DONT force me into pvp. I do NOT like being forced.

[Enako]

The only point I'm not clear on out of all of this is what, exactly, you were forced to do here.

 

I read your opening post. I make a very pointed habit of reading, with my full attention, whatever I'm responding to.

 

As stated, I quite entirely sympathize with the basic premise of what you're trying to say, but at what point; and I'm asking this for clarification, not to be snide; were you forced to PVP?

 

going through a ffa pvp zone, forces you to toggle pvp flag on without your consent. you are fair game for anyone wanting to attack you, even outside the ffa pvp zone, and even if they do not have their pvp flag on, until you get back to a safe place and wait for 5 minutes to lose the pvp flag.

 

do i really need to explain how is this forcing another playstyle on someone who doesnt prefer it ?

 

of course, totally leaving the possibility of some good grief pvping by waiting in that ffa zones in which people are forced to pass.

 

I've gotten good at evading the worst of feeling forced on a lot of things in these games; I might be able to help you with that. If nothing else, I'm interested in the expansion of what you have to say on it.

 

Not to troll you or bash you. I simply wish to know.

 

refraining from the mistake of forcing another playstyle on other groups to make up for the lack in numbers or participation in a particular playstyle, was a mistake blizzard has made.

 

i dont want it repeated here. therefore, as a paying customer, i have expressed my irritation about the situation, and stated my desire.

[Enako]

Then you found the wrong cave. The right cave isn't instanced, it's part of the open world. You can ride a speeder through it, actually.

 

It's near the sand people enclave, there's a tall strip of land and it's semi-hidden in a cranny connected to that strip.

 

then please find me the location of that cave in coordinates so that we can post it in the relevant thread for players encountering this in future.

 

................

 

in another respect, making a cave difficult to find is also akin to 'encouraging' people to pass through the ffa zone.

[Genesizs]

Then you found the wrong cave. The right cave isn't instanced, it's part of the open world. You can ride a speeder through it, actually.

 

It's near the sand people enclave, there's a tall strip of land and it's semi-hidden in a cranny connected to that strip.

 

this ..

[Enako]

I agree with the spirit of the original poster. If you are on a non-pvp server, you should NEVER be auto-flagged for pvp. It should always be a manual toggle that you choose to enable, or not enable, as you desire.

 

If its off, you can't hit any other players and no other players can hit you. If it is on, then it should be raised by choice. I really dislike how if I get someone flagged for pvp in my group, and I use a group buff, that it auto-flags me. I would prefer that the flagged player can not interact with unflagged players, and vice versa.

 

there are already griefers exploiting that. even in non pvp servers. it is something that was long abused in wow, and it is replicated here because the entire mechanic is replicated here.

[zenstrata]

how is that exploitable? Also, the game does not currently work like that, so how can someone exploit a process that is not currently implemented?

[wessik]

OP said himself he has TWO ways through...

 

1. through a FFA area that lasted 30 sec and where he probably didn't see another player and nothing ever happened

 

2. he COULD have gone the "PVE way" which was guarded by NPC's but he CHOSE not to...

 

 

on another note: this game FORCES me to pve, and i don't like it... ya i know, it's pretty ridiculous....

[Pastorfrog]

then please find me the location of that cave in coordinates so that we can post it in the relevant thread for players encountering this in future.

 

................

 

in another respect, making a cave difficult to find is also akin to 'encouraging' people to pass through the ffa zone.

 

Here, the relevant quote from torhead. Took me all of 20 seconds. I can verify that this works, as I did it myself on my smuggler without being flagged.

 

There's a way to get to the cave without going through the Den or getting flagged at all. Travel to Outpost Thorazan in the Dune Sea and make your way south to an unmarked cave entrance at -720, -895 (you'll have to fight/sneak past some Sand People). It's between Thorazan and the Imp outpost of Zaroshe, at the base of an arch that on the map looks, um, happy to see you. Go through the cave, which is marked as the 'Bantha Drifts Tunnel,' and out to the other side. You should pop out in the Jundland Central Chasm area, just south of the Outlaw's Den and out of the PvP zone.

 

TL;DR: Don't want to get PvP flagged? Go through the tunnel entrance at -720, -895 in the Dune Sea.

[Aisar]

I would just stay away from the PVP area.

 

Aliens are coming, are you ready?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBKI_S1GZDo&feature=autoplay&list=ULKcRi0UHvfyM&lf=mfu_in_order&playnext=2

 

[Cincere]

Are you serious? REALLY? There is absolutely nothing lost but a little time. LOLOL

 

In Darkfall.. when you die.. you lose everything on your player.. EVERYTHING. If you are on a pve server.. Im surprised you go red at all.. Maybe its a bug?

[fungihoujo]

Cuz, y'know, those who only want to pvp never get forced to pve... ever.... ever ever...

[Enako]

Here, the relevant quote from torhead. Took me all of 20 seconds. I can verify that this works, as I did it myself on my smuggler without being flagged.

 

i was able to find it in my 4th try now. i have found a cave to north of it which was red zoned to me. the entrance is totally obscured.

 

finding it would not be possible without referring to external sites. even by referring to them it is obscure.

 

i would like to be relieved, but as it stands the cave is meant to be hard to find, and the player apparently is meant to make a choice in between going through imperial or ffa zones to make the pass.

 

which means unfortunately, the original point of this post, is valid.

[Uruare]

going through a ffa pvp zone, forces you to toggle pvp flag on without your consent. you are fair game for anyone wanting to attack you, even outside the ffa pvp zone, and even if they do not have their pvp flag on, until you get back to a safe place and wait for 5 minutes to lose the pvp flag.

 

do i really need to explain how is this forcing another playstyle on someone who doesnt prefer it ?

 

of course, totally leaving the possibility of some good grief pvping by waiting in that ffa zones in which people are forced to pass.

 

 

 

refraining from the mistake of forcing another playstyle on other groups to make up for the lack in numbers or participation in a particular playstyle, was a mistake blizzard has made.

 

i dont want it repeated here. therefore, as a paying customer, i have expressed my irritation about the situation, and stated my desire.

 

 

 

 

Alrighty. I see what you're on with here then. The best and most helpful advice I can give for dealing with the current arrangement of matters is to figure out what gets you flagged and avoid it for the time being. Standing near an opposing faction's remote-location medical vendors for more than 10 seconds will do it too.

 

Additionally, performing any buffing or healing action on someone flagged for PVP will auto-flag you as well. Been in a couple Heroic teams where one person'd get accidentally flagged for dithering a smidge too long near an enemy faction's remote vendor and fwamp, whole team gets flagged as soon as we pop class buffs.

 

 

I can kind've understand the need for that; nobody likes a buffer/healer that's untargetable for not being flagged that can still buff or heal a flagged combatant, after all.

 

Just something to be aware of, if you weren't already, on what can also trip one up on that if one is wanting very specifically to avoid it altogether.

 

I'm not even going to run any speculation on the subject of griefers waiting to pounce on accidentally flagged targets. All I can say is that I've been accidentally flagged more times than I cared to commit to memory and not once, no matter where I was on my server, have I ever been jumped on.

 

It's a PVE server, pretty high population; I've certainly run into opposing faction folk while flagged. Never been jumped on. That is, as a comment, absolutely a 'my mileage' statement however; I know very well how radically different that could be from place to place and time to time.

 

So, in general, I'd agree; getting PVP flagged shouldn't be so easy in, particularly, the circumstances of standing even vaguely near an enemy faction's remote location med vendors.

 

I think a smartening up of the quest tracking markers would address the main thrust of your stated complaint, and I suspect that will come in time.

 

Still, lets also be reasonable in the basis of expectation and demand too; the onus will be on you to work around some stuff until they polish and tweak and tighten up this ship of New Game Woes on a lot of fronts.

 

Doesn't hurt to rattle a cage or two to at least let something be said about a problem, but I don't think you've focused on the right address of it.

 

Frankly, I don't think they're trying to force us into world PVP by demerit of a sometimes-very-dumb quest tracking system.

 

I honestly believe that it's dumb because some poor sod had a figurative 7 day job to do in 3 days and was probably a person short on doing it right and QCing it properly in every single circumstance.

 

In short, I think you're attributing malicious intent where Occam's razor suggests, at worst, a somewhat rushed job.

 

Is...any of that helpful, or at least ameliorating of your concern?

[Gohlar]

i was able to find it in my 4th try now. i have found a cave to north of it which was red zoned to me. the entrance is totally obscured.

 

finding it would not be possible without referring to external sites. even by referring to them it is obscure.

 

i would like to be relieved, but as it stands the cave is meant to be hard to find, and the player apparently is meant to make a choice in between going through imperial or ffa zones to make the pass.

 

which means unfortunately, the original point of this post, is valid.

 

It certainly is possible, people do it.

 

Remember, you are allowed to think while questing. Hope this helps you from making threads like this in the future. I would not comment about game design if I were you though, you are still learning to do simple quests.

 

And no complaining about an optional, hypothetical situation is in no way valid.

Edited January 24, 2012 by Gohlar

[Pastorfrog]

i was able to find it in my 4th try now. i have found a cave to north of it which was red zoned to me. the entrance is totally obscured.

 

finding it would not be possible without referring to external sites. even by referring to them it is obscure.

 

i would like to be relieved, but as it stands the cave is meant to be hard to find, and the player apparently is meant to make a choice in between going through imperial or ffa zones to make the pass.

 

which means unfortunately, the original point of this post, is valid.

 

Wow. Okay, so even though the quest is totally doable, either by flagging for 30 seconds or exploring (or looking up the location, which takes barely a few seconds), you'd rather continue to complain on the forums.

 

I'm getting the impression you don't really want the problem solved. You just like being pissed off.

 

Have fun, I guess. I'll be over here, enjoying the game.

[Gohlar]

I'm getting the impression you don't really want the problem solved. You just like being pissed off.

 

 

Was there ever any doubt?

[Enako]

Is...any of that helpful, or at least ameliorating of your concern?

 

no.

 

because being a pvp gamer who had spent majority of last decade pvping, i know that if there is anything to exploit, someone will eventually start exploiting it.

 

there were a bunch of 4 people continually trolling and griefing the low level quest zones by killing all npcs and trying to flag non-flagged low level players in that zone. these people were there every day except one day of the weekend, at 4 hours each night, nonstop.

 

there was even one person grief pvping an entire zone by himself/herself for over 1.5 years in earlier server i was on.

 

............

 

similar mechanics are here. they will get exploited eventually when populations rise and different varieties of players come.

[Enako]

It certainly is possible, people do it.

 

Remember, you are allowed to think while questing. Hope this helps you from making threads like this in the future. I would not comment about game design if I were you though, you are still learning to do simple quests.

 

And no complaining about an optional, hypothetical situation is in no way valid.

 

and now go back to the smuggler thread, and count the numbers of people who did not 'do it', despite the hints given in the thread, and later posted.

[Gohlar]

and now go back to the smuggler thread, and count the numbers of people who did not 'do it', despite the hints given in the thread, and later posted.

 

Want to know who did figure it out?

 

Everyone else.

 

I realize this thread hasn't gone well for you and you are desperate to come up with something, but there is a time to admit you're wrong and walk away.

 

Stop making excuses, stop blaming the game for your own mistake and learn from it. Don't complain about things that aren't even a problem. That's just silly.

Edited January 24, 2012 by Gohlar

[crazyhorsek]

lol all this because of one quest... that you do once?

 

Wow... talk about being whiney. I heard a lot of whining but nothing came down to this level.

 

Grats... you are now my new "lowest"... You the real life Francis? Did you cry and whine when Arthas died?

[Sulleyn]

All it is is a problem with the map, the second poster mentioned he had similar in hoth, all this is is the map guiding you to the quickest route which happens NOT to be the safest, stop think and look around

 

i encountered similar it wanted me to go through a sith base, when u could just go round, its exactly the same as when it comes up with the green arrow into a box sending you to the next area, the map designates this as the quickest route

 

just stop look around and chill, you arnt being asked to pvp and even then who cares? you'd think you were being asked to shoot your mum the way this thread is worded

 

people ask for more exploration yet this kind of topic comes up?

Edited January 24, 2012 by Sulleyn

[Solimen]

...lol

[Enako]

http://i.imgur.com/YNZnr.jpg

 

this is what you see when you get to the coordinates you can find OVER THE WEB.

 

and i have stopped right at the entrance of two caves, close, because i now found them.

 

anyone who was wandering from outside easily passes the cave on the right, because its entrance does not appear evidently when you approach it from south, and you cant even see it from the north.

 

if you get the coordinates from the web, and get to those coordinates, you will very easily get past the cave and meet the bounty hunter cave thats right after there.

 

..............

 

the entrance to the cave is not apparent in any point in the map. leave aside the quest tracker and triangulation system guiding you there, the cave does not appear at all in the map.

 

so it is evident that the player is expected to make a choice in between the level 50 elite pve entrance, or the ffa pvp entrance. and only find this cave if s/he doggedly avoids the two, and seeks another way without even knowing there is any - if s/he does not seek external websites.

 

which basically means that you are not supposed to find that cave easily and take either ffa or pve reskill route.

[Pastorfrog]

http://i.imgur.com/YNZnr.jpg

 

this is what you see when you get to the coordinates you can find OVER THE WEB.

 

and i have stopped right at the entrance of two caves, close, because i now found them.

 

anyone who was wandering from outside easily passes the cave on the right, because its entrance does not appear evidently when you approach it from south, and you cant even see it from the north.

 

if you get the coordinates from the web, and get to those coordinates, you will very easily get past the cave and meet the bounty hunter cave thats right after there.

 

..............

 

the entrance to the cave is not apparent in any point in the map. leave aside the quest tracker and triangulation system guiding you there, the cave does not appear at all in the map.

 

so it is evident that the player is expected to make a choice in between the level 50 elite pve entrance, or the ffa pvp entrance. and only find this cave if s/he doggedly avoids the two, and seeks another way without even knowing there is any - if s/he does not seek external websites.

 

which basically means that you are not supposed to find that cave easily and take either ffa or pve reskill route.

 

 

And yet, countless smugglers have, indeed, found their way through that cave.

 

Apparently we're amazingly talented and/or intelligent.

[Tiresias]

i was able to find it in my 4th try now. i have found a cave to north of it which was red zoned to me. the entrance is totally obscured.

 

finding it would not be possible without referring to external sites. even by referring to them it is obscure.

 

i would like to be relieved, but as it stands the cave is meant to be hard to find, and the player apparently is meant to make a choice in between going through imperial or ffa zones to make the pass.

 

which means unfortunately, the original point of this post, is valid.

 

You are looking for reasons to be angry.

 

You aren't interested in rational discussion or even willing to accept the possibility that you are wrong. I'm thinking that my comment about you surrounding yourself with sycophantic yes-men is spot-on.

 

This cave in question? I found it in BETA, back before we had sites with pretty maps that lead you through coordinate-based routes. Would you even be willing to play an MMO that doesn't have a quest locator on the map?

[Gohlar]

http://i.imgur.com/YNZnr.jpg

 

this is what you see when you get to the coordinates you can find OVER THE WEB.

 

and i have stopped right at the entrance of two caves, close, because i now found them.

 

anyone who was wandering from outside easily passes the cave on the right, because its entrance does not appear evidently when you approach it from south, and you cant even see it from the north.

 

if you get the coordinates from the web, and get to those coordinates, you will very easily get past the cave and meet the bounty hunter cave thats right after there.

 

..............

 

the entrance to the cave is not apparent in any point in the map. leave aside the quest tracker and triangulation system guiding you there, the cave does not appear at all in the map.

 

so it is evident that the player is expected to make a choice in between the level 50 elite pve entrance, or the ffa pvp entrance. and only find this cave if s/he doggedly avoids the two, and seeks another way without even knowing there is any - if s/he does not seek external websites.

 

which basically means that you are not supposed to find that cave easily and take either ffa or pve reskill route.

 

You're funny.