We Want Dual Spec & We Want it Now

[sczmajor]

Please don't add Dual Specs Bioware. Thanks.

[peaceandpassion]

If we want a dual spec than we want dual-siding as well!

We want to switch sides when needed so we could use dark side relics when they are cheap on GTN or light side relics when these get cheaper.

We want dual-siding to use little sandcrawler for Tatooine questing and than quickly switch to use Inetrrigation droids for Corelia questing.

We want dual-siding so we can wear black pants when it's raining outside and white pants when it's sunny!

 

We want dual-siding!

 

Your really not as clever as you think you are. Seeing as your post makes no actual point other than you dont understand what duel spec really does for endgame gamers

[Teknoflow]

As is the typical problem with arguments like you made it doesn't work, at all.

 

If people could drive without cops or the need to get a license then your argument would work. If people are horrible drivers it CAN (not always) catch up to them. If you have no idea how to drive and you try it you won't do it very long.

 

Where as people can change specs (if there is dual spec) without any consequences if they are lazy and bad. There is zero chance anything negative is going to happen to them for playing a role they have no idea how to play.

 

The irony is your very own argument says there is very little difference between the two roles you want to dual spec to and from. That being the case it really isn't needed is it? Sense there is only "2 different abilities" it's hardly worth them adding dual spec for that now is it?

 

 

It DOES have consequences though. If I spec to a tank spec and dont know what I'm doing, word is going to get around that I dont know what I'm doing, and I won't be invited to groups anymore. The community DOES police things like that.

 

As to your last bit. Kinetic Combat and Infiltration have a lot of the same abilities, making me relatively familiar with how both work (But certainly one would need to practice and study before making the switch though) But the two different abilities ARE NEEDED to play it efficiently. There is enough of a difference to make switching specs necessary, but NOT enough of a difference to justify me playing all of the same content again. But this is just a matter of opinion, not fact.

 

The fact is, dual specialization and how much it is needed is a matter of opinion. It isn't necessary, and therefore if you don't want it, don't use it. But the game will NOT be worse off for it.

[Adderdin]

You can't compare this game and WoW because by the time dual spec came in WoW most players had multiple characters max level anyway. The game was years old when dual spec hit so it had less of an impact.

 

Compare it to Rift because that had dual spec right out of the gate if you want to draw comparisons. Rift is where I learned just how bad it can really be. I actually had no problem with it in WoW, again because the player base was built up and so many that dual speced had an idea how to play the roles they were playing anyway.

 

When you buy a new phone that has been on the marked for 1 month, do you compare it to nokia 3210? It can call, it can answer calls, it can write and recive sms. OMG great product.

 

When you think about getting a car, do you think about those made 100 years ago, with just you know.... steam stanley. Or do you buy a product thats up to date?

 

Would you buy a game with sprite graphics of Duke Nukem 3d, just because the company that made it, is new to the market or would you choose Battlefield 3?

 

Yes, i laugh at people just like you.

[Lagerale]

You clearly enjoy making up storys, i played rift and still do. i can tell u duel spec saved that came and is the reason its still going strong even when pops go low.

 

Dont comment on something unless your at endgame and understand whats going on in regards to tanks and healers.

 

It's NOT "going strong" it's simply still going, you said yourself it has low population.

 

Lets also look at another effect of dual spec, especially in a story based game. Bioware worked hard on the story lines. They also want time sinks (every mmo needs them) to keep people playing. It's a fine line between too many of them mind you, but they are needed. So you add dual spec and now instead of rolling alts (the best time sink a company like Bioware wants) you just respec. This is a big problem and part of the reason Rift didn't work. I played it, it was a fun game, but once I had the character built I didn't really need to roll an alt. The problem was, what do I do now. The answer, play a new game.

 

If you think that Bioware, having planed this game for YEARS, couldn't have added in dual spec when they launched the game your crazy. They didn't add it for a reason. Sure they will eventually add it, I really believe they will, but they also see the problems with giving it to soon.

[peaceandpassion]

4 man flaspoints need 1 tank....

8 mans need 1 tank......

16mans need 2 tanks.....

 

Add up those numbers in your head. IF 16 people start the game together and progress as i have stated then at least 2 tanks and 2 healers will have to re-roll dps as there MS.

 

OR

 

respec every time they wish to dps or heal.

 

That is the major issue at endgame, and if u cant see it ur blind

[alike]

You can't compare this game and WoW because by the time dual spec came in WoW most players had multiple characters max level anyway. The game was years old when dual spec hit so it had less of an impact.

 

Compare it to Rift because that had dual spec right out of the gate if you want to draw comparisons. Rift is where I learned just how bad it can really be. I actually had no problem with it in WoW, again because the player base was built up and so many that dual speced had an idea how to play the roles they were playing anyway.

 

How can being able to switch between 2/3 builds destroy the game? Its not like we want to be able to pick what spec we want day after day, is it? We just want to be able to have a spec where we can do PVE, and one spec that will enable us to do PVP. Look at sages and their healing tree. What good dose that make in 1v1 pvp? NOTHING

[peaceandpassion]

It's NOT "going strong" it's simply still going, you said yourself it has low population.

 

Lets also look at another effect of dual spec, especially in a story based game. Bioware worked hard on the story lines. They also want time sinks (every mmo needs them) to keep people playing. It's a fine line between too many of them mind you, but they are needed. So you add dual spec and now instead of rolling alts (the best time sink a company like Bioware wants) you just respec. This is a big problem and part of the reason Rift didn't work. I played it, it was a fun game, but once I had the character built I didn't really need to roll an alt. The problem was, what do I do now. The answer, play a new game.

 

If you think that Bioware, having planed this game for YEARS, couldn't have added in dual spec when they launched the game your crazy. They didn't add it for a reason. Sure they will eventually add it, I really believe they will, but they also see the problems with giving it to soon.

 

I understand you point, but atm endgame is a mess because of the lack of duel spec, chec my post before this for the reason why.

[Swage]

Happy NOT to have dual spec as well.

 

Here's almost every MMO I've played on tough content:

 

On launch: People try to complete, some fail, some succeed regardless of party mix.

 

1 Month post launch: People try to build balanced parties

 

1-6 months in: Someone posts on the web a single way to succeed in that content, everyone else cuts and pastes it; that way now becomes the 'only' way to complete. People are rejected from groups because the leaders are trying to build the 'perfect' party because a web site told them they will fail otherwise.

 

More than 6 months in: People become so familiar with the content that they realise you don't need a very specific party to complete.

 

1 year in: People are making odd character builds for fun that actually work well, about half the community is completely unstressed about party build so long as there is a timely completion. The other half of the community continues to believe year old web posts about a singular way to complete content and still reject players from their parties to build the 'perfect party'; these people will never change.

 

My conclusions: SW:ToR will play out this scenario in a similiar fashion if the tools are given to the community to encourage it, dual spec is one of those tools.

[Faefrost]

Dual spec would be a nice feature. But it isn't a critically needed feature and certainly not one needed NOW NOW NOW!

 

I'm actually kind of enjoying the focus on my character being only one more specialized type. That I can't flip to whatever on the fly. It helps me identify with the toon and my class.

[Lagerale]

It DOES have consequences though. If I spec to a tank spec and dont know what I'm doing, word is going to get around that I dont know what I'm doing, and I won't be invited to groups anymore. The community DOES police things like that.

 

As to your last bit. Kinetic Combat and Infiltration have a lot of the same abilities, making me relatively familiar with how both work (But certainly one would need to practice and study before making the switch though) But the two different abilities ARE NEEDED to play it efficiently. There is enough of a difference to make switching specs necessary, but NOT enough of a difference to justify me playing all of the same content again. But this is just a matter of opinion, not fact.

 

The fact is, dual specialization and how much it is needed is a matter of opinion. It isn't necessary, and therefore if you don't want it, don't use it. But the game will NOT be worse off for it.

 

Your last sentence is also opinion, within reason. The GAME might not be any worse for having dual spec, but the enjoyment could be for players. No one can convince me that dual spec won't produce watered down quality of players in each role, just like I can't argue that I could play from 10 years and never run into a character that is bad BECAUSE they are running a dual spec. What we can't argue is that without dual spec I won't run into a bad player BECAUSE of dual spec and most bad players won't make it to end game as a healer or tank, they give up because it's "to hard" to level while getting yelled at in every group they join.

[Derbefrier]

i like how people pretend duel spec makes bad tanks or healers as if they dont already exist.

 

and the " I want choices to matter" argument is stupid as well you can already change your spec so there is no permanent choice anyway adding duel spec doesn't change that. if you really wanted choice to matter you guys would be in here wanting to take away a respec option all together but you don't because you want to be able to respec just like everyone else its just for some reason you think making it a pain in the *** gives depth to the game.

[aznthecapn]

Happy NOT to have dual spec as well.

 

Here's almost every MMO I've played on tough content:

 

On launch: People try to complete, some fail, some succeed regardless of party mix.

 

1 Month post launch: People try to build balanced parties

 

1-6 months in: Someone posts on the web a single way to succeed in that content, everyone else cuts and pastes it; that way now becomes the 'only' way to complete. People are rejected from groups because the leaders are trying to build the 'perfect' party because a web site told them they will fail otherwise.

 

More than 6 months in: People become so familiar with the content that they realise you don't need a very specific party to complete.

 

1 year in: People are making odd character builds for fun that actually work well, about half the community is completely unstressed about party build so long as there is a timely completion. The other half of the community continues to believe year old web posts about a singular way to complete content and still reject players from their parties to build the 'perfect party'; these people will never change.

 

My conclusions: SW:ToR will play out this scenario in a similiar fashion if the tools are given to the community to encourage it, dual spec is one of those tools.

 

This will happen even without dual spec. Dual spec changes nothing that we can't already do. It simply makes it more accessible. People who compete for tough content will STILL optimize groups and find the "best" spec possible and publish methods for beating content.

 

The path you laid out is already on course without dual spec therefore adding dual spec will cause no further issues.

[Trineda]

Hello everyone,

 

In order to keep the forums tidy and conversations in one place please use this thread to discuss the topic of dual specs, we will be closing this current thread. Thank you!

Edited February 1, 2012 by Trineda