Silverion_one Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) Hi im a lv 50 save and i have 2 set columi and all rest PvP viol reward gear t1.5 My problem is that doing Hard Esselex mode with my group of friends we are unable to deliver enough DPS to kill bosses before timer go in enrage ... We are group of 1 sage healer 2 Sage DPS and 1 tank all people with similar gear ... we have a BIG problem to kill IRONFIST before he enrages and when we fight final jedi we cannot kill him before he enrages ... So we picked up a trooper DPS in my place and after 2 tryes boss was dead as he delivered so much more DPS .... I and my sage friend are using cookie DPS telekinetic sage build, casting our Damage over time and turbulences etc . still we was unable to deliver enough damage to kill boss before it enrages Conclusion is .. or i really really miss something important to deliver enough damage or sage as DPS class is LOOSER for PVE ! Edited January 20, 2012 by Silverion_one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobloblo Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Hi im a lv 50 save and i have 2 set columi and all rest PvP viol reward gear t1.5 My problem is that doing Hard Esselex mode with my group of friends we are unable to deliver enough DPS to kill bosses before timer go in enrage ... We are group of 1 sage healer 2 Sage DPS and 1 tank all people with similar gear ... we have a BIG problem to kill IRONFIST before he enrages and when we fight final jedi we cannot kill him before he enrages ... So we picked up a trooper DPS in my place and after 2 tryes boss was dead as he delivered so much more DPS .... I and my sage friend are using cookie DPS telekinetic sage build, casting our Damage over time and turbulences etc . still we was unable to deliver enough damage to kill boss before it enrages Conclusion is .. or i really really miss something important to deliver enough damage or sage as DPS class is LOOSER for PVE ! I would say that you're doing it wrong... But sages are #1 healers in pve.. Maybe roll as heals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerJBD Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 You might look at your spec. Against bosses and elites, the Balance tree gives you an edge with all of its boosts to DoTs. Lots of people are using a 0/13/28 build to take advantage of the upper level Balance boosts to Weaken Mind and Mind Crush. If you use your abilities correctly and have a good rotation, you should be able to DPS as well as any other class. The key is you are doing consistent damage, not burst damage. But consistent damage is what you want on tougher enemies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverion_one Posted January 20, 2012 Author Share Posted January 20, 2012 I would say that you're doing it wrong... But sages are #1 healers in pve.. Maybe roll as heals? I was a healer for so long that its hard to get back healing people and in my friend group there is already one healer that like this a lot I used our specific setup where is 3 sages and all DPS is mostly sage based we toyed changing me and my friend for other classes DPS and they was able to deliver a lot more damage then us in end ... A lot of Telecinetic sage damage come from standing still casts .. and if boss is dynamic like many are moving interrupt your damage dealing .. lowering significantly your DPS output ... at last this is what was coming to my mind ? As another post suggest i will have to try balanced and see if i can get better DPS output but still it look like that output too require long casting times that can be interrupted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishice Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) The timer on Ironfast isnt that long to begin with i think. If you havent allrdy use relic's and adren's to boost your dam for a bit (anything helps). Also if have done it as healer myself and your not telling me hes been healing every gcd. At those times he has nothing to do its easy to apply a few axtra dots or use telekinetic throw. Like i said anything helps. Edited January 20, 2012 by Ishice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotm Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Disturbance being suck gets at the heart of this issue imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_asdf Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 My friends and I were able to do HM Ess with a couple pieces of champion gear each, on fresh 50s. I think it's more a problem of your rotation and talent spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karenai Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) What is your spec? I am running HM with half green tank/dps. It takes the other dd twice as long to kill his adds, I help him with 50% of his after I do mine. There was never a dps problem with my sage. Ironfist enrages? Did not even know that. Or and what are your stats? 650+damage, 31%crit, 71%surge, 104% hit. for example. (my stats) My spec is pure pvp so my dps takes somewhat of a dent. Would go with pure balance if you have problems with dps. It is easy and powerfull. Just remember to keep your dots rolling, without clipping. And use your AoE on single target, it is you biggest hitter and debuffs. PS. surge>all imho, I would love way more surge. was at 85% once and LOVED IT! Edited January 20, 2012 by Karenai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drakaris Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 OP, what are your stats, what are you stacking, what build... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) Hi im a lv 50 save and i have 2 set columi and all rest PvP viol reward gear t1.5 My problem is that doing Hard Esselex mode with my group of friends we are unable to deliver enough DPS to kill bosses before timer go in enrage ... We are group of 1 sage healer 2 Sage DPS and 1 tank all people with similar gear ... we have a BIG problem to kill IRONFIST before he enrages and when we fight final jedi we cannot kill him before he enrages ... So we picked up a trooper DPS in my place and after 2 tryes boss was dead as he delivered so much more DPS .... I and my sage friend are using cookie DPS telekinetic sage build, casting our Damage over time and turbulences etc . still we was unable to deliver enough damage to kill boss before it enrages Conclusion is .. or i really really miss something important to deliver enough damage or sage as DPS class is LOOSER for PVE ! I really hate to say this but then either: A.) Your gear is not what you claimed it was. B.) You... how do I put this nicely?...suck, and need to work on your rotations. C.) The trooper out geared you THAT much. D.) The other sage DPS was that BAD, but since they replaced you instead I'm doubtful. All the hard modes I've done have been as TK spec. 104% hit. for example. (my stats) PS. surge>all imho, I would love way more surge. was at 85% once and LOVED IT! That's 4% accuracy that you could have used on something actually benefitial. Power is still better than Surge at any value, because it affects every cast and unlike Surge is not subject to DR. Surge however is better than any other secondary stat by a long shot. Edited January 20, 2012 by Khadroth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverion_one Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 I really don't know what can be good rotation i was normally using WM and then a turbulence + mind crush with alacrity buff , then power up and project + telekinetic throw + disturbance if others was on coll down ... My stats is + 572 damage, +32 crit, +67 surge + 9,78 activation speed as i have a lot of PvP gear (10,60 % expertise) + 14750 hit points... In end i decided to go as healer so i can get in more FP and gear PvE stuff in hope this will help me more I really like PvE but i was under impression it is still too hard for me i was able to do only taral v in hard mode for now ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nerithiel Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Esseles/Kaon Siege/Battle of illum are the hardest HM FPS For gear i would suggest try False Emperor/Taral V/Maelstorm/D7 for starters have you tried Full balance spec with Sever Force ? it has pretty easy rotation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevencbradshaw Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Power is still better than Surge at any value, because it affects every cast and unlike Surge is not subject to DR. Surge however is better than any other secondary stat by a long shot. Stats? Number crunching? Or are you assuming things and talking out of your ***. Example: My rail shot as a PT crits for 4.8k, when it's a non-crit it's hitting for sub 2k. Theorycrafting isn't your strong point. Move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khadroth Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 (edited) Stats? Number crunching? Or are you assuming things and talking out of your ***. Example: My rail shot as a PT crits for 4.8k, when it's a non-crit it's hitting for sub 2k. Theorycrafting isn't your strong point. Move on. You know I actually have entire graphs and the conversion rates for each stat. Theorycraft is definitely my strong point. I was going to explain it and be helpful but not for someone so insulting. Esseles/Kaon Siege/Battle of illum are the hardest HM FPS For gear i would suggest try False Emperor/Taral V/Maelstorm/D7 for starters have you tried Full balance spec with Sever Force ? it has pretty easy rotation Esseles is not the hardest hard mode by far. Only thing in there remotely tough is Ironfist who just needs to be interupted. Edited January 21, 2012 by Khadroth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janaia Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Could you please share your reasoning for stat priority for us actual sages reading this thread? I'm currently playing a deep tk sage just getting into endgame, and I've been stacking :willpower>crit>power/force power >alacrity>surge, with a priority rotation of weaken mind>mind crush>turbulence>disturbance(less than 3stacks of the buff)>telekinetic wave(with the insta proc)>telekinetik throw(with the 1/2 proc)>disturbance. Does that look accurate to you? Sorry if the names r off I'm doin this off the top of my head at work Went yesterday and hit my(and everyone in the grps) first HMs, and in rapid succession knocked out Taral V (shadow tank, sage heals, me as sage tk, and a commando dps, and then maelstrom prison + false emperor (replaced the commando with a dps sentinel). Biggest prob we had was the last 5% on the Sith entity bonus boss. Took a few wipes but got it. Edited January 25, 2012 by Janaia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoling Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Seems like for DPS we should go Willpower > Power > Surge > Crit > Alacrity Change Crit and Surge around. Pulled from spreadsheet linked below. Edited January 25, 2012 by Cryptoling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janaia Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Not meaning to doubt you but do u have any numbers/theorycrafting/resources to back that up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptoling Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Not meaning to doubt you but do u have any numbers/theorycrafting/resources to back that up? Spreadsheet from http://sithwarrior.com/forums/Thread-DPS-Excel-calculator-for-Sorcerer-Sage Annoying to read since it's worded for sorcs but the info is there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janaia Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Thanks! Lemme read that over! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bthrawn Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Here is a well written out post from sithwarrior guys which does a good job of explaining the stats. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=157437 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janaia Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Noob question prolly but is tumult something we should even consider using? Say general Edikar silver robot adds 1 is still up and u r standing next to it? Is it worth it or take it off my bars? Edited January 25, 2012 by Janaia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruuprect Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Noob question prolly but is tumult something we should even consider using? Say general Edikar silver robot adds 1 is still up and u r standing next to it? Is it worth it or take it off my bars? I have not ever been able to get Tumult to even work, so I took it off my bars. Any one else have this problem, the icon is always red even when I am in range. When I push it nothing happens, am I missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janaia Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Are u stunning it first? Or using it on an already stunned target? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruuprect Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Are u stunning it first? Or using it on an already stunned target? It requires the target to be stunned? lol, didnt notice that in the mouse over. Sorry, dumb question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janaia Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 It's prolly useless to even try to use, ill prolly take it off my bars anyways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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