Shield broken?

[Crujido]

Hello new to Guardian and loving it.

 

A few questions since I noticed there was no FAQ:

 

Is shield broken?

 

When do I get useful in pvp besides guard (such as stuns and tanking)?

 

When do I get armor underneath my robes?

 

 

Any comments/suggestions would be wonderful!

[Malissant]

Hello new to Guardian and loving it.

 

A few questions since I noticed there was no FAQ:

 

Is shield broken?

 

When do I get useful in pvp besides guard (such as stuns and tanking)?

 

When do I get armor underneath my robes?

 

 

Any comments/suggestions would be wonderful!

 

You'll have to explain what you are asking by broken. If you're expecting something from your shield that it doesn't offer I could explain better.

 

It depends on what you're looking to do in pvp to be useful. Are you speccing for DPS or as a Tank? As a tank once you have guard and taunts you're pretty useful.

 

I think somewhere around level 30 or 40 I started seeing armored robe pieces. But realistically you can get them at any time, it's just a matter of finding the right orange pieces. The level of gear is completely dependant on the mods inside it.

[Crujido]

The actual shield generator. I've been hearing IG that the stat shield absorbation/chance doesn't work.

 

And I plan to spec tank for pvp to guard healers/run the ball

[Malissant]

The actual shield generator. I've been hearing IG that the stat shield absorbation/chance doesn't work.

 

And I plan to spec tank for pvp to guard healers/run the ball

 

It works just fine - the problem people have with it, is that 4/8 of the Advanced Classes have abilities that completely bypass the shield. So in PvP it is less useful. In addition, Defence is less useful in PvP since people don't really 'miss' you, no matter how high you spec into it since they're mostly using special attacks with boosted Accuracy.

[Y-Yorle]

As a defense focused player It's probably important to know you have attack types and then damage types.

 

- Attack types: Melee, Ranged, Force and Tech

Only Melee and Ranged attacks can be shielded (or avoided). Force and Tech attacks are 'unblock-able' but I believe they can be 'resisted'. Though as a guardian you have little to no resist against those. xD

 

(You can check what attack type an ability is in the ability window on the right side of every ability.)

 

- Damage types: Kinetic, Energy, Internal and Elemental.

Armor reduces the damage taken from Kinetic and Energy attacks. Luckily most of the attacks people have fall into these two catagories.

 

(You can usually check what damage type an attack is in the description of the skill. It would be handy if Bioware implements a separate line for this above the skill description if you ask me. Saves the hassle of having to look through the skill description.)

 

First the game checks what attack type is used against you. If it's Melee or Ranged the game will check their accuracy against your defense stat (since only these two types can be shielded/avoided). If it's Force or Tech bases, the game will only check any resist you may have against those.

 

If the Melee/Ranged attack hits (aka your defense stat fails to avoid), the game will check the attacker's critical stat against your shield stat. In essence, having a high shield stat, should prevent a lot of Melee and Ranged based (critical) hits against you.

 

So the problem, especially in PvP, is that only against Melee and Ranged attacks your shield plays a role in the mitigation of the damage received. A lot of classes have Tech and Force attacks (especially the ranged classes like Sage/Inquisitor and Smuggler/Agent, but also Trooper/Bounty Hunter to a higher extend then Guardian/Warrior) and as such your shield is useless against their attacks. Also, a lot of people increase their accuracy quite a bit and any % above 100% basically ignores any defense (avoidance) your armor gives (as decribed by the tooltip on the accuracy stat).

 

Of course most of their attacks still are either Kinetic or Energy based, so your armor still mitigates the actual damage they do. You just can't actually shield against those attacks though. It would be nice if it was possible to shield force and ranged attacks, especially because in Soresu form and tank spec your damage is utterly crap unless a LOT of your gear comes with accuracy, power and/or crit (+ surge). xD

 

TL;DR: Go read this anyway. It's important to know. :3

Edited April 6, 2012 by Y-Yorle

[Gearsofwarthree]

As a defense focused player It's probably important to know you have attack types and then damage types.

 

- Attack types: Melee, Ranged, Force and Tech

Only Melee and Ranged attacks can be shielded (or avoided). Force and Tech attacks are 'unblock-able' but I believe they can be 'resisted'. Though as a guardian you have little to no resist against those. xD

 

(You can check what attack type an ability is in the ability window on the right side of every ability.)

 

- Damage types: Kinetic, Energy, Internal and Elemental.

Armor reduces the damage taken from Kinetic and Energy attacks. Luckily most of the attacks people have fall into these two catagories.

 

(You can usually check what damage type an attack is in the description of the skill. It would be handy if Bioware implements a separate line for this above the skill description if you ask me. Saves the hassle of having to look through the skill description.)

 

First the game checks what attack type is used against you. If it's Melee or Ranged the game will check their accuracy against your defense stat (since only these two types can be shielded/avoided). If it's Force or Tech bases, the game will only check any resist you may have against those.

 

If the Melee/Ranged attack hits (aka your defense stat fails to avoid), the game will check the attacker's critical stat against your shield stat. In essence, having a high shield stat, should prevent a lot of Melee and Ranged based (critical) hits against you.

 

So the problem, especially in PvP, is that only against Melee and Ranged attacks your shield plays a role in the mitigation of the damage received. A lot of classes have Tech and Force attacks (especially the ranged classes like Sage/Inquisitor and Smuggler/Agent, but also Trooper/Bounty Hunter to a higher extend then Guardian/Warrior) and as such your shield is useless against their attacks. Also, a lot of people increase their accuracy quite a bit and any % above 100% basically ignores any mitigation your armor does (as decribed by the tooltip on the accuracy stat).

 

Of course most of their attacks still are either Kinetic or Energy based, so your armor still mitigates the actual damage they do. You just can't actually shield against those attacks though. It would be nice if it was possible to shield force and ranged attacks, especially because in Soresu form and tank spec your damage is utterly crap unless a LOT of your gear comes with accuracy, power and/or crit (+ surge). xD

 

TL;DR: Go read this anyway. It's important to know. :3

 

Great useful post I didn't know most of these things. Makes me even more skeptical about bothering with shield in pvp.

[GarfieldJL]

I don't think Shield blocks elemental attacks either, so if someone has an attack that does elemental damage the shield is bypassed.

[pure_laced]

Which is completely pointless to even have a shield at all if it cannot block 99% of attacks used against you.

[Y-Yorle]

I don't think Shield blocks elemental attacks either, so if someone has an attack that does elemental damage the shield is bypassed.

 

Well, in the case it's a melee or ranged (= attack type) elemental (= damage type) attack it can be shielded (because of the attack type), just the armor we are wearing doesn't mitigate the dmg (because of the damage type).

 

Of course I am not sure if there even is an "elemental" melee or ranged attack in the game, I haven't dug that deep in the skill of other classes besides my own (the Guardian) yet. But this should give you proper the idea on how it works. xD

 

As a rule of thumb, I'd like to think that shields work against other classes that like to get upclose and personal, or physical if you will. Of course there are (plenty of) exceptions to that one, but it generally works for as long as I haven't delved into the other class' ability list.

 

Personally I rather have a high shield rating then a high defense rating as a guardian. Shield is by far easier to increase and it also provides good protection against melee and ranged (attack types, not the practical distance) critical hits.

 

If anything, as a guardian I prefer to have a more stable solid defense then rely on RNG to help me, which in turn translates to why I also focus more on Power rather then Crit + Surge. As a guardian I already have plenty of skills, situations and other things to deal with compared to other classes and as such I don't want to deal with sudden burst dmg from my enemies or my own dmg failing because they got RNG on their side. I just want to have something more reliable in the chaos that is called being a Guardian. xD

[Atamasama]

Well, in the case it's a melee or ranged (= attack type) elemental (= damage type) attack it can be shielded (because of the attack type), just the armor we are wearing doesn't mitigate the dmg (because of the damage type).

 

Of course I am not sure if there even is an "elemental" melee or ranged attack in the game, I haven't dug that deep in the skill of other classes besides my own (the Guardian) yet. But this should give you proper the idea on how it works. xD

You don't have to look past your own class. Overhead Slash is a melee attack that with Burning Purpose leaves an elemental DOT. So that is an example of a melee attack that is at least partially elemental in damage. The attack can be shielded, since it's a melee attack, but I don't know if the shield mitigation will also affect the DOT. Avoiding it via Defense will affect the DOT, obviously, since if the attack misses the DOT won't be applied. The DOT itself will ignore armor or any other mitigation that doesn't work against elemental (so skills like Unremitting, Commanding Awe, Warding Call, and Inner Peace will still reduce it).

[Y-Yorle]

You don't have to look past your own class. Overhead Slash is a melee attack that with Burning Purpose leaves an elemental DOT. So that is an example of a melee attack that is at least partially elemental in damage. The attack can be shielded, since it's a melee attack, but I don't know if the shield mitigation will also affect the DOT. Avoiding it via Defense will affect the DOT, obviously, since if the attack misses the DOT won't be applied. The DOT itself will ignore armor or any other mitigation that doesn't work against elemental (so skills like Unremitting, Commanding Awe, Warding Call, and Inner Peace will still reduce it).

 

Ah right. I think I should have said "look past the Defense Tree in my own class", lol. Been a full time Defense Guardian so far and I don't even know about the other tree's skills. xD

 

Anyways, thanks for confirming the point I was trying to make and additionally illustrate (although I failed a bit at the latter, lol). ^^

 

I think the DoT of Overhead Slash doesn't get mitigated when the initial hit is shielded. I base this on my experience of Force Stasis having irregular dmg at times, which I think is caused by some 'ticks' of it critical hitting. If this is the case, then each tick is considered a seperate hit and as such I would think the DoT can be considered seperate from the initial hit of Overhead Slash.

 

However, in the case the DoT ticks are seperate hits, without a developer telling us what attack type the DoT is, we can't be 100% sure if they can or cannot be shielded. Perhaps some players can test this extensively?

Edited January 26, 2012 by Y-Yorle