[Guide] Sage DPS PVP Hybrid

[Anyday]

UPDATE: Updated For Patch 1.1+

 

Hello everyone, I've made a youtube video on a sage dps hybrid guide for pvp.

I'm just starting out with youtube videos so be kind

 

Guide

Check it out at:

My spec: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#600ZbsMMdMrZcrcRsMkz.1

Drakaris's Hybrid Build: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#600hZdcMMdRroZcMcRs0z.1

 

How To Obtain Certain Mods / Enhancements

(Locations still valid, stat-craft out of date)

Check it out at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cqOCs1_A-s

 

Hope ya'll enjoy

Edited March 12, 2012 by Anyday

[nilssen]

I thoroughly enjoyed that, keep em coming!

 

*liked, subbed.

[Anyday]

I appreciate the feedback

[KJOhio]

Great guide. Keep them coming.

 

I am starting with PvP, and your explanations make things easy to understand.

[Solantharius]

Very well done video, was most helpful as your explanations of things were very clear and easy to see and understand as you explained them. Just started my sage alt and this was most helpful

[commiedic]

This made me hungry for tuna salad, but all in all I enjoyed it.

[Fenz]

I like your spec, will try it out.

[Anyday]

Just started my sage alt and this was most helpful

 

I'm planning on doing a strategy guide later on be sure to check back ;-)

[Kyuubil]

Just going to point out

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=249703

 

this thread, which shows Psychic Suffusion doesn't affect TK wave, so those are some points you can free up.

[Drakaris]

Nice vid. Few flaws tho (that's my personal opinion, feel free to object ofc).

 

As mentioned previously, Psychic Suffusion currently doesn't work with TW, so you can simply free 5 points from Seer and just grab the crit talent there. I don't see a reason to waste 5 talent points for 10% dmg on FiB, if you wanna better FiB just go deeper in Balance.

 

However, you can spend 1 point in Telekinetic Momentum (yes, one) because that thing is currently bugged as hell and you'll be incredibly surprised by the proc rate of that one single point. Abuse it, till it's fixed. I didn't believe it (there's a thread somewhere, can't find it right now, will post later), i tested it, i love it.

 

This way you can max your Telekinetic Effusion because i don't really feel comfortable with only one point there and no points in Inner Strength. This will probably drain your energy in an intense and long fights.

 

Mind's Eye... I guess it's a matter of choice, personally i find this talent useless. I don't shoot Disturbances and 5m on TW is not such a big deal (rarely need that 5m more).

 

I suppose you have a really good reason not to take Upheaval. Kinda contradicts with your own statement of "still maintaining the ability to deal tons of dmg in solo encounters". This is huge dmg, dude and you didn't take it because... Focused Insight and 1 point in Jedi Resistance? Really? I'm sorry but these talents are simply worthless.

 

So my 2 cents. Atm with the bugged Telekinetic Momentum and "not working as intended" Psychic Suffusion:

 

http://knotor.com/skills#AgEDFRDLSWlyeomSmqq6ydLbeYmTmau6y9oA

 

This last point... Put it wherever you want, personally i'd suggest Containment, Pinning Resolve or Blockout.

Edited January 30, 2012 by Drakaris

[Sherpova]

Instant Force Lift is too good not to take in my opinion.

[JBloom]

I don't like kinetic collapse tbh. I put more points in balance than you but our builds are pretty similar.

 

Here's mine: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#600RZrczMdMMZfrrRoMk.1

 

I've considered moving a few points around to gain more crit but otherwise I think it's a pretty solid build for group pvp. Not so much solo pvp though, but I never pvp solo.

[agentbam]

Nice vid. Few flaws tho (that's my personal opinion, feel free to object ofc).

 

As mentioned previously, Psychic Suffusion currently doesn't work with TW, so you can simply free 5 points from Seer and just grab the crit talent there. I don't see a reason to waste 5 talent points for 10% dmg on FiB, if you wanna better FiB just go deeper in Balance.

 

However, you can spend 1 point in Telekinetic Momentum (yes, one) because that thing is currently bugged as hell and you'll be incredibly surprised by the proc rate of that one single point. Abuse it, till it's fixed. I didn't believe it (there's a thread somewhere, can't find it right now, will post later), i tested it, i love it.

 

This way you can max your Telekinetic Effusion because i don't really feel comfortable with only one point there and no points in Inner Strength. This will probably drain your energy in an intense and long fights.

 

Mind's Eye... I guess it's a matter of choice, personally i find this talent useless. I don't shoot Disturbances and 5m on TW is not such a big deal (rarely need that 5m more).

 

I suppose you have a really good reason not to take Upheaval. Kinda contradicts with your own statement of "still maintaining the ability to deal tons of dmg in solo encounters". This is huge dmg, dude and you didn't take it because... Focused Insight and 1 point in Jedi Resistance? Really? I'm sorry but these talents are simply worthless.

 

So my 2 cents. Atm with the bugged Telekinetic Momentum and "not working as intended" Psychic Suffusion:

 

http://knotor.com/skills#AgEDFRDLSWlyeomSmqq6ydLbeYmTmau6y9oA

 

This last point... Put it wherever you want, personally i'd suggest Containment, Pinning Resolve or Blockout.

 

Very nice build and I played around with the mechanics of it this morning and it worked really well. Thanks for sharing.

[Anyday]

Nice vid. Few flaws tho (that's my personal opinion, feel free to object ofc).

 

As mentioned previously, Psychic Suffusion currently doesn't work with TW, so you can simply free 5 points from Seer and just grab the crit talent there. I don't see a reason to waste 5 talent points for 10% dmg on FiB, if you wanna better FiB just go deeper in Balance.

Just going to point out

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=249703

 

this thread, which shows Psychic Suffusion doesn't affect TK wave, so those are some points you can free up.

 

I'll have to test this, but I'm fairly certain it's inaccurate. I know it does not affect the singe-target, but I do notice TK putting out more damage on surrounding targets (I'm critting surrounding targets for 4.1k damage where I'll crit the main target for 3.7k) and without doing any math that appears to be 10%. It might be an expertise issue, but it's hard to state definitively right now.

 

This way you can max your Telekinetic Effusion because i don't really feel comfortable with only one point there and no points in Inner Strength. This will probably drain your energy in an intense and long fights.

I've never had issues running out of force, even in pretty extended battles.

 

I suppose you have a really good reason not to take Upheaval. Kinda contradicts with your own statement of "still maintaining the ability to deal tons of dmg in solo encounters". This is huge dmg, dude and you didn't take it because... Focused Insight and 1 point in Jedi Resistance? Really? I'm sorry but these talents are simply worthless.

I've been messing around with the lower talents in balance and that's partially the reason I didn't mention them in the video. The reason I tried talenting out of upheaval is because it tends to be really bad RNG (considering I really only get one point) ... Focused Insight can and has saved my *** quite a few times, esp with the 2 set bonus of force-master. Keep in mind that the goal in pvp is not necessarily to always obliterate your enemy, just to survive longer than them. So while maxing out upheaval technically increases dps, it may not necessarily be the right idea.

[Anyday]

So, I've messed with your spec a bit Drakaris and it does seem very viable. Whether or not it does more dps is questionable due to the RNG factor and depends on how lucky you are on procs. It is worth it? I suppose it's up to the player... Regardless I've decided to do an addendum video and I'll be sure to give you credit.

 

As far as Psychic Suffusion not boosting TK, I'm relatively sure that's wrong -- I really just wish I had a combat log to compare.

 

Thanks.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Anyday

[Raeken]

Think 0/13/28 is much better for dealing damage.

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/jedi_consular/sage/#::e2fefe7cf2e4f9efe2fe3df20

 

Think penetrating light and psychic suffusion aren't worth it.

Don't need Telekinetic Effusion cause as you said ... you are fast to kill. So I don't have problems with my force-management .

Kinetic Collapse is fail too ... your main damage spells are areas. So they will be stunned and instantly knocked out of your own stun.

 

Think Mental Scarring, Force Suppression and Drain Thoughts are essentiel for good damage.

[JBloom]

Tk effusion lowers the cd on force speed though.

[Raeken]

Think Force Speed is crap ... 80% of the time Iam using Force Speed I got stunned or mezzed ... or some tank charged me. Totaly useless in my opinion. Iam a DD ... I want to generate damage and don't want to waste time running around

 

Mental Scarring gives you 30% Crit-Boost on Force in Balance which you can cast istantly every 15 seconds and boosts your Telekinetic Throw, Weaken Mind and Mind Crush Crits.

 

As a Sage you're dying very often ... so I'am spending all my points in skills which boost my damage. I don't care about force (mana) or something else. Except the 20% bubble boost and the 100 extra force ... which you have to skill in the tele-tree.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Raeken

[Drakaris]

Very nice build and I played around with the mechanics of it this morning and it worked really well. Thanks for sharing.

 

You're welcome.

 

I'll have to test this, but I'm fairly certain it's inaccurate. I know it does not affect the singe-target, but I do notice TK putting out more damage on surrounding targets (I'm critting surrounding targets for 4.1k damage where I'll crit the main target for 3.7k) and without doing any math that appears to be 10%. It might be an expertise issue, but it's hard to state definitively right now.

 

I suppose it's just a matter of bad RNG. After doing extensive tests i really can't notice a stable 10% increase neither on primary target nor the secondary targets. So that's the reason i'm dropping this talent simply because it's not worth the 5 points investment, these points can go to something far more useful rather than a "floating" % bonus dmg.

 

I've never had issues running out of force, even in pretty extended battles.

 

I suppose energy management won't be an issue even with one point in TE, i've tried it just for test and i really don't run out of energy even when doing massive dmg in long warzone matches without dying. I max the TE simply because i need that 20 points to get 1 point in Telekinetic Momentum and there's simply nothing else worth taking for 1 point in the lower Tele tiers. A viable alternative would probably be a 2/2 Blockout and 1/2 Tele Effusion but it's really up to your personal preferences, it's not something crucial for that build.

 

I've been messing around with the lower talents in balance and that's partially the reason I didn't mention them in the video. The reason I tried talenting out of upheaval is because it tends to be really bad RNG (considering I really only get one point) ... Focused Insight can and has saved my *** quite a few times, esp with the 2 set bonus of force-master. Keep in mind that the goal in pvp is not necessarily to always obliterate your enemy, just to survive longer than them. So while maxing out upheaval technically increases dps, it may not necessarily be the right idea.

 

It's bad RNG with one point, it's great with 3 tho. I simply can't get that out because it's still part of our only real instant cast nuke, everything else comes from PoM procs, talent skills like FiB and one puny instant DoT. So 45% bonus to an already instant cast spell is just too huge to pass. About FI... with the 4 pieces bonus it may work. But it's just a small bonus. Besides i'm already getting my 4th piece of Stalker set today and switching from Mystic/Master mix. Stalker's 4 pieces bonus is just too awesome. I already regret that i haven't done this long time ago and have 2-3 of each Master/Mystic champ/BM pieces and got only 2 champ stalkers but i will fix that mistake soon. And ~500k for swapping mods/enh... ouch. I just want to max out my burst in any way possible because sages don't really have good burst compared to other classes and everything that gives me the edge in maxing out my burst is more than welcome. And the Stalker's set 4 piece bonus is just too good to pass.

 

So, I've messed with your spec a bit Drakaris and it does seem very viable. Whether or not it does more dps is questionable due to the RNG factor and depends on how lucky you are on procs. It is worth it? I suppose it's up to the player... Regardless I've decided to do an addendum video and I'll be sure to give you credit.

 

As far as Psychic Suffusion not boosting TK, I'm relatively sure that's wrong -- I really just wish I had a combat log to compare.

 

Thanks.

 

The RNG factor just adds bonus dmg to already good dmg so if you're okay with procs (and after all we're playing sages, we have to deal with a lot of procs anyway) you will like the results. I really want to do more extensive testing on PS myself when i have the time. So far i'm just not sure it works as intended. Just like Telekinetic Momentum. It works, but a bit... odd.

 

Think 0/13/28 is much better for dealing damage.

 

http://db.darthhater.com/skill_calc/jedi_consular/sage/#::e2fefe7cf2e4f9efe2fe3df20

 

Think penetrating light and psychic suffusion aren't worth it.

Don't need Telekinetic Effusion cause as you said ... you are fast to kill. So I don't have problems with my force-management .

Kinetic Collapse is fail too ... your main damage spells are areas. So they will be stunned and instantly knocked out of your own stun.

 

Think Mental Scarring, Force Suppression and Drain Thoughts are essentiel for good damage.

 

Well, if that's your play style and and you're ok with dying a lot... Fine. But i'm not. I don't die more than 1-2 times in full time Void Stars, when i'm with my premade i don't die at all. So the energy management becomes an issue. Sometimes i also have to support heal which usually eats your energy pretty fast. I'm just not okay with "run-nuke-die" kind of gameplay. The 13/28 is just awful in terms of energy efficiency, no argument there. It's also a bit more DoT reliant rather than burst. But i guess it's about personal play style, i just don't like running out of energy when unloading and then running/dying or humping Noble Sacrifice.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Drakaris

[JBloom]

Think Force Speed is crap ... 80% of the time Iam using Force Speed I got stunned or mezzed ... or some tank charged me. Totaly useless in my opinion. Iam a DD ... I want to generate damage and don't want to waste time running around

 

Mental Scarring gives you 30% Crit-Boost on Force in Balance which you can cast istantly every 15 seconds and boosts your Telekinetic Throw, Weaken Mind and Mind Crush Crits.

 

As a Sage you're dying very often ... so I'am spending all my points in skills which boost my damage. I don't care about force (mana) or something else. Except the 20% bubble boost and the 100 extra force ... which you have to skill in the tele-tree.

 

Force speed is like the bread and butter of my playstyle. I don't usually die that much.

 

The extra damage is certainly nice but I prefer more survivability.

[Raeken]

First ... just for the understanding ... Iam dying like 2-5 times in a bg. I just dont want to waste points in a skill, which allows me to run away 15 seconds earlier ... in this case I prefer to pull out some extra damage.

 

And it often takes longer to run away and get you out of combat to meditate or heal yourself than making damage while you are beaten down ... and I still can use force speed too.

But they stun and charge me 80% of the time Iam using Force Speed ... so I think it's not worth skilling it when you can put your points in some damage skills.

 

I'm dying 3-6 times per BG. My average dmg with full T2 gear is 450-500K in a long voidstar game with 100K heal through bubble.

 

And 0/13/28 is not a real DoT build. More DoT-Area-instant thingy ...

 

Iam beginning with Force in Balance to debuff my enemys. Than Iam casting weaken mind and start channeling telekinetic throw (which has the chance to proc Physic Projection and Presence of Mind which allows me to throw a Force Wave or Mind Crush instantly.

 

Telekinetic throw is my main damage skill while Iam throwing force waves and force in balance all the time ... makes a lot damage to several targets.

 

Weaken Mind lasts 21 seconds in this build and is perfect for hindering the enemy to tap the targets.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Raeken

[JBloom]

Depending on the context of the fight, force speed can be used to run away, to reposition, to kite, to score the ball in huttball. A lot of times I use it just to move from one LoS point to another. Again, playstyle. I would certainly like the extra damage on my dots but I really really like having the shorter cd on force speed. I suppose it really comes down to personal preference.

[Raeken]

So you miss out 30% more critical damage on 4 of your main skills for a -15 cooldown on force speed?

 

Though this Threat is about DPS Hybrid ... and I think 0/13/28 is one of the most or the most effectiv build vor dps.

[MonsAlpha]

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#600ZfcbMzMrZcrcosrko.1

 

Say what you will, but Kinetic Collapse has saved me many times from sneaky Operatives.

Edited February 2, 2012 by MonsAlpha

[Drakaris]

First ... just for the understanding ... Iam dying like 2-5 times in a bg. I just dont want to waste points in a skill, which allows me to run away 15 seconds earlier ... in this case I prefer to pull out some extra damage.

 

So infinite energy and lower CD of one of our main defenses are not worth it? Sure, if you have two wahambulances healing you 24/7 and a 25k HP guardian guarding you, hell, i'd go full Telekinetics in this case. I can't imagine that there's a sage who doesn't love sprint and think it's useless... guess i was wrong. Oh, and btw, you won't be pulling any extra dps when you're dead or out of energy or humping noble sacrifice or meditating...

 

And it often takes longer to run away and get you out of combat to meditate or heal yourself than making damage while you are beaten down ... and I still can use force speed too.

But they stun and charge me 80% of the time Iam using Force Speed ... so I think it's not worth skilling it when you can put your points in some damage skills.

 

Time it properly, 80% of the time force speed saves my a**. Besides because of this talent i don't need to meditate... ever. I cannot run out of energy. It's impossible. Thus i can spam everything i want for as long as i want while maintaining high survivability. Win-win situation.

 

And 0/13/28 is not a real DoT build. More DoT-Area-instant thingy ...

 

It relies on DoTs a lot.

 

Iam beginning with Force in Balance to debuff my enemys. Than Iam casting weaken mind and start channeling telekinetic throw (which has the chance to proc Physic Projection and Presence of Mind which allows me to throw a Force Wave or Mind Crush instantly.

 

Telekinetic throw is my main damage skill while Iam throwing force waves and force in balance all the time ... makes a lot damage to several targets.

 

Weaken Mind lasts 21 seconds in this build and is perfect for hindering the enemy to tap the targets.

 

That's what we all do.

 

A lot of the talents in 13/28 are wasted or not as effective as it sounds. Longer duration of Weaken Mind and Mind Crush most of the time is wasted since the targets are usually dead or dispelled long before the full duration of these spells is over. In very rare occasion you will get full duration of WM and MC so they can benefit from all the talents like increased duration and dmg. This is not PvE, you can't expect 5-10 mins fights on a single target thus getting everything out of every single tick of every single DoT.

 

So you miss out 30% more critical damage on 4 of your main skills for a -15 cooldown on force speed?

 

Just out of curiosity - which 4 skills you're referring to?

 

Though this Threat is about DPS Hybrid ... and I think 0/13/28 is one of the most or the most effectiv build vor dps.

 

For PvE dps, probably. For PvP it's a glass cannon with incredibly poor energy management. Completely lacks survivability and i can't accept the idea that as a sage i'm supposed to nuke-die-nuke-die-nuke-die...

Edited February 3, 2012 by Drakaris