relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 Like WoW? No - you can't travel across huge land areas from one starting area to another starting area to begin with friends or have many different quest starting experiences for several alts. No TOR doesn't have an in depth crafting system nor lots of additional professions at launch above and beyond basic classes and crafting to add depth to gameplay. No fishing in TOR either. No TORs itemization isn't anywhere close to the vast number and variety of items available from drops, quests rewards, crafting, and professions at launch for World of Warcraft. In early WoW a good blue drop could last nearly 10+ in usefulness - in TOR elite NPCs 2 or 3 levels over your level drop green items 4 levels under your character level. Like current WoW when speeding though the levels there's no 'need' to group, but unlike WoW. in TOR just a couple levels later using a companion players can solo much elite instanced content. As many have said before, TOR is a collection of good ideas that many other games do/have done better - what TOR has going for it is that it's 'Star Wars' and that it has voice acting all the way through - but at great apparent cost to everything else. It's not that TOR lacks innovation or it's of course derivative of all MMORPGs - it's that it's truly lacking. In terms of proffessions and crafting TOR=Quality, other mmos=quantity Same goes for items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkblack Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 If you this game like innovation you've already proved how little you know. This game takes giant leaps ahead by integrating single player gaming experience into an MMO. This alone is enough innovation to set new standards for future MMO's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalfear Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 What the title says. I know I probably will get a lot of "no" because this place being rampant with fanboys, but I think similarities to WoW will hurt this game for a lot of people. *sighs* This launch WILL hurt the game The game however is very innovative and you clearly didnt play it in beta if you think its WOWish beyond the easy leveling (and thats even tougher then WOW) #1) No one can copy WOW, its not possible because WOW had NO original thoughts or ideas or concepts. You can copy EQ, UO, DAoC, oNWN, FFXI, SWG, even DDO, but its literally impossible to copy WOW because you dont give a copy credit for creative thinking/design. #2) There is plenty of original concepts fleshed out in TOR that makes TOR stand on its own feet to anyone who has a clue about MMORPGs. Does it utilize some standard EQ and on MMORPG concepts? Sure it does, EQ basically created the theme park design for modern MMORPGs. Oh you could go far back as NWN and the Realms but EQ finalized and built upon the model enough to be given credit #3) So no, innovation will not be a issue because those that think there is none dont even understand the term so its nothing more then a catch phrase for them (and people do see through the false front). Those that do understand the term see the innovation in game. So innovation will not be a issue! This launch though, this is going to haunt Bioware for A LONG LONG TIME! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 If you this game like innovation you've already proved how little you know. This game takes giant leaps ahead by integrating single player gaming experience into an MMO. This alone is enough innovation to set new standards for future MMO's Not enough for the general gaming population though, thats why this game will fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarinthal Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 LOL? It's WoW with voice acting and everyone has pets. Oh and the Star Wars setting of course. Lol, another wow fanboy. Just letting you know BIG BOY. WoW was just like ALL THE GAMES THAT CAME BEFORE IT. It's a MMORPG - there is VERY little you can do to make it innovative. I love how little kids like you think that WoW was the first MMO, that everything is JUST LIKE WoW. You make me sick. Please go do research before you say something is like WoW and atleast reference the game that originally had the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 (edited) Back then people didnt look at the MMO genre as something that was in DESPERATE need for innovation. Outside of a handful of kids on this forum who whine and complain alot its pretty much the same as it was then. What you people seem to forget is that SWTOR will not just grab the jaded ex wow kids like me, SWTOR has the potential to EXPAND the size of the MMO market. Meaning fresh blood that has ZERO preconceptions about what an MMO should or shouldn't be. The genre isn't in desperate need of innovation, its in desperate need of expansion. That is one of the many MANY reasons swtor will succeed. Edited December 15, 2011 by TonyIommi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 *sighs* This launch WILL hurt the game The game however is very innovative and you clearly didnt play it in beta if you think its WOWish beyond the easy leveling (and thats even tougher then WOW) #1) No one can copy WOW, its not possible because WOW had NO original thoughts or ideas or concepts. You can copy EQ, UO, DAoC, oNWN, FFXI, SWG, even DDO, but its literally impossible to copy WOW because you dont give a copy credit for creative thinking/design. #2) There is plenty of original concepts fleshed out in TOR that makes TOR stand on its own feet to anyone who has a clue about MMORPGs. Does it utilize some standard EQ and on MMORPG concepts? Sure it does, EQ basically created the theme park design for modern MMORPGs. Oh you could go far back as NWN and the Realms but EQ finalized and built upon the model enough to be given credit #3) So no, innovation will not be a issue because those that think there is none dont even understand the term so its nothing more then a catch phrase for them (and people do see through the false front). Those that do understand the term see the innovation in game. So innovation will not be a issue! This launch though, this is going to haunt Bioware for A LONG LONG TIME! Early access=/launch, quit overreacting 'The squeaky wheel gets the grease" I know this game innovates a lot and I enjoyed this game very much in Beta, but my concern is that..... IT DOESNT INNOVATE ENOUGH FOR THE GENERAL POPULATION, SO MOST WILL SEE THIS AS STALE AND MOVE ON Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamzaBehoulve Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 I love how desperate you are to be critical and overly negative and simplistic. He is right though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 Outside of a handful of kids on this forum who whine and complain alot its pretty much the same as it was then. What you people seem to forget is that SWTOR will not just grab the jaded ex wow kids like me, SWTOR has the potential to EXPAND the size of the MMO market. Meaning fresh blood that has ZERO preconceptions about what an MMO should or shouldn't be. The genre isn't in desperate need of innovation, its in desperate need of expansion. That is one of the many MANY reasons swtor will succeed. Same as it has always been? THIS RAMPANT IN HATE? Go to Totalbiscuits youtube videos of SWTOR, look at any SWTOR gameplay video and you will see the same constant hatred and negativity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmaura Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 Inovation is just improving on things, lets see, branching quests, full speak and cut scenes for quests and very good story for multiple classes. BUt I guess that is not innovation because every game out there has those things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 Early access=/launch, quit overreacting 'The squeaky wheel gets the grease" I know this game innovates a lot and I enjoyed this game very much in Beta, but my concern is that..... IT DOESNT INNOVATE ENOUGH FOR THE GENERAL POPULATION, SO MOST WILL SEE THIS AS STALE AND MOVE ON It innovates enough kiddo. Apple mac didn't really innovate **** either. Marketing, accesibility, style and "fun" are far more important than innovation. Windows and Dos didn't innovate either. Didn't matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 He is right though. He makes innovations of this game seem so much smaller than they actually are, on purpose. Companions are more than just combat "pets" and voice overs arent a gimmick, they will change forever questing in MMOs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 Same as it has always been? THIS RAMPANT IN HATE? Go to Totalbiscuits youtube videos of SWTOR, look at any SWTOR gameplay video and you will see the same constant hatred and negativity. You ignored the point I was trying to make. Previous mmos did not have as much potential to expand the market like SWTOR will. Its a beloved franchise, by a generally well respected company with loads of cash behind it. It has potenatial to expand the MMO market enourmesly. I know plenty of people who wouldn't touch mmos normally who are ready to launch for swtor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarfux Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 lack of innovation? umm I think voiced over npcs talking to you about your own story and being able to make choices with OTHER PEOPLE in an mmo is pretty darn groundbreaking for the genre...just sayin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 It innovates enough kiddo. Apple mac didn't really innovate **** either. Marketing, accesibility, style and "fun" are far more important than innovation. Windows and Dos didn't innovate either. Didn't matter. Games and hardware are different things, people want innovation in games because it improves the fun factor. People look to things like macs for functionality, which innovation can determent, and I do not see excessive amounts of HUNGER for innovation on you tube videos of Macs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 The "general gaming population" has also changed quite a bit in the past 10 years. This game has a broad appeal that previous mmos (all excepy arguably one) didn't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 (edited) Games and hardware are different things, people want innovation in games because it improves the fun factor. People look to things like macs for functionality, which innovation can determent, and I do not see excessive amounts of HUNGER for innovation on you tube videos of Macs Because its not very necessary. First Person Shooters and arguable the least innovative genre of games. Every year CoD sells so *********** well though... People don't run to macs for functionality they run to apple products in general because of style and marketing. Innovation is a side issue at best. Its all about how you sell things kiddo. Edited December 15, 2011 by TonyIommi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 The "general gaming population" has also changed quite a bit in the past 10 years. This game has a broad appeal that previous mmos (all excepy arguably one) didn't have. Every single comment (well 8/10) of them on just about every SWTOR video, every forum I have seen on this game have been nothing but pure negativity about the same thing. I know this game will have an appeal with Bioware fans but most of them say they dont care for MMOs or the way they work, that they will play through a few stories then leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 Because its not very necessary. First Person Shooters and arguable the least innovative genre of games. Every year CoD sells so *********** well though... People don't run to macs for functionality they run to apple products in general because of style and marketing. Innovation is a side issue at best. Its all about how you sell things kiddo. People aren't on their knees begging much innovation from FPS as they are from MMOs (LOOK AT GW2 CROWD). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qoojo Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 (edited) So what games have made major innovations to the MMORPG genre? These games all make incremental little innovations here and there, while not including some good options from other games. Edited December 15, 2011 by Qoojo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 Every single comment (well 8/10) of them on just about every SWTOR video, every forum I have seen on this game have been nothing but pure negativity about the same thing. I know this game will have an appeal with Bioware fans but most of them say they dont care for MMOs or the way they work, that they will play through a few stories then leave. Did you ever consider for a minute that what you see is pretty limited? Like the scale of your understanding of peoples concerns if probably nowhere near as good as the marketing and research team that EA, Bioware, and Lucas Arts can bring to the field? The game will appeal to a LARGE mass of people, not just Bioware fans but certainly them. I'm curious also where you get most bioware fans dont care for mmos or the way they work. I've played everything since shattered steel and I absolutely love SWTOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relapes Posted December 15, 2011 Author Share Posted December 15, 2011 So what games have made major innovations to the MMORPG genre? These games all make incremental little innovations here and there, while not including some good options from other games. People seem to be praising GW2 like a diety right now and apparently to them SWTOR=SATAN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 People aren't on their knees begging much innovation from FPS as they are from MMOs (LOOK AT GW2 CROWD). That's the point though. It not just about getting mmo nerds into the game. its about expanding the audience to a much broader mass. I don't know how many times I can say this, it feels like a broken record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashnazg Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 did it hurt wow? Not really wow killed EQ WoW to EQ was not the same as SWTOR to WoW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyIommi Posted December 15, 2011 Share Posted December 15, 2011 People seem to be praising GW2 like a diety right now and apparently to them SWTOR=SATAN. People need a messiah. I can assure you that when GW2 comes out people like yourself will come on forums and say "this is it? wheres my innovation?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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