1.2 Hybrid

[Deridia]

I refuse to be pigeon-holed.

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200rIMokbskcZhMbZf0c.1

 

Here's what I got on the surface. Maul still has the ability to hit hard, while shock damage is will still be good with chains.

 

The idea on a single target will be having your target burn trinket on a spike so they have to eat the 4 second electrocute. That's when a weakness proc and chain chocks coupled with the 9% damage boost when stunned should help.

 

I do not want to be 3 shotted by every decent DPS, so Dark Charge is a must. This build should still allow good DPS while not dying in 3 seconds.

 

Thoughts? Anyone see any glaring holes?

[hikotai]

People need to calm the heck down. 1.2 isn't "killing" the hybrid builds, it's making them less powerful. There's a difference. As it stands pre-1.2 the 23/0/18 is undeniably the best assassin spec because it has a crapload of utility AND a crapload of damage. It's not supposed to be that powerful, and BioWare knows this. They're rebalancing the skill trees so that being hybrid actually works like being a hybrid is supposed to work. More utility and variety of tactics, but less focus on any specific task which means you won't be as effective in specific scenarios as a pure might be.

 

In other words, giving up the damage output of a pure in order to gain more tank-ish utility and versatility. That's how hybriding is supposed to work. It's not supposed to be the easymode button all these whiners want it to be.

 

tl;dr: you're not being pidgeonholed. Hybriding still exists (I believe your post has proven that?), its just not the best spec anymore.

 

 

Edit: Forgot to comment on the build itself. My one and only complaint is that if I were to run darkness/madness hybrid, I'd want the Death Field stuff, which is missing from yours because you took up a lot of deception also. I can see what you're going for though, it looks okay from a glance. I'll take a more in-depth look later.

Edited February 2, 2012 by hikotai

[Deridia]

People need to calm the heck down. 1.2 isn't "killing" the hybrid builds, it's making them less powerful. There's a difference. As it stands pre-1.2 the 23/0/18 is undeniably the best assassin spec because it has a crapload of utility AND a crapload of damage. It's not supposed to be that powerful, and BioWare knows this. They're rebalancing the skill trees so that being hybrid actually works like being a hybrid is supposed to work. More utility and variety of tactics, but less focus on any specific task which means you won't be as effective in specific scenarios as a pure might be.

 

In other words, giving up the damage output of a pure in order to gain more tank-ish utility and versatility. That's how hybriding is supposed to work. It's not supposed to be the easymode button all these whiners want it to be.

 

tl;dr: you're not being pidgeonholed. Hybriding still exists (I believe your post has proven that?), its just not the best spec anymore.

 

 

Edit: Forgot to comment on the build itself. My one and only complaint is that if I were to run darkness/madness hybrid, I'd want the Death Field stuff, which is missing from yours because you took up a lot of deception also. I can see what you're going for though, it looks okay from a glance. I'll take a more in-depth look later.

 

While I appreciate your post, 1.2 will absolutely kill my build.

 

I was not 23/0/18. I am 23/18/0, meaning yes, the change breaks me. It doesn't make me less powerful it makes ~10 of the points I spent in deception useless.

 

I don't think hybrids are broke, I think my hybrid is broke, and wanted others thoughts on a replacement.

[ReFlexionn]

but but but....hardness darkness is missing

[Sabbathius]

People need to calm the heck down. 1.2 isn't "killing" the hybrid builds

 

There's a point where hybrids are made "less powerful" enough to make them dead. Dead, after all, is nothing more than "less powerful than alive".

[Deridia]

but but but....hardness darkness is missing

 

my play style is more melee. I prefer a rotation of thrashes, shock, and mauls rather than lightning.

 

I only really use lightning in conjunction with reckless to finish off fleeing enemies.

[Sabbathius]

my play style is more melee. I prefer a rotation of thrashes, shock, and mauls rather than lightning.

 

I only really use lightning in conjunction with reckless to finish off fleeing enemies.

 

Oh, yeah...who needs uninterruptible Force Lightning doing 25-75% more damage and potentially healing you for up to 12% of your total HP over 3 seconds?

[ReFlexionn]

^

______________

[Sovereighn]

Oh, yeah...who needs uninterruptible Force Lightning doing 25-75% more damage and potentially healing you for up to 12% of your total HP over 3 seconds?

 

Ok than as i was playing the 23-0-18 build i am thinking re specing to this build. I dont want to miss deathfield anymore. So you are saying Harnessed Darkness with 3 stacks is such a killer. Can you tell me aprox how many shocks you need to get 3 stacks? I know its different but yeah.. Also how high is a tick from force lightning than? Or better said full damage output with a 3 stack force lightning in total?

 

THis will be the build i would change maybe

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200rIMokrskbZZf0cRb.1

[Sabbathius]

Every Shock gives you a guaranteed Harnessed Darkness +1. In next patch, every Wither will give you a guaranteed Harnessed Darkness +1. So, Shock->Wither->Shock->Force Lightning, with Thrash or whatever in between.

 

Shock is on 6 sec CD, Wither is on 8 sec CD.

If you go Shock at 0 sec

Wither at 1.5 sec

Thrash, which has 50% chance to reset the cooldown of Shock because of Energize AND make it a guaranteed crit at 3 seconds.

If Thrash procs Energize, before you Shock, use Recklesness, it'll give that shock a +50% damage.

And then channel Force Lightning, which will be immune to interruption, and have 30m range and +60% crit due to remaining one charge of Recklesness, do 75% more damage AND heal you for 12% of your total HP.

 

You can still be CCd when doing Force Lightning, such as knockback, stun, etc. But these things add resolve. So next time you do it (which will be quick, your Shock and Wither will have reset by now), you will be immune to CC as well.

 

This is all guesswork. Currently it takes quite a bit longer to build the full stack of Harnessed Darkness, and it falls off too quick. In next patch, the buff will stay 30 seconds, which is also nice.

 

Overall, the spec looks beastly right now. Healing and tanking and mobility (Force Speed on 20 sec CD and removes roots when used) and decent damage all in one package.

 

And of course those guaranteed Shock crits with Energize from Thrash? They proc Exploitive Strikes in Madness tree, increasing your melee crit by 9%.

 

Bottom line, 31/0/10 is looking GOOD next patch. Deception still looks like crap. Madness? I haven't done it on a Sin, only Sorc. On a Sorc it's pretty beastly. But they can hybrid any way they like, because they don't have stances.

 

At level 40, in PvE, my 3-stack FL did about 2-3k damage over 3 seconds. According to a guildie, at 50 he can get up to 7k damage out of it.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Sabbathius

[Fashooba]

Will the second shock skill in the madness tree proc another stack of harnessed darkness?

[Sabbathius]

Will the second shock skill in the madness tree proc another stack of harnessed darkness?

 

Don't know, I don't have it yet (1 more level to go).

 

Good question though. If it does, rotation would be even easier.

1. Wither to reduce incoming damage and slow the enemy.

2. Thrash until Energize procs.

3. Recklessness.

4. Shock

4a. If second Shock procs, then Force Lightning.

4b. If it doesn't, Thrash until another Energize, then Shock, and again Force Lightning.

5. Repeat the above, minus the Recklessness which is on CD.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Sabbathius

[Varcan]

27/0/14 will be the last of the dying bred of hybrids.

 

But, 31/0/10 will be the new IT PvP build period. Its faster Harnessed Shadows(3 stacks) pushes it past 27/0/14, and it has similar AoE utility, and better utility overall because of the 30% AoE slow.

[Sabbathius]

But, 31/0/10 will be the new IT PvP build period. Its faster Harnessed Shadows(3 stacks) pushes it past 27/0/14, and it has similar AoE utility, and better utility overall because of the 30% AoE slow.

 

Yep. Not to mention Force Pull and Spike out of stealth on 30 sec CD. Pushes it way beyond any hybrid, when you consider it as a single package. What I mean is, Spike has a very nice synergy with the Force Lightning. You can make sure they stay where they are, and fry them. You can also make sure they can't CC you while you do it.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Sabbathius

[Pijinz]

Will the second shock skill in the madness tree proc another stack of harnessed darkness?

 

Nope. It doesn't benefit from Energize either (the second Shock can crit on its own, but it doesn't get auto-crit).

[Sabbathius]

Nope. It doesn't benefit from Energize either (the second Shock can crit on its own, but it doesn't get auto-crit).

 

Yeah, I was just reading that too. But apparently it does eat a second charge of Recklesness? Doesn't really matter though, I suppose.

 

The more I look at Sins in 1.1.2, the more I realize 31 Darkness is the way to go. Madness looks much better, but there's just way too much utility in Darkness to give up. And survivability should go through the roof if played right. I'm now thinking that 1.1.3 might even bring a nerf to it in some form.

[Deridia]

Oh, yeah...who needs uninterruptible Force Lightning doing 25-75% more damage and potentially healing you for up to 12% of your total HP over 3 seconds?

 

I personally prefer a 3500 maul over a 1200 per tick lightning. Damage over time allows them to react, sure they can't interrupt or knock you back but they can stealth, LoS, Range, pot etc.

 

Still just theory crafting though, so I'm definitely interested in trying to work it into a build and see if it fits the way I play.

[Berjiz]

I think your build is a bit bad, first you have 26 points in darkness but not anything in harness darkness. Which also leads me to the second point. Nerve Wrecking and Shroud of darkness is very crappy. 3% endurance is around 400 health, wont save you from anything. Duration of spike and electrocute is a bit to low and situatonal to be worth it. Those points are much better spent for 1 point in harness darkness or death field and in swelling shadows and premenition. It gives one point left though that I would put in electric execution. Not sure if premenition is that good either so they might be better in electric execution.

[Sabbathius]

I personally prefer a 3500 maul over a 1200 per tick lightning. Damage over time allows them to react, sure they can't interrupt or knock you back but they can stealth, LoS, Range, pot etc.

 

When you compare it purely like that, Maul's 3500 damage vs 1200 per tick of Lightning, sure. But does Maul heal you for 500+ per tick too?

 

Stealth, only 2 classes can do it. Sins and Ops. In both cases it's a 2 min CD minimum, 3 min untalented. If they want to blow it, they're welcome to it. I'll be happy to waste a 6 second CD Force Lightning on their 3 min CD.

 

LoS doesn't work, as Force Lightning slows your movement 50% for the duration. If you're not already LoSing by the time it is cast, odds are it'll finish.

 

Pot, again, 90 sec CD. They're welcome to it. The cast heals me while it damages them, and I'm a tank, in tanking stance. If I'm forcing them to pot, odds are I will outlast them anyway.

 

I get what you're saying though, a bird in the hand is better than 2 in the bush. They could get help (but so could I), they could msybe escape (which is fine and dandy with me, as I'm usually defending something and them running away is a win for me). But the benefits so far outweigh the shortcomings that I don't think it's even a competition any more. Post patch I expect 80-90% switch to Darkness just because it'll be the only semi-viable spec.

 

Some weirdos (in a good way) will play Madness, but IMHO if you want to do that, you should play a Sorc. it works ever so much better when everything you have is 30m range, plus you get the added DoT from Affliction.

 

EDIT: That is not to say some people will not stay Deception and make it work. I'm sure they will. But with that amount of skill and work, they would probably do better as Darkness anyway. Sure, they won't top the damage chart, but the team as a whole will be ever so much better off for it.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Sabbathius

[Buchy]

Marauders can also stealth.

 

However now this change is almost forcing people into Darkness for PVP.

[Lazymode]

Quick question. In regards to PvP, would a 31/0/10 sin want to go for the Stalker PvP gear or the "tank" pvp gear (i forget the name). And would they want a shield or focus?

[hikotai]

Quick question. In regards to PvP, would a 31/0/10 sin want to go for the Stalker PvP gear or the "tank" pvp gear (i forget the name). And would they want a shield or focus?

 

The simple answer is a response question: do you want to take more hits or do more damage? Base your gear on that decision.

[Berjiz]

Quick question. In regards to PvP, would a 31/0/10 sin want to go for the Stalker PvP gear or the "tank" pvp gear (i forget the name). And would they want a shield or focus?

You definlty will want shield since the whole point with darkness spec is to use dark charge and shield.

[AlphaBraddox]

It is somewhat lame for BW to require players to fully commit to a tree in order to get 2ndary benefits which will highly nerf hybrid builds. I never liked that idea and forces players to limit their builds.

 

2ndary benefits like HD should not require top tier tree feat.

 

Also I still think it is funny that BW decided to allow Sins to be tanks with light armor!?! About as funny as healers that are Heavy armor Tanks.

[ReFlexionn]

Every Shock gives you a guaranteed Harnessed Darkness +1. In next patch, every Wither will give you a guaranteed Harnessed Darkness +1. So, Shock->Wither->Shock->Force Lightning, with Thrash or whatever in between.

 

Shock is on 6 sec CD, Wither is on 8 sec CD.

If you go Shock at 0 sec

Wither at 1.5 sec

Thrash, which has 50% chance to reset the cooldown of Shock because of Energize

 

30% soon