Aramoro Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 If you can handle the class story twice then try out the Gunslinger. Ranged execute is awesome-sauce. I'll keep playing my 50 scoundrel although maybe slightly less pvp and more hardmodes and ops. Then lvling on of many alts which include Vanguard, Gunslinger, Shadow and Sentinel. Care to guess which role I play most? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davejax Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 I picked scoundrel and have played it since the beginning. My problem with these nerfs is the whiners. The point is to pick someone being stupid or low on health and kill them. If I start fighting in a group everyone targets me and I'm dead. Sorcs can stun the crap out of me and apparently we need our stuns nerfed. A good player will get stunned once and resist the rest. Sure nerf our burst but DPS is getting to be unplayable. PvE we are at a severe disadvantage as a scrapper compared to other melee classes, and Dirty fighting lacks compared to it being used as a gunslinger. I played this class to DPS, but when I got shadows bragging about doing more damage and 6k+ bursting and we are still getting nerfed, it is discouraging. In my guild I'm preferred to switching to heals if I want to raid because these are true facts. Can smugglers just be gunslingers, and add a fourth tree that is healing. I really don't want to reroll gunslinger to DPS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awakelol Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 I really hope you're not playing a sorc. Break the opening knockback, or break opening tranq. Whichever it may be. You have interrupts, dots, knockbacks, slows, a **** button yes? Use them. "ABSOLUTELY NOTHING YOU CAN DO" is not true. Smugs and Operatives have no gap closers. Break away and watch them come at you in slow motion, and destroy them. Rogues can't just stand toe to toe with someone and expect not to lose. Their strength is their suprise, and their weakness is extremely low survivability, an not having a gap closer. If your trinket cd is down, which normally it is in WZ's, then yes there is absolutely nothing you can do to prevent the knockdown opener, and subsequent absurd burst dmg. People who don't take anyone but tanks down to 30%ish from 100% in their opener are either fresh 50's in greens, or are not playing their class correctly. I regularly get that much taken off my health bar in openers even in full champion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agemnon Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 I really hope you're not playing a sorc. Break the opening knockback, or break opening tranq. Whichever it may be. You have interrupts, dots, knockbacks, slows, a **** button yes? Use them. "ABSOLUTELY NOTHING YOU CAN DO" is not true. Smugs and Operatives have no gap closers. Break away and watch them come at you in slow motion, and destroy them. Rogues can't just stand toe to toe with someone and expect not to lose. Their strength is their suprise, and their weakness is extremely low survivability, an not having a gap closer. Shadowstep should be baseline for all rogue specs since it's too important. I dual specced assassination, found out I have no shadowstep, which was one of those "What?!" moments like melee mobs who stand a floor under you, hit the air and still damage you or move at supersonic speed over normally unclimbable slopes to get to you after you hit them ("what?!" moments on another class obviously), so I said, "screw this I'm going back to subtlety". scoundrel/operative also needs an ability similar to CoS so we can wash off the DoTs while in the process of vanishing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davejax Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 I picked scoundrel and have played it since the beginning. My problem with these nerfs is the whiners. The point is to pick someone being stupid or low on health and kill them. If I start fighting in a group everyone targets me and I'm dead. Sorcs can stun the crap out of me and apparently we need our stuns nerfed. A good player will get stunned once and resist the rest. Sure nerf our burst but DPS is getting to be unplayable. PvE we are at a severe disadvantage as a scrapper compared to other melee classes, and Dirty fighting lacks compared to it being used as a gunslinger. I played this class to DPS, but when I got shadows bragging about doing more damage and 6k+ bursting and we are still getting nerfed, it is discouraging. In my guild I'm preferred to switching to heals if I want to raid because these are true facts. Can smugglers just be gunslingers, and add a fourth tree that is healing. I really don't want to reroll gunslinger to DPS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwacko Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 I don't mind the reduction for initial damage, but distance and sustained damage needs to be raised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tetrablade Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 (edited) How this for a comparison. No other AC in the game can take a player at 50 from 100% to 30%ish in a few second opener that leaves the player completely helpless and unable to react for the duration. Right and no honest scoundrel/operative will dispute that itself is overpowered. But what the non-operaitive/scoundrels seem to be deaf to is that we keep saying its ALL WE HAVE. Look at the scrapper tree, its all about the shotgun and crit. NOTHING boosts our survivability besides making one energy regen ability heal 2% health every 3 seconds. We can't taunt, we can't pushback, our knock down is very deep in the tree and costs 2 points, and flechet round is our 31 point ability and basically is a buff for armor penetration and bleed. The assassin/shadow in comparison gets a much bigger toolbox in terms of survival. Is the 3 second knockdown plus massive crits overpowered? YES, absolutely! But gutting the damage only makes the scoundrel/operative both weak in attack AND defense. All the community has been saying is if you take the burst damage, up our sustainable and defenses. If you actually read the forums, most of us have been complaining about being a one trick pony just as much as you all complain that the glass cannon is killing you. Edited January 29, 2012 by Tetrablade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caminheiros Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 thinking of rolling an op soon actually...(main and only class is a sage.) In my opinion Op gives more burst damage than scoundrel, the theory of they being mirror in kinda weird to me!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perato Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 If your trinket cd is down, which normally it is in WZ's, then yes there is absolutely nothing you can do to prevent the knockdown opener, and subsequent absurd burst dmg. People who don't take anyone but tanks down to 30%ish from 100% in their opener are either fresh 50's in greens, or are not playing their class correctly. I regularly get that much taken off my health bar in openers even in full champion. This seems to be the main issue. Most people have no idea yet how to manage their cc breaker. They will mash it at the first sign of being slowed or a 2 second stun so they can chase some 4 on 1 kill, and then when a real threat comes along they are totally helpless because their trinket is on cd. I would say if it's on cd most of the time then you're doing it wrong. Hell, a lot of people don't even realise you can trinket out of knockdown! We are being handicapped because of other classes' lack of knowledge and experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metalmac Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 Shadowstep should be baseline for all rogue specs since it's too important. I dual specced assassination, found out I have no shadowstep, which was one of those "What?!" moments like melee mobs who stand a floor under you, hit the air and still damage you or move at supersonic speed over normally unclimbable slopes to get to you after you hit them ("what?!" moments on another class obviously), so I said, "screw this I'm going back to subtlety". scoundrel/operative also needs an ability similar to CoS so we can wash off the DoTs while in the process of vanishing. Agreed as they first thing they do is put the dot on us to make stealth worthless for a stealth class this is doom. It is not like I can interupt the lighting spam they have with zero cooldowns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perato Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 doesn't cleanse get rid of dots? just pop that before disappearing act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trizell Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 If my CC breaker isn't up, it happens to me all the time and I'm in nearly full Battlemaster gear. There is ABSOLUTELY nothing you can do unless your cc remover is up and I'm usually less then 30% actually by the time it lets me do anything. Maybe you aren't playing yours correctly? I hit full BM gear people all the time while I'm in full BM gear. It happens to me ALL the time. Its even worse when I'm not fighting a COMPLETE pug. I can usually be kited and some healer heals my target back to full!!! Try it. Maybe you aren't playing your class correctly? I do this right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agemnon Posted January 29, 2012 Author Share Posted January 29, 2012 doesn't cleanse get rid of dots? just pop that before disappearing act. I've looked at it and you're right! Though for only two, and only tech or physical effects, so it would be useless vs. mind crush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leLoir Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Use dodge for mental effects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurro Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Ah, so you're one of THOSE types. my thoughts.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drakks Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Shadowstep should be baseline for all rogue specs since it's too important. I dual specced assassination, found out I have no shadowstep, which was one of those "What?!" moments like melee mobs who stand a floor under you, hit the air and still damage you or move at supersonic speed over normally unclimbable slopes to get to you after you hit them ("what?!" moments on another class obviously), so I said, "screw this I'm going back to subtlety". scoundrel/operative also needs an ability similar to CoS so we can wash off the DoTs while in the process of vanishing. Good god man, want them to name the class Rogue and call the game World of Warcraft as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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