on PvP awareness more than anything. No one spec/class will help overcome that...

 

Make sure to hit 3 targets with DF but also don't just be a damage king; sometimes I save it for a door/node when we are light on people/under heavy pressure. It can save a game for your team.

 

As you improve your skills in PvP you will start recognizing people by name in the WZ's and be able to understand who you've dotted up/duration to always maintain at least 3 dots.

 

Dots are king in PvP, two WZ's it's simply game breaking when trying to hold a door/node.

 

Also,

 

Assassinate should be always used too, make SURE unit frames are enabled and help your team out by assassinating the low people. Really helps finish off stubborn healers and will ensure you top the charts in killing blows.

 

Nope I am a reader and fan of the dots in your post especially where it states in PVP dots are king. The how to post for topping charts not skilled pvp in my book at all just how to get meaningless numbers up.

 

It really won't help mara vs SIN I take mara everytime vs dots spam on my team especialy the dude in the watchmen video his dots aren't spammed for numbers but for killing.

Edited February 17, 2012 by LordbishopX

[Kurfer]

Nope I am a reader and fan of the dots in your post especially where it states in PVP dots are king.

 

Read that again, my argument is intelligent dots are king.

 

You just fail badly at reading comprehension; dots makes this spec efficient. You always keep up 3 dots on the right targets and you stick the healers/focus targets like glue with your melee dps.

 

Why do you struggle so hard to realize this? You are not a smart person and you're showing it to the world right now. I've literally lost count of how many times (even in the quote you're failing at using against me) that you dot node cappers because that **** is what makes us shine in WZs. Other team can't cap, they can't win! How does keeping dots on 3 targets = spamming dots in your little world? 3 dots, on strategic targets while maintaining pressure on players with melee dps = win.

 

Again, you just don't get it.

 

You tiny little brain is consumed with discrediting large numbers. Would it make you happier if I didn't use dots at all? Why the **** would I spec into a dot spec then? smh

 

Dots are key for this spec to work, but as iv'e said in my previous posts it's the constantly being engaged and hitting someone that does the damage. I can't handle arguing with you anymore, I honestly feel like i'm having a conversation with a special needs person and i'd rather not insult them but relating them to you.

Edited February 17, 2012 by Kurfer

[LordbishopX]

I have your dots for numbers on the brain its all I see = meaningless numbers for epeen topping charts you said so yourself lol. I can play other classes that can get crazy numbers for spamming dots but cool I get it great numbers for spamming dots is just boss NOT....

 

Time to change to a dotting spec for numbers like the cool kids do now a days cause tab dot tab dot tab dot is boss.

 

Me I like this guy

 

No cheese allowed...

Edited February 17, 2012 by LordbishopX

[Kurfer]

I have your dots for numbers on the brain its all I see = meaningless numbers for epeen topping charts you said so yourself lol. I can play other classes that can get crazy numbers for spamming dots but cool I get it great numbers for spamming dots is just boss NOT....

 

I honestly think you're that guy with a low attention span that gets around 180k total dps and spends all your energy making excuses on why you don't do more when in reality you're really not doing much at all to help your team other than filling a roster spot.

 

If you think you can do it with a class other than the one you're currently playing then be my guest. Put up or shutup...

 

You're the guy that at the end of the match:

 

Has no idea how many healers the other team has

No awareness of enemy team's guild tags to understand who could potentially be working together

No idea of enemy team HP and how it relates to their gear level for selective bursting/focus target callouts

 

No idea of other team ball carrying habits

Tunnel vision door defender while other teams cap other door

That guy who whines when he constantly loses but doesn't have the balls to lead the team and help coordinate a win.

 

It's time for you to start showing proof you're not one of those guys I usually end up with every now on my team that makes me facepalm.

[darkenwolf]

Bad Kurfer - stop feeding the troll!

 

Unless you're bored, then rock on.

[Athilias]

Kurfer, bishop is a troll. Anyway, I'd like to see what you can do without the Shock Frozen Water (as I previously stated). Everyone knows that Sins and Ops had a nice advantage wtih that, since they could stealth and fully heal in less then 8s, while their dots ticked.

 

From all the matches you posted, you had a pocket healer and Shock Frozen Water. IMO that doesn't show how good a spec is at all. Your dots may not be your primary way of play, but the damage is still there and effective. If I were to guess, at least 300k from your 600k+ SS where from dots, which were able to be cast (and buff'd) because you had a pocket healer and shock frozen water (helps to keep nodes like no other).

 

So I'll wait for a more... fair screen shot before I start judging a spec by numbers you put out.

[LordbishopX]

Me a troll man to funny I just point out his claim:

 

Assassin's dominate in PvP. Even with only 4-5 champion pieces i'm breaking 600k dps every now and then. I am usually shocked if I am not #1 dps and have less than 40 kills and 10 medals in a typical WZ.

 

I think it's one of THE best pvp classes by far, you won't regret leveling one for sure!

 

Big numbers = meaningful and point out how meaningless they are period for the dots but truth = troll for the cool kids lol. I miss my shock frozen water 2 easy medals that I now have to work to replace qq...

Edited February 17, 2012 by LordbishopX

[Kurfer]

Kurfer, bishop is a troll. Anyway, I'd like to see what you can do without the Shock Frozen Water (as I previously stated). Everyone knows that Sins and Ops had a nice advantage wtih that, since they could stealth and fully heal in less then 8s, while their dots ticked.

 

From all the matches you posted, you had a pocket healer and Shock Frozen Water. IMO that doesn't show how good a spec is at all. Your dots may not be your primary way of play, but the damage is still there and effective. If I were to guess, at least 300k from your 600k+ SS where from dots, which were able to be cast (and buff'd) because you had a pocket healer and shock frozen water (helps to keep nodes like no other).

 

So I'll wait for a more... fair screen shot before I start judging a spec by numbers you put out.

 

Don't have shockfrozen water, never had it...never cared. My healing comes from dots, not water. Usually the shockfrozen folks get healing medals and much more healing than 28-30k; i'm not one of them. Not even on my hotbar... I use medpacs, usually buy 5 of them before every match as I covet my WZ coms too much to spend on healing WZ things.

 

Please identify the pocket healer? The 620k dps match we had ONE healer who did average healing, and he clearly wasn't healing me because I was right up there in deaths. My entire crew I play with there isn't one healer. I usually queue with a BH and Jugg. The other 600k dps match I played there were two healers, the other team had even more healing...why didn't their assassin equal get 600k? Don't discredit me with silly information, it's classless.

 

Edit:

 

Here is the SS in question:

 

http://i.imgur.com/qhFD3.jpg

 

our team had one healer, he was Karisma and the other BH pocket healer....they run together alot.

 

My deaths were up there with the rest of the team...I was not being kept alive.

 

Part of the utility of our spec is that our dots give us healing, thanks for pointing it out too because I forget to even use this with my argument. At 620k dmg I should have ALOT more healing assuming I "spammed dots".

 

Also notice...that "pocket healer" was dead alot. Point out where shockfrozen water is on my bar? Not sure what it even looks like.

Edited February 17, 2012 by Kurfer

[HBninjaX]

in a straight up fight marauder is stronger, but SINs have the ability to avoid death entirely and pop on you when you're at a disadvantage.

[Kurfer]

in a straight up fight marauder is stronger, but SINs have the ability to avoid death entirely and pop on you when you're at a disadvantage.

 

i'd agree with that.

[LordbishopX]

Show a video of you doing work unedited without chessy dot spam simple as that if you got the skill I am sure someone in your group can run hypercam and post this screen shot my damage from aoe spam is silly:

 

This is free just post when ur done:

 

http://www.hyperionics.com/hc/

 

Show the real.....

Edited February 17, 2012 by LordbishopX

[Kurfer]

I have a buddy that pulled 810k dps on his assassin, I should have him post here and get flamed for it.

[LordbishopX]

in a straight up fight marauder is stronger, but SINs have the ability to avoid death entirely and pop on you when you're at a disadvantage.

 

Pretty much what most has stated instead of the king of pvp I find decent played mara a hell of a tough fight in this game other SINs/shadows not so much thats it numbers lie and so do peeps is my only point.

[LordbishopX]

I have a buddy that pulled 810k dps on his assassin, I should have him post here and get flamed for it.

 

Post a video 810k doing work is not a flame lets see how the numbers are gotten that is it in the nut shell. Most just want to know how the numbers are gotten period I seen 900k+ screen shots and the guy loss priceless I love to see the video of that match.

 

This would all be put to a rest if they just add a parser to the game period.

Edited February 17, 2012 by LordbishopX

[Astarica]

Since Madness survival depends on heals from dots (or you're exactly the same as Deception in terms of survivality assuming you do use Lightning Charge) spamming dots is okay from the user's point of view.

 

But what this glosses over is the fact that because you dotted everything around you, when someone made a crucial Whirlwind against the enemy's best player, it now only lasts about 1 second instead of 8. People only see the 'OMG they can't cap because I dotted them" but they never ever notice the part that Whirlwind duration goes from 8 to 1 seconds because of dots. Honestly, Alderran side position is easily defended without the need for dots. You can't really defend center this way (run back is way too long). Voidstar respawn is similarly too long for this strat to be viable. It's only real good on a side cannon on Alderran but having two guys staggered running back works fine and you don't have to worry about if the enemy use Cleanse type abilities. To even talk about how dots stopped capping implies you're getting owned instantly, because you don't need dots to stop capping if you're alive. I have never lost a game where we're instantly owning the defender but still failed to win. Yes it might take a few tries but eventually the defending side will lose just from the fact that they're instantly owned.

[Kurfer]

Since Madness survival depends on heals from dots (or you're exactly the same as Deception in terms of survivality assuming you do use Lightning Charge) spamming dots is okay from the user's point of view.

 

But what this glosses over is the fact that because you dotted everything around you, when someone made a crucial Whirlwind against the enemy's best player, it now only lasts about 1 second instead of 8. People only see the 'OMG they can't cap because I dotted them" but they never ever notice the part that Whirlwind duration goes from 8 to 1 seconds because of dots. Honestly, Alderran side position is easily defended without the need for dots. You can't really defend center this way (run back is way too long). Voidstar respawn is similarly too long for this strat to be viable. It's only real good on a side cannon on Alderran but having two guys staggered running back works fine and you don't have to worry about if the enemy use Cleanse type abilities. To even talk about how dots stopped capping implies you're getting owned instantly, because you don't need dots to stop capping if you're alive. I have never lost a game where we're instantly owning the defender but still failed to win. Yes it might take a few tries but eventually the defending side will lose just from the fact that they're instantly owned.

 

One could argue that it's easier to just dot them up rather than deal with that horrid resolve system...

 

To me it's too easy for random n00bs to break CC; if I dot them they still can't cap and that random idiot attacking the one target that everyone else isn't on doesn't matter as much.

 

I do see your point though. Alot of my viewpoints are because I queue alot solo. A large portion of my friends don't pvp so I end up queuing solo or with another dps class; coordinated CC to me is a pipe dream sometimes.

Edited February 17, 2012 by Kurfer

[Astarica]

One could argue that it's easier to just dot them up rather than deal with that horrid resolve system...

 

To me it's too easy for random n00bs to break CC; if I dot them they still can't cap and that random idiot attacking the one target that everyone else isn't on doesn't matter as much.

 

I do see your point though. Alot of my viewpoints are because I queue alot solo. A large portion of my friends don't pvp so I end up queuing solo or with another dps class; coordinated CC to me is a pipe dream sometimes.

 

It's hard to quantify breaking mez as a number. It obviously doesn't matter too much in most PUGs because people often don't even know they can mez you, and if they do it's likely broken immediately by someone else. But I've been CCed by very good teams that actually do leave me alone the entire time I'm mezzed and getting taken out for 8 seconds can really turn a fight around one way or another. If I was dotted, obviously none of that would've worked.

 

There is some cost behind the dots. It's probably still worth it overall due to how Madness plays, but it's not a guaranteed gain. It's kind of like Guard. People only see the Protection numbers, but they don't see when you Guarded someone who was completely locked down which just led to two guys dying even quicker. You should still Guard, but you can't just blindly use it on anyone just like you can't blindly dot everyone and say 'higher DPS/Protection number, must be working!'

[Athilias]

STUFF

 

I must apologize then. I didn't realize a Sin's healing actually gave him healing points compared to other classes (aka PT doesn't get healing from it's abilities), and assumed it came out of using shockfrozen water.

[Philosomanic]

You have to understand that when looking at your screenshots we can see that you are obviously madness or some sort of madness hybrid. Dmg numbers like that are easy to come by with the amount of dots and aoe avalible. Most players just run around and spam discharge to dot people and use wrath to aoe and scream OMG LOOK AT MY DMG. Amount of Dmg doesn't tell the whole story.

 

If you place a single dot on a target then another player kills that target, you get credit for a kill even though you did very little work in the taking down of the target.

 

If all you do is dot people up while everyone else does all the work while taking the enemies down, you will still have Huge numbers and high kills that equate to very little.

 

Scrolling over your kills to show how many killing blows you achieved would be more benificial to stating a case since it will prove that you are actually the one achieving those kills.

 

But if you are getting 50+ kills with only 3 KBs then obviously you are just a dot spammer.

 

This post isnt an attempt to bash or be negative, I'm just letting you know why alot of people are skeptical of aoe/dot classes that post SS of ridiculous numbers.

 

 

I have to respond here. Clearly, having everyone spamming DoTs and AoE would be a strategy. However, in my mind, there are actually two types of DPS: Takedown, and pressure. A Deception Sin is going to be a takedown DPS. They focus on picking one target and killing them as quickly as possible. However, a Madness Sin is a Pressure DPS. By spreading DoTs around, they aren't going to do much damage. However, they have a powerful

 

First, they put loads of pressure on the healers. If everyone on your team is taking damage from DoTs, you have two choices. You could ignore them and heal the focus target, but that means that they'll take loads of damage. However, if you try to heal your whole team, the focus target goes down in seconds. If you are fighting an enemy of equal skill and gear, but he's got several DoTs on him, you're much more likely to win. And if the healers cleanse, then that's a GCD and some force that they didn't use to heal. If the players blow their self-cleanse CD, then they can't use that when they're fighting later.

 

 

 

Having everyone apply pressure wouldn't work. However, a mix of Pressure and Takedown DPS is far, far better than only Takedown DPS. So the fact that he got those numbers is pretty impressive.

[Pwnyride]

If you really wanna talk about Overpowered/broken, you should take a look at us darkness kids. Only class/spec that is able to get every medal avalible in game. Harness darkness heals for 9% of our health everytime we have a 3 stack and use forcelightning, This along with the heal we recieve from dark charge allows us to get absurd amounts of healing in a WZ without frozen water.

 

Since we are "the tank spec" ofc we can max out the protection medals, and we can achieve every damage oriented medal in game.

 

Theres a kid on this forum, that has gotten 16 medals in one WZ, with over 75,000 in healing, 150k in protection and almost 500k damage? And you think 600k dmg from a dps spec is broken? Kufer established his arguement and defended it well. Hes obviously not an idiot, so instead of everyone always arguing, why dont we all come together to try and figure out how to optimize it.

[LordbishopX]

It's not that hard the way the game is designed if he has a pocket healer or two puts on guard and aoes like crazy pretty simple imho. A guarded pocket healer and almost any one can get crazy numbers vs noobs. There is a great video displaying a sin deception with a pocket healer doing retarded numbers it wasn't the SIN that was remarkable it was his healer that oddly the noobs never focused down lol. Love that video montage at least he thanked his healer for being the best and that was true.

 

Most any decent premades have this advantage and not that hard to achieve the numbers once in Champ/Battlemaster gear really hitting for 4k was like a dream a few weeks ago today almost full champ not a problem even with the surge nerf.

Edited February 17, 2012 by LordbishopX

[Pwnyride]

It's not that hard the way the game is designed if he has a pocket healer or two puts on guard and aoes like crazy pretty simple imho. A guarded pocket healer and almost any one can get crazy numbers vs noobs. There is a great video displaying a sin deception with a pocket healer doing retarded numbers it wasn't the SIN that was remarkable it was his healer that oddly the noobs never focused down lol. Love that video montage at least he thanked his healer for being the best and that was true.

 

Gaurd.requires dark charge which would gimp the bajesus out of a madness sin.